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WSJ: Nintendo to Launch Two New Switch Models. Premium "Enhanced" Model and Cheaper Portable Model.

What are you most excited for?

  • The more powerful model

    Votes: 4,343 67.8%

  • The more handheld model

    Votes: 599 9.4%

  • Both!

    Votes: 711 11.1%

  • Neither.

    Votes: 751 11.7%
  • Total voters
    6,404
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javac

javac

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Oct 28, 2017
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People are saying Nintendo should save the 2 for next gen but do we actually think Nintendo will stick with Switch branding next gen? Didn't work well for them last time, 3DS and Wii U probably scared them. I think they'll stick with the hybrid setup and maybe even backwards compatible but a totally different name. DS plays GBA games after all.
 
Armoured_Bear

Armoured_Bear

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The recent Digital Foundry article confirmed the Pro upgrade will be small, quite annoying as I'd love a significant docked improvement :(
 
YolkFolk

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skittzo0413 said:
Emily said she heard both are planned for launch in September.



The sleeve leak in the other thread is a clear sign that the enhanced Switch will launch with the mini, since it calls the mini "Mini Switch 2"

A "2" would not make sense unless a Switch 2 was launching alongside the mini.
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That isn't a clear sign.

It's obviously not going to be called Switch Mini 2 and the sleeve isn't aimed at a Mini AND a Pro Switch because they won't be the same size.

There's zero chance of it being called Switch 2 tbh.
 
Skittzo

Skittzo

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Oct 25, 2017
41,037
ManCityX said:
That isn't a clear sign.

It's obviously not going to be called Switch Mini 2 and the sleeve isn't aimed at a Mini AND a Pro Switch because they won't be the same size.

There's zero chance of it being called Switch 2 tbh.
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I never said that sleeve would be for the mini and the pro.

If the mini is called "Mini Switch 2" which the box for the sleeve suggests, then that logically would suggest a "Switch 2" is also coming. It wouldn't make sense to call something the "Mini Switch 2" if there is no "regular" Switch 2.
 

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javac said:
People are saying Nintendo should save the 2 for next gen but do we actually think Nintendo will stick with Switch branding next gen? Didn't work well for them last time, 3DS and Wii U probably scared them. I think they'll stick with the hybrid setup and maybe even backwards compatible but a totally different name. DS plays GBA games after all.
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Switch
Super Switch
Ultra Switchty-Four
 
T002 Tyrant

T002 Tyrant

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Nov 8, 2018
8,951
javac said:
People are saying Nintendo should save the 2 for next gen but do we actually think Nintendo will stick with Switch branding next gen? Didn't work well for them last time, 3DS and Wii U probably scared them. I think they'll stick with the hybrid setup and maybe even backwards compatible but a totally different name. DS plays GBA games after all.
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I reckon

- Switch
- Switch Mini
- New Nintendo Switch
- Switch + (extra battery for normal Switch)
- New Nintendo Switch XL
- Ultra Switch (Switch 2) with optional "Lakitu" cloud computing cube (that patent they did a while back that gave you your own local cloud server to _upgrade" games/ free up local hardware resources by giving some resources to the local server) alongside more ergonomic joycons with analogue triggers, additional optional accessories such as "Switch Reality" headset etc. Ultra Switch XL
- Ultra Switch Pro and Ultra Switch mini
- Next completely new Nintendo console concept (like injecting games directly into your eyeballs or licking the cartridge and hallucinating the game :p)
 
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Bass2448

Bass2448

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Oct 27, 2017
565
I think Nintendo would be geniuses to start treating consoles like cell phones. Release incremental upgrades and attach a number. All games work. And upgrading is as easy as a few button presses.
 
Armoured_Bear

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Nov 17, 2017
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skittzo0413 said:
What would you consider small and what would you consider significant?

EDIT: Also absolutely nothing has been confirmed.
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Something more like a Tegra 2 with a New 3DS type of increase in power would be "significant" whereas according to DF "here wouldn't be a revelatory increase in system performance - nothing like a generational leap as such, or even anything as profound as the jump from 3DS to New 3DS, but it would still be a valuable addition."

So, basically the minimum you could expect.
 
Skittzo

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41,037
Armoured_Bear said:
Something more like a Tegra 2 with a New 3DS type of increase in power would be "significant" whereas according to DF "here wouldn't be a revelatory increase in system performance - nothing like a generational leap as such, or even anything as profound as the jump from 3DS to New 3DS, but it would still be a valuable addition."

So, basically the minimum you could expect.
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I assume you mean Tegra X2? Tegra X2 is the exact same thing as what DF thinks will be in Mariko, with the exception of the Denver cores which are useless for gaming anyway.

New 3DS type of increase (6x CPU, 2x RAM) was even bigger than PS4>PS4Pro so it was always strange that the original article said it wouldn't be like the PS4 Pro jump but be more like the New 3DS jump. I wouldn't expect that type of increase here.

That said, like I mentioned above nothing at all has been confirmed. It could be a very minor jump like 50% higher GPU clocks (or even less) and nothing else, or it could include faster RAM, more RAM, more bandwidth, better CPU cores, double the usable CPU cores, and maybe even a ~2x jump in GPU power.

We simply don't know one way or the other. DF explicitly says all of the info they're working from is outdated so it could be wildly different from what they expect.
 

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skittzo0413 said:
What would you consider small and what would you consider significant?

EDIT: Also absolutely nothing has been confirmed.
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In terms of the Pro... If 540p/600p games go up to 720p native or dynamic 720p in handheld mode and 720p/900p games go to 1080p native or dynamic 1080p when docked then I hope people realise what a huge upgrade that is in image quality especially in terms of what is essentially a thicker iphone 6+ sized device.

There will more than likely be a 10-20% CPU clock boost at all times too which should stabilise especially third party games with framerate issues. A pretty great upgrade all around for people that care about these sorts of things!
 
Skittzo

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Rion said:
In terms of the Pro... If 540p/600p games go up to 720p native or dynamic 720p in handheld mode and 720p/900p games go to 1080p native or dynamic 1080p when docked then I hope people realise what a huge upgrade that is in image quality especially in terms of what is essentially a thicker iphone 6+ sized device.

There will more than likely be a 10-20% CPU clock boost at all times too which should stabilise especially third party games with framerate issues. A pretty great upgrade all around for people that care about these sorts of things!
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I hate talking about specs in terms of resolution. It's going to be very different for each game, even games that have the same resolution might not get the same bump with the same specs. That's just not how it works.

All I am hoping for (but starting to get doubtful about) is OG docked performance in pro handheld mode. Which is more or less what you're asking for I think. I think that would be a pretty nice increase for a 2.5 year in refresh.
 
Sabin

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I wonder what the price point for the Switch Pro will be. Will Nintendo aim for the same price as the base switch or will they increase it.
 

Deleted member 1413

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I think "New x can play docked x in handheld mode" is a sustainable and attractive upgrade path.
For developers it doesnt' mean 2 new specs to aim for, would make the entire library forwards and backward compatible, and means the consumer will have something that'll be able to run games decently (if games start targeting Switch pro with 720p original docked games, it'll still mean that original switch owners can still play an acceptable version even if the OG handheld mode is a bit funky)

If the switch pro also enhances pro docked games (which doesn't seem super likely, but hey) then the Switch successor could use BC with all games running with that performance in handheld mode as a selling point.

I guess Switch Mini throws a wrench into that since games will need to be presentable on the mini.
 
bmfrosty

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Cartridge Games said:
I think "New x can play docked x in handheld mode" is a sustainable and attractive upgrade path.
For developers it doesnt' mean 2 new specs to aim for, would make the entire library forwards and backward compatible, and means the consumer will have something that'll be able to run games decently (if games start targeting Switch pro with 720p original docked games, it'll still mean that original switch owners can still play an acceptable version even if the OG handheld mode is a bit funky)

If the switch pro also enhances pro docked games (which doesn't seem super likely, but hey) then the Switch successor could use BC with all games running with that performance in handheld mode as a selling point.

I guess Switch Mini throws a wrench into that since games will need to be presentable on the mini.
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Ah, but what if both the switch 2 and the mini switch 2 are a pro upgrade?
 

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skittzo0413 said:
I hate talking about specs in terms of resolution. It's going to be very different for each game, even games that have the same resolution might not get the same bump with the same specs. That's just not how it works.

All I am hoping for (but starting to get doubtful about) is OG docked performance in pro handheld mode. Which is more or less what you're asking for I think. I think that would be a pretty nice increase for a 2.5 year in refresh.
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Of course not every game will gain the same percentage of resolution but they will certainly see improvements if patched or already support dynamic resolutions.

An ~30% increase on the Switch GPU clocks for the Pro model from an ~400gflop GPU to an ~600glfop GPU will mean games run at much higher resolutions (in relative terms). A lot of Switch games run at dynamic resolution by design imo so that later models would enable better performance by default. Most of the current dynamic 900p games in docked mode will run at 1080p native on the Pro. Same for dynamic 720p games then running at 900p when docked. Same for 540/600p games going to 720p when handheld.

If they've moved to 16nm (which is essentially 12) then the handheld Switch will see resolution increases. The Pro model will simply move to 16 then increase the clocks much further instead aiming for the launch Switch' battery life of 3/4 hours meaning much higher resolution gains.
 

Deleted member 1413

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Something that interests me is potentially shrinking the Switch screen for the mini.
If they don't need to accommodate for the joy con, tabletop mode, etc, a smaller screen might make sense.
Smaller pixels might make the screen look nicer, increase battery life, and make the overall system smaller.

Vita was 5 inches, so 1.2 inches smaller than the Switch. Not sure if that's a good size to aim at.
 
BoosterDuck

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I have a 5.5" phone screen and I can barely make out the UI when watching switch gameplay videos so I hope the Switch Mini screen is at least that size
 

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Cartridge Games said:
Something that interests me is potentially shrinking the Switch screen for the mini.
If they don't need to accommodate for the joy con, tabletop mode, etc, a smaller screen might make sense.
Smaller pixels might make the screen look nicer, increase battery life, and make the overall system smaller.

Vita was 5 inches, so 1.2 inches smaller than the Switch. Not sure if that's a good size to aim at.
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I think they'll want to keep the visible screen size the same but get rid of (or massively reduce) the bezel.
 

IamFlying

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Cartridge Games said:
If the switch pro also enhances pro docked games (which doesn't seem super likely, but hey) then the Switch successor could use BC with all games running with that performance in handheld mode as a selling point.

I guess Switch Mini throws a wrench into that since games will need to be presentable on the mini.
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It's baffling that many games still use fixed graphics UIs instead of resolution independent UIs, it is basic development knowledge and makes things much easier and is better for localisations too. It's like some developer learned all they know in the nineties (or before) and never bothered with "new" things.
 
perfectchaos007

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I thought people were saying this thing was going to be officially announced a couple weeks after E3. Guess we'll have to wait a bit longer. Probably they were concerned an announcement would take the console sales away from Mario Maker
 

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Ron Paul said:
I thought people were saying this thing was going to be officially announced a couple weeks after E3. Guess we'll have to wait a bit longer. Probably they were concerned an announcement would take the console sales away from Mario Maker
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z0m3le Thinks there's a gap for an announcement in the final week of this month / the first two weeks of August (I think that's his dates). It makes sense considering that from Fire Emblem onwards there's a constant stream of software all leading to Pokemon where a portable / lower priced Switch would obviously thrive.

I'm not sure if they'll announce the Pro alongside the more portable focused Switch (they'll want all the attention on the portable focused device for the rest of the year imo). Something tells me they'll just replace the current Switch with the smaller 16nm process (aiming for the current 3/4 hour standard Switch battery life) and not make a big deal of the resolution boosts, then they'll wait for a larger leap in performance before releasing a Switch Pro or Switch 2.0 in maybe late 2020 / 2021.
 
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ILikeFeet

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Rion said:
z0m3le Thinks there's a gap for an announcement in the final week of this month / the first two weeks of August (I think that's his dates). It makes sense considering that from Fire Emblem onwards there's a constant stream of software all leading to Pokemon where a portable / lower priced Switch would obviously thrive.

I'm not sure if they'll announce the Pro alongside the more portable focused Switch (they'll want all the attention on the portable focused device for the rest of the year imo). Something tells me they'll just replace the current Switch with the smaller 16nm process and not make a big deal of the resolution boosts then they'll wait for a larger leap in performance before releasing a Switch Pro or Switch 2.0 in maybe late 2020.
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The Pro has been said to be in production alongside the Mini. The problem is people think the Pro will be like the PS4 Pro, when it might be the refreshed OG
 
The Traveller

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Historically when Nintendo announces a handheld refresh do they offer multiple options? 2ds and 2ds xl, were announced at the same time right?

I still remember when the Game Boy SP came out and having a built in backlight was the biggest deal.
 
Peterc

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Rion said:
z0m3le Thinks there's a gap for an announcement in the final week of this month / the first two weeks of August (I think that's his dates). It makes sense considering that from Fire Emblem onwards there's a constant stream of software all leading to Pokemon where a portable / lower priced Switch would obviously thrive.

I'm not sure if they'll announce the Pro alongside the more portable focused Switch (they'll want all the attention on the portable focused device for the rest of the year imo). Something tells me they'll just replace the current Switch with the smaller 16nm process (aiming for the current 3/4 hour standard Switch battery life) and not make a big deal of the resolution boosts, then they'll wait for a larger leap in performance before releasing a Switch Pro or Switch 2.0 in maybe late 2020 / 2021.
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They better release a 1080p hanheld/4k tv now and release a switch 2.0 in 2021 / 2022. The cycle doesnt have to be 7y, look at apple/android
 
z0m3le

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Rion said:
z0m3le Thinks there's a gap for an announcement in the final week of this month / the first two weeks of August (I think that's his dates). It makes sense considering that from Fire Emblem onwards there's a constant stream of software all leading to Pokemon where a portable / lower priced Switch would obviously thrive.

I'm not sure if they'll announce the Pro alongside the more portable focused Switch (they'll want all the attention on the portable focused device for the rest of the year imo). Something tells me they'll just replace the current Switch with the smaller 16nm process (aiming for the current 3/4 hour standard Switch battery life) and not make a big deal of the resolution boosts, then they'll wait for a larger leap in performance before releasing a Switch Pro or Switch 2.0 in maybe late 2020 / 2021.
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Yeah that's my timeline, there is retail releases every week on Nintendo's calendar in July and September, (4 Nintendo published titles in September) but after the launch of Fire Emblem on the 26th of July, there is a huge noticeable void of software until Astral Chain on the 30th of August, that void is for the natural sales decline of the current model when the new models are announced imo. Japan requires a month official announcement before they will put up pre-orders for the device, so if they are launching the devices on September 13th or 20th, alongside their published titles that month, they will have to announce the devices no later than August 13th, but they don't want to hurt the weekend sales for fire emblem, so my bet is July 30th at their meeting.

Both the Pro and Mini models will launch this year, remember they both were confirmed to be in production in early June by the last article about the production of Switch consoles being moved from China to avoid tariffs. You don't start production of a product in June for a device that launches after the holidays.
 

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z0m3le said:
Yeah that's my timeline, there is retail releases every week on Nintendo's calendar in July and September, (4 Nintendo published titles in September) but after the launch of Fire Emblem on the 26th of July, there is a huge noticeable void of software until Astral Chain on the 30th of August, that void is for the natural sales decline of the current model when the new models are announced imo. Japan requires a month official announcement before they will put up pre-orders for the device, so if they are launching the devices on September 13th or 20th, alongside their published titles that month, they will have to announce the devices no later than August 13th, but they don't want to hurt the weekend sales for fire emblem, so my bet is July 30th at their meeting.

Both the Pro and Mini models will launch this year, remember they both were confirmed to be in production in early June by the last article about the production of Switch consoles being moved from China to avoid tariffs. You don't start production of a product in June for a device that launches after the holidays.
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I have a good memory haha! :P

Yeah I agree they'll both launch this year but I'm just being pessimistic in believing that they'll just phase out the current standard Switch and replace it with a 16nm variant while not even bringing attention to it but Digital Foundry and the like will notice previous dynamic res games getting massive boosts in resolution from the die shrink and higher GPU clocks.

The portable variant will obviously be hyped up in the run up to Pokemon.

I don't expect a RAM increase, memory bandwidth bump or CPU overclock until they have enough of an overall increase in specs to make a big deal out of it in late 2020 / Spring 2021.

I hope I'm wrong!

When do you expect the two new models will launch?
 
Diarrhea Day-Lewis

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The Traveller said:
Historically when Nintendo announces a handheld refresh do they offer multiple options? 2ds and 2ds xl, were announced at the same time right?

I still remember when the Game Boy SP came out and having a built in backlight was the biggest deal.
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No, they announced 3DS XL in 2012, 2DS in 2013, 2DS XL in 2017, DSi in 2009, DSi XL in 2010.

Only new 3DS got two models in 2015 and even then only new XL was available at launch in NA and the regular was only in NA in limited bundles, it wasn't regularly available like the XL.
 
RPGamer

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ManCityX said:
This makes no sense at all.
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It would make sense, it would be the Mini version of the Switch 2.


bonesawisready5 said:
1. Because Nintendo said about a year ago that they want the Switch to last longer than a normal gen, so 2023 is likely (their gens are 5-6 years) Source

2. Because it would be an infinitely unnecessary move when the system sells really well at a profit and isn't likely to have a sales drop in the next 12-18 months. Why not reduce costs and milk this product even more?

3. Because after the Wii U's total commercial failure and the 3DS losing half of the DS's install base, they should be conservative with risks like this now that the Switch brand is strong and selling 17-20M units per year.

4. Sony and Xbox could have made Pro/X new gens if they wanted to but they knew that would be poorly received so soon by consumers. Most people don't actually buy new phones for their full price and lease them and even then, we're seeing more and more the upgrade cycles for phones slowing down so the idea that phones make consumers more open to quicker console gens is flawed imo.


Just imo tho I think Nintendo saying they won't replace it until 2022-23 already kinda means it's not happening unless the Switch collapses dramatically.
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1. Switch would last for 6 or more years if it's still compatible with every game (for at least 6 years)

2. It would just be the new Switch, the latest model that succeds the old Switch, which still gets supported. Nothing lost and people who want one get an upgrade, new buyers get the new Switch, people who don't want to upgrade every 3 years will wait.

3. Imo giving the hardware a boost every 3 years would prevent the Wii situation where people got bored and in the end didn't want Wii U. You can also wait too long. I just wouldn't compare it to classic gens, they would be gone.

4. Sony did release PS4 Pro after some years, and now the PS5 that is backwards compatible, it could be very similiar, only that Nintendo would call the "Pro" Switch 2 and the system after that "Switch 3". And every 3 years wouldn't be the same situation like with phones that upgrade every year. Nintendo can upgrade the Switch as long as it sells and every system would get the majority of games for 6 years, some games even longer.

No guaranty that it happens, but it could happen.



Armoured_Bear said:
The recent Digital Foundry article confirmed the Pro upgrade will be small, quite annoying as I'd love a significant docked improvement :(
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They didn't confirm anything , they speculated on Thraktors findings and if you read the article you will find them even speculating if it could be 7nm (they guess it's 16nm/, but they also say they judge it on years old data.
 
Diarrhea Day-Lewis

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RPGamer said:
Switch would last for 6 or more years if it's still compatible with every game (for at least 6 years)

2. It would just be the new Switch, the latest model that succeds the old Switch, which still gets supported. Nothing lost and people who want one get an upgrade, new buyers get the new Switch, people who don't want to upgrade every 3 years will wait.
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Well yeah that would be fine because that wouldn't be much more than a DSi or New 3DS would it? Still similar to iOS in that it still takes 5-6 years for old hardware to get cut off (like how iPhone 6 from 2014 is just barely getting cut off from iOS updates 5 years later)

But then it wouldn't really be a next gen switch then would it? Since it wouldn't have exclusives? My original comment was more along why they shouldn't come out with a next-gen switch already, as in exclusive games. Ps4 to ps5 like, etc.

If its what you said and there's no real exclusives or few, then yeah it wouldn't break the "longer gen" comment from Nintendo because it wouldn't really be a next-gen switch, it would be an iterative bump a la iPhone 6 to 6S, DS to DSi, 3DS to New 3DS. A ps4 pro/Xbox one X maybe with a small exclusive at best like DSiware or Xenoblade 3D.

Yes, i'd Be okay with that. But for a full next-gen, new exclusive games library switch that (and the name switch 2) should wait until 2023 when they can actually make a next-gen switch. Ideally with 8GB-16GB of LP RAM, 8 cores @ 2Ghz, 3/5nm, 2-3TFs portable, etc. if possible. Oh and 1080p screen.
 
T002 Tyrant

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In the end nothing matters, some of us will buy one of these, some both for their family, others will refuse stating it wasn't enough (and it never will be with you folks you just come here to be smug), we all die at some point, life is meaningless, we never asked to be born, and we all just have to try and survive on this spinning rock while grasping at fleeting moments of happiness. Nothing lasts forever.
 
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