I have seen and very much enjoyed this, but never saw dances with wolves, how similar are they in terms of broad story strokes? If I enjoyed one will I likely enjoy the other?
Same. You can like the movie while acknowledging it is what it is, it's fine, you won't melt.Majorly historically inaccurate? Check.
White guy learns the ways of foreign culture at lightning-fast speed? Check.
Said culture is progressively destroyed by western civilization as enlightened white guy sadly looks on? Check.
Yes, it's Dances with Wolves in Japan...
...
... But, dang it, I really like the film still. Beautiful shots, amazing soundtrack, great performances. As a MOVIE, it's great.
Those "savages" were shown to be much more graceful and civilised then that drunken, dishonourable unrefined white man.White dude arrives and learns in mere minutes the way of the Samurai where natives are trained in since childhood?
White savior film trope.
Even if it's a damned good white savior film, there is little that shrieks colonizer more than Tom Cruise moving in with the widow of the first man he kills.
Saw this in the theater during a snowstorm while I was working in the mall. Perfect. Cherry. Blossom.
This is a good thread about it.
Yeah - the Samurai have a romanicized version like the Amercian Cowboys and the European Knights - all three weren't really heroes or good pepole. Cowboys were mercenaries and criminals and Knight/Samurais were soliders who were told to kill and they did soThe samurai were essentially Make Japan Great Again clowns who hid in their compound and complained about the system being changed so that others could have rights. I'm not saying the film is bad but the politics are blinkered.
I just watched this over the past weekend...
Seems like the OP didn't understand that the title of the movie is not singular and does not refer to Tom Cruise.
While I agree that the ending is a little too good to be true, there's a wrinkle in it If you were paying attention, the ending is likely not what was literally shown in the final moments, the narrator basically prefaces that scene with "I hope this happened"Same. You can like the movie while acknowledging it is what it is, it's fine, you won't melt.
That said, the only major issue I have with the movie is like, the last 10 minutes. It just gets too Hollywood. EVERYONE dies except Tom Cruise? Then Tom Cruise has to be the one to pass on the ways of the Samurai to the Emperor? THEN HE GOES BACK TO THE VILLAGE TO MOVE IN WITH THE WIFE OF THE DUDE HE KILLED?! Come onnnn.
Other than that I love the movie.
As for the American Captain, no one knows what became of him. Some say that he died of his wounds. Others, that he returned to his own country. But I like to think he may have at last found some small measure of peace, that we all seek, and few of us ever find.
I haven't seen every tom cruise movie in the last ten years, but it feels like he'll only do a movie if the ending wraps up like a generic hollywood movie would.Same. You can like the movie while acknowledging it is what it is, it's fine, you won't melt.
That said, the only major issue I have with the movie is like, the last 10 minutes. It just gets too Hollywood. EVERYONE dies except Tom Cruise? Then Tom Cruise has to be the one to pass on the ways of the Samurai to the Emperor? THEN HE GOES BACK TO THE VILLAGE TO MOVE IN WITH THE WIFE OF THE DUDE HE KILLED?! Come onnnn.
Other than that I love the movie.
Seems like the OP didn't understand that the title of the movie is not singular and does not refer to Tom Cruise.
While I agree that the ending is a little too good to be true, there's a wrinkle in it If you were paying attention, the ending is likely not what was literally shown in the final moments, the narrator basically prefaces that scene with "I hope this happened"
Edit:
So you're into conservatism?I know, white savior, all that, etc. etc.
But the themes of the movie is that the new ages erases the old, and it fucking sucks. The ending suuuuucks and is very sad.
This movie sucks for alotta reasons. The biggest is that the modern age erases the past.
To be fair, he is a great warrior already. Fighting is more will and instinct than mechanical skill. But indeed they way over did it, the one fight in town is particularly ridiculous and the weird mysticism/seeing the future thing was silly.Well, the plot of the movie is that some Westerner shows up in a society where people have been training as warriors from birth, and after a few months he is one of the best katana fighters there, and is repelling a ninja attack to save the village.
We can quibble over whether it fulfills all of the aspects of the white savior trope, but it clearly has the element of "white guy quickly outclasses natives in their own culture."
LolCuz Ken Watanabe and Tom Cruise had good chemistry.
They are all perfect, OP.
🥺😢😭
Yes! He is amazing!i just wanna say i love this actor right here, he needs to be in so many more things
Hiroyuki Sanada
He's playing Scorpion in the MK movie reboot and I'm very excited.i just wanna say i love this actor right here, he needs to be in so many more things
Hiroyuki Sanada
So, as a movie, I'm a fan of it.
But the ending was always a big problem to me, because in reality Japan modernizing while still maintaining elements of the Samurai ethos and principles heloped lead to...genocidal war and death on an incredible scale. The ultra nationalism and abject brutality of Japan and Japanese soldiers from ~1890-1945 can be traced directly back to this line of thinking.
Like, no Tom Cruise, don't encourage the emperor maintain the old ways. The oppressive system the nobles want to maintain (which is what the rebellion was about, keeping power in an entrenched militaristic noble class) needs to end.
I'm mainly seeing people disagreeing with the specific idea that it's a white savior movie, not with the larger issue of films centering white protagonists in stories about Asia (I don't see a bunch of people disagreeing that that's an issue).Gotta love how every one of these threads turns into a bunch of people dismissing the experiences of Asians and the Asian diaspora being fed up with Hollywood films centering white protagonists in stories about Asia. Fragility, fragility, everywhere.
Well no, of course not, and I don't think that's what the film depicts (he just delivers Katsumoto's message to the Emperor at the end).Yeah, but we don't need Tom Cruise to be making that decision for Japan in the first place.
I'm mainly seeing people disagreeing with the specific idea that it's a white savior movie, not with the larger issue of films centering white protagonists in stories about Asia (I don't see a bunch of people disagreeing that that's an issue).
White dude arrives and learns in mere minutes the way of the Samurai where natives are trained in since childhood?
I'm not sure if you're saying the experience of Asian people towards the film were dismissed or not. The reception of the film in Japan at the time was actually quite positive.Gotta love how every one of these threads turns into a bunch of people dismissing the experiences of Asians and the Asian diaspora being fed up with Hollywood films centering white protagonists in stories about Asia. Fragility, fragility, everywhere.
My honest answer is no, because it feels like it's basically a disagreement about a specific definition, not about whether it's a problem in general that Tom Cruise had to be the lead for the movie to be made (it's totally a problem). At the same time, the fact that you're telling me that it feels dismissive should at least prompt me to change up how I respond to this kind of thing (I need to think about this more).And you don't see how quibbling over how "it's not really a white savior movie" is disrespectful and dismissive of the concerns people bring up?
Yeah, you're totally right about that. Hell, the final scene of the movie bothered my teenage self in the theater before I was even explicitly aware of the dynamics. Purely in terms of tropes, though (and maybe I'm a nerd about this), it's a case of mighty whitey, just like you said (as opposed to white savior).Besides, it's straight up disingenuous to pretend it's not heavy shades of mighty whitey when the film is literally about Tom Cruise becoming an uber samurai and top confidante to Katsumoto, shacking up with the wife of the guy he killed, and becoming the representative of the samurai legacy to the emperor, thereby changing the course of Japanese history.
I'm sure there are some (many?) that fit that description -- I do think for others (at least for me) it's not about absolving the movie of its issues, but rather about accurately describing its issues.The fact that he doesn't literally save all the samurai from death doesn't absolve the film of its tone-deafness, and the fact people are so reticent to admit that speaks volumes about them.
I'm not sure if you're saying the experience of Asian people towards the film were dismissed or not. The reception of the film in Japan at the time was actually quite positive.
Ah, thanks for clarifying. I'm from Japan myself so I'm often just used to the "Japan hates what America did" talk, even when that's not the case at all.He is talking about the Asian people that agree with him, not the ones who don't.
Ah, thanks for clarifying. I'm from Japan myself so I'm often just used to the "Japan hates what America did" talk, even when that's not the case at all.
(Yeah, we DID like the Ghost in the Shell movie Hollywood made, even with ScarJo as the lead).
I'm not sure if you're saying the experience of Asian people towards the film were dismissed or not. The reception of the film in Japan at the time was actually quite positive.
Yeah, Tom didn't save shit in this movie. He just got to watch them die and carry their last memories and message with him.
I believe they are more referring to the Asian-American experience, who are often made to feel like they can never be the stars of American-made films about Asians.
He is talking about the Asian people that agree with him, not the ones who don't.
I was being sarcastic, sorry if it wasn't clear. He obviously doesn't care unless they agree with him.
While I disagreed originally with what wandering shared, I don't understand your reactions here... you seem quick to judge and you're stepping in to reply to others who weren't talking with you to denigrate wandering.No, he's not. He is using "Asians" as a cudgel to fight strawmen.
While I disagreed originally with what wandering shared, I don't understand your reactions here... you seem quick to judge and you're stepping in to reply to others who weren't talking with you to denigrate wandering.
The person you're referring to is an Asian America.No, he's not. He is using "Asians" as a cudgel to fight strawmen.