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Stopdoor

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,778
Toronto
I just finished Woolly World after powering through a string of the Yoshi games, and man - there was a lot of mediocre there, but with Woolly World, I'm not seeing it. I was reading some old thread on here with some topic like "Why can't Nintendo make a good sequel to Yoshi's Island???" and it's mind-blowing how people seem to ignore this game - literally because it doesn't have "Island" in its name, or it's got a Yarn aesthetic, or whatever. If we can't parse good games because they're not literally named "<series> <x + 1>", we don't deserve good games.

This game has essentially the entire core of Yoshi's Island. 6 Worlds. Egg throwing mechanics. The exact same batch of collectibles, plus more. You've got Baby Bowser, Kamek, you've got vehicle transformation sections, you've got keys, you've got Chomp Rocks, you have Shy Guys, you have Watermelons, you have Poochy, etc., etc., it's all here. I'm reading Super Mario Wiki and they cordon it off to some separate "Yoshi (platform series)" section from the Yoshi's Island games, and I'm just rolling my eyes. The fundamental difference here is there's no Baby Mario, and honesty - this is what everyone wanted. The "Baby Mario as health" mechanic was never not frustrating and obnoxious at its core, in audio and mechanically. Woolly World streamlines it to basic health in the most faithful way, and actually makes the game more difficult for it - you don't regenerate health like in the original Yoshi's Island, and you can actually be a single hit from death and consider enemies as a threat. That's like the opposite of modern Nintendo sawing off the pointy edges.

Yoshi's Island ain't untouchable. Woolly World makes piles of mechanical QoL improvements, like to that health system, and crucially the collectibles. The collectibles are the meat and potatoes of Yoshi's Island. It's not a hard game - you can barely die - it only gets hard when you have to collect things, take risks, spend longer time in the levels and risk losing it all. But Yoshi's Island treats it as a bizarre all-or-nothing - collect every item, or you wasted your time. And the levels do nothing to help that goal - you get trapped constantly after points-of-no-return. Woolly World, while letting you save every collectible you got when you finish a level, also does the UI miracle of tracking which collectibles you got in order, rather than just something like a 5/5 count. If you pick up the third flower in a level without collecting the second, you can actually weigh if it's worth going back and scouring the level before exiting a section, and at least you'll have an idea where it is next time.

Honestly, this is the sort of stuff I'd never expect to see in a mainstream review, even when it matters a ton to the experience. But even then, you've got people decrying how "unoriginal", or even "uncreative", or god forbid, "soulless" this game is. It's just a derivative, they say. It'll never match the originality of Yoshi's Island ... why can't they make another Yoshi's Island??? And I dunno, these people are insane. Woolly World, thanks in part to its Yarn aesthetic, has piles of original ideas. It's more of what you liked, plus more. And the plus more is no slouch.

You ain't got any levels like these in Yoshi's Island. If you look at these and go "I dunno what I'm looking at", well, you need to go play Yoshi's Woolly World, a game with tons of solid creativity. I'm not sure what people expect. They want a new Yoshi's Island, but if they see too much they recognize, it's just not fresh enough. Too derivative. SOULLESS. I'm not sure what you people want. It's all here.

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One of the most obvious things I could see people rag in the DS/3DS Yoshi's Island sequels was how they were also audio-visually inferior. That's kind of without debate. They each have about a single decent music track to their names, and their art style is passable but not really comparable.

But Woolly World doesn't have that problem. It might not have the SNES producing its finest pixel art and chiptastic tunes, but instead it goes back to that original creativity of Yoshi's Island and essentially invents its own art style: the Yarn aesthetic is indisputably beautiful and creative, and even better, it complements the level design. It's what we want, right?! We want inventiveness! We want soul! It's here. The game wants to love you. Some art designer somewhere put their heart into this. But it will never be enough.

And the musical tracks are incredibly solid. It might not be chiptune, but I wouldn't have it any other way. It goes its own way, and doesn't slouch with it. You've got vibes for days. Yoshi's Island is a vibe and Yoshi's Woolly World is a vibe.





And there's piles of other little things that make it its own. Like how you can flutter jump to infinity, which sounds bad, but this is the pathos of a game that made dying from enemies a bump and not the curtain. Simultaneously giving some forgiving to the the sudden obnoxious instant deaths of falling off a stage and losing all your collectibles, it's also a kind of technical move for "pro" players. You might find it trivial to float indefinitely, but this is a Yoshi game - I doubt your 8 year old child can pull it off to the degree you can. And the level designs can be built around that. Use that to your advantage. Take some risks. Even better, a variety of natural difficulty options also exist for young players without bothering the core gameplay. They even intertwine with it, removing the nearly useless "lives" mechanic, another whatever idea from Yoshi's Island, and give "coins" a new purpose, to massage the difficulty in much more direct way if you so choose. It's an adaption of the inventory system that the handheld games lack, and again, Woolly World apes it with aplomb, with its own mixture.

The level design is even intelligent using the power of these high fidelity yarn designs and the classic coin patterns of old and so on, in hiding off-screen secrets with subtle indications - walls you can pass through or scrunch, invisible egg clouds, clues to the pro, the trained eye, it's all there. No one was asleep at the wheel here.

It's all just icing on cake - co-operative play, unlockable Yoshi designs, and (optional) motion controls just enhance the experience in subtle but fundamental ways. This is a game with features, not gimmicks.

I can't say I'm hyped for Yoshi's Crafted World reviews. Piles more "oh, woe, why can Nintendo not match Yoshi's Island? I don't feel the magic, the soul, the I-can't-say-what. Why won't Nintendo just stay in their lane, and simultaneously do it all fresh?" Yoshi's Island diehards will be waiting forever, for the true, proper game that Miyamoto himself squirts his special sauce all over. Maybe, because, in the end, the "magic" is just magic - a time and a place, and that's not going to happen again. You've been nostalgia'd. It's with you forever. Poo-poo that you don't like the marginally slower paced Woolly World platforming physics, or somehow think the Yarn aesthetic is just whatever, but don't come at me with your magical soul of secret sauce criticisms and how nobody is smart enough to get Yoshi's Island right. It's here. It's been done. You're not gonna get any closer without a romhack or pray Nintendo pulls a Mega Man 9. That'd be rad, but there's no point yelling B-TEAM here. Enjoy video games. Please and thanks. Cool.
 

neoJABES

Member
Dec 23, 2017
542
Fucken love this game. One of my favorite co-op games to play with my daughter. We still boot it up often to try find some missing items that we're missing.

The music and graphics are still amazing to me years later.
 

Kouriozan

Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,072
Couldn't go past World 1, I heard it gets better but I was just not feeling it.
Also hoping Crafted World will be good but first impressions for me are the same as Wolly World. I won't judge before we get reviews though.
 

sheaaaa

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,556
Yeah it's fucking fantastic. If the new Yoshi can match it we're in for a treat.
 

Deleted member 5535

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,656
Wolly World is the best Yoshi game by far. And Nintendo as far of development wasn't involved like Yoshi Island (or past Yoshi games) and Good Feel did a amazing job on it
 
OP
OP
Stopdoor

Stopdoor

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,778
Toronto
I'm side-eyeing all you first poster guys right now because I doubt you read even a third of that paragraph vomit.
 

Deleted member 249

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
28,828
It's the best Yoshi game since Yoshi's Island, but I feel it doesn't match up to its bar. The level design and platforming mechanics simply don't come together as well as they do in the original game, and neither does the music. The art is the one and only area where I think Wooly World stacks up.

As I said, none of this is to take away from how good Wooly World is, it's just that Yoshi's Island is a superlative masterpiece.
 

JB2448

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,956
Florida
I agree wholeheartedly OP. The game was an absolute delight to play, both solo and co-op. Many people are missing out on a true gem.
 

BlueManifest

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,319
Did the game have any challenging levels towards the end or challenging secret levels or both?

A platformer without either of those aren't good platformers to me
 
OP
OP
Stopdoor

Stopdoor

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,778
Toronto
It's the best Yoshi game since Yoshi's Island, but I feel it doesn't match up to its bar. The level design and platforming mechanics simply don't come together as well as they do in the original game, and neither does the music. The art is the one and only area where I think Wooly World stacks up.

As I said, none of this is to take away from how good Wooly World is, it's just that Yoshi's Island is a superlative masterpiece.

Come back to me when you get the science of level design together, what secret magic you're hoping gets replicated.
 

ckareset

Attempted to circumvent ban with an alt account
Banned
Feb 2, 2018
4,977
I didnt even realize. it was built by a B team. What does that even mean lol

It's not like the same exact guys produce all of nintendos games
 

aerie

wonky
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
8,030
It's a really fantastic game but I didn't think it quite matched the original. It's not nostalgia talking either, I didn't play Yoshi's Island until the early 2000's when I was well into my 20's. The game has lots of strengths and we can celebrate them on their own, I don't really feel like Woolly World is quite in the shadow of Island compared to the past sequels.
 
Jan 11, 2018
9,653
Even if it's not better than people's memories of Yoshi's Island, it is absolutely a better game. And I'm expecting Crafted World to be just as good if not better. If only Nintendo's internal teams put as much love, care, and craft into their 2D Platformers as Good-Feel.
 

mopinks

Member
Oct 27, 2017
30,559
it's objectively worse than Yoshi's Island because of the boss recycling

Yarn Poochy almost makes up for it
 

Deleted member 249

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
28,828
"Simply don't come together" ain't much of anything, really. It's hard to put together criticism but it's just lame to be dunking with what you can't quantify.
I mean, what do you want to know exactly? I feel like the levels aren't as well designed given the array of moves and abilities available to Yoshi in Wooly World as they are in the original. I feel like they aren't as tightly designed as they are in the original. I don't feel the platforming feels as good as it does in the original.
Games aren't sum-of-their-pieces, and games critique isn't deconstructive. The most I can do is tell you my overall takeaway as to why I feel WW comes up short compared to the original.
 

Burrman

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,633
I had zero fun playing this game with my son. It's just so fuckin boring. The art style is cool and that's about it.
 

aerie

wonky
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
8,030
"Simply don't come together" ain't much of anything, really. It's hard to put together criticism but it's just lame to be dunking with what you can't quantify.
Sometimes it can be difficult to quantify the quality of one game over another, but i think Phantom Thief did a good job with a basic summary saying "The level design and platforming mechanics simply don't come together as well as they do in the original game, and neither does the music. The art is the one and only area where I think Wooly World stacks up.", it's simply put, but we aren't going to be expected to write an essay on it here to really break it all down.

I'd also add the games pace is quite a bit slower than Yoshi's Island and can be a bit dull compared to the original due to this.
 
OP
OP
Stopdoor

Stopdoor

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,778
Toronto
Sometimes it can be difficult to quantify the quality of one game over another, but i think Phantom Thief did a good job with a basic summary saying "The level design and platforming mechanics simply don't come together as well as they do in the original game, and neither does the music. The art is the one and only area where I think Wooly World stacks up.", it's simply put, but we aren't going to be expected to write an essay on it here to really break it all down.

I just can't imagine what these people are looking for. It's not more Yoshi's Island, it seems. It's just pursuit of freshness, of something else entirely. If you reversed these games in time the one would just be derivative of the other.
 

Pirateluigi

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,866
Personally, I think it's just about as good as YI. It may not hit the same highs, but the entire package is really darn good.
 

BlueManifest

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,319
Can someone answer these so I have an idea of what crafted world might be like

Did wooly world have any tense platforming moments like donkey Kong? Like those moments when your holding breath trying to make it through a specific part?

Basically part of the first question but are the extra worlds or last worlds challenging at all? How many times will the average player die from the beginning to end of the game?
 

Fuchsia

Member
Oct 28, 2017
6,641
I had fun doing a couch co-op playthrough with my SO, but found the game to be almost painfully slow and easy. But I'm someone who doesn't like the whole, "the difficulty is manufactured when you try and 100% the level." I get joy from progressing through levels in platformers and seeing the sights as I work towards reaching the end. I remember the levels in Yoshi's WW just being sort of boring. Maybe Yoshi games just aren't for me? Still, I'm gonna give the next one another shot and see if it can change my mind. It already looks more interesting to me visually.
 

Axass

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
1,384
WW is definitely the best Yoshi thing since the original Yoshis Island and damn good too. The original is still vastly superior though.
 

NuclearCake

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
9,867
For starters it's too easy, almost baby's first 2D platformer levels of easy. It borrows too much from the original Yoshi's Island without doing really anything new. It just adds up to a game that's not really exciting to play. Now yes, Wolly World is the best of the bunch since the original but the bar isn't really that high. Yoshi's Story was abysmal, Yoshi's Island DS easily makes it into the worst Nintendo games ever made list, thanks to it's broken level design and Yoshi's "New" Island is mediocrity incarnate.

The original game was unique title in the Mario series and plenty of it's ideas eventually made their way into Mario 64. The first Yoshi's Island was the first "Mario" game that was fully focused on exploration and it feels like Mario 64 was more or less Yosih's Island in 3D rather than something like Super Mario Bros 3 in 3D. It was a important title for the franchise and it still holds up incredibly well with it's amazing art-style, expert level design and solid mechanics. Nintendo pulled out all the stops when developing the original and it shows. Wolly World in comparison just feels OK at best. Never did i get the sense that the title was everything it could possibly be.

Personally i have no reason to ever replay Wolly World, since everything it does the original did better over 20 years earlier.
 

mopinks

Member
Oct 27, 2017
30,559
Can someone answer these so I have an idea of what crafted world might be like

Did wooly world have any tense platforming moments like donkey Kong? Like those moments when your holding breath trying to make it through a specific part?

Basically part of the first question but are the extra worlds or last worlds challenging at all? How many times will the average player die from the beginning to end of the game?
it's generally not a very hard game at all, but the extra levels do get pretty brutal
 

Akita One

Member
Oct 30, 2017
4,626
Just so I am clear, is this game being compared to Super Mario World 2: Yoshi's Island ????
 

MaverickHunterAsh

Good Vibes Gaming
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
1,391
Los Angeles, CA.
Completely agree with you, OP. I found Yoshi's Woolly World is to be exquisitely charming and relaxing (with appropriately challenging extra levels), though opinions on it vary widely even among the GX team. I won't say it's every bit as great as Yoshi's Island, but it definitely compares favorably and the gulf between them is fairly small in my opinion. It might just have the chillest soundtrack of any 2D platformer ever, too. It's SO good!

I'm so excited for Crafted World. If it's even half as good as Woolly World, we're in for a great time.
 

Entryhazard

One Winged Slayer
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,843
Level design and physics is not as good
The overemphasis on "crafted" aesthetic can be annoying

I don't think the music is up to par either


Definitely better than New Island but still doubles down in stylistically being "babby's first Mario game". Yoshi's Island plays on that but doesn't go overboard, "settling" on cartoonish graphics and still has "cool" music, as Kondo would say
 

Lucas M. Thomas

Editor-in-Chief of Nintendo Force Magazine
Verified
Oct 30, 2017
2,290
Kentucky
Woolly World is sensational and the first truly worthy successor to Yoshi's Island. Excited to see how Crafted World compares in just a few more weeks.
 

Kapryov

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,129
Australia
It looks kinda neat, but oddly I also do not find it aesthetically pleasing at all.
I'm being really petty, but Yoshi's Island is an all time favourite game and I've grown to actually dislike the character with every release and appearance since then. Why do we have to be wool now anyway? Is the series just going to be just constant unique art style changes?

Oh well, I'll probably check out crafted world when the reviews drop.
 

UsoEwin

Banned
Jul 14, 2018
2,063
OP asks why people don't like the game as much, and then acts like a complete ass when people give him reasons. Wow
 

Dyle

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
29,910
I think I enjoyed playing it more, but it was probably a time and place thing, I didn't really appreciate most of what Yoshi's Island was doing until long after I had first played it. Yoshi's Island is overall a better and far more important/groundbreaking game.