Absolutely agree. This honestly should have been released like a week before the election maximum! Collective memory of a goldfish and all that...
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Absolutely agree. This honestly should have been released like a week before the election maximum! Collective memory of a goldfish and all that...
I'll skip the sarcasm and just say: The "Bob Woodward is the real killer for not reporting this earlier" argument is really fucking dumb, and the people using it on this board should be embarrassed to have made it.
Yeah, and the only proof you need is the Comey letter that came out a little over a week before the election. It torpedoed Hillary's campaign, and we would probably not be discussing President Trump without the letter coming out. But if it came out two months before the election, she probably would have recovered.
A prison sentence for his innumerable high crimes and misdemeanors is the only thing that would partially restore my faith in America.
Pretty sure I am not alone in this.
You need to take a class in reading comprehension if that's honesty your takeaway from that post
I had to read the rest of your posts in the thread to see why you're responding to me, but I see now: you've been making the same argument.
Fucking.Terrifying.
No quarter for Republicans when Biden wins. They have to answer for letting this continue.
This. News. Isn't. For. The. Cultists. How many thousands of times on this forum does this point need to be hammered home before people get it? They're dug in. They're immovable. We all know this. Trump could personally butcher their children before their very eyes and it probably wouldn't change their convictions about their Messiah. They're a lost cause. Moreover, they're not even relevant to the election outcome.
Who is relevant are the unfortunately-critical "swing voters", and the increasingly disenchanted Trump supporters who never drowned themselves in the kool-aid. (Like, for example, the known Republican voters who have been turned off by Trump's response to the virus.) Some of us try to hold onto a tiny shred of hope that Teflon Don can be defeated. (Perhaps especially those of us who belong to a targeted minority.) It is vital that this message condemning Trump in his own recorded words gets before this intended audience unobscured and undeflected by the many layers of spin with which this administration sustains itself.
Words matter. They are what temper or even determine the public discourse. When you (royal you) receive news like this that Woodward has dropped and end up contributing more words to the public discourse condemning the messenger than the irresponsible despot culpable for 190k deaths, you help to do said despot's work for him. You normalize his actions and feed his spin mechanism. Look at the last several pages of this thread: the hijack is on. Woodward's character is now the primary subject of the discourse here, god help us, without any of Trump's agents (knowingly) swooping in here and contributing to the spin. Imagine what's happening to this story in domains not self-styled as "progressive"?
Contrary to your accusations, my grasp of this matter is far from "simple". I'm all too cognizant of the likelihood that, if Trump is toppled, it won't be due to any one scandal. Like others in this thread, I subscribe to the "death by a thousand cuts" theory of his defeat. It therefore behooves us not to get in the way of any potential cuts, as the situation is desperate enough to place a premium on every last one. How hard is it to simply audit your response to this and ensure that it's proportionate? How many words have you contributed to the discourse over this news unleashing your outrage at this murderous regime? How many have you contributed attacking Woodward? By my count, you're not balancing both issues well at all.
I will paraphrase what I said just a few pages ago: when your response to this news aligns more or less perfectly with Trump's response, it's time to stop and think.
Yep. I don't get the point of saying Woodward neglected to tell people coronavirus is dangerous.
We already knew the virus was a huge deal. The information was already out there. Everyone not up Trump's ass knew Covid was a big deal.
The point is that Trump clearly knew too, but he lied about it constantly because he was thinking of his re-election and wanted to paint a rosy false narrative.
You are most definitely not alone. His flagrant and unabated assault on the Constitution, established norms, and basic decency must not go unpunished.
I mean, I certainly have learned not to expect much from Era, but sitting on life-saving information in exchange for maximum electoral impact is a bit much. Yeah sure, the people he needed to convince at that point probably "deserve it" but they interact with local communities and endangered essential workers, many of whom are Black or Latino and certainly don't "deserve it".
Have I been attacking Woodward? By my recollection I've been venting my irritation at the fact that we can't have any nuance in our stances on this shit anymore, because anyone who feels like discussing that aspect of this story on a discussion board where Trump being a shithead is more or less already assumed is being beaten with the same hammer people reserve for Trumpers.
Trying to get ahead of the Pence knew also story (duh of course he knew and lied).
An inability to understand investigative journalism isn't a nuance. The idea that Woodward releasing this stuff to the press months ago would magically make people more responsible is absolute twaddle, and is the exact same argument Trump is using to deflect the issue.
At this point, they don't even need to deflect, because it's not going to detract from that base. After yesterday, not seeing the outrage, it's apparent with 190K dead, the GOP and that shitty base are willing to sit on top of all of those deceased to ensure Trump stays in power. If Trump loses in November, the GOP is not breaking away. They will not distance. They will just double down on Trump for 2024 and bitch, moan, do what they do best, which is impede progress. Trump will continue to push his agenda behind the scenes, GOP will continue to be implicit in it all because there's no turning back on them now.
We need a sweeping victory in November, with all three branches of Gov't. Biden needs to expand Supreme Court seats, he needs to add states, he needs to strongly regulate social media, push for deplatforming on these companies, or break them up.
We need a sweeping victory in November, with all three branches of Gov't. Biden needs to expand Supreme Court seats, he needs to add states, he needs to strongly regulate social media, push for deplatforming on these companies, or break them up.
No, it really isn't.
Like I and others here can be totally wrong about investigative journalism. Fine.
But the argument I keep seeing here, ignorant of journalism or not, is, "Woodward should have released this back then so we would have concrete evidence of Trump knowingly downplaying the pandemic in his own words behind the scenes,"
and the argument Trump is using is, "If it was so wrong for me to downplay the pandemic, why didn't Woodward release the tapes then?"
These are two conflicting arguments. One says that Trump is guilty of causing unnecessary deaths by downplaying the pandemic and that some of those deaths might have been prevented with evidence, and the other says that Trump was right to downplay the pandemic and that Woodward knew he was right at the time so he waited until it looked wrong to do so. No one here is arguing the latter.
Honestly at this point I'm just arguing over semantics so I should just stop contributing words to this discussion.
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Clearly Trump should impeach Bob Woodward. It's the only way to make sure he pays for the lives that were lost, and the only way to be fair in criticism for both of them.
At least that's what that Trump tweet suggests!
At least that's what that Trump tweet suggests!
Not only did we know he was lying and not only did we have a lot of experts say it was dangerous but one of the only time periods releasing this would make sense, mid to late March, we were literally having this conversation already and Trump told us all straight up that he downplayed it and knew it was dangerous. He even says he knew it was a pandemic before everyone else. The reason Woodward asks him about it on March 19 and gets him to say he downplayed it is because we were having that same conversation out in public. He just asked what every other reporter was asking him.
The only reason it hits as scathingly now is because we also know he did jack shit behind the scenes and that caused a lot of people to die.
Everyone isn't just going to abandon Trump en masse like the bully at the end of an 80s movie. His base is showing cracks. In particular, the 65 and older demographic who did not appreciate being offered up as human sacrifice to please the economy.
thats right!
it was a bunch of "its fine, its fine", then switched to wartime President and BS....
His Twitter is still saying COVID isn't dangerous and I'm sure if you summoned his ghost, he'd blame the libz.
Bombshell after bombshell drops about this man and usually it would sink a second term, but with him it doesn't matter because
"he doesn't like brown people like me so I'm voting him no matter what "
which even that gives his followers too much credit because that would mean they would have to believe the allegations first but still vote him because they are racist. But no they just think everything is fake news and the man is a saint.
"he doesn't like brown people like me so I'm voting him no matter what "
which even that gives his followers too much credit because that would mean they would have to believe the allegations first but still vote him because they are racist. But no they just think everything is fake news and the man is a saint.
Hopefully Trump, uhm pushes up daisies in the next four years if he loses. He'll be 80+ right? His younger brother is already dead, he can't be too far behind.
It's maybe a valid defence if he hadn't spent his entire administration trying to panic his base with various chunks of red meat: caravans of immigrants, ANTIFA, Muslims, China etc
The Lebanon explosion incident from a month ago? Seriously? People got careless, corruption happened, stuff exploded, case closed. Why is that their choice for a front-page? (obvious rhetorical question, we all know the reason)
Man, the USA is mighty fucked.
Edit: I made a comment and it turns out it was going to be identical to what you had here; but yeah
I think he should have released it in part because it was (and is) very bad for Trump (he would have exposed Trump as lying to the American public extremely early on). Trump is literally saying the opposite: that because the info was not released, that means the info was good actually. These are incompatible statements! And only works because Woodward chose to act in the manner that he did.
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Yeah, sorry Mike. That ship has sailed and it's been over the horizon for months.
OP
OP
Why does Twitter allow people to use dead folks' Twitter accounts?
Especially for propaganda..
I mean if social media is finding it difficult to weed through and censor misinformation, dead people would be super low hanging fruit. This would be like a Leonard Nimoy checkmark account existing to tell us smoking is fucking great.
That bystander who failed to stop me from stabbing that man is the real person at fault here. Arrest them.