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thetrin

Member
Oct 26, 2017
7,611
Atlanta, GA
OP, I agree with everything you're saying.

Era can be and do better. I did say in another thread that Era is considered pretty damn progressive by shtity video game forum standards, and while I still stand by that, that in no way means we can't improve.
 

Pet

More helpful than the IRS
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
7,070
SoCal
The problem is, there are many....MANY posters that are banned for simply giving their opinion on things that are in no way toxic, but go against the far left ideology.

Example, a mod started a thread asking the question "would you date a transgender person". Go look at how many were banned for saying "no".

I was one of them. I was banned under the made up charge of transphobia. I screenshot the post that got me banned, and in that post was nothing transphobic. I screenshot many other posts that got others banned that contained no transphobia, yet they were banned for transphobia.

So if people can't even answer a question to a post made by a moderator of their answer goes against the far left mentality of this site, is that good moderation? Is people giving opinions that aren't hateful or derailing but might not match the opinion of you worth a ban? Because that happens often. Way too often. My wife has checked this forum out a few times to see if she wanted to sign up but the fact that her opinion would be mobbed and reported because she is a moderate she has stayed away. That's what she told me anyway.

The "arguing in bad faith" is overused here. If someone has an opinion that goes against the majority, maybe that is just their opinion and that is OK as long as they aren't hating on anyone. I'm a conservative. Do you know how many posts I have to read that say things like "fuck them to death", or "all Republicans are Nazis"? If I post "All Democrats are Nazis" I would be banned faster than you could snap your fingers. How is that fair? It's not and it causes a toxic environment and goes against what progressiveness stands for which is inclusiveness. Inclusiveness includes people that might disagree with you, and everyone that disagrees with you are not wrong because they feel the way they do.

You're being purposely obtuse. Look at the Republican Party and their leaders and their policies and their supporters and what has happened under them (hint: hate crimes increased by hundreds of percents, environmental oversight is decimated, etc).

Also, being tolerant does not mean you tolerant intolerance. You have to kill intolerance in order to have an inclusive environment. The joke about "so much for the tolerant left" seems to have flown right over your head.

Spoilers

https://www.resetera.com/posts/9520288/

Saying trans women aren't the opposite sex to men and trans men aren't the opposite sex to women is transphobic.

MarineMountie - you posted

talking down to straight people that want the opposite sex for a relationship is appalling.

& that's where the transphobic comment comes into play. You're denying trans women her right to be a woman, by insisting she's not. That'd be similar to continuously asking your gay friend when he's going to "settle down with a nice girl" or ribbing him for being a "virgin" because he's never slept with a woman, even when your friend is like, dude, I'm gay.

I mean, if you look at the front page, there are many people expressing the opinion that no, not wanting to date someone who is trans is not the same as not socially accepting them. That's a different viewpoint than what you expressed.

Also, punching up is understandable. Punching down is not.
 

Laiza

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,170
I think you got it. But it takes a lot of energy. So many things go towards minimizing women's presence in gaming, and on the board. I don't think it's possible to solve without more decisive banning. Reality: someone is silenced either way. You either make the board more welcoming for vulnerable people or you give 200 people the ability to come back next week "just asking questions" about whether, right at this very moment, women are going through linkedin to target a wealthy white guy for their false rape allegation. How many women want to stick around, seeing that kind of shit? You think we don't each know a dozen women who were raped and never reported it, and the one that did because the asshole filmed it didn't have a strong enough case? There is nothing to be gained here, and sanity to lose. I would hope there would eventually be a tipping point where enough women participating would shift the culture of the board. Even then, mods would have to decisively bail to keep afloat in the sewage of gaming culture. I don't know if most of the people in here are talking about American standards, but if someone were to walk into my workplace and say stuff I read on this forum, they'd get side-eyed and people would revise their opinion to "ignorant asshole". What this forum finds reasonable is a far cry from what's acceptable in real life.

I think this is obvious, but maybe it isn't to everyone: a lot of women members don't want to get into the trenches. Entering those discussions is like a protracted gish gallop against "just asking questions". Frankly, it's depressing, and it erodes my faith in humanity. I'd rather discuss gender issues with random people on the street. I don't have the fire or self-hatred required. They are all the same. I see them: designs for female characters, arena net, any trans thread, men and empathy... I open them and hope to be surprised and want to say something, but I will bail by page two. If someone has metrics concerning activity for people on this site who identify as women I would not be surprised to see a tendency to lurk. I'm grateful for those who have the energy to keep establishing super basic shit for the j.a.q.offs. I admire women who throw their hats in. We all have a mental timer until some chucklehead types that their girlfriend/wife agrees with him, in an attempt to invalidate women who actually posted.

Privileged men, though, they've got a stockpile of excuses as to why they are always the ones who matter. In gaming, straight white guys are the majority so everything should be for them... what? Straight white males are not the majority demographic group of the world? Well, they are the most 'core,' legitimate group that everyone should be trying to sell things to, and women aren't even interested anyway, they just want to play candy crush! What, the wii happened and women also play 'core' games and actually spend money on shit? Well, uh, that was a piece of junk, clearly it's not a 'core' device. But let's talk about artistic integrity. Men don't try to censor devs' artistic vision by insisting that male characters shouldn't be dressed like strippers. Clearly men are the patrons of ART and FREEDOM, not those jealous women who can't stand seeing t&a! Oh, wait, men kicked up some huge fuss about that final fantasy mobile game guy not wearing enough clothes and it was changed?

I think the basic answer to why some men don't develop empathy is simple. You don't develop a muscle you never have to use. Women go through a gauntlet of judgement every day. Understanding others' perspectives is a tool for self-preservation. There's always a reason that it's only men at the table. It's natural! Due to merit! It's market forces! Women should be making people, not money - and preferably male people! All evil came out of Pandora's vagoo! Eve ate the apple! You don't have souls!

There's always a reason for everyone else to be grateful for scraps. Resetera being the "most progressive" of gaming sites, that's definitely a scrap.
All of this, 100%. All of it. Especially that third paragraph. You nailed it.

Getting real bloody tired of the deflection and the defensiveness. Always about "but we're totally progressive!" without actually backing it up with good behavior. On and on it goes...
 

NoName999

One Winged Slayer
Banned
Oct 29, 2017
5,906
Reminder:

A topic about female gamers leaving because they feel like they're not welcome is now hijacked because some dudes are upset at the word "brogressive." As if that's the most insulting word in the history of mankind.

Infuriating doesn't even begin to describe this.
 

dyst

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,461
How do you balance allowing people to discuss different view points without silencing one side versus the other? This site for the most part, I think does a decent job but it's not an easy task. Just last week we had the female thread, which had a ton of people supportive of the OP, people that were confused about the premise and then you had people from different cultures/backgrounds who have an entirely different vocabulary. It is much easier to moderate when you have people (as an example), openly wish harm/death upon someone, but something like the female thread has a little more nuance to it. The reaction that thread got compared to the thread about not wanting to be called honey or babe was entirely different. It's an evolving discussion here and unless a person is outright being cruel, you have to allow discussion to take place. Also, the bolded part in OP is a great example of how we should communicate with one another. Often times we generalize, which will naturally lead to discourse. If we make it clear, I think we will run into less issues.
 

zoukka

Game Developer
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
2,361
Chances are if you get hit with one of those during conversation, the reasons why would be apparent in whatever you said to earn it.

What? No you just can't label/belittle people without arguments. You are just trying to tell us that some labels cannot be wrong that's ridiculous.
 

Mass_Pincup

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
7,126
Putting READ OP in the topic title is barely interaction with the community. My last post in this topic tried to encourage anyone to engage.

The bans and warnings have started in this topic so eyes are watching it, but yet again it feels like the eyes that watching will be discussing the topic and posters off site instead of engaging with community questions or what is going to keep progressing into more and more arguing and bans.

It seems like anything even remotely related to site moderation is a complete no go zone for mods other than banning, warning and maybe eventually locking with "PM us for site policy questions".

If that is going to be the hard line stance taken from behind the scenes I would question why topics will be allowed to go for 30+ pages? Is it just to cull the herd a little whilst outside of any trolls other posters get themselves wound up and possibly banned?

It really isn't helping fostering an us vs them environment and everyone needs to remember offsite arguing and discussion ignores public interaction on the forum.

Just advice and observation above, I'm not being unfair. I've tried to keep up with the topic and haven't seen one mod post and the title with READ OP does seem to be user created. As I said I've just seen warns and bans started.

I completely agree with you.

When the site started I thought that the transparency regarding moderation would involve back and forth with the community. Not even an hands on approach where mods are being called in every thread but a dedicated thread where a broader explanation regarding moderation could be given in a any particular situation.
 

Cow Mengde

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,688
It's a gaming forum. Gaming forums by default can't be progressive because gaming is the hotbed for a new generation of alt-right. These are people that dish out racial slurs cause they lost in a game. This is a hobby that reinforces toxic masculinity with games like The Witcher, Call of Duty, and God of War. I say this as a gamer myself.

That said, the mods have done a good job with what they can. Yeah, sometimes things escape them, but that's cause of how big this place is. Plus, some of them were banned from the old place for being shitheads, but blended themselves into this new forum. It takes time for this forum to grow. We're only barely hitting the one year mark. I do wonder if we're too cynical and negative sometimes. I say this as someone who's incredibly cynical.

I wonder if it'll do this community better if we can tone down the number of Trump posts in EtcetEra. Like the constant barrage of shit from this guy can't be escaped. I know a lot of us here hate this guy, but I wonder if not being able to escape all the negativity is also bringing the forum down? I mean, don't we all get our news from other sources and know the kind of shit he's pulling? Do we really need to see it here as well? I'm asking this as a genuine question on how others feel. I don't want to censor the forum either.

But if we can shut down Trump's shit as much as we can, while focusing more on progressive discussion, maybe we can really turn this place in a more progressive community.
 

SweetNicole

The Old Guard
Member
Oct 24, 2017
6,542
Everyone, this has been a good thread so far with a lot of useful and thoughtful discussion. We've heard from a lot of voices and have been given a lot to think about. We also think it's valuable for members to listen to and engage each other about these issues that are important to our community.

We would like to keep this thread open, but if that's going to happen there needs to be less hostility than there has been in the last few pages. We understand that people are passionate, but nobody is going to gain anything from this discussion if it devolves into personal attacks and name calling. If you think someone is over the line, report them. Thank you.
 

Rmagnus

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,923
That's the discussion that's happening here

I noticed but your original post read to me like hey why don't you leave the forum you got the whole of the internet if you are a conservative whic is a pretty shit stance to take. The posters if they feel they are oppressed or not can take it up with the admin team or mods.
If that's your stance on things why don't you not reply to threads threads or post you don't agree with? You got the rest of the forum to post in
 

saenima

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
11,892
tenor.gif

Could be much worse. He could be surrounded exclusively by moderates and centrists.

Imagine that craven life.
 

FUME5

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,421

PhazonBlonde

User requested ban
Banned
May 18, 2018
3,293
Somewhere deep in space
That's one massive strawman. As the moderator stated anyone with good will and civil manners should be welcome here. In fact it would be the best case scenario to have people here who would learn to be more tolerant and liberal by engaging with the community. And by this I don't mean they should get any special treatment nor should we let in complete nutcases with completely opposing ethics. Bans for oppressing behaviour are good.
Fair enough, but tempering back my overexaggeration, the point stands. If someone wants a libretarian 'all free speech is valid' platform Reddit exists and is much larger and more diverse than this place.
 

netprints

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
1,068
Is there a way to make this place better? Do people lack respect or empathy towards one another? I have noticed an OP wanting to share their thoughts on a movie and get shit on and ends up asking for a self ban. I felt horrible for that person. That is not a way to build a community. I hope there is a way that we all can come together to make this place stronger. A lot of us cane from another site because we didnt like the action that the owner took towards women. We should be open minded and respectful to any race, sex, beliefs, or political parties.
 

Deleted member 1635

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,800
Spoilers

https://www.resetera.com/posts/9520288/

Saying trans women aren't the opposite sex to men and trans men aren't the opposite sex to women is transphobic.

You're going to have to clarify this one for me, because I'm honestly confused. I thought we acknowledged that there can be a difference in born biological sex and a person's gender around here.

Are you just saying we need to recognize trans women as women and trans men as men? If so, then that makes sense and I agree.
 

samoyed

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
15,191
As an aside, it's important to recognize that no one's perfect and when someone says "this can be considered bigotry", your thought processes shouldn't be "huh, bigotry? that's what those evangelicals get up to, that's not me, so the accusation must be wrong", but "hm let's think about this carefully for a sec, what are they saying exactly".

Replace bigotry with sexism, transphobia, racism, etc.
 

Enduin

You look 40
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,469
New York
Serious question, my dude. Can you make a real response?

I'm not conservative in the slightest, yet I completely agree with what that guy said.
What that guy said it complete bullshit and outright lies. There was no thread asking if you'd date a trans person, there was a thread about a study that showed most cis people still won't date trans people and tons of posters in that thread thought it important to make it clear they too wouldn't because that's super helpful and considerate to the trans community here. /s

This included the now banned poster you "completely agree" with who was transphobic as fuck claiming trans women were not the "opposite sex" to men and that "I don't want a penis in bed with me. I'm straight, I want a vagina." So what exactly are we doing here? How is this just a different opinion that's no way toxic, but just against the ideology of the left?
 

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,315
"If you do not agree with me, get out" is not exactly something worth discussing.

There are plenty places to go where they can declare that heterosexual people don't want to date trans people because they want to date people of the opposite sex and get the encouragement they desire.

That poster opted to come in here and whine about how unfair it is to be a conservative (lol) and bitch that they unjustly got banned for what they called a made up charge of transphobia only oops turns out they literally said that heterosexual people want to date people of the opposite sex and thus don't want to date trans people... oops.
 

Subutai

Metal Face DOOM
Member
Oct 25, 2017
937
Here's the deal people sticking around who want a more progressive space makes sense cause that shit be lacking but conservatives? They got the whole fucking internet
Exactly. Damn near every community that isn't decently moderated is full of mostly conservative views. Look how quick GAF ended up what it is when everyone moved over to here. You would see nothing but people shitting all over GAF, it's mods and members until it fell and then they happily invaded the place.
 

RedMercury

Blue Venus
Member
Dec 24, 2017
17,643
Everyone, this has been a good thread so far with a lot of useful and thoughtful discussion. We've heard from a lot of voices and have been given a lot to think about. We also think it's valuable for members to listen to and engage each other about these issues that are important to our community.

We would like to keep this thread open, but if that's going to happen there needs to be less hostility than there has been in the last few pages. We understand that people are passionate, but nobody is going to gain anything from this discussion if it devolves into personal attacks and name calling. If you think someone is over the line, report them. Thank you.
Thank you for listening SN, the whole team as well.
 

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,315
I noticed but your original post read to me like hey why don't you leave the forum you got the whole of the internet if you are a conservative whic is a pretty shit stance to take. The posters if they feel they are oppressed or not can take it up with the admin team or mods.
If that's your stance on things why don't you not reply to threads threads or post you don't agree with? You got the rest of the forum to post in

Because they literally were bitching they got banned for transphobia
 

PhazonBlonde

User requested ban
Banned
May 18, 2018
3,293
Somewhere deep in space
I think you got it. But it takes a lot of energy. So many things go towards minimizing women's presence in gaming, and on the board. I don't think it's possible to solve without more decisive banning. Reality: someone is silenced either way. You either make the board more welcoming for vulnerable people or you give 200 people the ability to come back next week "just asking questions" about whether, right at this very moment, women are going through linkedin to target a wealthy white guy for their false rape allegation. How many women want to stick around, seeing that kind of shit? You think we don't each know a dozen women who were raped and never reported it, and the one that did because the asshole filmed it didn't have a strong enough case? There is nothing to be gained here, and sanity to lose. I would hope there would eventually be a tipping point where enough women participating would shift the culture of the board. Even then, mods would have to decisively bail to keep afloat in the sewage of gaming culture. I don't know if most of the people in here are talking about American standards, but if someone were to walk into my workplace and say stuff I read on this forum, they'd get side-eyed and people would revise their opinion to "ignorant asshole". What this forum finds reasonable is a far cry from what's acceptable in real life.

I think this is obvious, but maybe it isn't to everyone: a lot of women members don't want to get into the trenches. Entering those discussions is like a protracted gish gallop against "just asking questions". Frankly, it's depressing, and it erodes my faith in humanity. I'd rather discuss gender issues with random people on the street. I don't have the fire or self-hatred required. They are all the same. I see them: designs for female characters, arena net, any trans thread, men and empathy... I open them and hope to be surprised and want to say something, but I will bail by page two. If someone has metrics concerning activity for people on this site who identify as women I would not be surprised to see a tendency to lurk. I'm grateful for those who have the energy to keep establishing super basic shit for the j.a.q.offs. I admire women who throw their hats in. We all have a mental timer until some chucklehead types that their girlfriend/wife agrees with him, in an attempt to invalidate women who actually posted.

Privileged men, though, they've got a stockpile of excuses as to why they are always the ones who matter. In gaming, straight white guys are the majority so everything should be for them... what? Straight white males are not the majority demographic group of the world? Well, they are the most 'core,' legitimate group that everyone should be trying to sell things to, and women aren't even interested anyway, they just want to play candy crush! What, the wii happened and women also play 'core' games and actually spend money on shit? Well, uh, that was a piece of junk, clearly it's not a 'core' device. But let's talk about artistic integrity. Men don't try to censor devs' artistic vision by insisting that male characters shouldn't be dressed like strippers. Clearly men are the patrons of ART and FREEDOM, not those jealous women who can't stand seeing t&a! Oh, wait, men kicked up some huge fuss about that final fantasy mobile game guy not wearing enough clothes and it was changed?

I think the basic answer to why some men don't develop empathy is simple. You don't develop a muscle you never have to use. Women go through a gauntlet of judgement every day. Understanding others' perspectives is a tool for self-preservation. There's always a reason that it's only men at the table. It's natural! Due to merit! It's market forces! Women should be making people, not money - and preferably male people! All evil came out of Pandora's vagoo! Eve ate the apple! You don't have souls!

There's always a reason for everyone else to be grateful for scraps. Resetera being the "most progressive" of gaming sites, that's definitely a scrap.
I endorse this message.
 

Apath

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,115
There are plenty places to go where they can declare that heterosexual people don't want to date trans people because they want to date people of the opposite sex and get the encouragement they desire.

That poster opted to come in here and whine about how unfair it is to be a conservative (lol) and bitch that they unjustly got banned for what they called a made up charge of transphobia only oops turns out they literally said that heterosexual people want to date people of the opposite sex and thus don't want to date trans people... oops.
I mean, are you really wondering why people would want to be a part of this community? There is a lot more to this forum than social politics. Having said that, I didn't see the context to your post, so I apologize for missing the comment you were responding to. I saw Phazon's post quoting your post and responded to it.
 

zoukka

Game Developer
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
2,361
Fair enough, but tempering back my overexaggeration, the point stands. If someone wants a libretarian 'all free speech is valid' platform Reddit exists and is much larger and more diverse than this place.

For me this forum is the most interesting one exactly because of the strong moderation. It was the same with the old site, I have no patience for unmoderated discussion boards. And I care about progressive values, my first post came out somewhat hostile it seems. There's always room to improve, even in Era. I have no doubt that minorities (and women) have it tougher out there (and here) and we are not even close to where we need to be in terms of social development.

All that said there was a lot of uncalled hostility and attacking towards members who didn't deserve it.
 

Deleted member 1635

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
6,800
Reminder:

A topic about female gamers leaving because they feel like they're not welcome is now hijacked because some dudes are upset at the word "brogressive." As if that's the most insulting word in the history of mankind.

Infuriating doesn't even begin to describe this.

Is that really the impression you have? The conversation has shifted through a variety of topics over the course of this thread and "brogressive" discussion had even died down by the time you posted that. I'm a guy, so maybe I'm missing some kind of perspective here, but I don't think classifying this thread as having been highjacked for a discussion about a made up label is all that accurate.
 

Avitus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,898
Here's the deal people sticking around who want a more progressive space makes sense cause that shit be lacking but conservatives? They got the whole fucking internet

It's hard to make a place "more" progressive because you never know who needs to be weeded out until they stand up to be counted. Experiencing backlash in a thread (even this one) is a natural part of the discourse of a forum. What's important is that there's course correction and whatever undesirable discussion took place is weeded out. Era seems to do a pretty good job of that. As an open forum on the internet, there's really no way to prevent 100% of the nonsense out there other than to make it abundantly clear that those takes are not welcome and will be met with a swift ban as a deterrent. Some will still persist.

I don't see many people flaunting the rules and getting away with it for long.
 

saenima

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
11,892
I think you got it. But it takes a lot of energy. So many things go towards minimizing women's presence in gaming, and on the board. I don't think it's possible to solve without more decisive banning. Reality: someone is silenced either way. You either make the board more welcoming for vulnerable people or you give 200 people the ability to come back next week "just asking questions" about whether, right at this very moment, women are going through linkedin to target a wealthy white guy for their false rape allegation. How many women want to stick around, seeing that kind of shit? You think we don't each know a dozen women who were raped and never reported it, and the one that did because the asshole filmed it didn't have a strong enough case? There is nothing to be gained here, and sanity to lose. I would hope there would eventually be a tipping point where enough women participating would shift the culture of the board. Even then, mods would have to decisively bail to keep afloat in the sewage of gaming culture. I don't know if most of the people in here are talking about American standards, but if someone were to walk into my workplace and say stuff I read on this forum, they'd get side-eyed and people would revise their opinion to "ignorant asshole". What this forum finds reasonable is a far cry from what's acceptable in real life.

I think this is obvious, but maybe it isn't to everyone: a lot of women members don't want to get into the trenches. Entering those discussions is like a protracted gish gallop against "just asking questions". Frankly, it's depressing, and it erodes my faith in humanity. I'd rather discuss gender issues with random people on the street. I don't have the fire or self-hatred required. They are all the same. I see them: designs for female characters, arena net, any trans thread, men and empathy... I open them and hope to be surprised and want to say something, but I will bail by page two. If someone has metrics concerning activity for people on this site who identify as women I would not be surprised to see a tendency to lurk. I'm grateful for those who have the energy to keep establishing super basic shit for the j.a.q.offs. I admire women who throw their hats in. We all have a mental timer until some chucklehead types that their girlfriend/wife agrees with him, in an attempt to invalidate women who actually posted.

Privileged men, though, they've got a stockpile of excuses as to why they are always the ones who matter. In gaming, straight white guys are the majority so everything should be for them... what? Straight white males are not the majority demographic group of the world? Well, they are the most 'core,' legitimate group that everyone should be trying to sell things to, and women aren't even interested anyway, they just want to play candy crush! What, the wii happened and women also play 'core' games and actually spend money on shit? Well, uh, that was a piece of junk, clearly it's not a 'core' device. But let's talk about artistic integrity. Men don't try to censor devs' artistic vision by insisting that male characters shouldn't be dressed like strippers. Clearly men are the patrons of ART and FREEDOM, not those jealous women who can't stand seeing t&a! Oh, wait, men kicked up some huge fuss about that final fantasy mobile game guy not wearing enough clothes and it was changed?

I think the basic answer to why some men don't develop empathy is simple. You don't develop a muscle you never have to use. Women go through a gauntlet of judgement every day. Understanding others' perspectives is a tool for self-preservation. There's always a reason that it's only men at the table. It's natural! Due to merit! It's market forces! Women should be making people, not money - and preferably male people! All evil came out of Pandora's vagoo! Eve ate the apple! You don't have souls!

There's always a reason for everyone else to be grateful for scraps. Resetera being the "most progressive" of gaming sites, that's definitely a scrap.

Preach.
 

Liljagare

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
616
I deleted that because it was too much, but the issue isn't that you don't know English well. I talk to tons of people that are just learning English, I even teach some. The issue is that you're being combative when being corrected on an issue that matters. The patronizing pleasantries aren't doing you any favors either.

You mean like your statement about Belfast? I know a few natives there that would be rather upset about your assumption about them, that was just a crass statement on your part.



And, I think you mistake sarcasm as patronizing, because I suck at it.

Thanks yet again though.
 
Last edited:

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,315
It's hard to make a place "more" progressive because you never know who needs to be weeded out until they stand up to be counted. Experiencing backlash in a thread (even this one) is a natural part of the discourse of a forum. What's important is that there's course correction and whatever undesirable discussion took place is weeded out. Era seems to do a pretty good job of that. As an open forum on the internet, there's really no way to prevent 100% of the nonsense out there other than to make it abundantly clear that those takes are not welcome and will be met with a swift ban as a deterrent. Some will still persist.

I don't see many people flaunting the rules and getting away with it for long.

I mean that poster was weeded out once and is now decrying their false ban and standing by their transphobia while denying it was ever transphobia so
 

D i Z

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,085
Where X marks the spot.
Reminder:

A topic about female gamers leaving because they feel like they're not welcome is now hijacked because some dudes are upset at the word "brogressive." As if that's the most insulting word in the history of mankind.

Infuriating doesn't even begin to describe this.

Like clockwork. It happens every. single. time.

What? No you just can't label/belittle people without arguments. You are just trying to tell us that some labels cannot be wrong that's ridiculous.

You're missing the point. I didn't say you couldn't/shouldn't respond. In fact, you probably should. I said you probably earned it.
The onus is on YOU to prove that you're not deserving of the label if you're actually invested in a "discussion". Best way to do that? By not being a jerk.
 
Oct 27, 2017
44,983
Seattle
Yep, shield the poor dudes from those opinionated women.

The message this would send is that women would not feel welcome in any other section of the forum.

No! What the fuck? No! Women should feel safe to talk about these topics in any thread on any side of the forum! Why would anyone want to coddle men to the point of forcing women to move to specific threads to feel like their opinions are valued and that they are welcome. Jesus what a terrible idea.

So segregate the Women and the topics they want to discuss?

Don't think that will help in anything really.

How about folks just behave instead and go away if they can't

Yikes, sorry guys. I wasn't trying to suggest that the women needed to leave or what not. And absolutely agree that folks need to just be better, It just seemed like their was a ton of opposition tighter moderation, so I was trying to think of solutions to that.
 

4859

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
7,046
In the weak and the wounded
The problem is, there are many....MANY posters that are banned for simply giving their opinion on things that are in no way toxic, but go against the far left ideology.

Example, a mod started a thread asking the question "would you date a transgender person". Go look at how many were banned for saying "no".

I was one of them. I was banned under the made up charge of transphobia. I screenshot the post that got me banned, and in that post was nothing transphobic. I screenshot many other posts that got others banned that contained no transphobia, yet they were banned for transphobia.

So if people can't even answer a question to a post made by a moderator of their answer goes against the far left mentality of this site, is that good moderation? Is people giving opinions that aren't hateful or derailing but might not match the opinion of you worth a ban? Because that happens often. Way too often. My wife has checked this forum out a few times to see if she wanted to sign up but the fact that her opinion would be mobbed and reported because she is a moderate she has stayed away. That's what she told me anyway.

The "arguing in bad faith" is overused here. If someone has an opinion that goes against the majority, maybe that is just their opinion and that is OK as long as they aren't hating on anyone. I'm a conservative. Do you know how many posts I have to read that say things like "fuck them to death", or "all Republicans are Nazis"? If I post "All Democrats are Nazis" I would be banned faster than you could snap your fingers. How is that fair? It's not and it causes a toxic environment and goes against what progressiveness stands for which is inclusiveness. Inclusiveness includes people that might disagree with you, and everyone that disagrees with you are not wrong because they feel the way they do.

Because the Republican party has become, and this is not debatable, the party of authoritarian fascism. This is a fact. They also dog whistle to, and even openly give support to racists and neo Nazis. Very fine people.

It is obvious why you can't simply call democrats nazi's, it's an argument made in blatantly bad faith.

Oh nooo I used the trigger wooooordddsss.

Yeah no, bad faith arguing is NOT overused here. In fact, consoldering the dozens of websites, and hundreds of accounts that literally only exist to obsess over and fuck with this forum exclusively in bad faith, it is extremely underused.

I have extreme doubt at your claims about the trans topic.

For one, I don't recall a poll of any shape or form if this is the thread I'm thinking about, I recall a link to an article with.... Brutal statistics. So already I smell another bad faith argument popping up. I mean I'm pretty sure you're framing the situation on a lie to begin with.

Ah, and as I've been off trying to fact check my memory, I've been beaten to the punch

Spoilers

https://www.resetera.com/posts/9520288/


Saying trans women aren't the opposite sex to men and trans men aren't the opposite sex to women is transphobic.


Yeah, I don't see any reason to engage in this anymore. It's beyond obvious this discussion isn't made in good faith.
 

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,315
Yikes, sorry guys. I wasn't trying to suggest that the women needed to leave or what not. And absolutely agree that folks need to just be better, It just seemed like their was a ton of opposition tighter moderation, so I was trying to think of solutions to that.

Yeah the solution is for those opposed to deal not to shunt women into some walled off space
 

Avitus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,898
I mean that poster was weeded out once and is now decrying their false ban and standing by their transphobia while denying it was ever transphobia so

And now they're gone, for much longer or for good. I would rather see people get a 2nd chance and to have a chance to 'see the light' around posters that know how to behave and converse rather than skipping to a permaban. Some are just going to keep going on and will throw away their 2nd chance. There isn't much you can do about that. I understand these people shitting up threads or otherwise muddying discussion until they are dealt with is greatly annoying but it's sort of part and parcel with how a forum functions.
 

Gotdatmoney

Member
Oct 28, 2017
14,487
Maybe from your point of view.

The thread has been hijacked from it's original opening yes, we are on page 30 and have shifted through like 20 different topics. The thread was not highjacked because I dissented when everyone was loving brogressive no. There has still been lots of other discussion

From my perspective it's been a pretty major disappointment.

I mean, that's unfortunate but it is what it is.

If everyone posted more like Guppeth we'd really be getting places.

Shrug, I can't be dude. I don't want to be dude.
 

Cocaloch

Banned
Nov 6, 2017
4,562
Where the Fenians Sleep
You mean like your statement about Belfast? :)

That was overly aggressive, that's why I deleted it before you even posted. That said, I was aggravated because you were being combative about something that matters. It's not too long ago that people were beaten for not speaking "correct" English.

I think you mistake sarcasm as patronizing, because I suck at it.

Thanks yet again though.

Sarcasm is often patronizing. For instance, the very tired shtick you've done for the last six posts or so.

Anyway, this a pointless tangent.

Edit: Oh you made it worse.

I know a few natives there that would be rather upset about your assumption about them, that was just a crass statement on your part.

What was the crass assumption on my part? That people in a Catholic pub wouldn't like hearing something demoting them in comparison to the English? That's not a crass statement, and I doubt you know much about the issue I'm talking about.
 
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excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,315
And now they're gone, for much longer or for good. I would rather see people get a 2nd chance and to have a chance to 'see the light' around posters that know how to behave and converse rather than skipping to a permaban. Some are just going to keep going on and will throw away their 2nd chance. There isn't much you can do about that. I understand these people shitting up threads or otherwise muddying discussion until they are dealt with is greatly annoying but it's sort of part and parcel with how a forum functions.

I'm down for minorities like myself to do education work and give these folks second chances but I'd have to get paid first.
 

PhazonBlonde

User requested ban
Banned
May 18, 2018
3,293
Somewhere deep in space
For me this forum is the most interesting one exactly because of the strong moderation. It was the same with the old site, I have no patience for unmoderated discussion boards. And I care about progressive values, my first post came out somewhat hostile it seems. There's always room to improve, even in Era. I have no doubt that minorities (and women) have it tougher out there (and here) and we are not even close to where we need to be in terms of social development.

All that said there was a lot of uncalled hostility and attacking towards members who didn't deserve it.
Ok, cool. You seem like a fairminded alright chap. Sorry if I read ya wrong.

(I actually do really mean this, I know a lot of sarcasm flying about in these pages.)
 

zoukka

Game Developer
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
2,361
Maybe from your point of view.

From my perspective it's been a pretty major disappointment. If everyone posted more like Guppeth we'd really be getting places.

On the page where the highjack was claimed there was probably 1-3 posts about "brogressive" out of 50 posts.

The onus is on YOU to prove that you're not deserving of the label if you're actually invested in a "discussion". Best way to do that? By not being a jerk.

I don't agree, the onus should always be on the accuser.
 
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