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MayorSquirtle

Member
May 17, 2018
7,961
Basic forward compatibility wouldn't surprise me, but there's no way in hell they'll let you bring Pikachu or Eevee forward. They have buffed stats and movepools, they appear in every cutscene, there are mechanics in the game that apply only to them, and it would kind of kill the whole mood of the game if you were able to transfer away this Pokemon that's formed an extra special bonded-for-life type relationship with the trainer.
 

Sea lion

Banned
Nov 8, 2017
903
What's the point of making it a series when the only selling point is nostalgia for gen 1 fans? If they made this same game with new Pokémon, the backlash would be huge - it's being protected by Kanto nostalgia.

You won't see DP fans asking for this instead of an actual remake.

I definitely agree they're gonna lose a big chunk of the player base once they introduce a Chikorita, which is one of the reasons I always question genwunners. If they love the series so much, why are they so against world building? God forbid you ever visit a town that isn't named after a colour.

But for the none close minded, I think Gamefreak is trying to ease them and new fans into the series and introduce them to the Pokemon slowly so they don't feel too overwhelmed when they play the core games.

The people saying Pokemon is too hard core are ridiculous, it's a god damn kids game, but I can see people like my girlfriend, who's never touched the series, can be eased into it more naturally with these new games.

I'm not too big on Lets Go, but I've come to see it as a necessary evil if it allows Game Freak to cut the tutorials, hand holding, and gen 1 pandering in the core games. These are the things the things they put in for new fans, but its holding the games back, so dumping it all in a separate series and allowing more freedom in the core series is a good way to go.

At least I hope that's what they've got planned. I'm fully prepared for that Kanto a few hundred years in the future bullshit rumour which really wouldn't surprise me.

I don't want the core games to be BotW, but they do need to give players more freedom and challenge. Let Lets Go be for the ones wanting a more casual experience and if it dies after this game, at least Game Freak tried to appeal to lapsed fans and give them a new gateway to enter the series. If they reject I hope they just say "fuck em".
 

Ereineon

Member
Nov 8, 2017
1,214
its true one thing though, even if they try to make bigger cities since BW they mostly feel a bit "empty"... since that generation its true that the cities (at least the main one) are getting better, but at the same time it feels like they are not pumping up the npcs. most of the time it feels like you only have at most 3-4 important places in each town and as they grow bigger they feel.... more like wasted space.
in XY at least luminose felt more lively than any city in SM (the bigger is the first island? at least by memory) even if the city itself was "worst" as a 3d space (and a bit confusing with the camera XD)
 

LinkStrikesBack

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
16,364
Pokémon is the most safe franchise Nintendo has in terms of just how little changes game to game. (Edit: I should be clear that I'm specifically not talking about the underlying battle mechanics for the haedcore players here. I'm well aware they put a lot of effort updating those between gens)

The vast majority of routes are straight lines from one ton to another, with minimalistic detours that have not advanced much from the game boy era of games. Yes, they look much nicer, but thats a surface level difference. Compare how much Zelda changes in world design from ocarina of time to Twilight Princess to breath of the wild, or mario from 64 to sunshine to galaxy to Odyssey and the difference is stark.

I almost think the Pokémon developers are scared to do anything that might bring some modern standards in to Pokémon.
 

lvl 99 Pixel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,699
Pokémon is the most stale franchise Nintendo is (somewhat) responsible for. I don't even want to imagine where the franchise could be right now, with GameFreak out of the equation.

Is it? in terms of single player games maybe, but games like Smash, Pikmin, Kirby, Mario Kart (and other spinoffs) are just as, if not more iterative. Nintendo loves their formulas, and I don't blame them when they're successful on that level. Zelda definitely was on that static formula before BOTW.
 

KushalaDaora

Member
Oct 27, 2017
7,838
its true one thing though, even if they try to make bigger cities since BW they mostly feel a bit "empty"... since that generation its true that the cities (at least the main one) are getting better, but at the same time it feels like they are not pumping up the npcs. most of the time it feels like you only have at most 3-4 important places in each town and as they grow bigger they feel.... more like wasted space.
in XY at least luminose felt more lively than any city in SM (the bigger is the first island? at least by memory) even if the city itself was "worst" as a 3d space (and a bit confusing with the camera XD)

Yeah, Lumiose and Castellia is great because they truly feel like a city.
 

GhostTrick

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,315
Up
Is it? in terms of single player games maybe, but games like Smash, Pikmin, Kirby, Mario Kart (and other spinoffs) are just as, if not more iterative. Nintendo loves their formulas, and I don't blame them when they're successful on that level. Zelda definitely was on that static formula before BOTW.


How was Zelda static ?
Skyward Sword played nothing like Twilight Princess
 

Deleted member 2793

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
15,368
I'm not too big on Lets Go, but I've come to see it as a necessary evil if it allows Game Freak to cut the tutorials, hand holding, and gen 1 pandering in the core games. These are the things the things they put in for new fans, but its holding the games back, so dumping it all in a separate series and allowing more freedom in the core series is a good way to go.
I don't think they will do this because of Masuda's comments about "Yeah, we're making Let's Go for more casual Go fans!" because he follows up with "But the next game can't be too hard or have complex areas or post game too because kids will get bored and go back to their smartphones".

I don't want the core games to be BotW, but they do need to give players more freedom and challenge.
I feel the same. I don't want an open world game, I like the random battles, etc. We just need actual good maps and a bit of challenge and content for fans that actually follow the series.

Feels like they don't want to throw a single bone. I doubt kids would drop Pokémon if it had areas more well designed and good challenges for post-game (Battle Frontier, rematches, minigames as complex as contests, etc).
 

Bowser

Member
Nov 7, 2017
2,814
Are you fucking for real?
34-beachfront.jpg


Also good way to show you've never touched Pokémon games
Just give me that in HD with better textures, shading, effects and I will be happy.

I love Let's Go graphics but they clearly wanted the games to remind us of old ones, hence why they look closer imo to ORAS in HD than Sun and Moon, specially when it comes to the camera and the way everything is shaped.
 

WrenchNinja

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,745
Canada
It is strange how the topic of conversation has steered into an argument over visuals and ambition when it's about Masuda's dumbass response to making sure Let's Go players get to transfer their Pokémon to the the next game while we can't transfer any of our Pokémon from the actual core games to Let's Go.
 

Serebii

Serebii.net Webmaster
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
13,126
It is strange how the topic of conversation has steered into an argument over visuals and ambition when it's about Masuda's dumbass response to making sure Let's Go players get to transfer their Pokémon to the the next game while we can't transfer any of our Pokémon from the actual core games to Let's Go.
But we'll probably be able to transfer them to Gen 8 so it's fine
 

lvl 99 Pixel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,699
Up



How was Zelda static ?
Skyward Sword played nothing like Twilight Princess

it still followed the linear dungeon to dungeon style via a hub field with an instrument and sidekick to get some number of relics and featured recurring characters and items+weapons.
it was formulaic to the point where the series had a massive change that it was praised for?

Most of the gameplay was still finding small keys to get the dungeon item to get the big key to fight the bosses.
 

Ereineon

Member
Nov 8, 2017
1,214
It is strange how the topic of conversation has steered into an argument over visuals and ambition when it's about Masuda's dumbass response to making sure Let's Go players get to transfer their Pokémon to the the next game while we can't transfer any of our Pokémon from the actual core games to Let's Go.
i actually dont mind that. its fine if we cant transfer our pokes to lets go (it would be like taking goku into a boxing ring at this moment XD, lets go its like kindergarden for pokemon at this moment for me at least) but if i can transfer (some of) my pokes from GO to the main games, even if using lets go... its an excuse at least to get it xd
 

AlexFlame116

Prophet of Truth - One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 17, 2017
23,182
Utah
Man I just want to transfer the Pokemon I capture in Let's Go into Gen 8. Is that so hard Masuda? It sounds like he isn't even sure if he wants to fully commit to that.

I'll judge GF on whether or not they can evolve the series AFTER they release their first next generation title on the Switch. Since Let's Go is from the 7th generation and is a different take on the core concepts, it doesn't count as an example to me.

I don't care if the next game is open world or not, especially when people have been complaining about the excess of them lately.
 

GhostTrick

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,315
it still followed the linear dungeon to dungeon style via a hub field with an instrument and sidekick to get some number of relics and featured recurring characters and items+weapons.
it was formulaic to the point where the series had a massive change that it was praised for?



It was following a a pattern it's true, but the serie always saw big gameplay AND visual improvements.
Since Ocarina of Time, each games had their own thing and the world was getting bigger and the visuals better.
For Pokémon though, we're stuck with a 2D gameboy level design.
 

Deleted member 8791

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
6,383
I think Pokémon is better to aim for a type of Xenoblade 2 exploration. All routes having a clear main road to follow but if you venture of it there's a lot to see and explore. I'd like that personally.
 

lvl 99 Pixel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,699
It was following a a pattern it's true, but the serie always saw big gameplay AND visual improvements.
Since Ocarina of Time, each games had their own thing and the world was getting bigger and the visuals better.
For Pokémon though, we're stuck with a 2D gameboy level design.

Going 3D for Pokemon was a pretty huge feat, then the next game did away with the grid movement and chibi style. Its not as impressive as Zelda but what Nintendo game (or series in general) is?
There are game franchises you can list that make fewer changes, and from much larger studios.

If anything GF make too many changes to their games in the wrong places by removing or gutting really good features
 

xyla

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,386
Germany
Sounds like there won't be single console coop on the 2019 title then.

Pity - sounds like an idea they could build upon.
 

NekoNeko

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
18,447
it's cute that people imply that GF doesn't get it when they are probably the absolute best in the business at keeping a franchise alive and kicking over such a long time.
 

AlexFlame116

Prophet of Truth - One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 17, 2017
23,182
Utah
Well, to be fair LGPE has literally Gameboy level design.

And Gamefreak actually said level design was scaled back because "kids thought DPPt was confusing". RSE Hoenn (GBA game) blows Kalos and Alola away in actual map/level design.
Yeah but no change at all since the 2D Game Boy games? We're singling out Let's Go which is a game I'm not happy about to be sure, but I really don't think that same thought applies to all of the other games.
 

Serebii

Serebii.net Webmaster
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
13,126
Well, to be fair LGPE has literally Gameboy level design.

And Gamefreak actually said level design was scaled back because "kids thought DPPt was confusing". RSE Hoenn (GBA game) blows Kalos and Alola away in actual map/level design.
Does it though? Linear backtracking is still linear
 

FiXalaS

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,569
Kuwait.
Unova did it best, Linear for those who are in for just a simple playthrough, and multiple branch-offs for those who want more.
 

TreeMePls

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,258
True, but Pokemon is perfect for an open-world title. Don't you agree?
Nah. The world would need to be pretty massive to properly convey the scale of the region I feel and honestly I would just prefer the game to run at 60 fps.

Unova did it best, Linear for those who are in for just a simple playthrough, and multiple branch-offs for those who want more.
I wouldnt mind Unova's design if they let me choose which way to venture off first, while having different story beats(that ultimately lead to the same thing) depending if you went West or East first
 

Malakai

Member
Oct 27, 2017
565
Pokemon LetsGo is headache inducing when I try to process it. So, we can't transfer Pokemon to if from Sun and Moon? But, it is a core game? God, my head hurts.
 

GhostTrick

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,315
Going 3D for Pokemon was a pretty huge feat, then the next game did away with the grid movement and chibi style. Its not as impressive as Zelda but what Nintendo game (or series in general) is?
There are game franchises you can list that make fewer changes, and from much larger studios.

If anything GF make too many changes to their games in the wrong places by removing or gutting really good features



Mario is. And Xenoblade too. For a serie such as Pokemon, with multi millions units sold, why would it be impossible ?
 

Deleted member 2793

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
15,368
Does it though? Linear backtracking is still linear
You actually had space at least, the game didn't stop you at every second. SM doesn't even try to have actual justification for why you can't go to certain places, it just adds a random NPC saying "you can't go here now".

In RSE the cities are actually all connected and it's cool to search for stuff after beating the main story. Can't do that in SM as maps aren't even connected.

I don't even like open world much anyway, but the maps in XY/SM are just poor and uninteresting outside of the good art design.

Unova did it best, Linear for those who are in for just a simple playthrough, and multiple branch-offs for those who want more.
BW games are the best.
 

lvl 99 Pixel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,699
You actually had space at least, the game didn't stop you at every second. SM doesn't even try to have actual justification for why you can't go to certain places, it just adds a random NPC saying "you can't go here now".

In RSE the cities are actually all connected and it's cool to search for stuff after beating the main story. Can't do that in SM as maps aren't even connected.

I don't even like open world much anyway, but the maps in XY/SM are just poor and uninteresting outside of the good art design.


BW games are the best.

The stoutlands blocking the paths are some of the most questionable gating. I guess they were unruly so nobody can get by or something.
Like, a boulder thats too heavy to move without an HM might seem weird, but a living person riding a pokemon all day and night to block the player is pretty out there
 

Malakai

Member
Oct 27, 2017
565
Couldn't transfer Pokémon from Gold & Silver to Ruby & Sapphire and those were core games

True, but wasn't that case a bit difference. Was there anyway Gamefreak in the early could upgrade the Pokemon data from Generation II to Generation III during that time period before wireless internet connectivity? Granted, my kid self was aware of it at the time. Furthermore, it blows my mind that GameFreak regressed in a way due to one being able to transfer Pokemon between Gen 1 and Gen 2.

On another note, that reminds me that I stop playing Pokemon due to the Ruby and Sapphire being a downgrade and didn't pick it back up until Pokemon X & Y.
 

unicornKnight

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 27, 2017
13,191
Athens, Greece
So if Let's Go become a a series and they introduce all other generations, what are they gonna be called?

Marill and Togepi
Plusle and Minon
Riolu and Pachirisu
Zorua and Emolga
Can't even think for Gen 6 and 7 besides the pika clones.

The problem with having the pika clones is that the general public will just think of the them as inferior yo Pikachu but picking any of the starters will leave the other 2 out.

Unless they go legendaries, but let's go Dialga and Palkia just doesn't seem right haha.

Will be interesting.
I think Let's Go games will receive additional generations through updates. I even expect data miners to find non gen 1 Pokemon inside the game files on release.
 

Wijuci

Member
Jan 16, 2018
2,809
True, but Pokemon is perfect for an open-world title. Don't you agree?

Depends what you mean by "Open World".

Octopath Traveler is *very* open (you can start from 8 different towns, go everywhere you want in any order you want, the enemies' level grow with yours), but I wouldn't call it an "Open World" game. The Octopath model would be perfect for Pokemon though.
 

sfortunato

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,740
Italy
Is it? in terms of single player games maybe, but games like Smash, Pikmin, Kirby, Mario Kart (and other spinoffs) are just as, if not more iterative. Nintendo loves their formulas, and I don't blame them when they're successful on that level. Zelda definitely was on that static formula before BOTW.

Breath of the Wild sales show that Nintendo should risk more with their franchises.

On the one hand, some franchises don't have much potential to change. Mario Kart and Smash are an example of this---here, more-of-the-same is what actually drives forward the series.

On the other hand, some franchises might see more experiments; Kirby and Pikmin are an example of this and I'm pretty sure the next Kirby will be 3D and the next Pikmin more open-world-ey.

Pokémon can still be faithful to its formula but adopt a much more organic and open worldmap.
 

Deleted member 5535

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,656
probably not. But I do expect at least a new engine.
Pokemon Let's Go looks like a phone game, so I think it's safe to expect something significantly better looking

So it looks good since phone games are in almost the same level or better than a Switch.

I've not read a post from him for a long time. I just see the avatar and skip it.

lmao

there are so many games right now that are open world and selling like crazy to both kids and adults, games more popular than sun and moon

Those games sell for teenagers, not kids. Kids here are below 10 years.