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Will we see The Last Night in 2020?
- Thread starter Legacy
- Start date
Maybe? Who knows what's going on with that game.
If it came out id play it but after all this time I honestly forget its a thing.
If it came out id play it but after all this time I honestly forget its a thing.
He apologized and then quickly went back to doing the things he apologized for.
Actually it would be a shame if it still does, considering the whole premise of the game. There are plenty of other titles with similar aesthetics on the horizon to look into.
Better that we focus on those instead of a game by a designer who hates women so much he set his game in a post apocalyptic world that came about from men and women being treated equally.
Not all that surprising that Fredrik doesn't care about these issues and is pretending it was just some old twitter comments by the dev that was the only problematic aspects.
i remember seeing tim sorets twitter and he's still working on it with a team. they're really focusing on make the pixels shiny
they got funding from another source.
soret is a product of male and white privilege. he speaks it and acts it. I don't expect him to ever change.
i treat those as dogwhistling and block immediately. we know what you really think
they got funding from another source.
soret is a product of male and white privilege. he speaks it and acts it. I don't expect him to ever change.
i treat those as dogwhistling and block immediately. we know what you really think
Not to mention there actually were threads with a lot of pushback about this here too so what Aaron said is flat out untrue. CDPR also showed they're willing to fire the people involved and hire LGBTQ+ allies in their positions.
Ah okay, just did a quick wiki search, they didn't mention any backlash there. What did he do? More GG tweets?
Fredrik in a different Last Night thread said:
Come on guy
I don't understand these takes in the thread that people will just enjoy the graphics or the setting/atmosphere and ignore the story. They exist in service to one another. The game would be in even worse shape if it conveyed absolutely nothing of meaning through its visuals; the problem is that what it wants to convey is junk (or worse).
. . .or they might not know about the background. I literally just watched that video and thought "Oh that looks interesting."
Come on what? I still talk with that guy and it's still as weird, his latest issues are the Star Wars movies and Captain Marvel, he can go on for like hours lol
Anyway I thought the Tim Soret controversy was the same old tweets, but now he has gone back to it again?
btw, there's a similar game to The Last Night - Replaced from Sad Cat Studios (also, still in development)
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Yes, and it was discussed at length in the other thread you posted in.
Maybe this isnt directed entirely at you, but it's hard to have conversations about anything GamerGate because it always boils down to people popping up to "just ask questions" and hand-wave away any issues people might have.
Soret positions himself as a centrist, but with a complete lack of empathy. He's a classic textbook academic. He doesn't endorse Trump (as far i know) but he'll blame the left for enabling the right. I have a feeling that they've completely abandoned their old storyline on the last night since it was so fucking stupid, and it'll be more of a reflection of the state of the world today. I'm sure the french protests have influenced his work. (he's french)
btw, there's a similar game to The Last Night - Replaced from Sad Cat Studios (also, still in development)
This looks dope! Thanks. Now hopefully these devs don't have shitty views.
Oh okay, GG support is unfortunate and going by media in my country Trump is a clown, but sorry to say this but Trump is the president so US have bigger issues if supporting the elected president gets you roasted :P Just make sure you all stop him from being elected a second time.
btw, there's a similar game to The Last Night - Replaced from Sad Cat Studios (also, still in development)
Things like this, Octopath, and no doubt many other games that are blending pixel art with modern lighting will basically lead to Last Night being shoved aside, yeah. No major publisher is gonna endorse it at this point. Certain groups of people will rally behind it, but that only goes so far.
Well it's not like I'm a right-wing or even centre but to be honest I'm not invested enough into US politics or social media or even the english language to be able to have any deeper talks about it.
I can tell you this though, to me it all seems like exaggerations, like people searching for a reason to hate on the man or the game. That's what it looks like at least. But maybe it's just me being an uninformed lazy old slob comfortably living in a bubble up here on the north pole. I'd be okay with that.
To me GG seems like yesterdays news though so it's sad to hear that Tim Soret is back on that sorry train again. The game still looks amazing.
It's weird that you don't get people going on about how eager they are to play these Last Night-alikes, or how "sublime" their graphics are. They all specifically want to justify their desire to play the GG game for some reason.
who cares about this game...
the more important question: will we see EITR in 2020?
Yo, this man with the real questions.
I ask this every time one of those big production shows happen and EITR stuff gets shown.
But yeah OP, I would be genuinely surprised if this game comes out.
FWIW - this is the first time I've seen the game by Sad Cat. Some real interesting 3D voxel work there.
It makes me wonder how far these games are.
That's weird, because I always notice the inverse - most everyone will admit that upon first glance The Last Night looks cool and they wouldn't mind playing it. Most of the searching is being done by people looking to justify their desire to still play it once they're informed how crappy the creator is.
During my first 12 years I finished and enjoyed a lot of games without knowing their story or meaning because of the language barrier(RPGS included).
Let's suppose that The Last Night comes with a more subtle story like, for example, Dark Souls. If that is the case I think it would be difficult for it to bother me. Recently I finished DS3 and I have few vague ideas about the overall plot but I really enjoyed the game as a lot of other elements were great.
The searching, piling up tweets, digging in the past etc is done by those who want to roast the guy, no doubt.
But the defense talk is logical, it's not the first or the last game that this happens with. Same thing goes on if you mention Yoko Taro's or Kojima's sexism, or the Kingdom Come Deliverance's studio head, etc. If a game looks cool then you don't want people high-jacking every thread to try pull you away from it and rant about one man's personal issues that might not even hurt the game as a whole even if they are weird, you want to make up your own mind if you could still be okay with playing the game or not.
All that being said, the end result of that decision is being able to say with a straight face, "I don't care about what this person did, I just want to play the game", which is hard to do with some of these people.
Personally, I wouldn't mind if this game came out, but man, if it is what it was reported to be early and if the mindset of the head dev made it into the game, I would roast it hard.
FWIW - 2D platformers with a heavy adventure game background almost never hinge on subtleties. I get how this can be done, I played a lot of JRPG's in Japanese back in college when I had a rudimentary understanding of the language, but I'll be the first to say that in doing so, I missed a LOT of what made those games special and important.
There is so much we don't know, probably for the best. I'm a cranky old man, I honestly think everybody has some dirt on their backs they don't want the wrong person to see, most have just learned to keep quiet and goes on pretending to be goody two-shoes instead, in certain scenarios.
But the idea that a vile person could put their toxic thoughts into the main story is harder to swallow. I don't think that is happening here though, or is it?
From what that story seemed to be about from whatever early blurbs we got, there was definitely a good streak of "equality, gender issues and inclusion are things that will bring about our downfall". If there's any substance to that, who can say, the game isn't out. But if there is, I can't think of a single publisher who would carry it.
And people are flawed, yes, that's a given. But there's a difference between, "I got drunk with my friends and smashed a window", and, "I willingly hosted an AMA on an imageboard that hosted child pornography and what was used as a staging ground for 2 mass shootings of people of color."
It's easier to distance when the creator's personal issues are divorced from the game but that doesn't appear to be the case here, with Kojima, or with Vavra. Their issues turn up in the text of the game. Their sexism is clear and present in the game.
People who don't care about the social issues will not be swayed by "hijacking", they just don't want to feel guilty, tax their morality, or have to think critically. They just want to be hyped with blinders. The problem is when they let everyone know how much they don't care about such issues, that others shouldn't care, downplay, or excuse it which lands them in trouble.
I get it, you just want to passively shovel candy in your mouth and not be aware of where it comes from, how it's made, or what it contains. Just be aware of how that makes you look.
In the past, he explicitly described it as being about a world where his GG take on "feminism" took over. Granted, he may have changed it since then due to the blowback, but it establishes the mindset he's coming at the project from, and it's also very telling that he's writing speculative fiction about the future where he can easily swap out the events that led to that future with an entirely different set of circumstances.
Don't know how new this is but here is a cut and paste from wikipedia:
"Tim replied following this that his stance from his previous position has since changed, and that The Last Night was in no way meant to be commentary surrounding the Gamergate controversy. He apologized for his past tweets while on stage during the PC Gaming Show the next day, stating "They don't in any way represent where I am today or what The Last Night will be about".[11]"
"In an interview with Vice, Tim Soret said that while The Last Night has themes that others see as right-wing, such as criticizing the concept of Universal Basic Income, his goal with the game is not to be critical of these elements, but only to describe a world that took a certain trajectory to implement these elements, for better or worse, and explore the new problems that were introduced. Soret compared this approach to the movies Gattaca and Wall-E, neither of which he felt politicized the situation"
And the publisher:
"Raw Fury supported Tim, stating: "The comments Tim made in 2014 are certainly surprising and don't fit the person we know, and we hope that everyone reading this who knows us at Raw Fury on a personal and professional level knows that we wouldn't tolerate working with someone who portrays the caricature of Tim going around the internet right now."
I don't know, I think things will iron itself out alright at the end if the game is actually released. A futuristic "what if" scenario isn't a too controversial way to build a story, as long as it isn't super toxic and he doesn't start preaching that this is absolutely what will happen if things keeps going this way in real life then he should be fine. Maybe it'll be like a crazy episode of Black Mirror?
Ignorance is bliss? Well, sometimes, yeah. And to use your analogy, there is no need to throw away the whole box of yummy candies because there is one sour candy in there.
Only time will tell.
But I will tell you this, the amount of scrutiny this game will be under if it ever does come out will be A S T R O N O M I C A L.
I'm trying to correct this analogy in a way that conveys the situation better and am failing to come up with something that isn't silly. Though I believe that to be because it's inherently silly to make this comparison.
This is not a matter of difference in taste- this game's setting sprung out of some legitimately hateful ideas. That's not to say that we cannot look at, directly critique, or even find enjoyment in art produced from such ideas. But it's not so easily separated from the work. And honestly, even some hypothetical message-less work from a Gamergater is still worth avoiding supporting.
I will also say I'm not really sure what you're hoping for here. I don't think there's a way this could end up being an appealing handling of these topics. If it does actually "iron itself out" of being controversial/toxic, I expect the result to be fairly bland and presenting "both sides" in a way that still inherently validates some ideas/ideologies that shouldn't be validated. If it doesn't, I expect it to be fairly uncomfortable at best, and being outright gross feels more likely besides. I find it extremely unlikely that his understanding will have grown enough that he can properly engage with these ideas and come up with a satisfying exploration of them, based on his past behavior and what he's said so far.
I do not think he has earned the benefit of the doubt here. He blew that chance early on and has done little to nothing to earn it back.
"Though the box of candy may only have one sour piece in it, it may still not be worth purchasing if it funds monsters who literally wish for the demise of minorities and the subjugation of women. It's some damn good chocolate though."
I'm not disagreeing, it could be awful, but I'm willing to check out for myself how awful it is when it's done instead of just dismissing it based on prerelease twitter hate.
Like, I was so close to forever ban Kojima's games from my house when seeing through Death Stranding, it was beyond gross, but I stuck through it and by the end I'm glad I did. Won't touch it again and he's obviously not a sane person but his skills in story-telling is unmatched for the industry.
To the people still hoping it gets released. Why are you looking forward to a game that will undoubtedly be misogynist and who knows what other bullshit?
The games setting is literally "a dystopian future where modern feminism won". If that sounds cool to you, please let us all know so we can mass report you.
The games setting is literally "a dystopian future where modern feminism won". If that sounds cool to you, please let us all know so we can mass report you.