Should Sony also release a streaming only console?

Tyaren said:

I'm pretty much clueless regarding streaming technology, but I guess you need extremely fast internet to stream a 4K image at at least 30fps? Much of Europe and the US still has rather slow internet. It doesn't look as if that would change withing the next couple of years.

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Latency is the biggest issue. Controller input lag + Having your console on WiFi + TV Input Lag + Streaming Input Lag = an unplayable mess. People WILL notice the lag. I mean if I put my high-end TV in any other picture mode other than Game, the input lag is obvious.

Thatguy said:

No its a bad idea. I don't care how good the performance is. I don't want to stream my games. We had Onlive. We have PS Now. Steam has it. Games aren't movies/TV. They require constant input and attention and people play a game hundreds of hours not 2. Sure I guess leave it in for those who like it but if you want the highest fidelity and responsiveness combined you will always need to be sitting right next to the thing processing your game.

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Why not let the market decide what it prefers?

Boy some of the fanboy dribble that comes out of ppls mouths is ridiculous lol. So lets get this straight? Sony acquired Gakai, also bought out Onlive for its patents on streaming, already had pstv and are heavily invested in PSNow but they arent ready or wont be able to compete with Microsoft? Lol only on the internet man.

Listen before this streaming talk was even happening on the Microsoft sid Sony has been investing heavily on making a streaming console a reality not only are they and will be competitive they probably will have the better solution since theyve been doing it so long. Its like ppl saying Microsoft is a software company yet Sony PS4s software features and os were spanking xbox ones upon release. Im sure Mictosoft will come out with something good but please stop the Sony hate and lets not act like Micro is innovating with streaming when Sony has been pushing extremely hard on this front before we even heard this news.

Btw Psnow worked great when i tried it with most games seeming as if they were being played straight off disc. This bs narrative console warriors are pushing tht it is trash is funny. Only reason i didnt keep it was its price point and it didnt have ps4 games at the time.

Kenjovani said:

Boy some of the fanboy dribble that comes out of ppls mouths is ridiculous lol. So lets get this straight? Sony acquired Gakai, also bought out Onlive for its patents on streaming, already had pstv and are heavily invested in PSNow but they arent ready or wont be able to compete with Microsoft? Lol only on the internet man.

Listen before this streaming talk was even happening on the Microsoft sid Sony has been investing heavily on making a streaming console a reality not only are they and will be competitive they probably will have the better solution since theyve been doing it so long. Its like ppl saying Microsoft is a software company yet Sony PS4s software features and os were spanking xbox ones upon release. Im sure Mictosoft will come out with something good but please stop the Sony hate and lets not act like Micro is innovating with streaming when Sony has been pushing extremely hard on this front before we even heard this news.

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Nobody is doubting they have the patents to do it. They're doubting the infrastructure to do it on a mass scale.

SPDIF said:

Well you weren't talking about a rule. You said that MS have never demonstrated better capabilities than Sony, which is clearly false. And I'm sorry, but that excuse you used for Sony is pretty terrible and doesn't really make sense. Part of having more capability is having the ability to predict/shape/react to the future. In that particular instance, MS clearly showed more of it than Sony

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lol talk about taking things out of context, good lord, no point even responding to you.

nekkid said:

Why not let the market decide what it prefers?

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With so many platforms that already have it, aren't we already there? This is not uncharted territory.

Thatguy said:

With so many platforms that already have it, aren't we already there? This is not uncharted territory.

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Are you saying it was already tried and it's now forever dead?

Black Chamber said:

Let's hope for the sake of this hobby that they absolutely do not ever do that.

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Lol im with you on this. If the future is digital and streaming without ever 100% owning your games then im not liking this one bit.

nekkid said:

Are you saying it was already tried and it's now forever dead?

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More like already tried and is a known commodity.

TakeNoPrisoners said:

lol talk about taking things out of context, good lord, no point even responding to you.

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Is this one of those replies where you don't actually have anything to respond with so you just say anything to try and shut the conversation down? It's the only way it makes sense otherwise.

If you genuinely didn't want to respond to me, then why did you even bother with this reply? Just move on.

No. Please.

Sony should fix PSN before they even think about this. They really need to overhaul the whole thing.

Thatguy said:

More like already tried and is a known commodity.

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It's been a bit half-hearted up until this point.

nekkid said:

Nobody is doubting they have the patents to do it. They're doubting the infrastructure to do it on a mass scale.

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I have read some of the comments and understand some of the insinuations thrown around and trust me some of them arent just about infrastructure. With that said in respect to infrastructure my comments still stand.

Kenjovani said:

Boy some of the fanboy dribble that comes out of ppls mouths is ridiculous lol. So lets get this straight? Sony acquired Gakai, also bought out Onlive for its patents on streaming, already had pstv and are heavily invested in PSNow but they arent ready or wont be able to compete with Microsoft? Lol only on the internet man.

Listen before this streaming talk was even happening on the Microsoft sid Sony has been investing heavily on making a streaming console a reality not only are they and will be competitive they probably will have the better solution since theyve been doing it so long. Its like ppl saying Microsoft is a software company yet Sony PS4s software features and os were spanking xbox ones upon release. Im sure Mictosoft will come out with something good but please stop the Sony hate and lets not act like Micro is innovating with streaming when Sony has been pushing extremely hard on this front before we even heard this news.

Btw Psnow worked great when i tried it with most games seeming as if they were being played straight off disc. This bs narrative console warriors are pushing tht it is trash is funny. Only reason i didnt keep it was its price point and it didnt have ps4 games at the time.

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It doesn't help (unless it's changed) that your digital purchases on PS3/PS4 aren't taken into account when using PSNow. While on Microsoft's side: gamepass and whatever "Scarlett cloud" is will have everything you own on 3 console generations available from day dot.
The prospect of playing left 4 dead/cross-play Fortnite or Forza Horizon 4 on a cheaper streaming only solution is very tempting.

Iucidium said:

/Thread

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I feel like some people really don't know what PSTV was made for and are just driveby posting now.

Microsoft was going to release a $100 Apple TV type box last gen too. Both rumored for 360 and One. Just because it's runored doesn't mean it will happen

Also, isn't that kinda what PSTV tried? I'm guessing they won't try the $99 non Console market again

I would think they will.

No way I am touching one though since my internet is crap as fuck.

Neonep said:

Sony should fix PSN before they even think about this. They really need to overhaul the whole thing.

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What is wrong with PSN?

I personally wouldn't buy it and I really don't see why anyone that pays for good enough internet to stream would also want to not get the best performance out of the box they buy.

I do find it odd that the question always seems to be "should Sony do this thing it's competitors are doing?" Whenever something like this comes up. They are doing their thing and doing it well. Shouldn't the questions be "should Sony's competitors be copying Sony?" seeing the success of the PS4.

Memento said:

What is wrong with PSN?

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Everything is wrong with PSN, the fact that you can't change your name is just the tip of the iceberg. It's slow and disorganized.

Really funny how the Xbox fans already acting ignorant like if Microsoft already has his Game streaming service online and people right now playing. Microsoft has nothing....both companies working to improve or bring it online (Microsoft) in the future. Sony is working on it behind close doors for that's for sure. You can say they will bring a better version next-gen because now...it's not their most important aspect. And having your own cloud service doesn't automatically mean you will have the best service. How do you think other large companies operate with their own cloud environments? They hire them in with their own software. Many people here really do not understand what they are talking about. Do some people here think that Valve, EA, Ubisoft, Bethesda, etc. all have their own servers running? If it was so important that you are the biggest company, why can't Microsoft beat its biggest competitor in the console market?

Everything is wrong with PSN, the fact that you can't change your name is just the tip of the iceberg. It's slow and disorganized.

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Has nothing to do with the performance. And i don't see what's slow about PSN? Playing online is nothing different from Live or playing on PC. Downloading? That really depends what ISP you have, how your own network is, which country your living, continent. Here in Europe..we have some of the best connections in the world.

Dussck said:

They will have to if they want to keep competing on the market. But it would involve very heavily investment in something Microsoft already has up and running a long time now.

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This post is so detached from reality lmao

SPDIF said:

Is this one of those replies where you don't actually have anything to respond with so you just say anything to try and shut the conversation down? It's the only way it makes sense otherwise.

If you genuinely didn't want to respond to me, then why did you even bother with this reply? Just move on.

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No it isn't, my post was easy understand. You took a single quote a took it out of context of the conversation we were having...

Bran Van said:

This post is so detached from reality lmao

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Like a large number of posts in this thread lol.

Neonep said:

Everything is wrong with PSN, the fact that you can't change your name is just the tip of the iceberg. It's slow and disorganized.

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Everything? I have an X and Pro..don't see any difference other than download speeds..so how is "Everything" wrong? It's not 2007 this is pure nonsense, there is not much difference between the services today. Using blatant hyperbole also does you no favours.

Slow? Using the X has been slower for me, especially the UI (Yes I know Ui is not Live/PSN). No difference playing online on my X than my pro at all.

Yes, so long as Sony improves their streaming service.

TakeNoPrisoners said:

Everything? I have an X and Pro..don't see any difference other than download speeds..so how is "Everything" wrong? It's not 2007 this is pure nonsense, there is not much difference between the services today. Using blatant hyperbole also does you no favours.

Slow? Using the X has been slower for me, especially the UI (Yes I know Ui is not Live/PSN). No difference playing online on my X than my pro at all.

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Some of the more idiotic policies that Sony has put me off of their network. Things like charging for cloud saves and that RIDICULOUS hard drive issue for example. I heard that Sony got rid of that $5 minimum charge so I won't list that as a negative but yeah - there are still some negatives about PSN that annoy people like me who primarily game elsewhere.

EdgeXL said:

Some of the more idiotic policies that Sony has put me off of their network. Things like charging for cloud saves and that RIDICULOUS hard drive issue for example. I heard that Sony got rid of that $5 minimum charge so I won't list that as a negative but yeah - there are still some negatives about PSN that annoy people like me who primarily game elsewhere.

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None of that is "Everything" is wrong with PSN. Which was the point of contention. No one is saying it's perfect because it clearly isn't. I thought they moved cloud saves from Plus years ago? Hard Drive issue? I don't follow?

EdgeXL said:

Some of the more idiotic policies that Sony has put me off of their network. Things like charging for cloud saves and that RIDICULOUS hard drive issue for example. I heard that Sony got rid of that $5 minimum charge so I won't list that as a negative but yeah - there are still some negatives about PSN that annoy people like me who primarily game elsewhere.

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I mean...it's like you want to say something negative about PSN and trying hard searching for some arguments. Even Live is not perfect, but some people acting like it is. Hell people even still think PSN has some big outages and hacks every single day, but when live has problems and that was even more common last year, you won't hear anyone complaining.

TakeNoPrisoners said:

None of that is "Everything" is wrong with PSN. Which was the point of contention. No one is saying it's perfect because it clearly isn't. I thought they moved cloud saves from Plus years ago? Hard Drive issue? I don't follow?

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When you want to download something on Plus you need to have a lot more space than is actually required. I have had instances when I got a notification that I need to free up hard drive space just to download a patch when I have more than enough space already available.

They released a digital only console (PSP Go) years before digitally downloading retail games was relevant, I could see them doing the same with a dedicated video game streaming device.

I doubt the outcome would be any different, though.

Options don't hurt.

But don't expect it to be massive yet.

TakeNoPrisoners said:

I thought they moved cloud saves from Plus years ago?

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Sony is, at the moment, the only one that charges for cloud saves while also being the only one that has effectively a limit on it and the worst implementation (imo) for cloud saves.

Captain_Raoul said:

I mean...it's like you want to say something negative about PSN and trying hard searching for some arguments. Even Live is not perfect, but some people acting like it is. Hell people even still think PSN has some big outages and hacks every single day, but when live has problems and that was even more common last year, you won't hear anyone complaining.

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Oh, knock it off. I am not reaching to find something negative to say about PSN. Sony does have some idiotic policies that are genuinely annoying - why are PS4 cloud saves behind a paywall and why do I need to clear up hard drive space for a 2GB updates when I already have about 50GB free? I am not saying that Live is perfect not do I actually think that but I do feel that service is more reliable and not as annoying as Plus (your mileage may vary).

Was Live down more often last year? I didn't have any major issues with either network being down last year except for the incident when Sony panicked over people playing Gran Turismo Sport and shut down the game's servers temporarily.

EdgeXL said:

When you want to download something on Plus you need to have a lot more space than is actually required. I have had instances when I got a notification that I need to free up hard drive space just to download a patch when I have more than enough space already available.

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Windows will also give you a notification or warning when you want to store some data even when you have more then enough. It just means it wants to cache an amount of it before it can install. It's nothing special and just how it works with storage, and not only for a device like a PS4 but also your computer, laptop, tablet, smarthphone etc.

Caayn said:

Sony is, at the moment, the only one that charges for cloud saves while also being the only one that has effectively a limit on it and the worst implementation (imo) for cloud saves.

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It was especially bad in the early days of the PS4 when we only got 1GB of cloud saves. Just two games filled that up for me.

TakeNoPrisoners said:

No it isn't, my post was easy understand. You took a single quote a took it out of context of the conversation we were having...

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OK, then maybe you'd like to explain why you think it was out of context. It's not like there was a larger conversation going on and I just picked that sentence from thin air. The overall theme of the discussion was that some people thought MS would be better prepared than Sony, while you and others thought different.

One of the people who thought differently to you, Crusadernm, predicted that MS would have a superior service to Sony. You disagreed and stated 'Ms has not shown they have far better capabilities than sony at all in the gaming market in 20 years'. I then come along and disagree with you. How exactly was it out of context?

Captain_Raoul said:

Windows will also give you a notification or warning when you want to store some data even when you have more then enough. It just means it wants to cache an amount of it before it can install. It's nothing special and just how it works with storage, and not only for a device like a PS4 but also your computer, laptop, tablet, smarthphone etc.

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No, my ssmartphone and tablet do not give me these notifications but then again I do not tend to keep large files on those devices. Be that as it may, on Xbox One if I have enough space for something I can simply download it. On PS4 I have to worry if the console is going to tell me to free up some space despite already having much more free space than is needed.

Caayn said:

Sony is, at the moment, the only one that charges for cloud saves while also being the only one that has effectively a limit on it and the worst implementation (imo) for cloud saves.

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Oh ok, i was honestly not aware PS plus was needed for cloud saves. That sucks, i've always had plus so never knew.

EdgeXL said:

When you want to download something on Plus you need to have a lot more space than is actually required. I have had instances when I got a notification that I need to free up hard drive space just to download a patch when I have more than enough space already available.

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That's annoying sure but hardly matching the hyperbole "Everything " is wrong with it, which was really the point.

Kenjovani said:

I have read some of the comments and understand some of the insinuations thrown around and trust me some of them arent just about infrastructure. With that said in respect to infrastructure my comments still stand.

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PSnow is not a industry standard to look up to
Everyone knows this, the topic is more about should Sony attempt to be competitive with a real solution.

EdgeXL said:

No, my ssmartphone and tablet do not give me these notifications but then again I do not tend to keep large files on those devices. Be that as it may, on Xbox One if I have enough space for something I can simply download it. On PS4 I have to worry if the console is going to tell me to free up some space despite already having much more free space than is needed.

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Maybe it reserved space for the OS? I don't know how large your drive is so maybe your doing something wrong? Never had this message and i don't see why this is a big problem? You can't really blame Sony or PSN for it. Are you gonna blame MS when you don't have enough space on your harddrive in Windows? I have 1TB SSHD internal en 2TB external. The 2GB package is maybe compressed and when it's installed a lot larger.

nekkid said:

Nobody is doubting they have the patents to do it. They're doubting the infrastructure to do it on a mass scale.

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Yeah like how Netflix owns its own server infrastructure to be the leading movie streaming service...
Oh wait!

TakeNoPrisoners said:

That's annoying sure but hardly matching the hyperbole "Everything " is wrong with it, which was really the point.

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Sure, but I am not the one who claimed "everything" was wrong with PSN. All I said was that there are things about PSN that are annoying to people like me who not use PS4 as a primary platform.

Captain_Raoul said:

Maybe it reserved space for the OS? I don't know how large your drive is so maybe your doing something wrong? Never had this message and i don't see why this is a big problem? You can't really blame Sony or PSN for it. Are you gonna blame MS when you don't have enough space on your harddrive in Windows? I have 1TB SSHD internal en 2TB external. The 2GB package is maybe compressed and when it's installed a lot larger.

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Again, the issue is not having enough space on my hard drive. The issue is having more than enough space but being told to free up even more for no good reason. That is a PSN issue and I can blame Sony/PSN as it is yet another reason why I should not buy third party games on PS4 because I do not want to deal with this.

By the way, I am not the only one on Era to complain about this. Search the forum sometime.

nekkid said:

Nobody is doubting they have the patents to do it. They're doubting the infrastructure to do it on a mass scale.

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What's more mass than a streaming service on the PS4 with it's approaching 90 million user base...and PC.

TheGhost said:

PSnow is not a industry standard to look up to
Everyone knows this, the topic is more about should Sony attempt to be competitive with a real solution.

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So an actual product isn't a real solution.

What if Sony did improve it, but with no need for a separate device? Like they are doing right now.

This is the issue some ppl have with this topic. Just dismissing an actual product, service. I hope MS does have a great streaming service. I just wanna wait till they actually have a product out first.

Streaming console sounds a lot like VR in terms of really testing if market will accept it or not. It's MS' version of VR.

I say Sony should sit out for now.

EdgeXL said:

Again, the issue is not having enough space on my hard drive. The issue is having more than enough space but being told to free up even more for no good reason. That is a PSN issue and I can blame Sony/PSN as it is yet another reason why I should not buy third party games on PS4 because I do not want to deal with this.

By the way, I am not the only one on Era to complain about this. Search the forum sometime.

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Still it's nothing special in storage solutions. Having enough space doesn't directly mean that it is enough for that file. Haven't seen this problem so if you can provide me with a link? Just check how large the file is when it's unpacked.

Maybe you need to rebuild your database...maybe it's fixed after you did this.

Gaming always has a shiny object that it chases after and tries to convince everyone that its the next big thing.

We saw alot of success with the Wii mote but that only lasted a few years and the other companies motion controls never came close to taking off like that, Microsoft told us that the cloud was going to make the Xbox One 4x more powerful than the native hardware would normally allow, they stopped talking about it after the system launched, then companies told us how VR is finally ready for the mainstream and its going to change everything when the writing was on the wall that its still a long ways off from being ideal for the average gaming fan, now we have companies tell us how big of a deal game streaming is when nobody asked for it or seems enthusiastic about the game streaming services we've had for years.

Once game streaming launches and inevitably under performs they'll go chase the next shiny thing that nobody is asking for.

Yeah I definitely think they should offer a streaming box as an option. I'll always buy traditional consoles but there are millions who would be attracted to the convenience and lower cost of a streaming box.