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Why don't vegans recommend a 80% plant based diet?

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Anthony Hopkins

Anthony Hopkins

Banned
Feb 10, 2018
17,534
No ice cream, no steak, no beef burger, no BBQ ribs, no chocolate, no fish etc etc

For the rest of your life!

This is what a lot of vegans recommend.

This scares most people, because who wants to have a life where they can not sometimes enjoy animal products?

The 100% vegan mentality puts also a huge amount of anxiety on people who may feel like they have "failed" if they eat some animal product.

So rather then trying to sell the idea of 100% plant based diet wouldn't it be better to try and get people to chose plant based meals?

I think this all or nothing mentality leads people to ditching veganisum and returning the diet they ate before.

Also all the studies are vegan diet vs standard American diet, a diet rich in fruits and vegetables+ some high quality animal products are very rare.

So if vegans want less animals being killed and more healthy people wouldn't the more easily persuadable idea of a 80% plant based be better because more ppl would do it? and therefore less animals would be killed and more people would be healthier.

I think a lot of vegans mean well but the psychology some of them are using is imo the wrong way to get more people to eat more plants and less animal products.
 
Ploppee

Ploppee

Member
Nov 28, 2018
1,040
they're chewy

(sorry for a serious response, I think you're generalising a bit too much there. having been vegan for over 4 years and knowing a lot of vegans we all support diets that people feel comfortable with, it's about trying new things. there are some amazing vegetarian and vegan foods out there so why not try them? Most people who spout the 'i have to have meat with every meal' just need to know what else is out there and just give it a go.)
 
higemaru

higemaru

Member
Nov 30, 2017
4,104
pant based diet

I think most vegans are more in favor of cutting down on animal-based product consumption than outright replacing people's diets, but a small, vocal segment gets boosted and ridiculed because they're the most extreme.
 

Raccoon

Member
May 31, 2019
15,896
You're basing this thread on anecdotal perception. Many, indeed I would say most, vegans advocate for everyone reducing animal product consumption as much as possible.
 
shnurgleton

shnurgleton

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,864
Boston
Partial veggie is in vogue right now. The mainstreaming of meat alternatives like Impossible and Beyond are catering directly to people who want to cut back on meat consumption but don't intend to go cold turkey
 

BAD

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,565
USA
It's absolutely hugely beneficial to the environment and demand of animal products if people cut even some animal products out.

Vegans typically, however, believe it is wholly immoral and unethical to use animal products in their food.

So they're not often willing to say "reduce demand" and would prefer "end animal product industries."
 
Gundam

Gundam

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
12,801
th
 
lenovox1

lenovox1

Member
Oct 26, 2017
8,995
shnurgleton said:
Partial veggie is in vogue right now. The mainstreaming of meat alternatives like Impossible and Beyond are catering directly to people who want to cut back on meat consumption but don't intend to go cold turkey
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Right? Meatless Monday, for example, was created by a marketer and was established by non-profit initiative.

Partial veganism is all the rage.
 
behOemoth

behOemoth

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,626
Vegans will also don't recommend animal products like leather, glues and others. They still tell you to start with at least something.
 
OP
OP
Anthony Hopkins

Anthony Hopkins

Banned
Feb 10, 2018
17,534
Raccoon said:
You're basing this thread on anecdotal perception. Many, indeed I would say most, vegans advocate for everyone reducing animal product consumption as much as possible.
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No doubt I am.
I watched game changers and the recent debate with Chris kresser vs james wilks



The debate they had was better because it was more in deph, but the game changers movies makes animal products look very harmful.

Also vegans I've followed on YouTube have treated animal products like poison.

So I apologise for generalising the vegan community.
 

Raccoon

Member
May 31, 2019
15,896
Anthony Hopkins said:
No doubt I am.
I watched game changers and the recent debate with Chris kresser vs james wilks



The debate they had was better because it was more in deph, but the game changers movies makes animal products look very harmful.

Also vegans I've followed on YouTube have treated animal products like poison.

So I apologise for generalising the vegan community.
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don't apologize man, I'm just saying I think you're wrong, and that vegans do recommend 80% (or other ratio) plant-based diets.
 
AusGeno

AusGeno

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,076
I've started eating 80% less meat since watching Game Changers. If I go to someones house and all they've cooked is meat I'm still gonna eat meat but given the choice if I'm buying groceries or out at a restaurant I'm ordering the vegetarian options now.
 

Deleted member 11985

User requested account closure
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Oct 27, 2017
4,168
You're generalizing to all vegans, when you're just talking about a vocal minority.

I've been vegan for 10 years, and that's exactly the way I eat and the way I recommend to anybody else who's interested in veganism. It's virtually impossible to go 100% vegan, and it's impractical to keep up a 95%+ ratio for a long period of time.

I did a lot better when I first started. I went like 5 years at like 90%+, but it was honestly the vegan pizza that almost drove me to the edge. Vegan cheese is a crime against humanity, and I just couldn't take that shit anymore, so now I eat like 80%. I occasionally cheat by having a cheese pizza or doughnut every once in a while, and I also go vegetarian for work functions.

It's a much better strategy in the long run to go like 80% vegan. A lot of militant vegans will probably talk your ear off about how you're not actually a vegan, but who cares, honestly. I've probably outlasted the majority of formerly militant vegans who started out within the past 10 years.
 

Deleted member 2625

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Oct 25, 2017
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i'm trying to do more vegetarian... which is i think what you are going for

I could opt out of meat without too much trouble but dairy... that's tough

edit – compo i hear that. cheese is harder to give up than meat for me. i don't drink milk. but the sweet sweet cheeeeeeese
 
Ramala

Ramala

Member
Oct 28, 2017
6,048
Santa Monica, LA
I'm a vegetarian who knows he should really be vegan. I advocate any ratio of plant based diet, the same way I advocate any ratio of recycling. Every bit helps, ya know?
 
cDNA

cDNA

Member
Oct 25, 2017
916
Is not just a problem of the vegan community; Any massive change in the diet style of the population, have economic consequences for the Agriculture and in the USA the Agriculture Department is the responsible to establish the nutrition guidelines.
 

Deleted member 31817

Nov 7, 2017
30,876
cDNA said:
Is not just a problem of the vegan community; Any massive change in the diet style of the population, have economic consequences for the Agriculture and in the USA the Agriculture Department is the responsible to establish the nutrition guidelines.
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Yeah the problem is the meat and dairy industries/lobbying efforts are gigantic
 

Deleted member 3093

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Oct 25, 2017
4,956
They do. You're allowing yourself to believe the stereotype that vegans are very aggressive all-or-nothing types regarding animal products.
 
OP
OP
Anthony Hopkins

Anthony Hopkins

Banned
Feb 10, 2018
17,534
Nerfgun said:
i'm trying to do more vegetarian... which is i think what you are going for

I could opt out of meat without too much trouble but dairy... that's tough

edit – compo i hear that. cheese is harder to give up than meat for me. i don't drink milk. but the sweet sweet cheeeeeeese
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My diet is around my macro nutrients, my meals evole around a complex carb, some veg and a source of protein, and I've been getting my protein from chicken, eggs, fish, pork, cottage cheese, cheddar cheese and beef.
So it's where I'm going to get my protein from if plant based?

I can get 18g protein from a peanut butter sandwich
19g from a tin of canilini beans

So my idea is to get my protein from beans, fish, cottage cheese and other plant based sources maybe eggs to.
 
y2dvd

y2dvd

Member
Nov 14, 2017
2,481
Yeah what others have said. You're just using the most extreme cases of vegans. You've probably ran into plenty that you didn't even know about that isn't preachy.
 
sgtnosboss

sgtnosboss

Member
Nov 9, 2017
4,786
Most vegans I know, self included are fine with whatever people wanna do. I'm not shoving my shit down someone's throat. You do you, I'd you switch over, great, if you don't, you don't.
 
Tuorom

Tuorom

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Oct 30, 2017
10,915
Anthony Hopkins said:
My diet is around my macro nutrients, my meals evole around a complex carb, some veg and a source of protein, and I've been getting my protein from chicken, eggs, fish, pork, cottage cheese, cheddar cheese and beef.
So it's where I'm going to get my protein from if plant based?

I can get 18g protein from a peanut butter sandwich
19g from a tin of canilini beans

So my idea is to get my protein from beans, fish, cottage cheese and other plant based sources maybe eggs to.
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Beans
Lentils
Sometimes tofu
Various vegetables
Quinoa
iirc hemp
......

The issue with a vegan diet is not a lack of protein, but getting a full amino acid profile as plant based proteins are not complete, ie. they don't contain every amino acid. Somethings do though like quinoa.

In any case, you can get enough protein in a vegan diet easy.
 
Mik2121

Mik2121

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,943
Japan
My brother went from vegetarian to vegan recently and he says he is enjoying his new diet much more than before and feels better. He had been vegetarian for about 6 to 8 years, and just went vegan about 4 months ago.
I personally eat a lot of meats and dairy products, and would like to reduce the meat consumption first and foremost. It sucks that I'm not the greatest admirer of vegetables' flavor once cooked... Will try my best though!
 
neon/drifter

neon/drifter

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Apr 3, 2018
4,062
As a vegan this post honestly pisses me off.

We don't all think a certain way or the same way.

I don't care what you eat.

"WhY dOnT TheY bLaH bLah?!"

Because there is no "they". Stop with the absolutist bullshit god damn. We're not a monolithic group of like minded Borg.

So fucking tired of being stereotyped.
 

Absolute

Banned
Nov 6, 2017
2,090
neon/drifter said:
As a vegan this post honestly pisses me off.

We don't all think a certain way or the same way.

I don't care what you eat.

"WhY dOnT TheY bLaH bLah?!"

Because there is no "they". Stop with the absolutist bullshit god damn. We're not a monolithic group of like minded Borg.

So fucking tired of being stereotyped.
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OP said a lot of vegans not all. Did you even read the OP or are you just here for righteous indignation?
 
BabyMurloc

BabyMurloc

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,890
The terrible tragedy of not being told by vegans to eat a little meat. I mean what the fuck? Since when did vegans become the dieticians of the world?
 
HandsomeCharles

HandsomeCharles

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,919
The reasons Vegans don't recommend anything other than a 100% plant based diet is because they view any use of animals, or animal by-products to be immoral.

Some (though not all) also do not draw any distinction between humans and other animals for the purpose of morality. So to them it would be like saying "What if I only eat people 20% of the time?". Their response would be "You shouldn't be eating people at all!"

The distinction you have to make is that "Veganism" is not a diet, it's a mentality and to many extents a way of life. If someone is still consciously having a certain portion of their diet derived from animal products then they are most likely not "doing it for the animals". Maybe for health, maybe to help the environment, but certainly not because they believe in "veganism".

Also, to respond to your point about people thinking they've "failed" if they eat an animal product, that's totally situational. I've been vegan for just over a year now, and last week I accidentally ate something with Milk in it. Nobody is going to hold that against me, it wasn't conscious and once I realized I stopped. If someone is deliberately doing so however then it's a bit different, and if they do it repeatedly then they're probably not one of those aforementioned "for the animals" folk.

Edit: I've been Vegan for just over a year now and found the transition actually fairly simple. If anyone would like some advice, help, recommendations for meat substitutes (that don't taste like ass) or a list of delicious junk food that is Vegan hit me up (Protip: Most Oreos are vegan)
 
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