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Lady Bow

Member
Nov 30, 2017
11,341
Why aren't there more women in the Smash community? How do we make them feel more welcomed? Why can't I bring my lewd anime collection to the venue??




This is a really great video for men to watch because it not only applies to the Smash community but every other community that exists out there. I encourage you to watch the whole video before posting any hot takes as well. I have the feeling this was set off by the whole Pyra/Mythra shitshow that happened here and elsewhere on the internet with men scrambling to defend the sexualization and framing of those two characters.
 

Stairmaster_

Member
Jan 27, 2019
268
God the DJ Nintendo/The Moon clip makes me so uncomfortable, I had never seen that before this video but I'm not at all surprised after it came to light the kinds of people they are (disgusting).

The lack of common sense in the competitive scene blows my mind.
 

Betty

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
17,604
The competitive Smash community seems like a cesspit honestly, but after watching the video it's clear that gaming has a long way to go maturity wise.
 

Daouzin

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,263
Arizona
The lack of common sense in the competitive scene blows my mind.

The problem is that their our predators, but mostly there are also people blatantly oblivious. When I was in the scene and traveling a lot, I used to crash at strangers houses when I was 18/19 and they were 24,25,28 or older. Never thought twice about it, just thought, shit, I get to play some sick ass Melee with these people and get better and then enter this cool ass tournament tomorrow.

I feel like as an outsider that's ridiculous, as an insider, it's like wtf, why would I think about anything besides Smash. Sounds scrub. Anyway, time for more Melee.

I think content like this is super needed and helpful.
 

Platy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
27,815
Brazil
That video was really good, even if the explanation of why "this is just a joke -> kids will see and find awesome -> will not be a joke anymore" is not that clear

And yeah, dear goddess of some of those examples
 

Dyle

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
30,112
Good video but sadly it's preaching to the choir.

And jesus man fuck all those redacted fuckers
 

NoKisum

Member
Nov 11, 2017
4,913
DMV Area, USA
I know exactly why. But the last time I brought it up here, I got banned for mentioning it. All I'll say is that it partially involves someone whose name rhymes with Nitro.
 
Nov 4, 2017
7,408
I'm a gigantic dude, and the Smash community makes ME uncomfortable. I'm not surprised women don't want to be involved with it.

Great video with broader application, thank you for sharing.
 

jacket

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,033
such a well made video, there's some disgusting stuff in there, and that's the tip of the iceberg
 

lvl 99 Pixel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,838
I know for a fact there's more dodgy people in the scene. Any criticism I had of that latest documentary that featured some of these well known abusers was met with contempt. Just basically gave up interacting with these people because its no longer worth the effort when my own mental state isn't up for it.

The one time I tuned into DJ, Moon or D1 stream they did together a long time ago they were basically giving PUA advice to chat, and im pretty sure they were serious about it. The evidence was already there that they're all highly sus but they're viewed through rose colored lenses by fans.
 
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Hailinel

Shamed a mod for a tag
Member
Oct 27, 2017
35,527
Given recent events, I can't imagine why anyone outside the competitive Smash scene would want in regardless of who they are. Really, it's just that gross.
 

PaperSparrow

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,026
it not only applies to the Smash community but every other community that exists out there.
Think that needs to be highlighted because there's a good chance men will leave this at "the Smash scene is gross, shame" when (even if it's not as bad) the boy's locker room/"let's not talk about that right now when I'm trying to have fun" here can get super nauseating and frustrating to read when it comes to sexualization.
 
Oct 26, 2017
9,969
"it's just pixels on a screen"
If that's the case then why do legions of manchildren lose their shit whenever a female game character doesn't look like a sex doll.

As always, the issue isn't that sexualization of female characters exists the issue is that it's the default state for them. When it comes to designing them for just about any game the making them sexually appealing to nerds is an essential part of the process.
 

DecoReturns

Member
Oct 27, 2017
22,003
The worst part is that it could've been say Twintelle, who has a design appreciated by all and we would still see this problem. The amount of jokes and sexist/thirsty comments her character receives because she has a "nice body" is downright embarrassing.

one of the most prominent commentators is a girl, and she's always getting harassed by the chat. By a lot of fans in tournaments, twitter. You name it and we've heard she's constantly wondering why she keeps doing this if she's getting nothing but hate.

It's suck a deep rooted problem and it's honestly been cultivated that way for so long it's gonna take so much time and effort to get something done, and frankly I don't expect any significant change to happen cause I have no faith they can achieve it. it doesn't help when Smash has this "wifu" glorification around it, bulit by some members of the community. Some have already been driven away by the revelations of last year. Zero was a huge creator of "thirsty" content where he would grade anime girls or use such sexist language, plus being one of the most popular Smash content creator, meant he taught others that it's okay to do that.

I can't speak of other communities, but with Smash since I'm familiar with it. It's downright terrible and depressing to see how Woman are treated.
 

Nepenthe

When the music hits, you feel no pain.
Administrator
Oct 25, 2017
21,031
It's because gaming as a whole is still a space dominated by men who couldn't give less of a shit about others? I mean, it's self-evident in 2021. The question is not why women are underrepresented in gaming communities. The question is when are people going to collectively put in the work to finally do something about it?
 

ClickyCal'

Member
Oct 25, 2017
59,951
"it's just pixels on a screen"
If that's the case then why do legions of manchildren lose their shit whenever a female game character doesn't look like a sex doll.

As always, the issue isn't that sexualization of female characters exists the issue is that it's the default state for them. When it comes to designing them for just about any game the making them sexually appealing to nerds is an essential part of the process.
Yea. It's been discussed a lot in the thread about women character designs, but even characters like Lara Croft from the reboot, RE3 remake Jill, Aloy, etc got called "ugly and masculine" when they were revealed. To the Gamers™, if they don't look like an exact certain way, it means they are just "sjw agenda designs".
 

ChristianH94

Member
Apr 14, 2019
492
The FGC has been dealing with stuff like this for a while but I feel the smash scene has it really bad because of how outsider they are so for every true grassroots underdog hero you get, you have the potential to get some serious scum as well that can mean horribly sexist or psychotic and abusive individuals. How the community approaches this? There are a few ways but a good start would be for more top players to call out shitty behaviors instead of just brushing it under the rug as she stated in the video, I'd also add that a good thing as well would be for the community to start valuing what people actually do for people inside the community instead of just idolizing those who get top 8 so you'd see people not be able to get away with being a shithead quite as much.

I think it'll definitely happen, it just sadly takes a bit more time than people want.
 

Mekanos

â–˛ Legend â–˛
Member
Oct 17, 2018
44,363
Gaming is a deeply misogynist hobbyist space even compared to a lot of "geek" hobbies and it's only going to get better when people put their foot down and remove the presence and power of harassers and abusers. The other side of the coin is so many companies are all too eager to appeal to the boy's club stuff to secure financial gain.

It's all pretty depressing.
 

Panicky Duck

Member
Dec 14, 2020
455
God, that commentary clip made me retch a little. Hopefully this video sets the community in motion to improve itself.
 

Truno

Unshakable Resolve
Member
Jan 16, 2020
4,918
Very new to the smash scene but how the fuck did DJ Nintendo and La Luna get away with shit like that
 

Skyscourge

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 7, 2020
1,857
I think a key problem here is that the community is almost completely grassroots, with no central power (i.e. Nintendo) that can set guidelines and rules, and enforce punishments for people that act out of line. The smash community has long relied on people that they have viewed as trustworthy, be it pros, commentators or content creators to act as leaders. But the revelations from last year has shown that many of those leaders were terrible people that perpetuated a toxic environment. People in the smash community get away with stuff because for the longest time, the community and their leaders, comprised mostly of men, let them get away with it. With Nintendo entirely unwilling to involve themselves with the competitive community beyond token acknowledgement/advertising, its up to the people to form some sort of central committee, similar to the old COC board. The community must also collectively decide to follow the rules that such a board defines and take it seriously.
 

Kaivan

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,390
You don't even need to look outside of Era.

The recent & still running Pyra & Mythra announcement thread is a graveyard, and that says a lot.
 

Rhaknar

Member
Oct 26, 2017
42,903
I have the feeling this was set off by the whole Pyra/Mythra shitshow that happened here and elsewhere on the internet with men scrambling to defend the sexualization and framing of those two characters.

People STILL out there defending Xeno 2 designs in 2021? lol my goodness. And I say that as a big fan of the game, but come on.
 

Paroni

Member
Dec 17, 2020
3,493
Yea. It's been discussed a lot in the thread about women character designs, but even characters like Lara Croft from the reboot, RE3 remake Jill, Aloy, etc got called "ugly and masculine" when they were revealed. To the Gamers™, if they don't look like an exact certain way, it means they are just "sjw agenda designs".

It genuinely feels like that lots of gamers seriously think that fictional women having clothes on in mainstream games means that evil feminists are going to break into their houses and take away all their porn and softcore fanart the first thing tomorrow.

The most surreal thing about this is that those same gamers then flock to the right wing extremists who actually would take all of their hentais and such away if they could.