about that...
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Why women criticise sexualised character designs | OT3 | "make her look more...corpulent, more stuffed where the eyes can't escape."
- Thread starter Persephone
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- OT
FFXIV's supporting cast is about 50/50 at this point. For the NPC trusts (the thing that let you do dungeons with NPCs) you have Thancred, Urianger, and Alphinaud for the men (plus a spoilery new guy), and Y'shtola (White/Black Mage), Alisae (Red Mage w/ rapier), and Ryne (Ninja?? No idea if she'll be in future expansions though) for the women. Plus Krile and Tataru as regular supporting characters. Pretty much all of them are treated respectably from what I've seen, with their own motivations, flaws, and personalities. The only real controversial one I can think of is Minfilia.
It expands even more if you count side characters who always have a chance of randomly showing up in the future (Merlwyb, Yugiri, Lyna, Lyse, Jessie, Dulia Chai, and way more besides). Pretty much all of the content, whether it be a raid series or a main quest line, involves a major female character providing input.
Also Lyna should take over Fran to be the iconic Viera of the franchise tbqh
The CG stuff is a shame for sure, though. Especially when I can't imagine "male human caucasian hume" is the most common race from their player data. I guess they figure they're in too deep now to change him out (that and he has vague lore connections, sort of)
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about that...
Oh god not to mention a majority of the garbs in that game look like absolute trash... Even the Dragoon-like armors have her thighs exposed. :'(
Thanks for the response Rotobit.
Fuck SE for those outfits in LR, including that main one. I think there's like a handful that are decent. But small correction, the game didn't release with that pose, but it was at e3 so fuck them for that. And the increased bust size was applied to certain outfit types. But it's still stupid and the fact that it was part of an interview as a highlight was disgusting.
Fuck SE for those outfits in LR, including that main one. I think there's like a handful that are decent. But small correction, the game didn't release with that pose, but it was at e3 so fuck them for that. And the increased bust size was applied to certain outfit types. But it's still stupid and the fact that it was part of an interview as a highlight was disgusting.
I honestly disagree. Don't get me wrong, FFXIV's female representation is decent, and it certainly looks pretty good when compared to a lot of other video games (and especially MMOs, not naming any names at all,) out there, but it could really be improved upon and it's honestly one of my main complaints throughout every single expansion so far.
FFXIV's cast of characters is gigantic, and there's a good amount of female characters in the game, but an overwhelming amount of major story characters are male. Every Ascian is male, every villain from the empire is male except for the one female commander under Gaius whose name I don't remember and who dies immediately, and Yotsuyu who gets killed off while every single male villain surrounding her that's died has gotten resurrected. Heavensward is a complete sausagefest except for Ysayle who's constantly given shit by Estinien and the narrative and then also dies without fanfare or ceremony while Haurchefant get a billion tributes to his death. Shadowbringers is all about the Exarch, Ardbert and Emet-Selch, the one major plot-important female character is Ryne (who I love, who is my precious daughter, who I am standing in the background and cheering on in hopes that she will get together with her goth gamer gf Gaia soon) who's a plot device and constantly accompanied by Thancred's shitty dad behavior. Stormblood is probably the best about this, with Lyse, Yugiri, Yotsuyu with all her caveats, and I guess Fordola who I actually forgot about until halfway through writing this post even though I love her because she is so underutilized in the story. I just personally have a bunch of complaints about Lyse's writing, and I still desperately want to see a female villain who isn't a henchman stepping stone for the real important male villains.
The Scions, the reoccurring party members, are the one group of characters I'd probably compliment in this regard, with the exception of Moenbryda who I probably don't need to explain. But the expansion storylines could be much better. I do love Lyna a lot as well, but I personally wouldn't really advertise her as an important standout female character, she's functionally just the bodyguard of a far more important and story-centric male character.
This post probably comes across as more argumentative than I mean it to be, FFXIV's female representation really is okay, but it still has a lot of room for improvement. Of course, the female representation is also a nonissue compared to other things like FFXIV's bipoc representation, but it's still something that's regularly bothered me. Basically, I'm just saying that there really is a good amount of female characters overall, but the main storyline importance and screentime often goes to male characters, and there are some egregious examples of female characters being sidelined or outright disrespected in the story.
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Yeah I definitely agree with this, I think my viewpoint was a bit rose-tinted because the final updates for Shadowbringers were so solid with those party members and it's been years since I've seen some of the older stuff.
They definitely do need to give the female characters more agency and less reliance on their male counterparts. A new female villain would be a good start because I have to admit the two men we're going into the next expansion with aren't exactly that compelling (well one is more of an enigma but still).
In their mini comic they make fun of the bare sides.Oof, I had no idea about the actual story of the game since I liked the art but yikes. I'll end up skipping it now that I know since it's just super creepy.
Almost a full set of armor lol.
Nael van Darnus was a woman and the main villain of the original Final Fantasy XIV, at least. Though we didn't know that until years later. >_>
After the overall historical importance of female characters in the Final Fantasy series, XV's boys club mentality felt like a slap in the face. I'm willing to give XVI a chance but so far it isn't looking good. On Twitter and elsewhere, a lot of more diverse gamers than I are calling out how not racially diverse the game's trailer is, and that's a huge problem for me too.
I am personally not happy about how XIV treats it's female characters at times(especially compared to it's male characters) so knowing the team is behind XVI and how the trailer ended up being doesn't surprise me or hype me up. Not really expecting much diversity of party members(if there even are any) but I will be glad to eat crow. I expect the shiva lady to sacrifice herself in some way already.
Agree 100% with this post. Ysayle really exemplifies the preferential treatment a male character would get even if he is less important in the story.
Agree 100% with this post. Ysayle really exemplifies the preferential treatment a male character would get even if he is less important in the story.
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Well. Feeling pretty good about not playing through all those games in the end.
Hehehe, this amuses me almost enough to forgive that design. Sigh.
The one item I wish GBF would that Djeeta would actually age and change her default clothing.
Yeah, it coming close to the Ash from pokemon scenario. The game has passage of time with characters growing and developing.
This is disappointing to read. I've been planning to give XIV a second shot, now that A Realm Reborn is less of a slog.
If you were interested in giving it a shot and putting in the time, I still wouldn't discourage you fully from trying the game out and deciding what you think for yourself, but it is a huge commitment on many levels so it's also completely understandable if you don't feel like it. The game's going to continue to be around for a while yet though, so you can always sit this one out for now and if future storylines end up improving in this regard then you can check it out at a later point. Personally, the issue isn't at the level of being a complete dealbreaker for me so far, but I'm not optimistic about this improving in future expansions. I'd be happy to end up being proven wrong down the line though.
I still say if FFXIV interests you even a little it's much better than a lot of current JRPG esp since technically you can play as FeMC. For example, you eventually meet Alisae Leveilleur is an awesome female character who has her own motivations and goals apart from her twin brother.
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remember when luna was textbook fridged. like remember that. they rly did that in a game released in 2016
XV was always going to be fucked in regards to the role of women since Nomura was originally in charge. That man, without help, does not know how to integrate girls and women into his games.
Just incase, we had an old thread about XV/Versus on the old site where we got some details about old Stella in Versus
Stella was a ghost that only Noctis could see and talk to, she had dead as Noctis killed her as a child and that drives her brothers hatred of Noctis
Stella would push Noctis through out the three games and the would reunite in the afterlife at the end of the third game
Stella would push Noctis through out the three games and the would reunite in the afterlife at the end of the third game
Thoughts on the Monster Hunter Rise Deluxe Edition bonus outfit differences? While her toes will get closed and she clearly has on shorter bottoms, it could be worse:
But it could be better. Like this is how far they can cover ladies? Still better than worlds.
Woman's covered in what I assume is a winter coat since she's got a few layers on her torso and the male is bundled up, but she still can't get any pants, she's wearing battle sandals, and they apparently ran out of undershirts for her.
This one gets me more than a fair amount of examples in this thread because it comes across as them wanting so hard to remove something but we have to keepitsensibleohgodtoesmaybe?!
This one gets me more than a fair amount of examples in this thread because it comes across as them wanting so hard to remove something but we have to keepitsensibleohgodtoesmaybe?!
Long time lurker, but I wanted to post my feelings about this. I always post about in XV threads about how badly the female characters are done in XV. I remember reading an article pre-release where Tabata said Luna would be "a stronger and more determined female character, who actively engages with the events in the story" and that she would "be presented as a very strong-willed character: she talks to people about her hopes and dreams and she acts on her own initiative, really playing a big part in the story. "
Final Fantasy XV Director Responds to Criticism for Stella's Removal; Explains Why Luna Was Chosen
The news of the removal of former heroine Stella from Final Fantasy XV has pro proven pretty polarizing, with many criticizing the choice. Today, during a
www.dualshockers.com
I just can't get over that, back when XV came out, I really did feel like I got lied to. I get that XV was a mess of a game, that Versus XIII would probably have messed up too (if those leaks are true, but anyway it isn't like Nomura has a good track record with female characters) and that Tabata probably did want to do better but couldn't, but I just can't get over how badly Luna was done. Here's this article from two years later where he says he wanted to depict her strongly in the DLC which got cancelled:
Final Fantasy 15's female hero deserves the spotlight, says director
The game could use a less dude-heavy installment
www.polygon.com
Honestly, FFXVI would have to mess up bad to get on the level of XV, but I won't be happy with just a small improvement. There should be a female co-protagonist. Female party members is the minimum. Yesterday, between XVI not having that, and DMCV not having Lady and Trish playable, I was pretty disappointed.
Some day, a monster hunter female armor set will have the thighs entirely covered. Some day.
I'm assuming they'll be revealed later, along with other prominent characters in general. The reveal trailer barely showed anyone of importance beyond the male lead and his childhood friend turned villain.
I like that the bulk of it is OK, but it's so frustrating to see the usual templated stuff slip in when differentiating it.
His stance is relaxed, hers is a forced one that looks less comfortable (feet together, pointed forward to look smaller).
His face guard protects his cheeks, hers doesn't.
His trousers look baggy and comfortable for being outdoors, hers are designed to be evocative of clingy stockings.
Bright red thigh band, to draw the eye and be evocative of that dumb zetta whatever thing.
His greaves cover his whole lower leg with armoured knees too, hers are more like tiny shinguards for sports so it doesn't break up the outline of her legs/stockings.
Her outfit shows neck, forearms, toes- nothing wrong with that in isolation but why is it always the female variant wearing less stuff.
I love MonHun and this could have been so much worse, but the whole 'the difference between a male and a female armour set is in 'how many of the dumb sexualised outfit tropes it uses', 'how can we show more skin' and 'how do we move closer to the shitty template while still being fully armoured' is something I hoped they'd moved past. It's an improvement over some of the worse variants in the past where it was literally fantasy platemail vs combat lingerie though.
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Maybe, but I wouldn't put anything past Square "but it's weird having a man heal another man!" Enix.
Honestly, the most tiresome part of Final Fantasy XIV is how it handles gear. Like the Neo-Ishdardian set, which is straight bullshit.
Like, I love the shit out of this game, but I'm 90% sure that if you were ask them why they do things like the Neo-Ishgardian gear, why generally they replace pants with skirts or wee shorts, they'd say "Well... Girls want to be cute, right?"
Like, I love the shit out of this game, but I'm 90% sure that if you were ask them why they do things like the Neo-Ishgardian gear, why generally they replace pants with skirts or wee shorts, they'd say "Well... Girls want to be cute, right?"
I'm conflicted since Neo-Ishdardian set is a contest design winner so the devs can only deviate from it so much w/respect to the original artist.
It's one of the reasons I switched to catboy in FFXIV since the huge lack of nice long pants in armor sets made me sad.
Iris and Luna aren't really bad character designs, arguably quite the opposite given how everything you need to know about them is shown in the design and they aren't objectified like the other two. The writing though, indefensible, you got a girl with all the incredibly cringe worthy mannerisms of an anime character in a "fantasy based on reality" where the team made an active effort to make the characters feel more real and naturalistic and then a character who doesn't d much of anything besides cling to the memory of a person she met one time. And then we didn't even get to see timeskip Iris where she's apparently received legendary status as a monster slayer.
Here is hoping the new FF is actually smart about it and doesn't destroy their female characters. The darker gritty tone and more realistic look they got going is great and I am really hyped for it if that's how the whole game will be.
It sucks they didn't make the main character a woman though.
It sucks they didn't make the main character a woman though.
Was catching up with the thread and I'd also recommend the Life is Strange comics. They are also a Bae ending story that goes into the ideas of the multiverse.
Life is Strange (Comic Series)
Life is Strange is an officially licensed, comic book series based on the video game of the same name, Life is Strange. It is published by Titan Comics and was initially launched on November 14, 2018. Originally a four-part miniseries, it is now comprised of twenty three issues and five...
life-is-strange.fandom.com
You just reminded me of how mad I was that we never got to see badass slayer Iris. Just a casual throwaway line about how cool she apparently is now. *pout*
Overall I though XV was just really bad at doing the "show don't tell" thing, sometimes because they wanted you to engage with the tons of supplementary material but some stuff like what the side characters were doing post timeskip or Ravus
having his heel face turn and bursting into a bunch of expository notes when he died
Was catching up with the thread and I'd also recommend the Life is Strange comics. They are also a Bae ending story that goes into the ideas of the multiverse.
Life is Strange (Comic Series)
Life is Strange is an officially licensed, comic book series based on the video game of the same name, Life is Strange. It is published by Titan Comics and was initially launched on November 14, 2018. Originally a four-part miniseries, it is now comprised of twenty three issues and five...
Cool, thanks so much for the recommendation. I'll check these out. I really loved these characters when I first played the game, and it is fun to see them still being used.
Yeah that is incredibly disappointing. Only FF6 and 13 had a main character as a woman. Well, if you dont count FFX spin offs.
What timing
In a recent game I'm playing, BPM Bullets Per Minute, a FPS roguelike that has you shooting at a beat. It not perfect but generally fun.
There 2 female characters IO can identify and both are in full armor.
What timing
In a recent game I'm playing, BPM Bullets Per Minute, a FPS roguelike that has you shooting at a beat. It not perfect but generally fun.
There 2 female characters IO can identify and both are in full armor.
The weird washed out smear textures look so bad. Does it look better in motion at least?
Anyway, the actual character designs are neat, I like a good battle angel.
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by the way this is only tangentially related to anything but i highly recommend the shinigami eyes extension. it highlights both trans-friendly and transphobic links (e.g. the link to jk terfling's twitter will be in red whereas the link to jim sterling's youtube channel is green) and it's a gr8 way to make sure you're not sourcing or boosting transphobes
i posted a version of this in the suikoden community thread but i figure folks here might also have opinions on it: i think suikoden was generally regarded as having good character designs for its female characters (or at least a large enough variety of characters that folks can point out ones they think are good), but Suikoden 5 feels way hornier than the previous games. also for it to take place in a Queendom, it's a little strange how every town is led by a man (except for rafleet), and all the nobles we meet are men?
To quote Wikipedia:
Is there a JRPG that didn't turn to shite over the course of the PS2 generation?!
Suikoden 5 yeah I could see being quite a bit hornier compared to the previous games, but the previous games are so low on horny (really, just Jeane) that S5 just stands out even though it's still relatively low on horniness compared to even other JRPGs of its generation.
The "fanservice-y" designs in 5 are really just contained to Sialeeds, Jeane and Kisara's designs, which out of 108 recruitable characters is pretty low.
Also some of the designs are really cool in that one. The queen is ornate as hell. The writing for her isn't great (the rune makes her InSaNe)
The "fanservice-y" designs in 5 are really just contained to Sialeeds, Jeane and Kisara's designs, which out of 108 recruitable characters is pretty low.
Also some of the designs are really cool in that one. The queen is ornate as hell. The writing for her isn't great (the rune makes her InSaNe)
and isabel (who doesn't wear pants with her armor and has a comment box letter about how it's easy to move around in) and zerase.
but really it's not just the character designs, it's a lot of the dialogue and interactions that are off putting as well - from euram barows being obsessed with the 11 yo princess, to the 35 yo mercenary who keeps talking about how hot lyon is, to just generally a lot of the NPC chatter, it's just really noticeable how different it feels from past games - and again, i think part of the disconnect for me is the setting of the Queendom seems like it would involve women in general being better respected both in terms of like having leadership positions and not having npcs constantly commenting on how attractive they are.
(perhaps part of it is also that there's so much dialogue in suikoden 5 compared to previous games, so instead of being like "oh well this isn't really ideal but they're painting with broad strokes because they don't have a lot of time to develop these characters" it's like "oh they're really tripling down on this, huh")
Hey y'all! I'm not a regular to this thread, but my girlfriend is doing a project for one of her courses, and she chose to do it about the effects of societal expectations on women. She has a survey to get input on what effects people have seen or gone through, and I was wondering if anyone in this thread would be open to taking the survey and sharing their experiences? It seems like if any thread on this forum would have the most conductive responses it'd be this one!
(also I'm sorry if this is against the rules or something, just let me know and I'll stop mentioning it!)
(also the survey is open to all genders!)
(also I'm sorry if this is against the rules or something, just let me know and I'll stop mentioning it!)
(also the survey is open to all genders!)
I admit it's been a while since I played it. I don't even remember Isabel.
Suikoden 5 is really good in a few ways, but it's got problems. Writing, pacing, some of the designs.
Suikoden in general was always much better than other JRPGs, but it's not perfect.
I'm really excited for Eiyuden