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DarthWalden

Prophet of Truth
The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
6,030
Yes, but you also boosted their coffers by purchasing 3 years of Gold ;)

This has to be the "catch" here, my situation was potentially unique because in already had 2+ years if live loaded on my account.


But ignoring my situation I'm guessing the "catch" is for those that had minimal or no investment in the Microsoft, suddenly they have years of gamepass subscription and start doing a lot of their gaming through Xbox and the Microsoft store which leads to the purchase of Pheriphals, DLC, other games etc..
 

DevilMayGuy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,577
Texas
LOL at those analyzing every angle and talking about possible future negative things when many of us are just having the time of our gaming lives with this incredible thing called Xbox Game Pass where we get what looks to be an amazing game in The Outer Worlds on Friday!. This is definitely going to be a huge factor for Xbox going into the next gen launch having this service with Halo Infinite and every other first party game on there.
Don't analyze the content, just enjoy content and get hyped to enjoy next content

What? One can enjoy a thing and also analyze the thing. Maybe stick to advertisements and PR puff pieces instead of discussion boards if you don't want discussion lmao
 

Honome

Member
Jan 10, 2018
1,084
Rio de Janeiro
So let's talk about the potential future positives.

At $10/m, $8/m being generous with credit card charges, distribution costs, taxes, and other fees, GamePass has a huge potential upside.

Imagine GamePass with 40 million subscribers due to Xbox, PC, and XCLOUD players. That is $320 million in revenue per month just from GamePass. Even if none of the games in GamePass made any sales outside of the service, that is a ton of money MS can invest into game development. This can be into Either first party or third part software.

Let's assume the average AAA costs $100 million to make, AA $25 million, and Indie $2.5 million.

Even is MS and their content providers take a combined 30% profit on GamePass, or $100 million/month of the $320 million in revenue, that would still be enough to fund or pay for the following each and every month on the service without expectations of additional revenue from MTX or DLC.

1 AAA game
3 AA games
10 Indie Games

That is a ton of content that can be funded each month at current budget levels with each game having around 30% profit beyond development costs before any MTX or DLC and assuming 0 sales and revenue outside of GamePass. Needless to say, all those other revenue sources will continue to exist.

This feels highly sustainable and highly profitable to me in the long term. I really don't get why people think it won't be.

Netflix have 140 million subscribers worldwide, how the hell a video game service will have 40 million???
 

Deleted member 43

Account closed at user request
Banned
Oct 24, 2017
9,271
True. I didn't mean to imply it won't have any impact, just that I don't think it will have the huge, negative impacts that many worry in terms of things like entire genres of games going away.

If anything, I think it can help with diversity of games. For instance, people seem worried about single player games. Most of these, especially outside of exclusives which tend to do well as fanboys snap them up and they are often very well made, seem to fail to meet publisher expectations. Sales are very frontloaded and then the tend to end up in the bargain bin in a few months or less. Subscription services could be better for those as the hardcore will still buy the game, but then they may have a more steady revenue stream from people on subscription services playing the game over a longer period of time (when traditional sales have otherwise dried up).

Service games I think are largely unaffected. They want the money from DLC expansions and micro transactions more so than the initial purchase price--and it's obviously completely moot for games that would otherwise have been F2P monetized games.

So I think things will definitely change some, I just think it will mostly be positive. Just like all the streaming services have us having more, and more variety, of shows and movies to watch for lower cost than ever before. I think gaming will go much the same. But I tend to be an optimist! I'm sure some changes will make some people unhappy for various reasons. But that's just life. No change is going to please everyone. This is just an inevitable change as younger generations who grow up with cheap subscription services that provide a lot of content are going to balk more at paying $60+ for games just like they've already balked at buying movies and music vs. using streaming services. Gaming has to adapt or risk a huge market crash in the coming decades IMO.
Oh I'm not assuming that either. I think, for example, subscription services will help usher in a sort of renaissance for AA games, which I'm very excited about.

But how games are monetized will be changing if these subscription services are successful, and games will largely adjust to that new reality. Will games be made even longer to raise playtime, or shorter to both sell more DLC and increase a publisher's output of games? Will streaming encourage developers to make their games more accessible for short bursts of playtime, such as while in transit? Will each publisher find success with their own subscription services and develop to push those services, or will we consolidate around one or two? And how will microtransactions evolve?

These are all good questions that no one has the answer to right now, but none are really inherently positive or negative, just different.
 

bcatwilly

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,483
Don't analyze the content, just enjoy content and get hyped to enjoy next content

What? One can enjoy a thing and also analyze the thing. Maybe stick to advertisements and PR puff pieces instead of discussion boards if you don't want discussion lmao

LOL, you conveniently left out the original second part of my post where I did contribute a thought to the discussion. And I posted another follow up too, just pointing out that Game Pass is truly one of the most amazing things for many gamers ever and can be enjoyed and celebrated currently too.
 

Deleted member 43

Account closed at user request
Banned
Oct 24, 2017
9,271
Understood, and the second part of my post was an intro to some of my thoughts on some possible positives that others may not be seeing as much.

  • It could result in games that are a little more tightly scoped and focused such as Gears 5 and Outer Worlds that were both apparently developed in around 3 years or less. I don't personally view that as a bad thing because they are both great experiences even per the critic reviews (some of which have said it could be in their personal GOTY running) and provides more regular content to the subscription service, and I don't want every game that I play to be some crazy huge game like Red Dead 2 or Cyberpunk.
  • There could also be a real opportunity for some even smaller narrative type games to be launched into such a service such as this that would get zero backing otherwise, and I believe Amy Hennig said as much at one point in the last year or so.
  • The most obvious positive is to the consumer having a bunch of varied gaming experiences for a great value, but of course this relies on the first two items maintaining a level of quality that makes people interested.
I think those are all very likely outcomes.
 

Deleted member 9486

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
4,867
This has to be the "catch" here, my situation was potentially unique because in already had 2+ years if live loaded on my account.


But ignoring my situation I'm guessing the "catch" is for those that had minimal or no investment in the Microsoft, suddenly they have years of gamepass subscription and start doing a lot of their gaming through Xbox and the Microsoft store which leads to the purchase of Pheriphals, DLC, other games etc..

Yep, that's pretty clearly their hope. The 360 success in the US and UK and a few other countries is looking more like a one off fluke when Sony botched the PS3 release, price etc. They ended up neck in neck in total sales by the end of the generation and the PS4 has killed the Xbox 1 in sales.

So they probably figure they've got their diehard fans that will by Xbox consoles, even if Gamepass and Xcloud are on PC and other platforms. So why not have their games available on these other services, port somethings like Ori and Minecraft that make sense to be multiplatorm to maximize profits etc. to open up more ways to sell their games and services to more people who'd never (or at least be unlikely) to buy an Xbox console.

The Xbox diehard who now just has Gamepass and plays Gears, Halo etc. on there instead of buying the games for $60 isn't a good deal for them of course. But their hope is they're still getting that sub money and hopefully some DLC purchases from those types, while all so getting the sub money and DLC purchases from a bunch of other people that would otherwise be spending $0 on Xbox games and DLC due to not wanting an Xbox console.

Time will tell if the money works out in their favor or not.
 
May 25, 2019
6,028
London
It's probably good for those who dont value ownership and want to play some games by paying as little as possible, in the short term.

It has no value to me though: i'd rather buy what i want to play and not have a subscription dependant game library.

I dont think is going to be sustainable in the future either.

Having a game "library" is meaningless to me. I used to replay my games when I had more time than I knew what to do with; now I just want more new experiences, both solo and with friends.

The all digital future and services like Game Pass are exactly what I want to see more of.
 

Splader

Member
Feb 12, 2018
5,063
I actually think GP has altered the perception of what people consider good, simply because its seen as a cheap service. I saw a thread on Era about World War Z, a game that didn't interest me but someone said it was like l4d, a good game they said. I thought really? I mean I'd seen the odd thing about and would never consider buying it usually. That's a bad game, the animation is bad, the atmosphere is bad, it's a really shit left 4 dead game. But maybe it's good because it's so cheap, I mean how much is GP a day? Like 25p so I mean you can't moan for 25p? So is this the standard we hold stuff too? Because it's so cheap that even a bad game becomes a good game because it's dirt cheap? An average game ( gears 5) becomes a good game? Do we just shift the goalposts because of the price?
Out of curiosity, have you played either WWZ or Gears 5?
 

TAoVG

Verified
Oct 27, 2017
95
USA
It's not that Netflix "is boring" it's that as soon as studios realized that the streaming model could be profitable (it was originally an afterthought and not considered a valuable revenue stream) they simply began pulling content off the service and into their own walled gardens, creating a fragmented environment where one needs to subscribe to 4 or 5 services at 10 dollars a month to get access to what they used to have with a single subscription.

No thanks, not interested in encouraging that as the status quo.

Streaming services, by and large, are still not profitable. In video it's about audience capture and aggregation to drive legacy revenue (advertising and distribution) which is still the lion's share of the industry. As for game streaming/subscription services, the economics don't work in the aggregate. However, Microsoft has seen a significant uptick in purchases outside of GP, due to GP usage. This is an acquisition, keep, and upsell opportunity for them.
 

Deleted member 43

Account closed at user request
Banned
Oct 24, 2017
9,271
Streaming services, by and large, are still not profitable. In video its about audience capture and aggregation to drive the legacy revenue (advertising and distribution) which is still the lion's share of the industry. As for game streaming/subscription services, the economics don't work in the aggregate. However, Microsoft has seen a significant uptick in purchases outside of GP, due to GP usage. This is an acquisition, keep, and upsell opportunity.
The growth in sales outside GP will, in my opinion, be reduced or eliminated over time, and GP games will start selling fewer copies in some cases (we already see this with Gears as a clear example). The economics of a games subscription service does require a massive subscription base to make sense, which is one of the reasons MS is trying to cast so wide a net.
 

Arukado

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,299
Having a game "library" is meaningless to me. I used to replay my games when I had more time than I knew what to do with; now I just want more new experiences, both solo and with friends.

The all digital future and services like Game Pass are exactly what I want to see more of.
Time is precisely one of the reasons i dont value the service: i dont have as much time as i had when i was young so i prefer to focus on games that i actually want to play. And the concept of library is not important to me, but ownership is. If it is not for you, then more power to you.

I agree that the service is a cheap way of exploring outside your confort zone, i'll give you that (as it was ps+ for me, where i discovered some amazing games), but those new experiences are also available outside the service though, and i'm sure those developers would appreciate for you to buy their games instead of having their revenue attached to the service (I suggest you people to do that, if you want them to keep making the games you like).
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,841
I agree that the service is a cheap way of exploring outside your confort zone, i'll give you that (as it was ps+ for me, where i discovered some amazing games), but those new experiences are also available outside the service though, and i'm sure those developers would appreciate for you to buy their games instead of having their revenue attached to the service (I suggest you people to do that, if you want them to keep making the games you like).
If the developers want me to buy their game, they should not put the game on Game Pass then. This service would not exist if developers didn't allow their games to be on it.

I am quite actively avoiding buying Devolver Digital and Focus Home Interactive games at the moment due to their embrace of Game Pass, and one of the questions affecting my purchase decision of a game is "how likely is this to go on game pass later?".
 

Ploid 6.0

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,440
EGS free games is the best for me right now, so many good games, mine forever for nothing.

I got 3 months of Gamepass for $0, I didn't do the x2 trick by promising to not cancel my subscription then canceled after anyway. Even with 3 months I only tried it with a small file game, it glitched out on me downloading all of Prey when I attempted to cancel it multiple times, secretly downloading the full thing days later in the background without even touching Gamepass (thanks windows 10). I don't like having to sub to access games especially when I have to ration data use to download them, that's a extra cost to me.
 

PianoBlack

Member
May 24, 2018
6,645
United States
I have played Gears 5 on Xbox One X and on PC and have payed 1 euro. I will play in February Ori and the Will of Wisps for 1 euro. In a couple of days i will play Outer Worlds for 1 euro. I have played Shadow of Tomb Raider and Metro Exodus for the same cost...

Yep, Gamepass is good for my wallet, so i am good with it.

Do you just keep making new fake accounts or what? I think most people tend to stick with one real account for friends, achievements, and ease of use, rather than going out of their way to try to take advantage of introductory deals in this sort of borderline unethical way.
 

Kromis

Member
Oct 29, 2017
6,515
SoCal
Do you just keep making new fake accounts or what? I think most people tend to stick with one real account for friends, achievements, and ease of use, rather than going out of their way to try to take advantage of introductory deals in this sort of borderline unethical way.
Microsoft is usually pretty nice about $1 game pass and runs the promo somewhat often
 

Kittenz

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,156
Minneapolis
Broadband was the greatest thing to happen to gaming IMO and as a console gamer I'd say Xbox Live was pretty great too.

Game Pass is so great though. Gimme a steady stream of 80-90 meta critic games at this price and y'all can have all the 98s as exclusive that ya want on the other platforms. I don't care if they are exclusive or not. They're all exclusive to me. Even if MS hadn't invested in studios this is a great service. The fact that they DID makes it amazing.
 

OneBadMutha

Member
Nov 2, 2017
6,059
Remember when Netflix was the new hotness and was the place to go to for movies? Then they got a shitton of subs and started making original content to not have to license as much externally created content? And more and more of the licenses are dropped, regardless of quality, in favor of spending billions on original content that a lot of doesn't stick? And a lot of people dropped their subs each time they raised prices because the perceived value went down?

It feels like that all over again, and I don't want to see it all happen the same way. EA did it to help recoup losses and get more people into their ecosystem day one than otherwise would. They literally chased the non day-1 players and wrote off any day-1 players who got on board Access instead of buying day-1 because there likely weren't a lot of them (and numbers show that, apparently). PSNow was there for, well, more offerings and capturing more player revenue, they just didn't hit it quite right by placing the cost so high. It was also used as a BC method as an afterthought.

So now we're using Netflix as an example of a subscription (and industry) going to shit due to success?

1) Netflix going to shit is subjective
2) Netflix investment has increased so regardless of subjective opinions of execution, drawing a parallel that a platform holder will intentionally pump out shit once it hits critical mass isn't proven with the Netflix example
3) Success has only bred competition for Netflix meaning more options for consumers. Value comes from consumer options because it allows consumers to better fit their priorities while putting pressure on platforms to continue to invest in content and differentiation.

The total picture of streaming TV is one of more options and value since Netflix came out, not less. So we need better examples of how Game Pass is a race to the bottom. Because quality of TV is exponentially better than it was 20 years ago. Actors, actresses, directors, makeup artists and special effects leads have more job opportunities, not less. Developers aren't going to have less opportunities due to Game Pass or streaming services. It's the platform holders at risk with the market disruption to delivery. Which is exactly what this is about. People are concerned that Sony will get impacted with their business model which most people in this forum are very comfortable with. Wish we were more honest in our concerns.
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,327
Do you just keep making new fake accounts or what? I think most people tend to stick with one real account for friends, achievements, and ease of use, rather than going out of their way to try to take advantage of introductory deals in this sort of borderline unethical way.

What?!! No! I have Ultimate Gamepass until 2021 (converted 3 years Gold for 1 euro) so, for 1 euro i play all this games.
 

PianoBlack

Member
May 24, 2018
6,645
United States
Microsoft is usually pretty nice about $1 game pass and runs the promo somewhat often

Sure but only for new subscriptions. You can't cancel and then two months later get another month for $1.

What?!! No! I have Ultimate Gamepass until 2021 (converted 3 years Gold for 1 euro) so, for 1 euro i play all this games.

Oh. So then you paid 181 Euro for your subscription (or whatever you paid for three years if Gold + the 1 Euro to convert to Game Pass), not 1 Euro.
 

Mr.Deadshot

Member
Oct 27, 2017
20,285
This is such a short term conclusion. Who knows what the state of the games we will be getting are in 3 or 4 years time if everything moves to a subscription model.
Yes, this probably won't end well in the long run. On the other side, we are still in the honeymoon phase with prices as low as 1€ to play the newest shit. It will settle between 10€ and 15€ a month and people will start to complain about how it's too expensive.
 

komaruR

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,045
http://www.twitch.tv/komarur
Right now game pass is a ridiculous great deal. But something behind the back of my mind says, later down the road when they get enough subs they will switch to a tier or a la carte service. by that time, people will already be on board with the convience of game pass that they wont complain a big ruckus or atleast enough cushion to lessen the negative feedback.
 

Firefly

Member
Jul 10, 2018
8,634
Right now game pass is a ridiculous great deal. But something behind the back of my mind says, later down the road when they get enough subs they will switch to a tier or a la carte service. by that time, people will already be on board with the convience of game pass that they wont complain a big ruckus or atleast enough cushion to lessen the negative feedback.
But people can top up 3 years max of Game Pass right now. Can MS introduce such changes on current long term subscriptions?
 

OneBadMutha

Member
Nov 2, 2017
6,059
Yes, this probably won't end well in the long run. On the other side, we are still in the honeymoon phase with prices as low as 1€ to play the newest shit. It will settle between 10€ and 15€ a month and people will start to complain about how it's too expensive.

Then people will cancel and go back to the other options. Again it's an option. There's room for more than one business model to flourish in the industry. Industry is still growing.
 

Kromis

Member
Oct 29, 2017
6,515
SoCal
Sure but only for new subscriptions. You can't cancel and then two months later get another month for $1

Actually, I've been able to take advantage of all the limited time $1 promos! I do the $1 for a month and don't renew. And then another promo comes up, I can take advantage of it just fine! Though I believe this is because I've never used the game pass free trial. YMMV but it works for me. I don't kind subbing every so often in this way.

EDIT: To be clear, I'm talking about Xbox Game Pass for console, not Ultimate or PC
 
Oct 27, 2017
1,327
Sure but only for new subscriptions. You can't cancel and then two months later get another month for $1.



Oh. So then you paid 181 Euro for your subscription (or whatever you paid for three years if Gold + the 1 Euro to convert to Game Pass), not 1 Euro.

I have payed 85 euros for 3 years of Gold (as i will be paying it already, because of multiplayer and nothing more). For 1 euro more, i have acess to all gamepass games in that period. So, yes, this all games more (on Gamepass) is just 1 euro more...
 

Yasuke

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
19,817
Aside from not caring to sub to a game streaming/downloading service, I really don't think the model is all that sustainable, especially in a world where games are already being sold at retail for less than they're worth.
 
Aug 25, 2019
380
I agree it's the best thing to ever happen to gaming. I'm actually playing with my friends again. Gears 5 and World War Z, my friends and I are all in our 30's and we haven't played games like this together since the launch of the first co-op missions in GTAV, and then halo 3 and black ops 1 days.
 

PianoBlack

Member
May 24, 2018
6,645
United States
Actually, I've been able to take advantage of all the limited time $1 promos! I do the $1 for a month and don't renew. And then another promo comes up, I can take advantage of it just fine! Though I believe this is because I've never used the game pass free trial. YMMV but it works for me. I don't kind subbing every so often in this way.

EDIT: To be clear, I'm talking about Xbox Game Pass for console, not Ultimate or PC

Huh. Well, personally I'd assume that's a bug or something that will go away soon then. Usually the intent is to offer a promo price to new subscribers, not to make the promo price the de facto price.

There's a lot of confusion here because there's also the deal to convert your sub to Ultimate for $1, and obviously you can't repeatedly convert the same sub to Ultimate for $1. Like the other guy I replied to, paying for three years of Gold and then converting for $1 doesn't mean you are getting three years of Game Pass for $1 or that you can get every new game by just paying $1 here or there as a lot of posts imply.
 

Mr.Deadshot

Member
Oct 27, 2017
20,285
Then people will cancel and go back to the other options. Again it's an option. There's room for more than one business model to flourish in the industry. Industry is still growing.
Sure but the sentiment is that you get more and more for less and less money. I can feel this, too. I even hesitate to pay 10€ nowadays for a game because it might end up in some subscription service or even free in the epic store. It's even worse than waiting for the next humblebundle or Steam deal.
 

WhiteNovember

Member
Aug 15, 2018
2,192
Do you just keep making new fake accounts or what? I think most people tend to stick with one real account for friends, achievements, and ease of use, rather than going out of their way to try to take advantage of introductory deals in this sort of borderline unethical way.
You can subscribe to Gp and still play the games on your main account/stick to your real account. At least if they didn't change it.
 

hikarutilmitt

Member
Dec 16, 2017
11,424
So now we're using Netflix as an example of a subscription (and industry) going to shit due to success?

1) Netflix going to shit is subjective
2) Netflix investment has increased so regardless of subjective opinions of execution, drawing a parallel that a platform holder will intentionally pump out shit once it hits critical mass isn't proven with the Netflix example
3) Success has only bred competition for Netflix meaning more options for consumers. Value comes from consumer options because it allows consumers to better fit their priorities while putting pressure on platforms to continue to invest in content and differentiation.

The total picture of streaming TV is one of more options and value since Netflix came out, not less. So we need better examples of how Game Pass is a race to the bottom. Because quality of TV is exponentially better than it was 20 years ago. Actors, actresses, directors, makeup artists and special effects leads have more job opportunities, not less. Developers aren't going to have less opportunities due to Game Pass or streaming services. It's the platform holders at risk with the market disruption to delivery. Which is exactly what this is about. People are concerned that Sony will get impacted with their business model which most people in this forum are very comfortable with. Wish we were more honest in our concerns.
Of course it's subjective. This whole thread, every single one lauding Game Pass, every single one lambasting Stadia and any ever comparing all of these services and subscriptions are subjective. I was drawing a parallel, not a line in the sand.

The point is that while the quality of them is subjective (again, the quality of Netflix going down for some people) it is a real concern to those that care about them. There's a lot more to TV shows these days than before, yes, but that's not necessarily an indicator of quality. We've learned and grown from our past experiences of making TV shows and movies and what works and doesn't work and the perceived quality has ended up in two camps: quality or mass appeal, and seldom the two shall mix for some people. If this weren't the case we wouldn't have award-winning directors lambasting MCU films and people calling them boomers and other nonsense to justify their feelings. It's very possible that in the future, possibly the near future, games will have reached this state and I just won't anything to do with most or any of them because their quality, for me, will have gone down.

Again, to your point about the perceived quality of TV these days, I watch less and less TV each year because each year more and more shows come out catering to the lowest common denominator and almost all of them are terrible, to me. There's a reason Chuck Lorre shows are divisive. I also cannot stand reality shows, of which we get more and more each year. I like the choice that using a bunch of streaming services over DirecTV or terrestrial cable has offered me, because my bills are lower and I can cut out a lot of crap, but there's still a ton of crap out there regardless and that won't change. the more of these services that continue to grow and the more we eat them up because they've been offering us a smorgasbord of content that we probably won't play even half of the more content will begin getting pared back to reach a sort of equilibrium that has a net loss of quality.
 

Mollymauk

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,317
Someone should tell Disney, Warner, and Apple that subscription services aren't sustainable before they make a huge mistake.
 

DevilMayGuy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,577
Texas
Someone should tell Disney, Warner, and Apple that subscription services aren't sustainable before they make a huge mistake.
If you don't think that a contraction in that space is coming, I don't know what to tell you. There will be winners and losers, but you can bet your ass that there will be a contraction. People aren't going to pay more for streaming services all told than they used to for cable month to month.
 

Splader

Member
Feb 12, 2018
5,063
I've played them both using GP. Feel free to search me up on XBL and check for yourself. Upinsmoke2k6
No worries, I believe you.

I don't think Gears 5 is an average game though. Not even close, I would say. This also isn't only my opinion but the general consensus around the game.
Price isn't the only factor on whether a game is worth playing. These days time is becoming more important and reviews generally try to answer the question of "is this game worth playing".

Hundreds of thousands will be buying The Outer Worlds for 60 USD (or equivalent) and hundreds of thousands more will be playing through Gamepass. Will the people accessing through gamepass think the game is automatically better?
 

OneBadMutha

Member
Nov 2, 2017
6,059
Of course it's subjective. This whole thread, every single one lauding Game Pass, every single one lambasting Stadia and any ever comparing all of these services and subscriptions are subjective. I was drawing a parallel, not a line in the sand.

The point is that while the quality of them is subjective (again, the quality of Netflix going down for some people) it is a real concern to those that care about them. There's a lot more to TV shows these days than before, yes, but that's not necessarily an indicator of quality. We've learned and grown from our past experiences of making TV shows and movies and what works and doesn't work and the perceived quality has ended up in two camps: quality or mass appeal, and seldom the two shall mix for some people. If this weren't the case we wouldn't have award-winning directors lambasting MCU films and people calling them boomers and other nonsense to justify their feelings. It's very possible that in the future, possibly the near future, games will have reached this state and I just won't anything to do with most or any of them because their quality, for me, will have gone down.

Again, to your point about the perceived quality of TV these days, I watch less and less TV each year because each year more and more shows come out catering to the lowest common denominator and almost all of them are terrible, to me. There's a reason Chuck Lorre shows are divisive. I also cannot stand reality shows, of which we get more and more each year. I like the choice that using a bunch of streaming services over DirecTV or terrestrial cable has offered me, because my bills are lower and I can cut out a lot of crap, but there's still a ton of crap out there regardless and that won't change. the more of these services that continue to grow and the more we eat them up because they've been offering us a smorgasbord of content that we probably won't play even half of the more content will begin getting pared back to reach a sort of equilibrium that has a net loss of quality.

My point is that while the quality is subjective, the increase in investment is not. Subscription platforms aren't intentionally making content worse. In fact, there are far more risks with higher production values than we've ever seen on TV or serialized programs due to competition. Lowest common denominator doesn't even make sense. TV, before Netflix, was a bunch of reality shows, game shows, sitcoms and occasionally something as good as Lost. The era before Netflix is when we made Trump a household name and gave him credibility.

While it's subjective, my guess is your opinion would be in a tiny minority that thinks TV was better before streaming.

I don't think the evidence you're using to justify your speculation that a streaming service will make art and content worse is backed up by using the TV streaming model. TV has much more variety, takes more risks and appeals to a wider range of audiences due to subscription services.
 
Oct 28, 2017
16,780
PS Plus in its prime is still my favourite subscription service. PS3 era PS Plus was so consistently great and for such a cheap price.

Gamepass is something I sub to for cheap when a big release comes out like Crackdown 3 or Gears 5. Then I stop subbing and maybe get it again with another big release, which usually coincides with a cheap deal. It's not a service I stick to.
 

piratethingy

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,428
Why is game pass PC so much worse? I want to play Outer W(x)lds but both Worlds and Wilds are only on the console game pass :(
 

ForgedByGeeks

Self-requested ban
Banned
Dec 1, 2017
601
Woodinville, WA
Netflix have 140 million subscribers worldwide, how the hell a video game service will have 40 million???

I remember when people said the same about Netflix, Xbox Live Gold, PSN+, and many non entertainment subscription software services.

Maybe realize that gaming is now a larger industry than video as a starting point amd then ask why wouldn't a gaming service be able to reach the levels of Netflix if you can use it on iOS, Android (Through XCLOUD), PC, and Consoles?

I am endlessly amazed at how many people can't imagine a world where gaming continues to grow at the levels it has been, becomes more accessible to more potential gamers, and eventually leads to services like GamePass even potentially exceeding what we see with services like Netflix. Sure that's a long time out, but in the shorter term, 20-40 million subscribers to a service like that is a reasonable bet.
 

piratethingy

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,428
Outer Worlds is absolutely available on Game Pass for PC this Friday too.

Excellent! In that case I'll be signing up Friday, very exciting. I really searched the site to try to see if it was coming but it looked to me like it was only listed on the console page. Great news
 

Dezzy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,435
USA
I wish I could be happy with GamePass, but I just can't.
I want to play The Outer Worlds, but once again I'm already busy with games I bought. I have a few games on PC I'm waiting on, I'm finishing up The Alliance Alive on PS4, and my copy of Trails of Cold Steel III for PS4 just showed up today and is next on the list. Before I'm even done with Cold Steel III, Pokemon Sword/Shield and Death Stranding will both be out.

This is my problem with GamePass. It's obviously a great service, but not for everyone even considering its value proposition. There are too many other games that aren't part of GamePass that I want.