Why women criticise sexualised character designs | OT3 | "make her look more...corpulent, more stuffed where the eyes can't escape."

[Timu]

The last main DOA game had shit like this:

Spoiler: NSFW

]

So it's not really surprising that their soft porn game is constantly trying to out do itself.

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I still can't get over

Spoiler

Marie Rose

Like I said in the previous thread, I'm a fan of the series but mainly for the gameplay in their fighting games.

 

[Toxi]

Also I was wanting some opinions and advice, I'm doing a mini fan project for myself that's an idea for horror themed 3D fighting and was coming up with character ideas for characters based on the classic monsters and was wanting some advice on how to handle the Vampire and the Mummy design wise and their lore.

My basic summaries are:

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They both seem great. My immediate gut reaction is that the vampire is more of a "creepy" character while the mummy is more of a "cool" character, so I like how they hit different archetypes.

Not sure if you want any creative input, but for the owl vampire, you gotta have the Exorcist-style neck rotation. Real owls have their eyeballs fixed forward in their skull and can't move them in any other direction; they evolved the ability to rotate their necks 270 degrees to compensate. So if she has owl eyes, it's only fair to give her that feature. It's also creepy as hell.

 

[RecLib]

Isn't DoA also one of those games that is guilty of having clearly underage characters, listed as underage in japan, and just changing their age in the us release?

 

[Timu]

Isn't DoA also one of those games that is guilty of having clearly underage characters, listed as underage in japan, and just changing their age in the us release?

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Probably, Marie Rose is said to be 17 years old yet many people don't think she is that age.

 

[Nimby]

Kasumi and Ayane had their ages listed as N/A in DOA2 in the North American release. They were 16 in Japan.

 

[HockeyBird]

Isn't DoA also one of those games that is guilty of having clearly underage characters, listed as underage in japan, and just changing their age in the us release?

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I believe in the earlier games some of the cast were underage. So for the Western releases, their ages were removed from the game as loophole to be able to release the games.

 

[plagiarize]

I haven't looked at DOAX crap in years. I thought the 1000 year old ogre thing was a joke. I should have known better.

 

[Conditional-Pancakes]

Isn't DoA also one of those games that is guilty of having clearly underage characters, listed as underage in japan, and just changing their age in the us release?

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Probably, Marie Rose is said to be 17 years old yet many people don't think she is that age.

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Kasumi and Ayane had their ages listed as N/A in DOA2 in the North American release. They were 16 in Japan.

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I believe in the earlier games some of the cast were underage. So for the Western releases, their ages were removed from the game as loophole to be able to release the games.

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Oh no!! No wonder the new trailer for that Dead or Alive Venus Vacation porn game gives such predatory vibes... Disgusting!

 

[Shining Star]

Isn't DoA also one of those games that is guilty of having clearly underage characters, listed as underage in japan, and just changing their age in the us release?

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Oh yes, 100% they just change the ages here. I'm pretty sure I've seen other things do this too.

 

[HockeyBird]

My only memory of the DOA volleyball series was with the first game on Xbox. I was like 13 or 14 at the time. My friend rented it and I just so happen to have an April Issue of EGM magazine that told of a way to unlock topless mode in the game. My friend really wanted to unlock it. It was an April Fools joke but I didn't know this was a thing the magazine did at the time. I remember sitting their for hours watching my friend desperately try to unlock the mode. He was pretty frustrated. It was funny then and still funny now.

 

[SemRockwel]

For DoA I don't think it matters much what they localize the ages to be. A number of the girls are clearly depicted as being underage, and a localization cant change that. The series is just a total creep-fest.

 

[Fat4all]

when i think of DoA extreme beach vobblybob the first thing that pops into my head is this

 

[RedHoodedOwl]

when i think of DoA extreme beach vobblybob the first thing that pops into my head is this

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You forgot about the Outlaw Sports series.

 

[Dary]

You forgot about the Outlaw Sports series.

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It's sad when you know people in their thirties who would still consider that some kind of "life goal".

 

[Manu]

You forgot about the Outlaw Sports series.

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"Tits & Tats Volleyball" was probably a bit too on the nose.

 

[HockeyBird]

When people say they miss AA game development, they are probably forgetting some of the stuff that came along with it. Early 2000s game releases were sure something.

 

[Common Knowledge]

when i think of DoA extreme beach vobblybob the first thing that pops into my head is this

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And to think at least one of those can probably get you on a list if you own it now.

 

[RedHoodedOwl]

I forgot about this masterpiece from 2004.

 

[Fat4all]

And to think at least one of those can probably get you on a list if you own it now.

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one at the very least

 

[RedHoodedOwl]

Wasn't there some controversy revolving around the Guy Game?

 

[Timu]

Wasn't there some controversy revolving around the Guy Game?

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Yep, it had an underage girl in it.

 

[Princess Bubblegum]

• women & women-aligned ppl (henceforth referred to as women for brevity) are sick and tired of being treated like sacks of meat for the consumption of the cishet male gaze
• this thread is a safe space for discussion and venting by and for women. non-women ARE allowed to participate but only if they behave themselves. bullshit WILL be actioned by mods.
• despite the title (which is a holdover from the original) this is a thread for feminist discussion of all aspects of video games, not just character designs

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Loving these additions to the OP. Good job Persephone.

 

[Flannel_and_Assam]

Yeah, what I'm thinking of is the worst case scenario where developers are looking to bring in more ethnic groups but doing it that still panders to the male gaze audience.

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I can think of more than a few Native American characters that fit that mould, sadly.

When people say they miss AA game development, they are probably forgetting some of the stuff that came along with it. Early 2000s game releases were sure something.

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Who could forget games media too, like IGN with their "Videogame Babe of the Day" column. Thankfully such puerile nonsense stopped in uhh... 2010.

 

[Choppasmith]

Congrats on reaching OT3! Not much else to say, looking forward to continuing to enjoy the ride from the back seat and maybe learn some new things.

 

[KujoJosuke]

Eiyuden has voting up in the last days of the kickstarter for the design of a female ninja character.

Reactions are fairly mixed with most of the people in the Eiyuden thread not liking A, and preferring either B or D.

I voted for B just because she's pretty close to the Suikoden 2 ninja style. I liked C as a backup because she just looks mean.

edit:

Lol gotcha
V

 

[Sesha]

Quasi-related to this topic, Eiyuden is doing a poll for the last Eiyuden character, a female ninja:

Edit: Beaten, lol

 

[Kinsei]

Quasi-related to this topic, Eiyuden is doing a poll for the last Eiyuden character, a female ninja:

Edit: Beaten, lol

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Just a heads up, you're sharing a link that lets other people change your vote.

 

[Caeda]

Ugh, seeing all this DoA beach volleyball stuff reminds me how the university I used to go to would have it out to play on a massive tv during the video game society meetings. Mad grody. Didn't help that one of the people who was very loud there wore one of those god awful hentai hoodies all over the place and constantly was going on about how 2d waifus are better than a real human woman could ever be. Gross.

I so desperately want to bang the sexy Qunari lady in DA4 and if she is not gay I will die and make them put Bioware as my cause of death.

But also BIOWARE ARTIST FUCKING PLEASE. DON'T BE THIS WAY.

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this art is how I look when I'm running in fear far, far away from any spiders that have decided to come take up residence on the couch with me. a desperate asstempt to flee while not falling on my face.

fr though she looks like she's about to fall flat on her face. not very assassin of her.

 

[Sesha]

Just a heads up, you're sharing a link that lets other people change your vote.

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Im a dum dum. Thanks. Looks like someone used the opportunity to change my vote to option D.

 

[Yu Narukami]

Persephone you have a great sense of humour, thank you. Your OP made me laugh a few times here at the office where I'm completely alone.

 

[Oinone]

Eiyuden has voting up in the last days of the kickstarter for the design of a female ninja character.

Reactions are fairly mixed with most of the people in the Eiyuden thread not liking A, and preferring either B or D.

I voted for B just because she's pretty close to the Suikoden 2 ninja style. I liked C as a backup because she just looks mean.

edit:

Lol gotcha
V

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Is it just a coincidence that D seems to have the biggest breasts? lol

 

[pronk]

Holy shit is there a link to that quote from the title? Some people...

It really bugs me when people use that "just being prudish" bullshit mentioned in the OP, or the whole "I like looking at it why do you want to take it away from me" attitude.

 

[ImaPlayThis]

Why is it that Japanese culture, specifically anime, seems to have such a massive problem with misogyny in so many forms? I recently watched a Pop Culture Detective episode that mentions it and it makes you realize how creepy so much anime stuff is.

I honestly think that's the biggest reason I don't like anime much.

EDIT: Mentioned earlier in the thread, this is what I'm talking about: https://www.siliconera.com/dead-or-alive-xtreme-venus-vacation-introduces-the-otaku-girl-tsukushi/

The sexuality of so many women in anime is so often related to child-like attributes that it is beyond disturbing.

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Specifically regarding your last point, the child-like attributes becoming a key factor for female sexuality in anime. It is 100% because child pornography in Japan was made illegal so recently and distribution and selling is still an issue that they're trying to tackle, to the point softcore child model stuff is still easily obtainable there.

Basically since then more and more lolis and moe characters have entered anime, with a groundswell in the last 10 years since anime is so easy to make now than before. Either by accident or choice many anime cater to these predatory nonces either by pandering physically to their desires in the case of loli or psychologically in the case of moe (from all I've seen all moe is are literal 8 year olds transplanted into late teens or adults).

Unfortunately this issue might not be going away for ages, as pretty much every anime is designed from the start to have a moe waifu character and enough idiots will defend it behind "it's not real it's just a cartoon" or "it's their creative vision" BS while not understanding what they are actually defending, the sexualisation of infantilism of women and girls

 

[caff!!!]

On that subject of such moe, born sexy yesterday seems to be the fun rest of the world spin on the same concept

 

[Lycanthrope -R-]

Isn't DoA also one of those games that is guilty of having clearly underage characters, listed as underage in japan, and just changing their age in the us release?

Click to shrink...

Probably, Marie Rose is said to be 17 years old yet many people don't think she is that age.

Click to shrink...

Kasumi and Ayane had their ages listed as N/A in DOA2 in the North American release. They were 16 in Japan.

Click to shrink...

I believe in the earlier games some of the cast were underage. So for the Western releases, their ages were removed from the game as loophole to be able to release the games.

Click to shrink...

Oh no!! No wonder the new trailer for that Dead or Alive Venus Vacation porn game gives such predatory vibes... Disgusting!

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I feel like some clarification is needed here, because getting details wrong leaves too much room for bad faith actors to blow everything up.

In DOA1-4, and DOAX1-2, the youngest character(s) were 16, Ayane being one of them (Eliot being the other, first introduced in DOA4). The main character, Kasumi was 17 (as well as one other DOA4 character, Kokoro). In America, these ages were switched to "N/A" for obvious reasons.

From DOA5 onward, I guess from 8-ish years ago now, following dealing with a number of issues related to the above, the series went through a two-year time skip, making the youngest characters in the game 18. Marie Rose is also 18 (though few really buy that). And no one has been added to the games under 18 since. And at this point in time, there are no age discrepancies among regions.

I can't speak to all of how this Venus Vacation game works. But from what I've heard, it's a gacha freemium game that differs from the other DOAX games. The DOAX games have actually sport gameplay, while this Venus Vacation game is pretty much just unlocking swimsuits and smut cutscenes, I think. Or it's just like a dating sim, I guess? It's Asia/Japan only, because you know. Clearly Western games media has some...thoughts...about DOA and especially DOAX. I don't know why they'd think this would free them from scrutiny, but okay.

This DOAXVV game also added a monster girl character who looks pretty damn young and is stated to be 1014-years-old. And it's easy to allege that they were going for a 14-year-old under the table. So...yeah. This is where we're at.

 

[MasaDrew]

I love checking on this thread daily. In some ways it helps me gain perspective on my own character designs as an artist, not only for looks but to avoid cliches like refrigerator woman as well.

As a gay man sometimes I get oblivious to male gaze stuff. Like with Nier Automata I'm just fully engrossed in "floaty sword go brrrr" but that doesn't mean the issue isn't there. I hope in the future I can incorporate more creative designs and ideas into my own work so that it can be enjoyable by all.

One of the major times I had to stop playing a game due to something like that was Yakuza 6, a series that is labelled by its creator as by men, for men. The internet cafe made me yikes so hard it turned me off to the entire experience.

 

[Teriyaki Blues]

Another excellent OP, I really enjoy seeing the evolution.

As always, here to mostly lurk, read, and cringe (mainly about character design).

 

[Godfather]

Haha, great thread subtitle, i remember seeing that stated here multiple times.



Oh this one is a classic, there must have been hundreds of variations on this in the earlier threads.



What even is that game at this point.

Big o'l yikes.

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Am I crazy for thinking this is close to being a good design? Waist up, it's not a bad look overall. If she just had some pants, or leggings, or a reasonable skirt, if would be a stylish look without being too over the top.

I've just started playing No Straight Roads and I'm loving the artwork, particularly the character designs. I thought the lead character Mayday was worth sharing:

She's a bit bonkers, but she takes no shit. I like her a lot.

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This looks a bit like it could be a Gorillaz video. I like the style a lot.

 

[pizzabutt]

Am I crazy for thinking this is close to being a good design? Waist up, it's not a bad look overall. If she just had some pants, or leggings, or a reasonable skirt, if would be a stylish look without being too over the top.

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Yeah she just needs some capris and it would be good. I like the art bag, but the pens strapped to her thigh look weird.

 

[Timu]

Marie Rose is also 18 (though few really buy that).

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That makes it worse because she is considered legal even though people say she looks like a 12 year old!!!

 

[RPG_Fanatic]

There will be so many Balloon Breasts mods.

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I now wish someone would take this statement literally and make a mod that give the girls literal balloons on their chest that cause them to float into the sky.

 

[Princess Bubblegum]

But also BIOWARE ARTIST FUCKING PLEASE. DON'T BE THIS WAY.

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The good ol' ass and titty pose.

 

[Richter1887]

Just saw we got a new thread. Mighty fine work Persephone !

I love it

 

[Conditional-Pancakes]

Note to self: I must stop clicking on Anime/Manga threads. There's a new one that popped up about what is best between anime and manga for emotional moments.

In the first reply there's a clip of some anime with a girl in tears (wearing a very short dress with a plunging neckline) slapping another character (while apologizing, of course...) The first line of dialogue after that is a male character screaming: "Oh! A bitchy girl! How hot!"

And it's supposed to be a super emotional "gut punch" moment.

-_-

 

[ClickyCal']

Note to self: I must stop clicking on Anime/Manga threads. There's a new one that popped up about what is best between anime and manga for emotional moments.

In the first reply there's a clip of some anime with a girl in tears (wearing a very short dress with a plunging neckline) slapping another character (while apologizing, of course...) The first line of dialogue after that is a male character screaming: "Oh! A bitchy girl! How hot!"

And it's supposed to be a super emotional "gut punch" moment.

-_-

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Nami from one piece, she infamously has one of the worst downgrades ever for a design, going from a cool and normal design to pure waifu bait.

 

[Richter1887]

Time to bring back this gem again:

 

[ClickyCal']

How can anyone take this show seriously?

 

[KrillinLikeAVillan]

Am I crazy for thinking this is close to being a good design? Waist up, it's not a bad look overall. If she just had some pants, or leggings, or a reasonable skirt, if would be a stylish look without being too over the top.

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My issue with her is not so much her design, it has more to do with that she looks like she is about to get assaulted in that picture.

 

[Metalsnakezero]

Note to self: I must stop clicking on Anime/Manga threads. There's a new one that popped up about what is best between anime and manga for emotional moments.

In the first reply there's a clip of some anime with a girl in tears (wearing a very short dress with a plunging neckline) slapping another character (while apologizing, of course...) The first line of dialogue after that is a male character screaming: "Oh! A bitchy girl! How hot!"

And it's supposed to be a super emotional "gut punch" moment.

-_-

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That a sad way of starting a thread that has reasonable meaning between media.

 

[Richter1887]

How can anyone take this show seriously?

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Went from a good stylish design to an hourglass shaped sex doll.

Really disappointing.