Would you exterminate all of the Daleks? "Spoilers for Doctor Who: Genesis of the Daleks"

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

For context, The Doctor in the iconic 4th Doctor Story: Genesis of the Daleks, The Doctor has an opportunity to destory the Daleks completly in order to save potentially millions of lives from their attacks (as destorying the Daleks then would erase their futher actions from history - which in turn would save entire planets) but in exchange the Doctor would be killing millions of Daleks which despite their actions are still living beings . The Doctor is extremely conflicted about this as he felt he would be no better then the Daleks - as he would kill millions. I personally really like this scene and Genesis of the Daleks but

My question to you guys/gals - is what would you do in this suitation? - would you destory the Daleks to save millions but in turn be responsible for killing millons of Daleks or would you spare them despite knowing how much damage they can and wil cause. Would you extreminate all the Daleks?

 

[Sephzilla]

EXTERMINATE

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

EXTERMINATE

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I know, i accidently clicked on the spacebar and it published the thread without me making changes to the title

 

[Sephzilla]

I know, i accidently clicked on the spacebar and it published the thread without me making changes to the title

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it's also the answer to your question

 

[PlanetSmasher]

It's honestly a pretty interesting question when you consider that the Fourth Doctor hasn't even begun to see the true depths of the Daleks' evil by the time he reaches that point in Genesis. But even then, I imagine if any of the other Doctors were put in the same position Four was in at that time, they would've made the same choice.

...well, maybe not the War Doctor.

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

it's also the answer to your question

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Fair enough, honestly i would hesitate to kill millions even if those millons were the Daleks. They are evil sure but i would be comitting genocide on an entire species

 

[Duane]

Then who was TARDIS??

 

[Sign My Guestbook!]

Then who was TARDIS??

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The call is coming from inside the time machine!

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

It's honestly a pretty interesting question when you consider that the Fourth Doctor hasn't even begun to see the true depths of the Daleks' evil by the time he reaches that point in Genesis. But even then, I imagine if any of the other Doctors were put in the same position Four was in at that time, they would've made the same choice.

...well, maybe not the War Doctor.

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Yeah, considering the time war - it may have been much more difficult for a Post Time War Doctor to make the same decison

 

[Kinsei]

Yeah. Then again it's easy to say yeah to a hypothetical that will never happen. In truth none of us truly know what we would do.

It's honestly a pretty interesting question when you consider that the Fourth Doctor hasn't even begun to see the true depths of the Daleks' evil by the time he reaches that point in Genesis. But even then, I imagine if any of the other Doctors were put in the same position Four was in at that time, they would've made the same choice.

...well, maybe not the War Doctor.

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I think 9 would have if given the choice before meeting Rose.

 

[Stopdoor]

Nice pontifying in that scene and all but hasn't like 10 more seasons of Dr. Who proven whatever out he had in that situation was a dumb, temporary bump in the road?

 

[Sephzilla]

It's honestly a pretty interesting question when you consider that the Fourth Doctor hasn't even begun to see the true depths of the Daleks' evil by the time he reaches that point in Genesis. But even then, I imagine if any of the other Doctors were put in the same position Four was in at that time, they would've made the same choice.

...well, maybe not the War Doctor.

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I kind of feel like 9 or 10 might have done it.

 

[pikachief]

Id like to say yes but I think id have a similar conflict when put to the test. I cant just rob millions of choice.

 

[PlanetSmasher]

I think 9 would have if given the choice before meeting Rose.

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It's a hard thing to say, because 9's pre-Rose continuity is all over the place. The 50th kind of hints that War regenerates into 9 and then he IMMEDIATELY encounters Rose, but then there's also a bunch of stuff in S1 where 9 kind of hints that he's been around for a while.

Of course, that's what happens when you retcon an entire Doctor into existence because Eccleston didn't want to come back on the show. You get ants.

 

[Rassilon]

Daleks just need to chill man

 

[Deleted member 4783]

I accidentally the verb

 

[Sign My Guestbook!]

I kind of feel like 9 or 10 might have done it.

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[Midramble]

Yes, I would all of them. They are fictional super Nazis literally only capable of hate. They are manifest extinction.

 

[PlanetSmasher]

I kind of feel like 9 or 10 might have done it.

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I don't think Ten would, but Ten's entire character is literally CREATED out of his regrets from the Time War so it would be hard to remove The Moment from Ten's personal history without completely changing who he was as a person.

Nine had the opportunity to do it and turned it down.

 

[APZonerunner]

I kind of feel like 9 or 10 might have done it.

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Well, 9's whole thing in the end is he gets within a press of a button from wiping out all the remaining Daleks in the universe (or so he thinks), but he bottles it. He can't do it. "Coward, any day." And then 10 repeatedly gives them chances over and over again. It's only really when you get to 11 that a cavalier, fuck 'em attitude emerges.

 

[Serif]

I would.
If I recall correctly though, Time Lords can see alternate timelines and outcomes so incarnations of the Doctor may not have chosen to exterminate all the Daleks if they see that the alternative is a worse threat.

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

Mod: Would it be okay if you could change the title just because it might be confusing for those looking at the thread

 

[Tabaxi]

It's honestly a pretty interesting question when you consider that the Fourth Doctor hasn't even begun to see the true depths of the Daleks' evil by the time he reaches that point in Genesis. But even then, I imagine if any of the other Doctors were put in the same position Four was in at that time, they would've made the same choice.

...well, maybe not the War Doctor.

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Spoiler

The War Doctor's choice was based on both the Daleks and the Time Lords threatening all of existence. It was a different calculation.

 

[GungHo]

Yes.

And Picard should have given Hugh the virus.

 

[Sephzilla]

Well, 9's whole thing in the end is he gets within a press of a button from wiping out all the remaining Daleks in the universe (or so he thinks), but he bottles it. He can't do it. "Coward, any day." And then 10 repeatedly gives them chances over and over again. It's only really when you get to 11 that a cavalier, fuck 'em attitude emerges.

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Good points!

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

Good points!

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True and after the End of Time, i don't blame the Doctor becoming more cavailer which continued on 12 but was dialed back with 13

 

[Deleted member 25606]

I think 9 would have.

But the real ethical question isn't how many Daleks would you be killing, but how many not yet lost innocent lives will eventually be exterminated if you don't kill the Daleks. I meant you kill millions of Daleks, exterminates genocide or not you don't have the far outweighing numbers of every civilization they will go on to genocide on your head. They are living beings sure, living death, a thinking cancer, if tumors all of a sudden gained a voice would you all of a sudden decide we shouldn't eradicate cancer since it's alive?

 

[PlanetSmasher]

Well, 9's whole thing in the end is he gets within a press of a button from wiping out all the remaining Daleks in the universe (or so he thinks), but he bottles it. He can't do it. "Coward, any day." And then 10 repeatedly gives them chances over and over again. It's only really when you get to 11 that a cavalier, fuck 'em attitude emerges.

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The funniest part is that Twelve, the angriest Doctor in a long time, the one who hates the Daleks so much that Daleks call him a good Dalek, wouldn't even do it.

 

[Spectromixer]

Daleks just need to chill man

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amazing

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

The funniest part is that Twelve, the angriest Doctor in a long time, the one who hates the Daleks so much that Daleks call him a good Dalek, wouldn't even do it.

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The Doctor is like Batman in a way in that if he croses that line, he's never coming back

 

[PlanetSmasher]

The Doctor is like Batman in a way in that if he croses that line, he's never coming back

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Well, the Doctor is a little different than Batman in that Nine, Ten and Eleven believed that they DID cross that line. And they spent three lifetimes trying to atone for the fact that they did, without realizing that in truth they did what the Doctor (almost) always does - find a better way.

 

[Double 0]

War Doctor would, just not to take out Gallifrey too.

There are three doctors who fit in the "might do it" range. But one would have to contain a specific condition.

1) First Doctor if given third hand knowledge of what the Dalek later do. But I have a feeling his companions would stop him.

2) Seventh Doctor at his worst, but he likely tries to find some other messed up way to resolve it.

3) Eighth Doctor on a very, very bad day. Like, Daleks killed a bunch of my companions bad day (those who keep up with the audio dramas may know what I'm talking about). That unlucky dude was beaten down enough to want to start killing.

He might be the one that could do it.

The others, even 10 and 11, can't and/or won't.

 

[Googleplex]

Yes I would. Without hesitation. The Daleks have killed billions and are and threat to the very exsistance of the universe.

 

[Blader]

The thing about killing the Daleks in their infancy like that is, even if you did choose to kill them, the plan would probably fail and even end up turning the Daleks into the genocidal manics that you were trying to prevent in the first place.

Well, 9's whole thing in the end is he gets within a press of a button from wiping out all the remaining Daleks in the universe (or so he thinks), but he bottles it. He can't do it. "Coward, any day." And then 10 repeatedly gives them chances over and over again. It's only really when you get to 11 that a cavalier, fuck 'em attitude emerges.

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10 was willing to kill them all over again as moral support for War.

(10 also sends what he thinks is every last Dalek alive into the void in Doomsday, though I guess that's not technically killing them)

 

[PlanetSmasher]

War Doctor would, just not to take out Gallifrey too.

There are three doctors who fit in the "might do it" range. But one would have to contain a specific condition.

1) First Doctor if given third hand knowledge of what the Dalek later do. But I have a feeling his companions would stop him.

2) Seventh Doctor at his worst, but likely try to find some other messed up way to resolve it.

3) Eighth Doctor on a very, very bad day. Like, Daleks killed a bunch of my companions bad day (those who keep up with the audio dramas may know what I'm talking about)

The others, even 10 and 11, can't and/or won't.

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I think Eight would TRY, but stop at the critical moment. He would want to do it so hard that it would tear him up inside but he wouldn't be able to finish the job.

 

[Kneefoil]

Truthfully, if I had to actually do something to cause the extinction, I don't think I would, but if they were all dying and I could do something to save all or even just one of them, I probably wouldn't do that either.

 

[Hanbei]

If I have proof that all of them, absolutely all of them, are evil, and would cause catastrophic damage to the universe if given the opportunity, then yes, I'd kill them all.

But if you told me that some of them are, and can be good, then I would hesitate (and probably not do it).

 

[Tabaxi]

The funniest part is that Twelve, the angriest Doctor in a long time, the one who hates the Daleks so much that Daleks call him a good Dalek, wouldn't even do it.

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Twelve talked a big game, but even in series 8 he never reached close to the callousness of 11 or 10 did in their darker moments. He's one the Doctors least likely to do it.

 

[Blader]

I think Eight would TRY, but stop at the critical moment. He would want to do it so hard that it would tear him up inside but he wouldn't be able to finish the job.

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Well there was no War Doctor when RTD first wrote the Time War backstory, so it would've had to have been either 8 or 9 who killed them all in the first place.

 

[Deleted member 7051]

It's one of those things that's just way too difficult a question to answer, like ''if you could time travel to 1889, would you kill Hitler?"

The knee jerk reaction is "yeah absolutely", but the more I think about it the more it seems like a really bad idea. You have to remember after all that it wasn't a one sided conflict and the Time Lords were pretty shitty people themselves. I mean, the only way the Doctor could stop the Time War was to take both sides out of the equation - first by destroying both, then of course by freezing Gallifrey in time and causing the Daleks to destroy themselves.

You kill the Daleks and the Time Lords become unchallenged in time and space, quite likely creating an even worse future. Just like killing Hitler wouldn't prevent WW2, it'd just change who was fighting who.

Well there was no War Doctor when RTD first wrote the Time War backstory, so it would've had to have been either 8 or 9 who killed them all in the first place.

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It was meant to be Eccleston. It's why he refused to be in it, because he didn't feel as though it was accurate to his incarnation of the Doctor.

https://www.radiotimes.com/news/tv/2019-09-18/why-christopher-eccleston-turned-down-doctor-who-50th/

 

[Deleted member 29660]

They're killing machines (albeit living creatures inside) that seldom react otherwise. It's hard to feel bad for them. Daleks are created to hate, other than a complete mental break down there is no changing them. They keep coming and killing.

 

[PlanetSmasher]

Well there was no War Doctor when RTD first wrote the Time War backstory, so it would've had to have been either 8 or 9 who killed them all in the first place.

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The original plan was definitely for it to be Nine that did it, yeah.

 

[The Adder]

I'd like to say I wouldn't. But honestly I probably would. What's the value of my soul and peace of mind in the face of billions, trillions dead for no other reason than having the gall to exist in the first place.

 

[Lagamorph]

Yeah, considering the time war - it may have been much more difficult for a Post Time War Doctor to make the same decison

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Ironically I think some of the extended universe stuff considers this act to essentially be the catalyst of the Time War, and as such the Time Lords are responsible for starting it in the first place by sending the Doctor back to either wipe out the Daleks or alter their evolution so they would be less evil.

 

[APZonerunner]

The original plan was definitely for it to be Nine that did it, yeah.

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I mean, it was Moffat's plan for the original draft of Day of the Doctor, but RTD said in an interview that in his mind originally he envisioned the regeneration into 9 being triggered by whatever act it is that ended the war, which is why the trauma weighs so heavy - he was 'born' in the blood of that moment. But it was never on screen, so hey ho.

Ironically I think some of the extended universe stuff considers this act to essentially be the catalyst of the Time War, and as such the Time Lords are responsible for starting it in the first place by sending the Doctor back to either wipe out the Daleks or alter their evolution so they would be less evil.

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This isn't just extended universe - RTD wrote this in Doctor Who Magazine a bit. He basically retroactively added several Dalek/Time Lord skirmishes from the classic series into actually being part of the war, even though people didn't realize it at the time of their involvement - and he considers Genesis the first act of the war. Which isn't a surprise really, as it is an act of war on the Time Lords' part, really.

 

[Stinkles]

I accidentally all the daleks

 

[Deleted member 29682]

So basically "Would you make a good Dalek?".

 

[Z-Beat]

Fuck those squids driving trashcans

 

[TheGamingNewsGuy]

Ironically I think some of the extended universe stuff considers this act to essentially be the catalyst of the Time War, and as such the Time Lords are responsible for starting it in the first place by sending the Doctor back to either wipe out the Daleks or alter their evolution so they would be less evil.

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Yeah - Genesis is pretty much considered to be the 1st act of the Time War.

I accidentally all the daleks

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That was not my intention. I meant to be exterminate. Just waiting on a Mod to change it

 

[NinjaGarden]