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Y'all too quick to forgive Severus Snape
- Thread starter Jack Bauer
- Start date
OP
OP
Like, I'm rereading the series for the first time in ages, and this is only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to shit he does.
Failing to teach Harry Occlumency was ridiculous.
Obligatory JK Rowling a terf and a pile of fecal matter and broken glass.
Anyway, naming your child after the abusive man who only kept you alive because he called dibs on your mom decades ago is an odd choice.
The epilogue is kind of shit.
Anyway, naming your child after the abusive man who only kept you alive because he called dibs on your mom decades ago is an odd choice.
The epilogue is kind of shit.
Harry: "And he was the bravest man I've ever known."
No, he wasn't. He was the most obsessed man you've ever know. Obsessed with your mom.
IMO all of the movies are good but Azkaban, Half Blood Prince, and Deathly Hallows Pt. 1 are incredible.
Is this the thread where we collectively take a dump on JK Rowling? Because I want to do that.
Harry is a fucking idiot for that one.
No argument here.
Oh, the John Williams soundtrack is pretty good. Unless that counts as part of Prisoner of Azkaban.
I really enjoyed the book because it seemed like the first time you got a sense of history and people living their lives before Harry's time. Not that it really matters as all that stuff ended up being pretty boring. And granted, I haven't read it since I was twelve.
Oh, the John Williams soundtrack is pretty good. Unless that counts as part of Prisoner of Azkaban.
You know how many innocents Severus would kill if it meant clapping Lily Potter's cheeks? Thousands.
The way that I view Severus Snape is the same way that I view Obito Uchiha. The narrative wants me to believe their love is pure and there's a good man under there but they're obsessively, horny man-children.
I guess Obito has the excuse that it's genetic for him.
The way that I view Severus Snape is the same way that I view Obito Uchiha. The narrative wants me to believe their love is pure and there's a good man under there but they're obsessively, horny man-children.
I guess Obito has the excuse that it's genetic for him.
For me, I have put my relationship with the series on hold. I don't think I can revisit the books ever again. Reading her writing is simply infuriating. I just see the whining about cancel culture and bad faith nonsense about trans women not having period.
I think the movies are bigger than her. She wasn't the one who made those movies special. It was Chris Columbus, Alfonso Cuaron, David Yates, John Williams, Daniel Radcliffe, Rupert Grint, Emma Watson, Tom Felton etc that made those movies special.
I think the movies are bigger than her. She wasn't the one who made those movies special. It was Chris Columbus, Alfonso Cuaron, David Yates, John Williams, Daniel Radcliffe, Rupert Grint, Emma Watson, Tom Felton etc that made those movies special.
I am surprised Ginny wasn't all "Harry I love you but our son would share a name with someone everyone in our family despised because he treated all of us like shit. Just name him Albus Micheal Potter."
Someone made the comparison to Naruto earlier and it weirdly fits
It does feel like Kishimoto liked Harry Potter a lot. Some plot elements feel similar.
This is common in stories where politics are no more than surface level and "good" and "bad" are just changeable personality traits.
I always felt there was a big disconnect between what Rowling wanted me to feel about Severus Snape and what I actually felt about him. The man had very few redeeming qualities, even at the end, and his "selfless" acts were ultimately acts of selfishness anyway. I was able to recognize the moment in the story where Rowling wanted me to feel compassion for the man, but I just couldn't. He deserved everything he got and then some.
oh a shit on harry potter thread? fun
Anyways book 3 and movie 3 are the only good things to come out of this franchise, bunch of blairite trash
Anyways book 3 and movie 3 are the only good things to come out of this franchise, bunch of blairite trash
Both Harry Potter and Naruto are fairly reactionary in nature. Uphold the status quo through traditions of violence and all that.
Snape was an asshole. He tormented his students for years, doubly so when it came to Harry. Snape was entirely fine with Wizard-Nazi views until it impacted him personally. He was out for revenge, and Dumbledore perfectly exploited his guilt to get the most of him. Dumbledore tried to show him freindship, and I wouldn't be surprised if the other teachers did too, and he just rejected it all.
Also...
Also...
he only stopped being a nazi because he wanted to bone lily. even as a kid i knew jk was on some bullshit trying to frame it as noble act.
i used to like snape before that and before i got older and realized the fucked up dynamics of an adult mocking children. he went from one of my favorite characters to one of my most hated
i used to like snape before that and before i got older and realized the fucked up dynamics of an adult mocking children. he went from one of my favorite characters to one of my most hated
For Rowling, the forgiveness aspect feels more tied to Christianity, religion in general and Rowling's personal politics
In Naruto, Kishimoto said he did it that way because Naruto is a Shonen and Shonen should be upholding idealistic ideals despite it not being realistic. He's talked about how he's actually personally closer to Sasuke than Naruto when it comes to forgiving people as Sasuke is a character that finds it hard to forgive others whereas Naruto is all-forgiving.
In essence, Naruto being part of the Shonen genre dictated Naruto's character writing to an extent whereas Harry is all Rowling.
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Glad Era has the right take on this.
As sad as the moment is in the movie, any amount of thought put into it makes you realize how dumb the reasoning is.
As sad as the moment is in the movie, any amount of thought put into it makes you realize how dumb the reasoning is.
I don't know.
He was a heart broken man actually trying to save the life of his lost love's son while sacrificing a lot, including murdering his friend just so that the arch nemesis of the series could be defeated.
He wasn't an incel. It wasn't like he hated women or couldn't find a lover. He loved Lily and when she died he later down the road devoted his life to saving her son. We don't know much about his personal life aside from that and the flashbacks.
He wasn't an incel. It wasn't like he hated women or couldn't find a lover. He loved Lily and when she died he later down the road devoted his life to saving her son. We don't know much about his personal life aside from that and the flashbacks.
I actually feel like people are being kind of harsh towards him. If he was shown postin on 4chan and carrying an AR-15 around sure, but within the context of the story he wasn't really a bad guy.
I never quite understood why Harry Potter got the level of fandom it did. Or rather why, in my experience, so much of the fandom didn't move beyond it or interact with other material with the same enthusiasm. I can't help but feel bitter that seemingly only a few folks moved on to say something like Earthsea. Imagine if the world was as obsessed with Le Guin's work and had her stories as part of their formative experiences.
I don't even mean as an alternative to Harry Potter as it's not an either or situation. But for me, the best thing about reading Harry Potter was that it exposed me to better books. So this is all really just me being selfish and wanting more people to enjoy other works with.
Imagine someone being a colossal dick to you just because of some family secret super secret to Severus. Eat shit, Snape.
There are stories in both traditions which did not find it necessary to treat its audience like lobotomy victims in order to achieve those ends.
And it is not Snape achieving some measure of redemption that is the problem, it is the narrative bending itself to excuse and forgive him.
Snape didn't want him to die but he still began to antagonize Harry from the very first class, and throughout the school year.
He was literally a death eater.
Like an actual death eater before Dumbledore recruited him to be an undercover death eater.
You're right, he wasn't just some rando on 4chan. He was a full-blown Nazi working beneath Hitler to try and impress a girl.
Dude was bullied for being a Nazi
I don't even understand why he was sneaking around with the whole Quirrell stuff. Isn't that the one where Quirrel tricked Dumbledore into leaving Hogwarts on the night that he was stealing the philosopher's stone?
Maybe I'm misremembering, but shouldn't he have been like, "hey Dumbledore, dude's trying to steal the Philosopher's Stone and kill Harry Potter?"
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People change. I think it gave his character more nuance. He clearly realized he was wrong long before the end.
I should say: I only read the first book (some of the second, didn't finish), but I was told the movies follow them very closely so they are what I am mainly going off of.
If only...
And Le Guin deserves that kind of fandom so much more than JK the terf.
Money, corruption, power structures and turning a blind eye protected them more than forgiveness. Pretty realistic actually.
Even if I don't think Snape was fully redeemed at least he did some good, better than the Malfoys just stopping fighting and people being cool with it.
As for Snape I'll never get over him outing Lupin and trying to get his soul sucked out.
Really didn't feel like the movies did a good job with Draco's parents. Don't remember if the books even did a better job explaining why they became so unloyal so quickly.
Why do I always see bad opinions like this on this site for critically acclaimed and popular series? Christ, not even other places like Reddit is this bad and that place can be such a mess.
Harry Potter is like How I Met Your Mother. In both cases, the authors wrote the ending as they were just starting to write the series, and they were hell bent on keeping that epilogue because it's supposedly so cool that the ending had already been written so long ago, they stuck to the plan, it's how it was meant to be etc etc... while completely ignoring how the series evolved over the years and what the audience felt for the characters based on what is actually in the story. So there's this huge disconnect, or dissonance, between the work as a whole and the epilogue.
Fuck Snape, the ultimate incel wizard. Wizel?
Fuck Snape, the ultimate incel wizard. Wizel?
I'm currently rereading the entire series for the first time since DH released 13 years ago and among other rediscoveries (man, people on the Internet weren't kidding when they said Ron is pretty great in the books, it slipped away from me over the years) I'm shocked at just how much of a gigantic turd of a human being Snape is. Constantly. I did a double take at Snape trying to poison Trevor but I'm 2/3 GoF and the only decent thing he did so far was casting countercurses on Potter during that one Quidditch match. Outside of that he is gigantic bully who constantly tortures kids and in PoA he was absolutely delighted he could turn Sirius (and really that was not because he was a murderer) and Lupin in to dementors for the kiss. Like, I get it he was bullied but jesus christ dude what the fuck.
Alan Rickman and films in general leaving most of his actions out surely clouded people's judgement of him.
I wrote out a long post saying that Snape was more nuanced than this thread is making him out to be, but as I thought about it more, I kind of concluded that he was such an abusive POS that that outweighs the positive things that he did. Yes, he was very important to the war effort and put himself in great personal peril, at the eventual cost of his own life to kill Wizard Hitler. But his verbal harassment, psychological torment, and abusive treatment of little kids was so bad during the books that that it just completely casts a pall as dark as his demeanor over his legacy. Hogwarts, take down the Snape portrait.
edit: I still think the title of this post is a strawman though. Is there a single person in this thread saying to forgive Snape? Maybe 10 years ago, but his character has aged VERY poorly. I think 90% of sentiment on the Internet is negative towards him nowadays. The ones who are still sympathetic to him probably only watched the movies which was almost a different portrayal entirely.
edit: I still think the title of this post is a strawman though. Is there a single person in this thread saying to forgive Snape? Maybe 10 years ago, but his character has aged VERY poorly. I think 90% of sentiment on the Internet is negative towards him nowadays. The ones who are still sympathetic to him probably only watched the movies which was almost a different portrayal entirely.
