Trevor Noah Responds to Criticism from the French Ambassador

G.O.O. · Jul 19, 2018

I'd also like to post that cartoon that was made after the final

"Usually, I'm asked to make this test by the far-right, but yes : there is [racial slur] blood in that national team"

""racialized" blood"

Not saying the cartoonist is right, but that's pretty much how many in France will see it.

30yearsofhurt · Jul 19, 2018

Rupetta said:
What annoys me slightly is that no one in this thread is willing to put down what the perceived common culture of 'Africans' is, what the signifier that creates the national myth - what is the common heritage they are suppose to celebrate?

1.2 billion people. We don't have time to understand them or their massive diversity so we'll just lump them all in the same basket. Like we can lump Indians, Indonesians and Japanese together in the 'Asian' basket. Right?

Onebadlion · Jul 19, 2018

X1 Two said:
It was a stupid joke to begin with and I doubt it was even written by Noah himself. He doesn't strike me as a stupid guy. Even in a best case scenario it was a pun that racists make. Straight out of the "they are French but not really" play book.

Yeah, minorities in France, and elsewhere in Europe, have had to fight hard to be recognised as citizens on a par with anyone else. This attitude is a step back. By trying to make a "clever" point like this, he looks ignorant of the situation over here.

Cup O' Tea? · Jul 19, 2018

I mean French people can be overly patriotic sometimes, I guess. They aren't the only people who like to puff their chests out (here's looking at you America) but I didn't think the ambassador's letter was that horrible, aside from being a bit pompous.

Noah is on the money though when he talks about how they are French when something good happens, but African if it's something bad. I see that kind of racism all the time in Australia too. Look up Cathy Freeman if you ever needed an example. She's a national icon because she won gold at the Olympics in 2000 and I have no doubts plenty of racist Aussies enjoyed that victory and then went right back to shitting on indigenous people afterward.

Deleted member 9305 · Jul 19, 2018

Trevor is really sharp, him being on TV is almost a waste.

boris_feinbrand · Jul 19, 2018

mael said:
Front National or whatever they call themselves maybe but Marine Lepen?
After her disastrous appearance last year basically killed all of her credibility?
Not really.
And using racist rhetoric isn't going to do anything but normalize racist rhetoric.
There's issue with skin color and religion but let's not claim that it's anything beyond discrimination issues.

Which is the French national football team.

You won't get an argument there. They are French as far as I'm concerned, but I've seen and heard enough people call them N---s in France, Italy, Germany and Austria (over the last 20 years)... this isn't some fringe phenomenon, no matter what we would want to pretend.
Le Pen is incompetent, her message however hasn't lost any popular appeal.

Sticking our heads into the sand pretending that everything is going just swell is what allowed these vermin to scurry out of the recesses of society and infesting everything. Not some south african comedian coopting their rethoric to make a throwaway joke that judging from the reactions fell flat on its face.

Visanideth · Jul 19, 2018

weekev said:
This is the last thing I'm gonna say in this thread cos it's going in circles. I see nothing wrong with an African dude celebrating guys originating from Africa being successful.

The French guys who rightfully consider themselves French and not African however have a problem with it. Their families have fought for them to be considered part of the country they were born in and they wear their colours proudly, despite what some asshole from the US who's taken Black Panther a bit too seriously may think.

Integration is a fundamental part of a multiethnic society. People would riot if a French journalist called Obama "an african man in the White House".

Hyun Sai · Jul 19, 2018

Yeah, sorry Trevor, as a french POC, that was a very bad joke, because that's what the racist are and were saying here, even 20 years ago. Jean Marie Le Pen kept saying the French Team was too "colored", so you can understand how bad taste your take is.

But I can understand his confusion from his american perspective. Just don't do it again, you sound like a far right winger from here.

Irminsul · Jul 19, 2018

Rupetta said:
What annoys me slightly is that no one in this thread is willing to put down what the perceived common culture of 'Africans' is, what the signifier that creates the national myth - what is the common culture they are suppose to celebrate?

Exactly. I mean, even if the players felt the way Americans think they should feel, why would they ever feel connected to an "African" heritage? Moroccan, sure, or Algerian (just to give some examples, not specific to this case), but that's it.

Windrunner · Jul 19, 2018

Mr_Moogle said:
Noah is on the money though when he talks about how they are French when something good happens, but African if it's something bad.

Wrong. The far right are pretty consistent about this. My racist grandfather refuses to support the French national team, doesn't matter if they are winning the WC or dropping out in the group stages. It doesn't matter what a non-white person achieves, to a racist they will never be French enough.

That's why you don't use the language of the far right with this. Noah has fucked up really badly here.

mael · Jul 19, 2018

boris_feinbrand said:
You won't get an argument there. They are French as far as I'm concerned, but I've seen and heard enough people call them N---s in France, Italy, Germany and Austria (over the last 20 years)... this isn't some fringe phenomenon, no matter what we would want to pretend.
Le Pen is incompetent, her message however hasn't lost any popular appeal.

Sticking our heads into the sand pretending that everything is going just swell is what allowed these vermin to scurry out of the recesses of society and infesting everything. Not some south african comedian coopting their rethoric to make a throwaway joke that judging from the reactions fell flat on its face.

So you see the issue with racists in the Europe and yet you don't see the issue of singling out Black population in France as specifically African?
You'll notice that the player who spent the less time in the country isn't considered anything but French while the others born and raised in the Republic should somehow attach an identity that never existed because of their skin color?

Van Bur3n · Jul 19, 2018

Yeah, this ultimately boils down to how one (in this case the players) personally identifies. There is no wrong way to go about it unless the context itself is blatantly racist.

The ambassador finding what Noah said offensive is understandable given the context of ethnicity in France and Noah still made points worth talking about regarding context.

Regardless, let the players as individuals decide and let Trevor Noah learn from this.

Berto · Jul 19, 2018

I like how americans say "african etnithity" when you are black and not "european etnithity" when you are white. Neither are real. When you are white suddendly you are italian, irish and whatever. What if the parents of your italian ancestor that imigrated to america was, I dont know, swiss? These stuff gets lost in time.

Slaythe · Jul 19, 2018

boris_feinbrand said:
You won't get an argument there. They are French as far as I'm concerned, but I've seen and heard enough people call them N---s in France, Italy, Germany and Austria (over the last 20 years)... this isn't some fringe phenomenon, no matter what we would want to pretend.
Le Pen is incompetent, her message however hasn't lost any popular appeal.

Sticking our heads into the sand pretending that everything is going just swell is what allowed these vermin to scurry out of the recesses of society and infesting everything. Not some south african comedian coopting their rethoric to make a throwaway joke that judging from the reactions fell flat on its face.

What popular appeal ? There's a reason they lose every time. They're a shitty minority.

Did you see the tens of thousands of people in the streets of paris ? That's popular.

AcademicSaucer · Jul 19, 2018

Irminsul said:
Exactly. I mean, even if the players felt the way Americans think they should feel, why would they ever feel connected to an "African" heritage? Moroccan, sure, or Algerian (just to give some examples, not specific to this case), but that's it.

You don't get it, we are all supposed to see these things in the same way the US sees it, any deviation from that view means you are wrong

D65 · Jul 19, 2018

My blood is boiling here.

Here's the thing. If you're a minority in the US or anywhere else and you think you should be able to celebrate or identify as your ethnic origin, yes that's great. But to impose that onto other people is where that's not good. It's a personal choice if someone wants to. These French players are Team France, to say otherwise is racist as fuck, I'm sorry if you know you ain't but in this instance it's a fucked up thing to say.

How about, instead of coming in here and leaving with the same mindset, you leave understanding how the players themselves would prefer. Technically, they are French. Objectively, they are French.

I can't tell you how many mixed raced people in know here in the UK hate it when other people dictate our labels as anything before we say what it is.

And this is ONLY happening because they are black. If they had heritage from elsewhere but appeared white no one would care.

In fact, you know, I'm sure they're all proud to be black too. But that doesn't make them "African" .

G.O.O. · Jul 19, 2018

Also, real question : isn't mocking the French accent insensitive ?

I know, we were a colonial power, not slaves or anything, and I get the banter. But I feel like it's a serious issue that's being discussed here and Trevor really seems to miss the point by doing that.

Deleted member 16609 · Jul 19, 2018

Mr_Moogle said:
I mean French people can be overly patriotic sometimes, I guess. They aren't the only people who like to puff their chests out (here's looking at you America) but I didn't think the ambassador's letter was that horrible, aside from being a bit pompous.

Noah is on the money though when he talks about how they are French when something good happens, but African if it's something bad. I see that kind of racism all the time in Australia too. Look up Cathy Freeman if you ever needed an example. She's a national icon because she won gold at the Olympics in 2000 and I have no doubts plenty of racist Aussies enjoyed that victory and then went right back to shitting on indigenous people afterward.

You have any articles where a black, born French men or women are called "African" by the French media? Because if you do not have any don't compared your countries problems with others.

Michaelandavinci · Jul 19, 2018

So how many times have Africa win the Basketball Olympics Gold medal?

Onebadlion · Jul 19, 2018

It's kinda disrespectful to the actual African teams who participated too. He should have just apologised and left it at that.

cdyhybrid · Jul 19, 2018

D65 said:
I can't tell you how many mixed raced people in know here in the UK hate it when other people dictate our labels as anything before we say what it is.

Then you'd understand why an American citizen of X ethnic origin would be a bit steamed by a European person posting in this thread and stating unequivocally that they are not X because they were not born and raised in X country, yes?

Alexandros · Jul 19, 2018

Feep said:
French ambassador - "They are French, not African."
Bad people - "They are African, not French."
Noah and actual reality - "They are French in nationality, they are African by descent/race."

Not sure why this is complicated. I can understand why the third option didn't come through in the joke, and why it could be seen as offensive by those in France, for sure, considering how option two is used against them. But the reality is three, and Noah knows that.

French players: "We are French". And that should be the end of the discussion. Putting race over nationality might be the way America does it but other parts of the world are different. The only people I'm always hearing putting emphasis on a person's race is racist assholes. I understand that the US deals with these things in a very different way but any comedian should take these cultural differences into account before making a joke. I'm sure it was not his intention but Noah's joke was racist. He should educate himself and apologize instead of doubling down. When the players themselves are calling you out it's time to realize that you're wrong.

D65 · Jul 19, 2018

Berto said:
I like how americans say "african etnithity" when you are black and not "european etnithity" when you are white. Neither are real. When you are white suddendly you are italian, irish and whatever. What if the parents of your italian ancestor that imigrated to america was, I dont know, swiss? These stuff gets lost in time.

Low key why the term African American is bullshit when it refers to people who's haven't had heritage from the continent in generations. Caribbean, etc.

Cup O' Tea? · Jul 19, 2018

Windrunner said:
Wrong. The far right are pretty consistent about this. My racist grandfather refuses to support the French national team, doesn't matter if they are winning the WC or dropping out in the group stages. It doesn't matter what a non-white person achieves, to a racist they will never be French enough.

That's why you don't use the language of the far right with this. Noah has fucked up really badly here.

Maybe racism has a spectrum too.

I know what you mean though. I've met my share of people like that.

KunaiDrilla said:
You have any articles where a black, born French men or women are called "African" by the French media? Because if you do not have any don't compared your countries problems with others.

Oh get off your high horse mate. The Cathy Freeman thing is an apt comparison. It all started with colonialism and the shit indigenous people have to put up with here mirrors that of what French African people have to deal with.

Godzilla's Left Toe · Jul 19, 2018

G.O.O. said:
Also, real question : isn't mocking the French accent insensitive ?

I know, we were a colonial power, not slaves or anything, and I get the banter. But I feel like it's a serious issue that's being discussed here and Trevor really seems to miss the point by doing that.

Sorry but what?

cdyhybrid · Jul 19, 2018

Godzilla's Left Toe said:
Sorry but what?

I think the poster is saying the French were the colonizers and not the slaves.

GuessMyUserName · Jul 19, 2018

France believes in a colour-blind society - every person is French, to say otherwise would be blatantly racist, judging a person by their "ethnicity".
North American culture believes being colour-blind is highly problematic, ignoring countless struggles, as well as a shameful history of stripping away one's culture

I mean for America, Colbert not being able to see race on the Report was a satirical gag commenting on the ignorance of the concept.

Trevor just stepped on a crosscultural landmine. As a South African living in America he is inspired to see descendants of other African ancestries involved with the French team, making a joke in celebration of their backgrounds -- and that's the "nuance" Trevor refers to in this video. It's obviously understandable to take offense from the French perspective, but conflating him with right-wing racists using their ancestry as a negative is completely off. On this side of the ocean, for black Americans in particular due to historical cultural erasure, this is a big deal in an incredibly uplifting way. To ignore this context and treat the comments the same as said by the French far-right is as ignorant as it was for Trevor to make the African team joke.

As a Canadian it's kinda interesting to me to see American culture in this spot -- we grow up viewing our country as a "cultural mosaic" of people from different origins, contrasted to America being known as a "melting pot" where everybody becomes an American. To me as a Canadian... there is no "Canadian", we all come from somewhere else. Well, except for the aboriginal population which is treated terribly <_<

G.O.O. · Jul 19, 2018

Godzilla's Left Toe said:
Sorry but what?

"France was a colonial power and wasn't enslaved"

BlackSalad · Jul 19, 2018

X1 Two said:
France had a civil war as well, you know? They also had colonies. They had slavery. They have lots of immigration. I think France has a better understanding of the issues than any American.

The french didn't have a civil war because of the treatment of an imported race to support an economy in half the country. Its not a relevant comparison.

There is a lot of cultural disconnect in this thread. African-american is a enduring prideful term in the US while apparently the french equivalent is not, from what I understand anyway.

Godzilla's Left Toe · Jul 19, 2018

G.O.O. said:
"France was a colonial power and wasn't enslaved"

Ok.

Ferulci · Jul 19, 2018

Mr_Moogle said:
I mean French people can be overly patriotic sometimes, I guess.

I disagree. French living in France might be the less patriotic people I've ever saw. We dont have national flags in our house, we are the first to do french bashing and the grass always seem the be greener everywhere else. Nobody cares if during the national anthem you take your hat off or not.
If you talk with the average french talking about france, you might think he's talking about Syria.

Mr_Moogle said:
I mean French people can be overly patriotic sometimes, I guess.
Noah is on the money though when he talks about how they are French when something good happens, but African if it's something bad.

He's not.
The far-right is doing this but thankfully that's a minority.
While it's far from perfect, the majority doesnt think that way and is able to separate your color from your actions. Most beloved frenchs are POC (Noah,Zidane,Riner). We suffered terrorists attacks for years and still come election time, we didn't go far right.
What is maddening is that we got something bringing us together, reminding us what we're standing for, and you've got people who got nothing to do with this who are trying to divide us. And it's not the far right, it's the non-eu progressive left.

D65 · Jul 19, 2018

cdyhybrid said:
Then you'd understand why an American citizen of X ethnic origin would be a bit steamed by a European person posting in this thread and stating unequivocally that they are not X because they were not born and raised in X country, yes?

Who is doing that?

We can describe our colour. Our heritage. But our nationality is objective. In the context of a World Cup team, nationality is the question. And for these footballers, the answer is French.

Mass_Pincup · Jul 19, 2018

BlackSalad said:
The french didn't have a civil war because of the treatment of an imported race to support an economy in half the country. Its not a relevant comparison.

There is a lot of cultural disconnect in this thread. African-american is a enduring prideful term in the US while apparently the french equivalent is not, from what I understand anyway.

Yes because most French people with African roots can exactly pinpoint where they're from. They most likely know where their african families are and their cultural backgrounds. All of that was robbed from African-American hence the difference.

Visanideth · Jul 19, 2018

Rupetta said:
What annoys me slightly is that no one in this thread is willing to put down what the perceived common culture of 'Africans' is, what the signifier that creates the national myth - what is the common culture they are suppose to celebrate?

Once you start to formulate these things the absurdity will emerge. It will be as absurd and racist as the 'protestant work-ethics'. The nationalism and the nation-building politics that is inscribed in sports can and should be mocked... but not by replacing one myth with another

governing people's identities towards one singular identity, as a way to open up a more diverse spectrum of identities is going to be problematic.

I assume race is the only signifier that people will come up with in response to my question about what makes 'the African'. This might make sense in the US experience (or it might not, someone in this thread alteady asked what reactions a progressive joke on 'Africans winning the Olympics for the US' would trigger) but the resentment of French POCs in this very thread shows that identity politics is complex and contextualized. Not recognizing that context can be an act of violence in itself, no matter the food intentions. Calls for the construction of an identity of "French-African" is an inherrently US idea, almost imperial - as it would likely not solve any of the racialized problems in European setting.

In the US people have been stripped of their cultural heritage, most African Americans do not know if their heritage is Yoruba or Oromo, so there is a need for a pan-African myth. For most POVs in France there is no such need for identity construction. Understanding this difference is key in the struggle for solidarity.

This is another good point.

African-Americans tend to have this "panafrican" myth that in some way feels... hypocritical? Because they apparently strongly care about something (their heritage) yet they seem to know very little about it. Expecially in the context of a world cup where Africa isn't partecipating as a continent but as individual states.

There's no "Africa". Europeans know because we live next to it. Nigerians partying because Senegal won makes as much sense as Germans partying because France won.
Africa isn't this cradle of misery united by misfortune that is only waiting for one unifying event, a single joy to drag it out of the mud. It's a collective of different nations, ethnicities and cultures much like Europe and Asian.

Keep in mind that not all soccer players feel the same way. Mario Balotelli is a black italian football player who considers himself italian (like he is) but he's also proud of his african heritage. He, however, was adopted in a young age (unlike the french players, who are second generation for the most part). There's a huge difference between a french player going "I want to dedicate this victory to Africa/my african country of origin too" (something the right may use against integration but who cares) and a third party, from another country, trying to impose his view on integration on the french players, no matter their skin colour.

Godzilla's Left Toe · Jul 19, 2018

D65 said:
Who is doing that?

We can describe our colour. Our heritage. But our nationality is objective. In the context of a World Cup team, nationality is the question. And for these footballers, the answer is French.

Olaf said:
If you're not born in Africa your'e not African.

.

Visanideth · Jul 19, 2018

Mr_Moogle said:
Noah is on the money though when he talks about how they are French when something good happens, but African if it's something bad.

That's probably the worst part and the signal he doesn't see the problem in his argument. He's doing exactly the same. He's saying there are times where the distinction should be made because it's politically convenient to one side.

D65 · Jul 19, 2018

Godzilla's Left Toe said:
This.

That poster is ignorant in many ways it's really besides the discussion. The discussion here is that what Trevor said is bullshit and fuck him for playing into this crap.

Tell me how many generations of their family it will take before they aren't Team Africa? Is it when or if those descendants children aren't black? Is it specifically 3 or 5 generations?

Feral · Jul 19, 2018

G.O.O. said:
Also, real question : isn't mocking the French accent insensitive ?

mocking any accent is insensitive, yes. It's not like the French get the worst of it either, I mean, I'm German

however, I think that it should be allowed as a comedic tool . I haven't watched Trevor in a long time but he used to imitate stereotypical African accents all the time if I recall correctly. It's not something to be terribly upset about, imo

Keuja · Jul 19, 2018

cdyhybrid said:
A lot of PoC (specifically black people) over on this side of the pond had only their origins (or what little they had left of them) to form their identities around, unless you consider their shared struggle in bondage. They were denied their national heritage and culture (i.e. the societal perks and benefits afforded to citizens of their country of residence) by a government born of European colonialism because of their ethnic origins - they were barred by law from receiving education, the right to vote, etc. because they were descended from African people, despite the fact that they were born on American soil and only ever knew life in America. Do you see why someone coming from that perspective on the relationship between European nations and people of color might find it a bit odd that a government official is so eager to push aside someone's ethnic origin?

To be clear, the players should be free to identify as whatever they want to identify as. I just don't think people should be so quick to criticize those that celebrate the success of people who share ethnic origins with them when they've been disadvantaged for centuries BECAUSE of those ethnic origins.

Feel free to celebrate their success if you feel you share a past with the French players, just leave your American politics on the door steps.
Those players have been called dirty African, fake French and immigrant their whole life by racists because the color of their skin despite being French born and raised. They wear the French shirt with pride until the final victory only to be smugly told (as a "joke" haha so funny... ) by Americans/South Africans /whatever, that they are Africans not French.
The ambassador response is in reaction to this. He's not pushing aside any ethnic origins, he is highlighting that they are as French as anyone, whatever the Trevors and racists of the world thinks.
Instead of ignorantly doubling down on his shitty joke maybe that Trevor guy should have taken this opportunity to actually try to understand the French player's point of views.

cdyhybrid · Jul 19, 2018

D65 said:
Who is doing that?

I mean, this is all just from the first two pages of this thread:

Olaf said:
If you're not born in Africa your'e not African.

And in response to this post:

Enzom21 said:
Do you feel the same way about people who are Irish but weren't born in Ireland? How about Italians, not born in Italy?

we get all this:

Sage said:
Let me tell you the rest of the world does feel that way. Nothing more annoying than an American person telling me that they're 'Scottish' in their clear as day east coast accent when I tell them where I'm from. Yeah fucking right, and I'm a Gael from the Kingdom of Dal Riata.

PunishedOkabe said:
How can you be Irish and not be born/live in Ireland?

Khalme said:
You can in America !

People are 1/8th Irish, French, German, British etc..
And 1/16th Navajo because it's important to mention it.

PunishedOkabe said:
Uhhhhhh

Being 1/8th Irish doesn't mean you're Irish.

You would be just American.

So apparently if you practice all of a culture's customs and hold the same values and observe the same holidays/etc. you're not of that culture even if you are literally 100% from it by both blood and by practice, but not born and raised there.

Yeah, fuck that. Especially after we get told our whole lives what we can and cannot do specifically because of that ethnic background. Nah, that's fucked.

Elynn · Jul 19, 2018

GuessMyUserName said:
France believes in a colour-blind society - every person is French, to say otherwise would be blatantly racist, judging a person by their "ethnicity".

Saying every person is french doesn't make it a "color blind" society. We know Pogba, Lemar, Kanté, etc. are black.
And no one would have had a problem if Noah had talked about that instead of just dumping them all in the "African" box (as if Africa was a monolith in the first place).

Irminsul · Jul 19, 2018

AcademicSaucer said:
You don't get it, we are all supposed to see these things in the same way the US sees it, any deviation from that view means you are wrong

The funny thing is, if he had just celebrated a French team of diverse backgrounds winning the WC, no one would have bat an eye. But he couldn't just let go of an American point of view, which is kinda weird seeing his own upbringing. And then he doubled down when the people he was talking about already made perfectly clear they want to be seen as French.

G.O.O. said:
Also, real question : isn't mocking the French accent insensitive ?

I dunno about insensitive (but probably yes, considering the topic at hand), but it's definitely neither clever nor funny. Maybe he should've started smoking and hold a baguette as well.

It's the same thing with John Oliver whenever he talks about Germany, though (well, the accent and clichés are different, of course). I mean, if that still counts as humour in the US, so be it. I just think it's really lame.

John Doe · Jul 19, 2018

RastaMentality said:
Jamaicans are as far removed from Africa as many white americans from europe who call themselves irish or german or italian. Calling us African isn't that far fetched.

I don't think white Americans who have lived in America since the time when slavery still existed call themselves anything but American. The whole Irish-American etc thing seems to be, to me for those whose families immigrated in the 20th century and on.

PunishedOkabe · Jul 19, 2018

cdyhybrid said:
So apparently if you practice all of a culture's customs and hold the same values and observe the same holidays/etc. you're not of that culture even if you are literally 100% from it by both blood and by practice, but not born and raised there.

Yeah, fuck that. Especially after we get told our whole lives what we can and cannot do specifically because of that ethnic background. Nah, that's fucked.

If you're 1/8th Irish (whatever that means), living in America all your life it is ridiculous to say you are Irish. You have Irish relations/ ancestry, but you're not Irish.

Arjen · Jul 19, 2018

G.O.O. said:
Also, real question : isn't mocking the French accent insensitive ?

I know, we were a colonial power, not slaves or anything, and I get the banter. But I feel like it's a serious issue that's being discussed here and Trevor really seems to miss the point by doing that.

I wouldn't say insensitive, but it's sure getting tiresome. Especially coming from English speakers who only know English.
I mean, come on, you're mocking how someone sounds making an effort speaking in a language that is not native to them. Lazy "comedy" and it's annoying the hell out of me everytime I hear it.

Deleted member 9237 · Jul 19, 2018

A comedic reading of the ambassador's letter with the audience laughing at serious points that he brought up is completely tone deaf

D65 · Jul 19, 2018

cdyhybrid said:
So apparently if you practice all of a culture's customs and hold the same values and observe the same holidays/etc. you're not of that culture even if you are literally 100% from it by both blood and by practice, but not born and raised there.

Yeah, fuck that. Especially after we get told our whole lives what we can and cannot do specifically because of that ethnic background. Nah, that's fucked.

Here's what I want you to consider. By calling them team africa, choosing their identity for them, you are implying that they "practice all of a culture's customs and hold the same values and observe the same holidays/etc." of their heritage.

You don't get to do that to other people. All of those posters are just as wrong as Trevor on a different note.

I work right next to this girl who joined us for dinner and said she was shit at chopsticks and made a note that she wasn't very "cultured". She tried to go Hong Kong but was a fish out of water. At the end, because I'm from London, I commented on how she is the most Mancunian person I've ever met (the city Manchester) and she had to say:

"I'm happy you said that... People don't tend to see me as if I'm from here..."

Shit Trevor says can directly cause people to feel like they can't be what it says on their birth certificate. And they are singled out and obvious because they are PoCs.

Now if this girl, who doesn't speak a word of Chinese ever wished to say she was Chinese then yes she should be able to. But it starts with what she identifies as.

. .

Not that China would ever really let her but w/e. We had that discussion too. These are all valid and real things that can exist at the same time.

Calling them Team Africa is fucked. No matter what.

Visanideth · Jul 19, 2018

Michaelandavinci said:
So how many times have Africa won the Basketball Olympics Gold medal?

G.O.O. · Jul 19, 2018

Menace said:
mocking any accent is insensitive, yes. It's not like the French get the worst of it either, I mean, I'm German

however, I think that it should be allowed as a comedic tool . I haven't watched Trevor in a long time but he used to imitate stereotypical African accents all the time if I recall correctly. It's not something to be terribly upset about, imo

Usually I'm not upset about it either. But in that case French people tried to make a point about the fact that his joke was problematic, answering with a fake french accent isn't great.

Irminsul said:
I dunno about insensitive (but probably yes, considering the topic at hand), but it's definitely neither clever nor funny. Maybe he should've started smoking and hold a baguette as well.

It's the same thing with John Oliver whenever he talks about Germany, though (well, the accent and clichés are different, of course). I mean, if that still counts as humour in the US, so be it. I just think it's really lame.

Arjen said:
I wouldn't say insensitive, but it's sure getting tiresome. Especially coming from English speakers who only know English.
I mean, come on, you're mocking how someone sounds making an effort speaking in a language that is not native to them. Lazy "comedy" and it's annoying the hell out of me everytime I hear it.

Yeah, as I said I don't think it's that offensive most of the time. It's just weird to do it when you're portraying yourself as the sensitive guy.

And yeah, it's cheap and lazy.

FeliciaFelix · Jul 19, 2018

I think Trevor and the Americans telling the French to be more American (x-American) is projecting neuroses. Plus relations in America are a hot mess and I dont blame the French for trying to craft their own solution as flawed as it is.

Trevor Noah Responds to Criticism from the French Ambassador

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