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Witchfire announced (The Astronauts, FPS)
- Thread starter Transistor
- Start date
Maybe expecting that behavior is unfair, but it's not like I was planning on buying every game released next year and am now subtracting this one. I'm likely only going to choose a handful of titles and something like this has an impact on that decision.
It was a movement transparently about driving women and other marginalized people's voices out of the industry, it resulted in harassment, doxxing, swatting, literally driving them out of their homes. I think the lack of those voices is one of the more important issues in the game industry, so I'd rather not support someone who has a rose tinted vision of GG in 2017.
That's just my personal viewpoint. I think the game looks great and I hope it sells well, as I'd like to see more games like it.
I'm finding these comments on Poland being a "shitty" country somewhat backward and Neolithic in honesty.
Having spent time and my partner being from there, I can understand a certain level of resentment between countries but it's a bit of a stretch to heckle a country because you had a bad incident.
It's a beautiful country, and full of lovely people.
Sure it's not exactly a fun place for anyone that isn't straight and white but most of Eastern Europe is totally backward with "human rights"
It is far from a shitty country
Having spent time and my partner being from there, I can understand a certain level of resentment between countries but it's a bit of a stretch to heckle a country because you had a bad incident.
It's a beautiful country, and full of lovely people.
Sure it's not exactly a fun place for anyone that isn't straight and white but most of Eastern Europe is totally backward with "human rights"
It is far from a shitty country
One of my coworkers is a Polish (I think?) and he is good fun to work with, and i also have a friend who regularly travels to there. One day ill shall visit it aswell.
Please visit ! It's beautiful
Just try not to get overly consumed by political climates and enjoy the people and food etc
You might want to play Shadow Warrior and a few more FPSs if you like the dodge.
But GG was primarily an american/western movement with ties to the socio-political climate in America. So if an international dev is going to get involved in that, why shouldn't they be judged by the same standards?
You might want to play Shadow Warrior and a few more FPSs if you like the dodge.
Is that 1 or 2?
Lol, after you said that it does fell like I am playing as a dwarf
Great post. After looking at an article about him on Vice, he just seems to be the kind of guy who's too smart for a group like the gaters. It's still baffling how he sides with them.
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You might want to play Shadow Warrior and a few more FPSs if you like the dodge.
Yeah I knew there are some out there I haven't played. I hope this one is a little slower paced.
If it's paced like Painkiller, it will be quite fast paced at least during the action :P
What's this? I am not American, so I can appraise the dev then. Good.
That looks pretty sweet. I've got my eye on this for sure, assuming it's on the PS4. I just hope the final product actually looks and plays as good as the trailer
Good post, agreed 100%. Blaming people like Chmielarz and Vavra for actions of assholes who sent harassing tweets to women is unfair and reminiscent of collective punishment. Now both these developers disagreed with lot of Sarkeesian and McIntosh's work and critiqued it, but that should not be a cause for calling them garbage/trash. It is clear from reading interviews with them that they do not support harassment of anyone and I am not aware that they harassed anyone (disagreement is not that). If I am wrong about that and they did harass people then I will readily correct my opinion of them.
Also I am a bit surprised at some of the posts regarding Poland, from my experience it is a beautiful, friendly country, but of course it is anecdotal I have only been in Krakow, Gdansk and Warsaw. No doubt every country has its share of people with problematic views however.
As for Witchfire I loved Ethan Carter and am not that much into shooters so for me the trailer was disappointment. But on the other hand Valley of the Gods got also announced so I am very happy about that :)
I second this but don't engage with the games BS loot rubbish. You can safely ignore it by playing at hard or below and just enjoy the sweet, sweet gameplay.You might want to play Shadow Warrior and a few more FPSs if you like the dodge.
Great post. I think it's going to be hard to make headway if we have two trenches dug where one side says "anything is permissible" and the other side says "all voices in GG are abusive against women." I'm staunchly anti-GG but I think that there are individual points within it's initial sell that are attractive to many people. Similarly to the Trump phenomenon, it's worth exploring why this movement was so intoxicating and was able to find headway among both hate groups and more centrist groups. Dr. Caroll's post on the historical angle really helps shine a light on that. And it's true, I have seen a several Europeans online flat out dismissing Wolfenstein 2 for having communist protagonists.
Regarding Witchfire, I think the reveal was kind of funny. But, much in the same way it got plenty of people to say "fuck yeah, fuck walking sims," it kind of earned an eye-roll from me. Especially after the official Astronauts blog said that this was the reaction they were looking for:
That sort of "fuck walking sims, fuck feelings" reaction they were apparently looking for veers a little too close to the anti-SJW rhetoric that GG/KotakuInAction peddles, and it's pretty tiring to see a game dev that has made a competent enough walking sim play into that stereotype. Games like Wolfenstein 2 and Mafia 3 show us that gamers can have their cake and eat it too as far as emotionally-driven violent narratives go. And I'm not sure why alienating the customers that bought Ethan Carter would be seen as a good marketing move.
Anyway, it's just a teaser, and it's too early to really tell how I feel about the game. But the reveal and the subsequent blog post kind of left a sour taste in my mouth.
Yea, I'll be honest I thought the bait and switch was cute. But damn, I hated seeing so many people in comments posting about shitty walking sims getting wrecked and that sort of stuff. Especially when it's a really solid genre with great entrees almost every year now, including their own previous title. It's very weird that they would play into that mindset. Either way, I'm probably biased as I'd likely prefer a walking sim over a painkiller type game.
I definitely see where you're coming from. It is a clever bit of marketing, but I guess it does attract a certain annoying demographic. They're quite proud of Ethan Carter, mind you, and the game did sell very well. I guess it's hard to separate the subversion of expectations from the really unpleasant negativity towards walking sims in some parts of the gaming community that they have attracted. I can only imagine how some of the devs must feel seeing people shit on something that was a labour of love. The game is extremely early in development, seemingly. And it is worth noting that Bulletstorm had a heavy, if extremely non-serious focus on storytelling. Who can forget Waggleton P. Tallylicker? It's not like Bulletstorm was a mindless shooter. It had heart. And dicks. I do hope that Witchfire is less Painkiller and more Bulletstorm, because I'm not really a fan of the Painkiller design template.
I mean the guy in the video even posted in comments that he has nothing against walking sims as a genre. Just a bit of disappointment because it feels like there are lot of them lately. I can emphasize with that, having finished (and enjoyed) Firewatch, Gone Home, Observer, Ethan Carter, Tacoma...I am oversaturated with them myself.
And this trailer just poked a bit of fun with the bait and switch, nothing wrong with that.
Willing to bet that the majority doesn't care for that type of stupidity.
People are giving too much attention to bad intentions instead of coming up/praising the good ones (they do, but it is not enough, and at times comes from a confrontational pov).
It is like "but what those groups will think, what will they do?"
They will be wrong and uninformed people, that is what they will do. And it will come a time when naturally things will evolve, as they usually do, that that backwards and uninformed mindset will become inadequated and have no place in the world at that moment.
If we let ourselves to be driven by the possibility of someone or some group being negative towards something, eventually everyone is intoxicated without knowing.
Accept that there are people that are lost and are willing to be negative and piss on people cereal for no reason. From that point on, make an effort to either trying to come up with a direct dialogue and education or step away, don't engage, move on and try to change the environment around you.
Sorry for the rant, nothing personal, I'm just... *sigh*
That Czech user is just jeleaus we're making a lot better games than they are ;)
Seriously though, 10-15 years ago Czech devs were kicking Poles' asses despite being much smaller country. It took Poland surprisingly long time to finally start making great games and surpass it's neighbours. Didn't help that the best Czech studio is gone
Hah I am czech too and I will be the first to admit Poland has become videogamedev powerhouse overtaking Germany and maybe even UK at this point, as insane as it sounds. It is impressive how much gamedev flourishes there.
Czechland lost 2K Czech but Warhorse will hopefully be a good replacement. At the very least they are making game that fits my taste even better than anything Illusion softworks ever did.
Wish someone else on the team was a spokesperson for this game other than Adrian Chmielarz. His mixed messaging of how he wants this game to be perceived and wanting people who hate games like Ethan Carter but get excited for FPSs just sets off on a negative foot. Do you really want your game's reaction to be like this Youtuber guy who has heavy metal in his intro and says this, to be your audience? (I've transcribed the video so you don't have to watch the cringe)
"Oh my god, get the fuck out of here. I hate these motherfuckers with these games where you just walk and you're bored for 55 fucking minutes at a time. You look at some object, there's some obtuse mystery behind you and at the end of the game you're dead. OH THEY GOT ME! BARS! That's what the fuck I'm talking about! Best trailer I've ever seen. Best bait-and-switch of all time."
Like mentioned above you can have FPSs that take from adventure games like Wolfenstein, NOLF, Half Life, Bioshock, etc. What if Witchfire has more adventure bits, won't it be a bait-and-switch who expect a pure FPS?
"Oh my god, get the fuck out of here. I hate these motherfuckers with these games where you just walk and you're bored for 55 fucking minutes at a time. You look at some object, there's some obtuse mystery behind you and at the end of the game you're dead. OH THEY GOT ME! BARS! That's what the fuck I'm talking about! Best trailer I've ever seen. Best bait-and-switch of all time."
Like mentioned above you can have FPSs that take from adventure games like Wolfenstein, NOLF, Half Life, Bioshock, etc. What if Witchfire has more adventure bits, won't it be a bait-and-switch who expect a pure FPS?
I think the Czech Republic has done amazing things for the tactical shooter genre in particular. Hidden and Dangerous, Vietcong, and of course Operation Flashpoint and ARMA. I have high hopes for Warhorse's work. But Poland's game development community is amazing. No denying that.
My impression is that it has both things from Ethan Carter and Painkiller. So it's a walking exploring adventure game, until it isn't anymore and you get your gun out.
And not that it is another pure Painkiller-esque game. Am I wrong? Has the dev team brought out a statement about the game yet? Or interviews or something?
And not that it is another pure Painkiller-esque game. Am I wrong? Has the dev team brought out a statement about the game yet? Or interviews or something?
Oh yeah Hidden and Dangerous2, Vietcong 1 (second was horrible) are classics as is Operation Flashpoint of course (I never played further Armas besides dayzmod).
2K Czech still exists partially, but they are support for Hangar 13, working on stuff like cutscenes and physics/AI in Mafia 3/4.
What they posted about Witchfire is here:
http://www.theastronauts.com/2017/12/new-game-witchfire/
So you made a narrative game and now you're making a shooter?
Our first game was The Vanishing of Ethan Carter, a narrative game for PC and PS4 which won BAFTA's Game Innovation award, and was nominated for GameSpot's Best Game of the Year and IGN's Best PC
Game. To date, we have sold over 1 million copies of the game.
The obvious next step is to create another one like this, right?
But we really, really want to make a shooter.
That change in direction isn't anything new for the core team. The three co-owners of The Astronauts were also the co-owners of People Can Fly, as well as the creative leads behind shooters like Painkiller and Bulletstorm.
We love adventure games, and we've made some in the past, even before People Can Fly or our The Vanishing of Ethan Carter. Mystery of the Statuette, Teenagent, The Prince and the Coward – all adventure games. As I have already mentioned, we've also made a few shooters, Painkiller and Bulletstorm. We have reached for other genres, too. Katharsis was a 2D arcade shooter, Reflux was an RTS, and Gorky 17 was a strategy RPG. There was also a big action adventure called Come Midnight that People Can Fly was making for THQ over ten years ago …but let's leave that story for another time.
One of the reasons we called the studio The Astronauts was to emphasize the journey to new places. After we made an innovative – we think – narrative game, now we want to make a shooter unlike anything we've done before. Can't wait to bring you along on the ride with us!
I hope Warhorse will enjoy big success and grow to become Ilussion Softworks successors. I loved their games and they've aged so damn well. I've recently been replaying Hidden and Dangeours 2 and it's still pure gem.
Their webpage for it basically implies that the game is so early that they're really only comfortable announcing it for the PC right now.
The truth is, the bait and switch was really well done and it's the perfect way to show that they're taking what they learn from Ethan Carter and using it for this game. It's ingenius, because it's a funny way to tell everything you need to know about the game in less than a minute. Perfect sales pitch.
The fact that it pleases some of the most unsavory part of the gaming world ("fuck SJW walking simulators!") is just some unfortunate collateral damage. Really, most people get more excited for an FPS than a slow pace adventure game, especially at a hype event like the game awards. So it made sense to play it like that.
The fact that it pleases some of the most unsavory part of the gaming world ("fuck SJW walking simulators!") is just some unfortunate collateral damage. Really, most people get more excited for an FPS than a slow pace adventure game, especially at a hype event like the game awards. So it made sense to play it like that.
This in particular is where i am at, especially the latter part. I condemn the things Adrian has said in GG, but i dont condemn every single voice that partakes in that discussion. Unfortunately, you have people, who do consider that all voices in GG are against women and even partake on personal conquest to silence one down. That to me seems to be the exact kind of reaction you should not do when you are anti-GG. You will always retain dissonant voices in this discussion, but personal witchhunts should not be part of that discussion, from either side of the argument, that is.
I should also add that from here, in the NL, Gamergate is a topic a lot more unknown to many gamers than that it is in America.
I do think thats a bit stretching, after all, all they added was ''The makers of Ethan Carter... BUT ALSO Bulletstorm''. Personally, i just found that a funny tactic, especially when the video went into that aiming modus that reminded me so much of Bulletstorm, so i definitely felt it was tongue-in-cheek humor right there.
It does go to show that the actions of one especially prominent member outshines the efforts of many. I am not particularly fond of it either, and i agree with what you are saying. This obviously is made with love, and its a shame that the game is getting so much flak because of the co-owner being a questionable personality.
''hold it right there dick tits.''
God the dialogue of Bulletstorm was so good. Cringey, but so good. That overly macho stuff when there is nothing to be macho about. So good.
That sadly doesn't mean some people will try either way to keep that side of the story an active one. And that's fine. Its different when its the only road you want to drive on and can't respect the others building on this game.
I do think however that a different spokesperson other than the co-owner should do all the talk for this game. The less that guy is in the ''spotlights'', the better.
Your GameCube is outdated? ;) But yes, PC only so far, Supreme Leader Galahad. (Love the name.)
I loved The Vanishing of Ethan Carter. And while I also enjoyed Painkiller back in the day, ultimately what they're going for here is not what I'm looking for right now.
Shame! I think there's a space for adventure/mystery games with high production values and great graphics like Ethan Carter was.
Shame! I think there's a space for adventure/mystery games with high production values and great graphics like Ethan Carter was.
That's the direction I hope they're going for. Bulletstorms storytelling always felt underrated.
Very well said, I think. I love nice walking simulators with intriquing plots and nice graphics, but I did enjoy the twist here.
Also, the graphics really do look superb. Their photogrammetry technique seems to have taken a new leap.
Sorry, I really want to respond to this. I don't want to clog the thread, so don't bother reading this if you aren't interested in the developer conversation.
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Hey, thanks. This was an excellent post. Sorry I don't have anything to add but I just wanted to say that.
Also the game looks great. I hope it feels good to play.
I will agree that cultural differences, and in this case particularly those related to politics, can be complicated and should be taken into account. But I'm also seeing this post being used to push an inaccuracy to defend him and let him of faith lightl.
Adrian Chmielarz personally directed harassment at female journalists. I saw this happen. This is not guilt by association. This is not "oh, he didn't know what it was really about".
He directly participated in GamerGate himself, make no fucking mistake. And he has never apologized for it.