I love Wind Waker. But it is Breath of the Wild.
Though you dont get the latter without influence from the former.
Though you dont get the latter without influence from the former.
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Zelda: Wind Waker or BOTW ?
- Thread starter Baphomet
- Start date
It's impossible to choose. BotW is a revelation in terms of exploration , but Wind Waker was the most charming game I've ever played. I just love them both.
Wind Waker. I fell in love with that game right away. It took me a while to get into botw, and I still don't love it. Also, the triforce hunt may be a slog, but about 75% of botw is. That trek up the zora river... running back and forth across the desert... combat shrines... Wind Waker may have had some content cut, but botw feels like an unfinished game.
Wind Waker is amazingly charming, has great combat (although the players skill is never significantly challenged throughout the game), and was definitely ahead of it's time with it's open level design. However, the dungeons are straight up dodo for such a prestigious series and the game itself falls off a cliff towards the end around the time the Triforce Hunt happens.
So by default, Breath of the Wild is the superior game. Wind Waker was taken out the oven undercooked. BotW just made deliberate game design decisions early on that focused on other area rather than the dungeon heavy focus of the past 3D games.
So by default, Breath of the Wild is the superior game. Wind Waker was taken out the oven undercooked. BotW just made deliberate game design decisions early on that focused on other area rather than the dungeon heavy focus of the past 3D games.
If you like traditional Zelda, choose Wind Waker, altough it's a largely flawed, incomplete game.
If you like modern open world games, play BoTW.
If you like modern open world games, play BoTW.
WW hangs its hat on its visuals and charm (which I found to be way too Disney the last time I played it). The real meat of the game isn't nearly as good as those attributes.
BotW, regardless of the dungeons and all, is a watershed moment for the franchise. One of the best ever.
BotW, regardless of the dungeons and all, is a watershed moment for the franchise. One of the best ever.
Breath of the Wild is the better Zelda game and a much better game overall. But i didn't like Windwaker that much to begin with. It has a nice style, but there were too few bigger islands, too few cities and as good the celshading looked some of the characters were ugly and were annoying and too kiddy for my tastes. Personally i liked the cast in BotW much more. Also some of the dungeons in Wind Waker felt annoying. I liked Twilight Princess more than Windwaker and BotW does capture most of the spirit i want in a zelda game.
I praise WW for the balls it had to use that style and i liked the idea with the ship and the islands, but it sounded better than it was in reality. I do hope we are allowed to venture further out to the Sea in BotW 2 though, there are some bigger islands i want to explore. Also diving, let me explore underwater again.
I praise WW for the balls it had to use that style and i liked the idea with the ship and the islands, but it sounded better than it was in reality. I do hope we are allowed to venture further out to the Sea in BotW 2 though, there are some bigger islands i want to explore. Also diving, let me explore underwater again.
There's about as many obvious cut corners for both games and their respective formats. The difference is the QoL of BotW that everything is optional so nothing will ever feel like the kind of roadblock the triforce-hunt was.
Both games really have trouble offering anything of substance. The dungeons in Wind Waker, and the shrines, dungeons and patches of level design in the overworld of BOTW are for the most part really poor. Major mechanics in each game are also painfully slow. For Wind Waker that means the deku leaf, command melody, wind direction changes, and grappling hook, and for BOTW, well, basically everything, from climbing to gliding to fighting.
When it comes to the exploration, I think Wind Waker is far superior. The cartoon ocean world is so much more interesting visually than the generic natural looking landscapes of BOTW. The music in Wind Waker creates the feeling of being on a magical adventure, while the music in BOTW fails to create anything, neither emotion nor atmosphere, on its own. It's so light, intermittent and without impact that it's virtually indistinguishable from silence.
The islands house the typical level design components of a 3D Zelda overworld which I love, and serve as useful gameplay rewards for exploration. Points of interest in BOTW often might be a sole enemy, probably not a very interesting one, and one that you've almost certainly seen many times before. The rare cases in which BOTW actually presents a purpose built piece of level design it will always be poorly done, lacking any of the polish or skill we're accustomed to. When it shows something interesting on the horizon, that something will almost always end up being disappointing, especially from a level design standpoint.
One final difference between the two I think lies in the 'meaning' behind both. Sailing out into an unexplored world, into savage storms, fearing the unknown, well, that's something that is straight out of history. Wind Waker takes those fears and hopes, whether it be sighting the outline of an island on the horizon and wondering what it could be, or fighting against giant sea monsters, and wonderfully realizes them in exaggerated form on a highly condensed map. Add in some swashbuckling feeling (raiding platforms and downing enemy ships with cannon fire) and I just buy into Wind Waker's world in a way that I can't with BOTW. Going out into a world with a worse art style, that's a bland recreation of reality, with all of it's samey land forms, which is so heavily dependent on physics manipulation and resource gathering, well, it certainly doesn't convey the romantic feeling that Wind Waker's waves and music and islands do.
If they ever did revisit the ocean world concept, I wouldn't expand the islands, or the amount of things between islands (honestly, keeping in context that this is an ocean, there's plenty of stuff on your way from here to there in WW aleady), I'd make the world underneath the waves fully explorable. Not in a drowned Hyrule Castle way, but in a undersea exploration way. Then you might not even feel the need to clutter the surface with too much stuff. Ideally though, neither Wind Waker or BOTW would ever come back.
When it comes to the exploration, I think Wind Waker is far superior. The cartoon ocean world is so much more interesting visually than the generic natural looking landscapes of BOTW. The music in Wind Waker creates the feeling of being on a magical adventure, while the music in BOTW fails to create anything, neither emotion nor atmosphere, on its own. It's so light, intermittent and without impact that it's virtually indistinguishable from silence.
The islands house the typical level design components of a 3D Zelda overworld which I love, and serve as useful gameplay rewards for exploration. Points of interest in BOTW often might be a sole enemy, probably not a very interesting one, and one that you've almost certainly seen many times before. The rare cases in which BOTW actually presents a purpose built piece of level design it will always be poorly done, lacking any of the polish or skill we're accustomed to. When it shows something interesting on the horizon, that something will almost always end up being disappointing, especially from a level design standpoint.
One final difference between the two I think lies in the 'meaning' behind both. Sailing out into an unexplored world, into savage storms, fearing the unknown, well, that's something that is straight out of history. Wind Waker takes those fears and hopes, whether it be sighting the outline of an island on the horizon and wondering what it could be, or fighting against giant sea monsters, and wonderfully realizes them in exaggerated form on a highly condensed map. Add in some swashbuckling feeling (raiding platforms and downing enemy ships with cannon fire) and I just buy into Wind Waker's world in a way that I can't with BOTW. Going out into a world with a worse art style, that's a bland recreation of reality, with all of it's samey land forms, which is so heavily dependent on physics manipulation and resource gathering, well, it certainly doesn't convey the romantic feeling that Wind Waker's waves and music and islands do.
If they ever did revisit the ocean world concept, I wouldn't expand the islands, or the amount of things between islands (honestly, keeping in context that this is an ocean, there's plenty of stuff on your way from here to there in WW aleady), I'd make the world underneath the waves fully explorable. Not in a drowned Hyrule Castle way, but in a undersea exploration way. Then you might not even feel the need to clutter the surface with too much stuff. Ideally though, neither Wind Waker or BOTW would ever come back.
What Wind Waker misses in memorable dungeons (beside the irritation of having to pick up Medli and Makar), and although I do really love Valoo's Mountain, I think it gains in atmopshere and tone. There's this deeply haunting (in a good way) tone to WW, from the combat music to the strange noises from portals and being inside of caves. It breathes atmosphere, in its audioscape probably better than any Zelda to date.
BotW has a more subdued and saccharine feeling to it. I just didn't like it as much.
BotW has a more subdued and saccharine feeling to it. I just didn't like it as much.
The big difference between the first Zelda and BOTW is you can play the first Zelda like a typical Zelda game. It has the same riddle based puzzle solving, the same pacing, the same exact focus on dungeons (9 mainline and x2 for the second quest). Like the first Metroid, the items acquired are more combat focused, but still very much used in puzzle solving and progression.
I'm less of a this game is about something type of person and more sensitive to the nuts and bolts of the actual game. So perhaps I don't have a full appreciation for the feeling generated by the first Zelda. But still, there's a lot of what Zelda was for 30 years, already there at the beginning.
Same thing with Mario 64 actually. Not sure that it was pure platforming that really took the world by storm in Super Mario Bros. More the quality of interactivity, the incredible sense of motion through the environment, and the discovery and surprises gleaned from interaction that gripped people. Less, I'm going to overcome this 4 step platforming challenge, and more, I'm running on the damn roof! Mario 64 is very much an advancement on the latter.
Breath of the Wild is my favorite Zelda game, but Wind Waker is a very close second.
WW feels the most open/free out of all the traditional Zelda games I've played. That may be the biggest reason why it was #1 for me until BOTW came along.
WW feels the most open/free out of all the traditional Zelda games I've played. That may be the biggest reason why it was #1 for me until BOTW came along.
OoT followed ALTTP's overall formula of 3 dungeons, midpoint, more dungeons after. Almost exactly. And had the dungeon item structure as well.
SM64 completely changed structure from its predecessor, SMW, with the big explorable collectathon worlds over linear courses. We finally got what OoT was to LTTP game structure-wise for Mario with 3D Land and World.
Agreed...
Wait... you're the guy who did that insane acoustic Wind Waker music video? That was amazing!
God dammit. Both are top 3 zelda titles for me for sure. (Alttp would be the 3rd) Right now i say botw for sure,but at the time wind waker was as breathtaking for me if not more. Can't decide,sorry.
All three of them captured a feeling that very very few games could at their respective times.
All three of them captured a feeling that very very few games could at their respective times.
I wouldn't say WW is the worst but it definitely is one of the worst.
BOTW is my favorite Zelda too.
This. BotW did one thing well and everything else worse than average.
WW felt like a magic experience when it was released, it was my first GC game and I loved it. It looks amazing even today, and the story/art/music are perfect for a Zelda game.
But BotW pushes the series in a lot of new amazing directions, has become my favorite game ever (in fact has become a lot of people's best game ever, which I could have never guessed 2 weeks before launch) and is what the series needed to be fresh again.
But I think that all 3D Zelda games have been top games from their generation, even TP and SS that were weaker compared to the others are amazing games.
But BotW pushes the series in a lot of new amazing directions, has become my favorite game ever (in fact has become a lot of people's best game ever, which I could have never guessed 2 weeks before launch) and is what the series needed to be fresh again.
But I think that all 3D Zelda games have been top games from their generation, even TP and SS that were weaker compared to the others are amazing games.
In terms of charme, Wind Waker is hard to beat. But design-wise? Come on, it's such a messy game with tons of pacing issues.
I'm not sure about comparing the two since BotW completely changed the Zelda formula. If you're into puzzly-dungeon-type stuff, BotW won't make you happy at all. If you hate open-world stuff, BotW isn't for you. But it's a marvelous game that I enjoyed way more than Wind Waker overall.
I'm not sure about comparing the two since BotW completely changed the Zelda formula. If you're into puzzly-dungeon-type stuff, BotW won't make you happy at all. If you hate open-world stuff, BotW isn't for you. But it's a marvelous game that I enjoyed way more than Wind Waker overall.
BotW is literally one of the most boring games I've played so Wind Waker wins by a billion times over.
I'm 45 and I co-sign this post. Though I would like to add that ALTTP was an incredible experience and an all-time great game that sits comfortably with Zelda 1 and Breath.
WW is great in many ways, but you have to be really bad at the game to even come close to dying.
Its still close and I hate to admit it but BOTW is a better game if only because there's actual danger (though dying doesn't mean much in either game)
Both games get really tedious with the sailing and climbing/gliding long before completion.
Its still close and I hate to admit it but BOTW is a better game if only because there's actual danger (though dying doesn't mean much in either game)
Both games get really tedious with the sailing and climbing/gliding long before completion.
I usually just automatically respond that Wind Waker is my favorite or second favorite game, but if I spent time to really think about it, I'm not sure that'd hold up under scrutiny. Breath of the Wild is an amazing game, and for very different reasons that I consider Wind Waker an amazing game. But ultimately, they're too different and the emotional response I have to both games comes from a different place.
I will say that Breath of the Wild was much, much harder to put down. Every little thing in that game invited just 10 more minutes, just 10 more minutes of play. Forever.
I will say that Breath of the Wild was much, much harder to put down. Every little thing in that game invited just 10 more minutes, just 10 more minutes of play. Forever.
Wind Waker for the amazing, warm feeling I get when I dive into its timeless colorful world while listening to the great OST.
Breath of the Wild for everything else though, tbh. It is the much better game to play with a lot more fun content. I still wish Nintendo would have added the scrapped parts to WW.
Breath of the Wild for everything else though, tbh. It is the much better game to play with a lot more fun content. I still wish Nintendo would have added the scrapped parts to WW.
That's an interesting take - I've not heard the design philosophy of 3D Land / World put in those terms before.