-
Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
It's 2018, is The Wire still the best TV show ever made?
- Thread starter fluffydelusions
- Start date
I've rewatched the full Wire series maybe 4 or 5 times now. I love it each time, but each time my view of the show changes -- not of the quality, but of what it is.
The first time around, when the cast were all relative unknowns, it felt so "real" especially compared to anything else on television.
Other times, the "strings" of the show -- the Greek tragedy elements, the "Bruce Springsteen song about oppression"-ness of white guys writing black culture with societal messages -- became more apparent. There are times when you can see the makings of Treme in The Wire.
The show is celebrated for it's "wide focus" on the structural elements of how capitalism screws people over, and the ways in which power manifests and maintains itself -- but unfortunately this is at the expense of deeper character developments. Breaking Bad is the opposite; the focus is narrow and tight on the characters. The Wire creates many, many memorable characters, but they are often living as sketches of people more than deep studies.
I think the two best seasons are S4 and S2, (then S3, S1, S5) because you get the "full arc" of the Sobotkas and the 4th Graders and both are great tragic stories with great portrayals and specifics about the characters' habits and lives.
But the flaws come when great "main" characters like Kima -- especially Kima -- or Daniels or Bunk get pushed aside in favor of Carcetti. And on the rewatch, Carcetti is a draaaaaag and takes up way too much screen time in S3, S4, and S5 for storylines that did NOT need the amount of screen time they received. Carcetti's storylines weigh the second half of the show down a bit too much, and the Stanfield gang is unfortunately the least interesting of the major gangs in the show. (Barksdale, Sobotkas / The Greek, Prop Joe are all more interesting).
Most recently, I realized the best way to approach this show for NEW viewers -- for a show that's been overhyped to the heavens, with a cast that's mostly all gone on to other recognizable things, meaning the show becomes a ton of "oh hey its that guy" while watching -- the best way in is to not think of it as "the best show ever, life-changing television" but instead as "the HBO version of Law & Order."
If you take the pressure off of the show and allow it to breathe in that way, it's one of the most compelling cop dramas ever made.
The first time around, when the cast were all relative unknowns, it felt so "real" especially compared to anything else on television.
Other times, the "strings" of the show -- the Greek tragedy elements, the "Bruce Springsteen song about oppression"-ness of white guys writing black culture with societal messages -- became more apparent. There are times when you can see the makings of Treme in The Wire.
The show is celebrated for it's "wide focus" on the structural elements of how capitalism screws people over, and the ways in which power manifests and maintains itself -- but unfortunately this is at the expense of deeper character developments. Breaking Bad is the opposite; the focus is narrow and tight on the characters. The Wire creates many, many memorable characters, but they are often living as sketches of people more than deep studies.
I think the two best seasons are S4 and S2, (then S3, S1, S5) because you get the "full arc" of the Sobotkas and the 4th Graders and both are great tragic stories with great portrayals and specifics about the characters' habits and lives.
But the flaws come when great "main" characters like Kima -- especially Kima -- or Daniels or Bunk get pushed aside in favor of Carcetti. And on the rewatch, Carcetti is a draaaaaag and takes up way too much screen time in S3, S4, and S5 for storylines that did NOT need the amount of screen time they received. Carcetti's storylines weigh the second half of the show down a bit too much, and the Stanfield gang is unfortunately the least interesting of the major gangs in the show. (Barksdale, Sobotkas / The Greek, Prop Joe are all more interesting).
Most recently, I realized the best way to approach this show for NEW viewers -- for a show that's been overhyped to the heavens, with a cast that's mostly all gone on to other recognizable things, meaning the show becomes a ton of "oh hey its that guy" while watching -- the best way in is to not think of it as "the best show ever, life-changing television" but instead as "the HBO version of Law & Order."
If you take the pressure off of the show and allow it to breathe in that way, it's one of the most compelling cop dramas ever made.
I'm not much of a television person, but I do try to watch those programmes that are often hailed as the 'greatest shows on TV'.
I have seen Atlanta, Better Call Saul, Black Sails, Breaking Bad, Curb Your Enthusiasm, Deadwood, Firefly, The Good Place, Seinfeld, Six Feet Under, Vice Principals and The Wire, and I still think the latter show stayed in my mind the longest, mostly due to the extraordinary character development - even minor ones - and the Shakespearean dialogue.
Yes, the fifth and last season lacked the urgency and tension of the four seasons gone by. For me, season four was very personal and tragic, whereas the fifth season returns to some broader social commentary (using the media and newspapers) ~ you either like it or you don't.
I have seen Atlanta, Better Call Saul, Black Sails, Breaking Bad, Curb Your Enthusiasm, Deadwood, Firefly, The Good Place, Seinfeld, Six Feet Under, Vice Principals and The Wire, and I still think the latter show stayed in my mind the longest, mostly due to the extraordinary character development - even minor ones - and the Shakespearean dialogue.
Yes, the fifth and last season lacked the urgency and tension of the four seasons gone by. For me, season four was very personal and tragic, whereas the fifth season returns to some broader social commentary (using the media and newspapers) ~ you either like it or you don't.
Well a lot of things become bad when taken to the extreme. Change happens one step at a time and as I've mentioned multiple times there's those on the authority site that could help as well. Just seems in the show that the stars never align and maybe they didn't want to give a false sense of hope by having anything actually change. Trust me I was getting the "things will never change" message when they locked him up at the end of season 1 and they showed the drugs flowing just the same. But there were moments where things were hopeful in the show and whose to say those couldn't be more permanent if things lined up a little better. If that's naive then I'd rather be a naive fool than a cynical realist. I'd rather have hope for change being possible
Yeah, those are my top 3. My ranking of them can change on a daily basic, but usually it's the The Wire and The Shield battling it out for first.
I find The Wire far more riveting, funny and heartfelt than any of the three you mentioned. Boring is not the word I would ever use to describe that show.
It would have easily been the best if it wasn't for the writers strike and the fuckery they had McNulty do in the last few episodes, even with all of that it's still my favourite show.
Best drama shows ever for me are:
The Wire
The Sopranos
The Leftovers
Breaking Bad
Line of Duty
Best drama shows ever for me are:
The Wire
The Sopranos
The Leftovers
Breaking Bad
Line of Duty
Opinions and all but I find few shows more engaging and riveting than The Wire. Watching DeAngelo take that car ride with Weebey not knowing whether he's going to be killed or not was one of the most riveting scenes in TV for myself.
I liked Deadwood, Breaking Bad and Better Call Saul more but it's next in line. Some quality ass TV there.
Considering American history especially on the topics The Wire covers, yeah it's a little naive. The show even points out many times over how insanely hard it is to get out of that lifestyle, let alone unscathed.
Last edited:
See, The Shield will always have a special place in TV for me because somehow it got better with each season, which is so uncommon with TV shows in general, while never having a bad season. While The Wire definitely didn't have a bad season, the ending was def a drop in quality compared to the rest of the show.
So that's why I stick The Shield as the best drama and my personal fave TV show. I actually am just finishing up watching Seinfeld the whole way through for the first time today and I think it and Curb Your Enthusiasm have a lock on best TV comedies, but it's hard to place them in a conversation with something like The Shield or The Wire.
So that's why I stick The Shield as the best drama and my personal fave TV show. I actually am just finishing up watching Seinfeld the whole way through for the first time today and I think it and Curb Your Enthusiasm have a lock on best TV comedies, but it's hard to place them in a conversation with something like The Shield or The Wire.
Better Call Saul is already better than Breaking Bad.
But both arent as good as the Wire.
I have never seen a show with a better ending than The Shield. It was just absolutely perfect.
Last edited:
What you're describing is basically the story of Mayor Carcetti. His entire platform and build was on fixing all the problems and even as stuff slowly mounted he still kept hope. But you watch how the system just totally breaks him down, and his will.
Bodi tries to run away, but can't
Wallace escapes to his Aunt's but ends up hating the 'peace and quiet'
Stringer tries to diversify their money and switch to building wealthy through investments, only to be taken advantage
Prop Joe attempted to be the middle man and form a co-op to prevent shit from getting worse, but in comes Marlo
There were so many signs in the show that showcase the small bit of hope to something changing only for it all to come back around
They have been working on doing a Bluray release for like a year and a half now. I've been saving a rewatch for that but I'm curious if the project is dead.
My only problem with The Shield is definitely more in the 'comic' drama type of story telling, similar to Breaking Bad. It's also hard for me to go back and re-watch with all early 2000's production & music.
That said Vic Mackey is one of the best characters in a drama, ever.
The Wire is up there with Deadwood and Mad Men as one of the most rigorous explorations of its themes coupled with excellent writing, production, and acting. Definitely one of the best US shows and probably the best about its contemporary moment. It's a wonderful achievement even with the hit and miss final season.
Look beyond the US and it begins to get overshadowed with "shows" like Dekalog and Heimat.
Look beyond the US and it begins to get overshadowed with "shows" like Dekalog and Heimat.
The last update I could find was from Shawn Ryan's twitter almost a year ago. Basically said he expected to be finished getting it ready for 4K early 2018 then it was up to Sony for a release. So I'm thinking it's probably not dead, but hopefully we'll hear something soon.
The one thing I'm shocked about in this thread is the Breaking Bad love, and part of me is curious if it's because way more people here got to experience it on a week to week basis but binged The Wire or Sopranos. I like BB fine, but it wasn't even the best show on the network it was airing on at the time.
Watched the entire series once through. Have no inclination to ever watch it again, and I've rewatched plenty of shows.
So no. It's good, but nothing that blew me away. I've read a bunch of people didn't dig season two though and I think that was probably my favorite, so there's that.
I binged Breaking Bad just like I binged The Wire. The former is infinitely better and I've gone through the series multiple times.
Also, I'll take the bait. What AMC show are you referencing as superior?
So no. It's good, but nothing that blew me away. I've read a bunch of people didn't dig season two though and I think that was probably my favorite, so there's that.
I binged Breaking Bad just like I binged The Wire. The former is infinitely better and I've gone through the series multiple times.
Also, I'll take the bait. What AMC show are you referencing as superior?
I mean that's kinda my point though. The Wire can be a slog when binging so many episodes in a row. And that's not a knock against the show, the pacing just isn't meant for that, I don't think. BB is definitely a more binge friendly show.
Mad Men. I wasn't meaning it as bait either, I just genuinely thought it was better.
The Wire is pretty unique. We have had follow-ups to Sopranos (Mad Men, Breaking Bad etc.) but I'm not sure if anyone really attempted to make a show like The Wire since. I don't expect anyone to be able to come close to it anytime soon, not even David Simon.
I was probably most disappointed the Kima got relegated to the periphery of most threads and didn't really have an 'arc' or her own that I can remember. Maybe it is because she was meant to die in season 1, but the show could have done with more female protagonists.
Also, rewatching season 1 with The Wire Stripped Podcast recently was really great. I think they are doing season 2 soon and I would recommend it.
I was probably most disappointed the Kima got relegated to the periphery of most threads and didn't really have an 'arc' or her own that I can remember. Maybe it is because she was meant to die in season 1, but the show could have done with more female protagonists.
Also, rewatching season 1 with The Wire Stripped Podcast recently was really great. I think they are doing season 2 soon and I would recommend it.
Last edited:
I think The Wire is a great show and I admire its social commentary on different aspects of urban American life. Definitely think more fondly of it than, say, Breaking Bad, which was definitely more compelling from episode to episode, but that show got super self-indulgent in the latter seasons, and the final episode was way too neat for Walter White given the harm he's done to everyone around him and to his community at large. Also, the number of fans who ended up idolizing Walt and demonizing Skyler make me want to distance myself from "enthusiasts". When those sentiments ring the loudest in the fanbase, maybe the themes and messages aren't as clear and resonant as a lot of people espouse.
Besides, Better Call Saul already surpassed it!
As a character study, I like Mad Men more, too. The fact that it also has a strong cast of female characters compared to the other mentioned shows helps a lot.
Speaking of women, I wonder if a majority of female TV watchers also share the opinion that The Wire is the best show. All the online communities I've been in that talk about the GOAT TV shows are mostly populated by my demographic (21-35 yr old males). Era is no exception. I've only met a single woman IRL who's even seen The Wire, and most of my friends are women!
Besides, Better Call Saul already surpassed it!
As a character study, I like Mad Men more, too. The fact that it also has a strong cast of female characters compared to the other mentioned shows helps a lot.
Speaking of women, I wonder if a majority of female TV watchers also share the opinion that The Wire is the best show. All the online communities I've been in that talk about the GOAT TV shows are mostly populated by my demographic (21-35 yr old males). Era is no exception. I've only met a single woman IRL who's even seen The Wire, and most of my friends are women!
Opinions are great, but man I can't disagree more. I love Mad Men's setting and Jon Hamm, but I quit watching every time I tried getting into it. I just don't find the characters or their interactions particularly interesting.
As far as binging vs week-to-week, I think every show I've liked benefits from binging. Sometimes I'll put off watching something I'm lukewarm on until the season has wrapped just because I feel it gives the show a better chance to shine. (ex. Preacher — I enjoy the show well enough especially when it's at its most bizarre, but that first episode of the season didn't leave me enthused) The week-to-week anticipation for something truly great can be weirdly fun torture, (can't wait for new Saul and Venture Bros) but I seem to maintain my investment better on rewatch when I'm able to just catch an episode at my leisure. The latest season of Rick and Morty was a good example as I thought it was a bit weak when watching the episodes as they aired and then loved it the second time around.
Yes. I firmly believe anyone serious about their TV that has seen The Wire to completion, and still says Breaking Bad or Game of Thrones, is trolling.
The Wire is still very good (and holds up surprisingly well) but there are just a few too many seams showing to really crown it the GOAT. IMO even in terms of blockbuster HBO shows, The Sopranos hit higher highs anyway
People who compare Breaking Bad to The Wire or The Sopranos can't be trusted. They aren't on the same level.
Personally I'd say The Wire is still the best show, with The Sopranos at #2.
Personally I'd say The Wire is still the best show, with The Sopranos at #2.
I feel like seasons 1-3 and the big moments of 4 are worthy of some acknowledgement. The drop off after season 4 is huge sure but the universe has an enormous amount of depth, the production values are the best in history, and the big moments in seasons 1-4 are worth the buildup.
That being said, Hannibal is #1
And every list should have Avatar TLA in the top 5
The best television show of all time is the Wire.
If the last season of Banshee wasn't so rushed and edited, the wire would be number 2 :)
If the last season of Banshee wasn't so rushed and edited, the wire would be number 2 :)