I wonder how long it will take Trump to comment?
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...ly-wont-ratify-eu-free-trade-deal-with-canada
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...ly-wont-ratify-eu-free-trade-deal-with-canada
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Italy going to scupper the Canada-EU trade deal
- Thread starter Norwegian_Imposter
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What do you mean? Wasn't there a new elected Italian leader months ago?
What is missing from the OP is that until they ratify it (and until all of the others agree it is dead), it will remain in effect.
Uh, I don't understand why is Italy against this deal?
Because they hate EU, but what's the official reasoning if there is one?
Because they hate EU, but what's the official reasoning if there is one?
Italian politics aren't very stable. They change often because nobody seems to win outright and coalitions go pear shaped, scandals etc. It's a merry go round. If they last more than 1-2 years that's an oddity.
Not really. AFAIK the agreement is already mostly in effect during the ratificaton process, and the EU can just wait for a new governmet willing to sign. It's not unusual for these things to take years .
Have they ever agreed to anything?
I mean, it would seem impossible for me that all 27 countries would all benefit from any deal.
you could read the article, you know. not that Di Maio's position deserves any support, but at least the reason is spelled out
Nope.
And before people jumps and says "Damn italians, they're ruining it for everybody!" this is one of those things that prove that a non-federal EU can't work.
This deal massively benefits some countries and massively damages others, which could be fine if the EU was a federation and pros and cons were shared. But that's not the case.
The Italian government (which, makes no mistake, utterly sucks) is under special scrutiny because it's the most important country that can defy the aging but still lingering left-leaning Bruxelles institutions. This leads to particularly hilarous situations such as Macron criticizing Salvini's anti-immigration policies as inhuman while he sends armed personell in Italian territory to prevent immigrants from boarding trains directed to France or violates Schengen by stopping cars at the theorycally open frontier to look for immigrants being smuggled.
We're talking about the istitutions that would send "help" to Greece during the economical collapse of 2012 while also forcing Greece to buy German and French military equipment as compensation.
What's particularly "far right" about protesting for being forced to produce a certain amount of your mozzarella cheese with powdered milk coming from Germany?
The 5 Stelle/Lega government is a tragedy but their stance against Europe it's probably the one thing you can salvage. Europe is a trainwreck.
Apparently the ECJ ruled last year that it does when it comes to FTAs, as long as they don't include IDS or FDI arrangements as I understand it. They'll just start splitting deals into seperate components I assume to avoid this in the future
Why do you keep saying Europe? It's the EU. So weird to misuse the term like that.
Are you one of those "let's all do our version of brexit" people?
Oh, and could I get a source on this? Google gives me nothing, and it sounds frankly like an exaggeration of some sort.
Bloody hell no, that would be a disaster. The EU is a necessity, but we need to escalate it to a true federation. The problem isn't that "there's too much Europe", it's that there isn't enough.
Individual countries pull away from the EU because the MO of the EU is that of forcing deals and practices that benefit the usual suspects and then disappear when it's time to share the negative consequences. Striking commercial deals is an example. We've pumped money in the German economy with our commercial policies with China and we're unloaded the consequences on countries that took next to no benefit.
We need to become a federation so that we can handle the economy as a sum of different parts with different strengths and weaknesses instead of a cluster of radically different economies subjected to the same rules. You can't ask Greece to follow the same principles as Italy or Germany.
"because it's wrong and risky" aka no reasoning, I see, well thanks for pointing that out to me.
What's the problem, can you explain to me why Italy is against this deal? Or not?
That would be a good start. Honestly the full federation solution is preferrable in my opinion, as it defeats the idea that you can advantage a region at the detriment of another. We win together, we fail together. It's the only way to make things work.
If Italy do reject the deal then the provisional application ends. Also, M5S + Lega are on 60+% of the vote in Italy right now. There is little chance of a new Italian government popping up who will ratify the deal unless M5S and Lega change their tune.
It's fundamentally an issue of protecting your economy. Food exports are a huge voice in Italy's commercial balance (over 40 billions) and without getting into details, there's many precedents of these deals becoming problematic in terms of counterfeiting.
When the EU first introduced free commerce to the members states, several countries (Germany included) almost managed to forbid processed food to display the country of origin. Would you rather buy Italian pasta or German pasta? Well, how about we don't let you know where it comes from!
What Coldiretti is factually afraid of is that we'd be injecting lower quality (debatable, since Canadian beef is excellent) beef or very cheap (ding ding ding) beef on the market, hurting the local producers.
Italy has almost 300 products with PDO (Protected Designation of Origin) and PGI (Protected Geographical Indication) labels. With this deal Canada will recognize only 40 of these.
This means that if "Parmigiano Reggiano" is not one of those 40 products, someone in Canada could produce a similar cheese and call it "Parmigiano Reggiano", de facto killing all the importation of the "real" Parmigiano from Italy to Canada. On the other hand, when a PGI and PDO label is recognized, a similar product made in a different country or area simply can not have the same commercial name.
I'm sure Italy would have liked more of its PDO and PGI labels recognized (or all of them).
Should have happened within in the last 20 years or so, and this doesn't come as a surprise either, but now it's probably kinda too late for such changes.
But I agree with the general idea.
That poster isn't wrong but it's not that bad as it sounds imo?
Oh, I figured this... didn't see it spelled out like this though, so IF that's the reasoning, I wouldn't sign that deal either. But it's already in effect? Wow, EU can be a confusing mess..
Edit:
Yeah, I see, it's weird these labels wouldn't be recognized. It's still a thing though kinda, they're selling prosciutto cotto "made in Germany" here for example, I guess that's not a protected label though.
And I prefer peccorino cheese, but yeah... I get it, these labels are a huge deal for Italy's economy
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I agree.
That said the council still needs to approve of the deal so Conte could still kill any new deals there.
i guess it's about this
it's already a problem with imported meat from east europe, and with this deal you'll add canadian meat on top of it. imported meat make meat price collapse and italian producers struggle to keep up. i mean i'm not calling for protectionism but you need a balance
it's already a problem with imported meat from east europe, and with this deal you'll add canadian meat on top of it. imported meat make meat price collapse and italian producers struggle to keep up. i mean i'm not calling for protectionism but you need a balance
And none of them were recognised before CETA.
So there's that too.
While true, I don't think many people here in a Canada understand the significance of that labelling anyway. Having taught Foods classes, the number of kids (and their parents) that believe parm comes from a
can is depressingly high.
That poster isn't wrong but it's not that bad as it sounds imo?
it is very bad. our political system is like a heavy tank, it's very difficult to steer it, change the constitution (which is not necessarly a bad thing) but it's also slow to approve anything. add to this show term government of different faction that try to undo what was done previously or try to patch what was made and you'll have a political system that doesn't do anything
That is depressing .
The parm flower blossoms so beautifully in summer. It's sad kids think this miracle plant comes from a can.
As a Canadian, I'd prefer if Canada recognized the labels. If I want the real thing, I want to be able to be get the real thing without having to worry about false branding. Same thing for other imports like Kobe beef. Anyone can claim to have it, which is annoying.
Though, from what it seems, in the EU even the name 'Parmesan' by itself is a PDO, so maybe they do not like anything else at all being called that.
I don't think they are calling it far right because of cheese.
Just a hunch.
PDO can die as far as I'm concerned (like quite a bit of European agricultural policy). It's just protectionism motivated by chauvinism.
I'm all for clear labelling, but geographic location says FA about quality. Just because it was made in Emilia Romagna, doesn't mean the bottle of "balsamic vinegar" sold at my discount supermarket isn't garbage. Maybe emphasise a qualitative labelling regulation as opposed to geographic and then I'll be understanding.
I'm all for clear labelling, but geographic location says FA about quality. Just because it was made in Emilia Romagna, doesn't mean the bottle of "balsamic vinegar" sold at my discount supermarket isn't garbage. Maybe emphasise a qualitative labelling regulation as opposed to geographic and then I'll be understanding.
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