Yesterday, Star Citizen held a $275 dinner available only to users who had spent $1000+ where they announced a new $675 ship

[Dreams-Visions]

If I paid $275 for a dinner and was served Frankfurter sausages and chocolate mousse I would feel like I had been done over. That's a hilarious meal for that amount of money. If people paid that and aren't fucking raging about being ripped off then just....wow.

Games looks fabulous in many ways but the pricing practices around it seem less than healthy. I also get the impression that it's just one huge mission creep in terms of features but I'm hardly informed from a few brief gameplay demos.

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Generally speaking, you don't go to events like this because of the dinner menu. You go for the support/fundraising and the meet & greet.

Was Roberts in attendance? That'd be about the only person I can imagine a supporting wanting to shake hands with. If it was just some random developers, that'd be pretty uncool.

 

[Version 3.0]

Every time I see a story about this game and its endless development cycle and scammy-sounding but apparently fan-pleasing money train, I worry that this will spread. God knows there are plenty of dead franchises that could potentially milk money out of hopeful fans for years.

 

[Deleted member 1589]

this is wrong and bait

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Not really.

Hell, it has happened to Chris Roberts before. He doesn't have a good track record regarding this.

 

[Deleted member 5359]

Every time I see a story about this game and its endless development cycle and scammy-sounding but apparently fan-pleasing money train, I worry that this will spread. God knows there are plenty of dead franchises that could potentially milk money out of hopeful fans for years.

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I'm surprised Lord British hasn't tried this.

 

[Boddy]

I'm surprised Lord British hasn't tried this.

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don't give him ideas.
At least Forsaken Virtues is the perfect title for that game.

 

[borntoulouselautrec]

I'm surprised Lord British hasn't tried this.

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He has, check out the great success of Shroud of the Avatar.

 

[Deleted member 1589]

I just saw the menu and regret giving the dinner the benefit of the doubt.

 

[Jraphics Horse]

I'm surprised Lord British hasn't tried this.

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You have much to learn

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-07-08-richard-garriott-selling-vials-of-his-blood-on-ebay

 

[Deleted member 46948]

I actually managed to get a whale to send me a copy of the event's menu:

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I'm dying lol, breaded schnitzel and pork knuckle... That's a 6 euro lunch menu around here.

 

[glaurung]

Also, what does "FAMILY STYLE" mean? A cheap ass buffet?

Edit: both wines retail for ~13 USD on average. That is some high quality fine dining right there. Should have gone for Popeye's chicken sandwich instead.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

I'm dying lol, breaded schnitzel and pork knuckle... That's a 6 euro lunch menu around here.

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...but is your 6 euro lunch made with the same LOVE that this schnitzel and knuckle was made with???

 

[Deleted member 31104]

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That's pretty much my experience of it. They keep adding shit gameplay systems in essentially a broken state, they fester with only marginal improvements while the backlog increases with each whaling expedition.

And while verisimilitude is nice, watching the same canned animations over and over again not so much (RDR2 suffered from the same issue). The problems I have with the flight model and systems is basically a matter of taste.

 

[Refyref]

You have much to learn

https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2016-07-08-richard-garriott-selling-vials-of-his-blood-on-ebay

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Was there something in the water at Origin Systems?

 

[hanmik]

This "so-called game" is a shell of a game.. a shell used to hide something bigger..

And it goes a little something like this:

- Pitch an idea for a space game. The idea is really great, and all the necessary game mechanics are in place.
- Get that idea crowdfunded.
- Get a lot of money from the funding.
- Pitch some more ideas to get even more money.
- Game gets the biggest amount of money ever crowdfunded.
- Show some amazing looking tech videos for the stuff originally pitched.
- Launch a very very very light early access game for the backers.
- Add a lot of new game mechanic ideas. Even though the first ideas aren't even implemented yet.
- Say you need more money to finish your new ideas.
- Start selling ships for crazy amounts of money.
- Implement a Recruitment scheme, where you can get said ships for "free" by getting people to back the game.
- Update the Early access with some good looking tech stuff, that does still not make it a "game".
- Keep adding ships that cost a lot of money.
- Still not delivering on the original promise.
- etc.

this is just fucking crazy.. this has NOTHING to do with normal game development.. and I am even leaving out stuff like the paid dinner etc. Things just made to make the whales pay even more money...

I am glad someone likes the product they have gotten, for whatever they paid for it.. but if you look at it from an outsiders view, it looks crazy..

 

[Skade]

So if I wanted to play the vertical slices today where do I go and what is the minimum amount that I can pay?

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Around 40/50 bucks i think.

 

[ShinUltramanJ]

At this point let them enjoy their expensive virtual nothings. If they want to drop thousands on digital ships, have at it. Nothing surprises me at this point.

 

[Lupercal]

The 275$ Star Citizen menu can finally replace the 30$ Italian meal meme.

 

[ckareset]

I wont comment on the whole Star Citizen stuff but on the last part of your comment:
3 years ago was 2016. The game was kickstarted from nothing in 2012. Do you really believe that a game from that scope would've been cancelled 3 years in developpement ? And that's bot even considering that the first 2-3 years basically barely count since it was the begining, they didnt have money and such.

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What should have happened is that the publisher would have told Roberts to fuck off when he tried to increase the scope multiple times. So it wouldn't be cancelled but it would be done at this point.

Anyways my biggest problem is that the scope is so big the gameplay will bore people to tears

 

[Captain_Raoul]

The 275$ Star Citizen menu can finally replace the 30$ Italian meal meme.

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The $275 dollar for this event is not really worth it. This price is for the whole event my ticket for CitizenCon was way more cheaper then this closed event. They gave them a lot of cool merchandise but you can buy those separately on the website atm.

ckareset Look back at how the game was before, i wouldn't go back with how it was back then. Landings on hero locations was all onrails.

 

[Deleted member 50658]

Rumpestump So you admit that you don't know anything about the game, otherwise non-backers like you could just have a normal discussion about the game itself. But that seems to be very difficult for you trollers. Me and other backers see it for years now, when we go in-depth about the game itself, it's all getting downplayed from the start.

We like to discuss the game with nonbackers, But people are going to be insulted for being a backer in the first place. Everything is easily getting ignored when it's about the game itself. Why not watch some technicall videos if people ask so many questions about the games techside? Or is just ignoring because talking about how "bad the funding is" is more important and everybody can drop words like, cult, scam.

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I know more than enough to see it for what it really is and perhaps you are a bit too invested to see what it is not. You actually claim and think 8 years of development and every deadline they set missed is part of a normal and well managed project. The technology and scope 5 years ago sounded and looked impressive at that time but now several years later it still is not even close of implementing a fraction of the features they talked and promised their backers and the systems in place is more or less duct taped together into a unstable mess. The graphics the one area they put most of their attention on is already not that impressive anymore and with a new console generation out next year that will not help it stay fresh either. That it's also funded by probably the worst measures in the industry with a budget larger than probably all other kickstarter games combined and multiple times a regular AAA game is just the icing on the cake. This project is a mess of feature creep, mismanagement and predatory monetization like nothing else in the industry.

I get it you have 6k dollars invested in one game alone and that is probably more money than most people who call themselves gamers probably spend in a decade or more on their favorite hobby. 1500+ videos watched and with it hundreds of hours of marketing straight into your brain as well as your effort to recruit god knows how many thousand people in order to receive your *free ship and all this without the actual game even close to being finished. I bet that makes it kind of easy to put the blinders on for all these troubling issues and stick your head in the sand about any criticism.

The fact that you think people should stop criticizing how they get their funds like in this case and don't discuss it because it's not the first time they do something despicable in that area is proof enough for any sane person to understand you have a pretty disturbing agenda when it comes to defending this game.

 

[Ganyc]

You actually claim and think 8 years of development

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8 years of development? Maybe if you include the Publisher/Kickstarter demo video that had nothing to do with the actual game/endproduct.

First they had to build the studios after the kickstarter campaign (at the end of 2012) until they could start development

 

[borntoulouselautrec]

8 years of development? Maybe if you include the Publisher/Kickstarter demo video that had nothing to do with the actual game/endproduct.

First they had to build the studios after the kickstarter campaign (at the end of 2012) until they could start development

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I got a bingo! The classic 'development didn't really start until...' argument.

 

[Deleted member 50658]

I can see the valid reason to have some concerns about the game, but it's always so difficult to discuss about the game in these threads. That's why these threads have almost no purpose.

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Lol you got to be kidding me. You seriously say that people have "concerns" about the game are valid now but threads about the "conserns" and discussing them have almost no purpose.

This is what I meant when I said you might be a bit more invested than you should be to discuss this game from a rational standpoint.

And you call me a troll...

 

[Ganyc]

I got a bingo! The classic 'development didn't really start until...' argument.

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Because it goes against your narrative, i know.
Fact is, they had only a handful developers at the end of the kickstarter project. And they had to replan after the success of the kickstarter.


Don't compare games with a publisher and an estabilshed development studio with a kickstarter project that has no publisher, no development studio and only 10 members (or less) at the end of the kickstarter campaign.

 

[SmokingBun]

Elon Musk will be selling real spaceships by the time this game releases in a feature Complete form

 

[Captain_Raoul]

Lol you got to be kidding me. You seriously say that people have "concerns" about the game are valid now but threads about the "conserns" and discussing them have almost no purpose.

This is what I meant when I said you might be a bit more invested than you should be to discuss this game from a rational standpoint.

And you call me a troll...

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Because these fucking threads are never about the game itself but only the funding around it...and how it is a scam and that we are cult etc etc. I would like to see someone goes indepth in the game and discuss the tech, gameplay how things work...Of course, that's going a little too much since you don't know anything about it.

Everyone can repeat each other that it is a scam...nothing new.

I know more than enough to see it for what it really is and perhaps you are a bit too invested to see what it is not. You actually claim and think 8 years of development and every deadline they set missed is part of a normal and well managed project. The technology and scope 5 years ago sounded and looked impressive at that time but now several years later it still is not even close of implementing a fraction of the features they talked and promised their backers and the systems in place is more or less duct taped together into a unstable mess. The graphics the one area they put most of their attention on is already not that impressive anymore and with a new console generation out next year that will not help it stay fresh either. That it's also funded by probably the worst measures in the industry with a budget larger than probably all other kickstarter games combined and multiple times a regular AAA game is just the icing on the cake. This project is a mess of feature creep, mismanagement and predatory monetization like nothing else in the industry.

I get it you have 6k dollars invested in one game alone and that is probably more money than most people who call themselves gamers probably spend in a decade or more on their favorite hobby. 1500+ videos watched and with it hundreds of hours of marketing straight into your brain as well as your effort to recruit god knows how many thousand people in order to receive your *free ship and all this without the actual game even close to being finished. I bet that makes it kind of easy to put the blinders on for all these troubling issues and stick your head in the sand about any criticism.

The fact that you think people should stop criticizing how they get their funds like in this case and don't discuss it because it's not the first time they do something despicable in that area is proof enough for any sane person to understand you have a pretty disturbing agenda when it comes to defending this game.

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Really? i think you trying way to hard to criticizing on every aspect. I don't care if people have a problem with the funding because everyone need to do what ever they want. What makes you think you have the right that others can't be positive about this game? The only really funny thing around here is that people even try do downplay the tech.

Like i said, i can see absurd prices for ships which you can already buy ingame right now. It's clear you can't stand that people having fun with it because you have so much to say.

I get it you have 6k dollars invested in one game alone and that is probably more money than most people who call themselves gamers probably spend in a decade or more on their favorite hobby. 1500+ videos watched and with it hundreds of hours of marketing straight into your brain as well as your effort to recruit god knows how many thousand people in order to receive your *free ship and all this without the actual game even close to being finished. I bet that makes it kind of easy to put the blinders on for all these troubling issues and stick your head in the sand about any criticism.

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Man you really have some problems with it..do you? You should just chill the fuck out a bit because it's not your fucking money.

 

[Deleted member 50658]

You

8 years of development? Maybe if you include the Publisher/Kickstarter demo video that had nothing to do with the actual game/endproduct.

First they had to build the studios after the kickstarter campaign (at the end of 2012) until they could start development

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You think any game development starts out with all developers onboard right away? Every game have a planning faze were the story, mechanics scope, proof of concept etc is carried out and that time is included in the development time of the game. Not until late in production the bulk of the developers on a project is working on it. SC is not different in any regard and all projects ramp up production with time.

 

[borntoulouselautrec]

Because it goes against your narrative, i know.
Fact is, they had only a handful developers at the end of the kickstarter project. And they had to replan after the success of the kickstarter.

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They didn't have to replan anything, they decided to seeing they could live off selling ships for years. And they were right:

You think any game development starts out with all developers onboard right away? Every game have a planning faze were the story, mechanics scope, proof of concept etc is carried out and that time is included in the development time of the game. Not until late in production the bulk of the developers on a project is working on it. SC is not different in any regard and all projects ramp up production with time.

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Stand by for another classic: 'you don't understand game development'.

 

[Herman The Tosser]

Because it goes against your narrative, i know.
Fact is, they had only a handful developers at the end of the kickstarter project. And they had to replan after the success of the kickstarter.


Don't compare games with a publisher and an estabilshed development studio with a kickstarter project that has no publisher, no development studio and only 10 members (or less) at the end of the kickstarter campaign.

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If they had developers, then they were developing the game. It's not a difficult concept.

 

[borntoulouselautrec]

Because these fucking threads are never about the game itself but only the funding around it...and how it is a scam and that we are cult etc etc. I would like to see someone goes indepth in the game and discuss the tech, gameplay how things work...Of course, that's going a little too much since you don't know anything about it.

Everyone can repeat each other that it is a scam...nothing new.

Click to shrink...

 

[Deleted member 50658]

Because these fucking threads are never about the game itself but only the funding around it...and how it is a scam and that we are cult etc etc. I would like to see someone goes indepth in the game and discuss the tech, gameplay how things work...Of course, that's going a little too much since you don't know anything about it.

Everyone can repeat each other that it is a scam...nothing new.

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The thread title is not fucking STAR CITIZEN DEVELOPMENT TRHEAD OT:We got scope son!

The tread is about the MONETIZING of the game. Wonder fucking why we are discussing MONETIZATION in it?????

Like I said if anyone is in this thread acting like a troll it is you or you have some severe and really disturbing lack of reading comprehension.

 

[Komo]

8 years of development? Maybe if you include the Publisher/Kickstarter demo video that had nothing to do with the actual game/endproduct.

First they had to build the studios after the kickstarter campaign (at the end of 2012) until they could start development

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Most of that was development of tech. They've done insane work to get the game to look exactly how they want.

 

[glaurung]

The entire project is a scam and we have known this for years.

Yes, the "game" will manifest eventually and it will be a below average piece of malware, designed to be more of a storefront than an actual entertainment product. When? 2022? 2025? Who knows.

This thread is about them holding a fundraiser with a steep seat price, while the food adds up to maybe a happy meal cost. And all this to hock another fake piece of ones and zeroes at the participants. Which is deplorable and sad.

 

[Ganyc]

You think any game development starts out with all developers onboard right away? Every game have a planning faze were the story, mechanics scope, proof of concept etc is carried out and that time is included in the development time of the game. Not until late in production the bulk of the developers on a project is working on it. SC is not different in any regard and all projects ramp up production with time.

Click to shrink...

any AAA game development starts with a studio and a publisher behind them. The development phase from star citizen was way after the kickstarter

i say it again: don't compare traditional game development with this big project that got its resources though crowdfunding. It had to build their studios (and crew) first. That took a little more time (i think they said it on a citizencon where they presented the cig studio slides)

They didn't have to replan anything, they decided to seeing they could live off selling ships for years. And they were right:





Stand by for another classic: 'you don't understand game development'.

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oh now we are beyond trolling and it is shitposting? How unexpected.

They had to replan almost everything. For example: SQ42 was not planned to be open world (open universe)

If they had developers, then they were developing the game. It's not a difficult concept.

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planing is the word i would use. Saying the game is 8 years (1 year before the kickstarter campaing) in development is just plain wrong.

The entire project is a scam and we have known this for years.

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you don't know what a scam is, do you?

 

[Deleted member 50658]

Most of that was development of tech. They've done insane work to get the game to look exactly how they want.

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Sad that it's not work exactly like they want and you are applauding it.

 

[Fizzgig]

So, for one of the attendees to buy the new ship, they will have spent at least, AT LEAST $1,950....on a videogame...

Yeah, fuck these greedy pricks

 

[Captain_Raoul]

Sad that it's not work exactly like they want and you are applauding it.

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Ooh right tell us "mister who knows everything".

 

[Deleted member 31104]

8 years of development? Maybe if you include the Publisher/Kickstarter demo video that had nothing to do with the actual game/endproduct.

First they had to build the studios after the kickstarter campaign (at the end of 2012) until they could start development

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I always fail to see that point when it comes up. RSI are the ones who set the 2014 SQ42 date during the kickstarter. RSI the ones who talked about the preproduction and design (and yes that counts as development) during the kickstarter. Even the "well, they got far more money than they could have expected so all that's out of the window" rings hollow, this isn't the Origin days of releasing a product and having no real way of updating it: build a minimum viable complete version of SQ42 and use that as the base template for the MMO all the while having another set of MMO teams working on the network/server technology you know you'll need. Then build the MMO up with those building blocks folding the technology improvements back into SQ42 (and it's successors). Meanwhile, we're talking about a game 'design' which now includes a drink mixing game and selecting movies for NPC's simply to service ship sales.

 

[Dan Thunder]

As someone who's not followed the game's development in depth, but is aware that they've raised a bloody fortune, what's the decision behind charging these amounts for ships?

I mean there must be some rational about being able to charge nearly $700 or 14x the price of the game itself?

 

[Deleted member 50658]

any AAA game development starts with a studio and a publisher behind them. The development phase from star citizen was way after the kickstarter

i say it again: don't compare traditional game development with this big project that got its resources though crowdfunding. It had to build their studios (and crew) first. That took a little more time (i think they said it on a citizencon where they presented the cig studio slides)


oh now we are beyond trolling and it is shitposting? How unexpected.

They had to replan almost everything. For example: SQ42 was not planned to be open world (open universe)



planing is the word i would use. Saying the game is 8 years (1 year before the kickstarter campaing) in development is just plain wrong.



you don't know what a scam is, do you?

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You should have joined MS at the reveal of the Xbox One as a pr agent you are seriously even above them trying to spin this shit.

 

[Klyka]

If I was invested into something for thousands of dollars I'd defend everything they do and find the prettiest webms too

 

[borntoulouselautrec]

As someone who's not followed the game's development in depth, but is aware that they've raised a bloody fortune, what's the decision behind charging these amounts for ships?

I mean there must be some rational about being able to charge nearly $700 or 14x the price of the game itself?

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Notice the wording on their site, buying ships is sometimes called a 'pledge' (even though you have to pay VAT when buying ships in the EU and pledges are not taxed). What this means basically is they really creatively monetised the game development by creating an in-game economy that allowed them to keep the game in constant development. There are no publishers so no one is telling them when to ship, backers are angry at all the missed milestones but what can they do? They're not investors, they just 'pledged'.

And if you wonder how many of the ships are in game currently you can watch this 4 second video:


(The video is 1 year old and they added about 15 ships since then.)

 

[Deleted member 50658]

H

Ooh right tell us "mister who knows everything".

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Hey at least I know what thread I am in and that is more than you can say of yourself. Maybe you should take a break and go out from this thread and get those last 500 recruit you need to provide Chris with for your free* ship.

 

[entrydenied]

As someone who's not followed the game's development in depth, but is aware that they've raised a bloody fortune, what's the decision behind charging these amounts for ships?

I mean there must be some rational about being able to charge nearly $700 or 14x the price of the game itself?

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Probably because development never ends and the initial crowd sourced funds is unable to sustain an evergrowin list of things that had to be done. Selling ships at exorbitant rates allows them to stay in the black instead of just failing completely.

 

[KKRT]

The thread title is not fucking STAR CITIZEN DEVELOPMENT TRHEAD OT:We got scope son!

The tread is about the MONETIZING of the game. Wonder fucking why we are discussing MONETIZATION in it?????

Like I said if anyone is in this thread acting like a troll it is you or you have some severe and really disturbing lack of reading comprehension.

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Thread is about "dinner" on Star Citizen Convention costing 275$ which is nothing extraordinary, so i do know why this thread still continues.
And btw its not a dinner that important for people paying for it, its ability to talk and drink with CIG's developers, management included.

ExileCon - Path of Exile convention
Ticket that includes dinner with developers cost 500$, normal ticket 200$

Path of Exile

Path of Exile is a free online-only action RPG under development by Grinding Gear Games in New Zealand.

www.pathofexile.com

Blizzcon
750$ for a ticket that includes dinner with developers, normal Blizzcon Pass 230$

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/blizzcon-2019-dates-and-ticket-details-announced-p/1100-6466498/

TennoCon - Warframe convention
Ticket for dev team stream session with devs and voice recording 1000$ - normal ticket 30$

https://www.warframe.com/news/tennocon-2019-tickets-on-sale-february-28

 

[entrydenied]

Thread is about "dinner" on Star Citizen Convention costing 275$ which is nothing extraordinary, so i do know why this thread still continues.
And btw its not a dinner that important for people paying for it, its ability to talk and drink with CIG's developers, management included.

ExileCon - Path of Exile convention
Ticket that includes dinner with developers cost 500$, normal ticket 200$

Path of Exile

Path of Exile is a free online-only action RPG under development by Grinding Gear Games in New Zealand.

www.pathofexile.com

Blizzcon
750$ for a ticket that includes dinner with developers, normal Blizzcon Pass 230$

https://www.gamespot.com/articles/blizzcon-2019-dates-and-ticket-details-announced-p/1100-6466498/

TennoCon - Warframe convention
Ticket for dev team stream session with devs and voice recording 1000$ - normal ticket 30$

https://www.warframe.com/news/tennocon-2019-tickets-on-sale-february-28

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I don't know whether anyone flagged these out before but people flag Star Citizens: out because of their questionable monetization practices. Those games arguably don't share a similar problem.

 

[glaurung]

If I am a whale supporter who gets invited to a 275 USD dinner - because I have already donated a ton of money to the same cause - I expect filet mignon and a properly good red wine to go with it. Not fucking sausages and a house Riesling from the bottom shelf. If you then ask me to pay a further 675 USD at that pitiful dinner as an additional donation, I know you are lining your pockets, not generating goodwill.

And I would walk out, asking my money back.

 

[KKRT]

I don't know whether anyone flagged these out before but people flag Star Citizens: out because of their questionable monetization practices. Those games arguably don't share a similar problem.

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There are extreme whales in all of those games, this is how the model works.

People complain about SC, because its not out, but thats the thing, it would be never created without such monetization and its the most ambitious game of all time, can we have one of those once in a while? I do not like how safe industry is today. Nobody will make second EVE Online anytime soon with how current industry tries to eliminate risks and for me EVE is the best i've ever played and hoping for SC to be a successor.
I would see the problem if CIG was really not fair, but they are. They give free access to current state of alpha 3 times a year, you can use any ship you want on PTU, with current economy ships do not require extreme grinding to buy or rent and all community stuff they do, its completely free (lets forget last year's citizencon 'incident' ;p)

 

[Orbit]

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this is seriously the perfect gif for this thread.

more on topic: i mean, hey, if backers of this game are satisfied and happy with their investment i am okay. but some of the decisions of the devs surrounding the development of this game just seems so scummy sometimes.

 

[Ganyc]

I always fail to see that point when it comes up. RSI are the ones who set the 2014 SQ42 date during the kickstarter.

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yes, you are right. But that was the kickstarters old scope without the stretchgoals and without the planet tech plans. They asked the community if they should add more features and the project grew.

With SQ42 they had a few setbacks (Star Marine and the illfonic desaster and quick progress on the planet tech - that is why they decided to use the planet tech for SQ42) and now it has more content and features than before. That they could'nt follow the (estimated!!) kickstarter release date is only logical.


(btw it's CIG not RSI)

You should have joined MS at the reveal of the Xbox One as a pr agent you are seriously even above them trying to spin this shit.

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okay, i think i'll ignore your shitposts now. Your agenda is obvious.