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Septimus Prime

EA
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
8,500

It might sound strange, but an Asian-American lead character playing a low achiever might just be what our community needs right now. The story of Asians in America is happy one at first glance — as the nation's fastest growing racial group, we're seen as educated "model minority" citizens who have earned society's respect. But Asian American achievement often faces backlash.

Princeton psychologist Susan Fiske has found that people evaluate groups along two primary dimensions: warmth (friendly, trustworthy) and competence (capable, effective). Numerous surveys have found that white Americans generally receive high marks for both warmth and competence, while black and Latinx Americans are seen as less competent and get mixed results on warmth, both depending on factors like income and profession. Meanwhile, Asians and Jewish people are seen in these surveys as highly competent but colder, less friendly and maybe untrustworthy. These stereotypes can lead to feelings of envy, an ambivalent emotion that Fiske says is a mix of both admiration and resentment.
Fully developed depictions of Asian Americans are rare and increasingly important — as an envied outside group, Asian Americans are in "a dangerous place," Fiske told me. While people might generally cooperate with us because we're useful, in times of perceived competition for scarce resources, we can face "attack and sabotage."
These biases follow us into the workplace. A 2016 study looking at 106,000 Silicon Valley tech workers found that among professionals, Asian Americans make up the largest racial cohort. But once employed, we were the least likely among all races to get promoted to be managers or executives.

My research on Asian American men has found that we're more likely to be recognized for working hard or our technical skills than for being creative or our leadership ability. We're hired for our competence, but can't seem to ascend.
I don't think this is terribly surprising for some, but it's nice that it's being pointed out. I think before this, the depiction of Asians in western media either dismissed us or set impossible standards and stereotypes. I hope, moving forward, Asians will be considered for more everyman roles and push forward the paradigm that we're just like everyone else.
 

Vonnegut

Banned
May 27, 2018
1,082
But Ali Wong's character is a famous, outrageously successful chef and restauranteur.

So it's a wash.
 

Ashhong

Member
Oct 26, 2017
16,590
I don't watch it but Kim's Convenience? Even Fresh Off the Boat, since Randall Park is just an ordinary business owner, much like his character in this movie (even if it's his dad's company)
 

Mona

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
26,151
throughout the entire movie Marcus couldn't take a fucking hint

she told him she loved him and begged him to come with her, and then later he's like "wait, why did you buy all my merch?"

all throughout the movie she says his band is great and has potential, then they're fighting and hes like "you hate the band!"

what a dunce
 
Oct 25, 2017
10,391
Chinese person here
I always think that the successful stereotype of us was like the first world problem of all the races

That said... author does have this point:
Perhaps Asian Americans should simply be grateful for our general success and not complain about seemingly minor obstacles. But this kind of envious prejudice can quickly take a dark turn. Fiske pointed out that historically speaking, "The targets of genocide are often successful outsiders." Democratic presidential candidate Andrew Yang, best known for his platform of universal basic income, fears that we are "one generation away" from Asians being targets of violence in the same way Jewish synagogues have been.
 
OP
OP
Septimus Prime

Septimus Prime

EA
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
8,500
But Ali Wong's character is a famous, outrageously successful chef and restauranteur.

So it's a wash.
Sure. But it's actually Randall Park's character that this article is about, since it's so rarely depicted in western media. Roles like that usually go to white guys because what's more "normal" and the default everyman than a white guy?

Chinese person here
I always think that the successful stereotype of us was like the first world problem of all the races
I think as stereotypes go, it could definitely be a lot worse. But that it exists at all shows that there's still a perception of deviance from the norm. The "norm" being white people.
 

Lumination

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,447
Chinese person here
I always think that the successful stereotype of us was like the first world problem of all the races
I used to think this way until I met a more Asian Americans that weren't stellar in their studies or whatever. The self-doubt and pressure they are under is intense. And that number is growing as more and more are born here, assimilate, and no longer as militant in their own households.

Also, this "positive" stereotype lends itself to its negative counterpart: the meek, unmanly Asian man.
 

Riversands

Banned
Nov 21, 2017
5,669
I dont know how about you, but as i was watching the movie, i thought well the movie really hit the nail about asian portrayal. It is very relatable to me as someone who happens to be an asian too, like the authenticity of asian food which is mostly disliked by americans
 

Miss Piggy

Member
Oct 27, 2017
542
UK
Especially the refreshing part where he didn't go to college, can you imagine the outrage in a regular family.
 

Pet

More helpful than the IRS
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
7,070
SoCal
How did I miss this thread.

Especially the refreshing part where he didn't go to college, can you imagine the outrage in a regular family.

TBH that's way more common than people think, though I think the most common occurrence next to "overachiever" is a regular Asian kid who goes to some regular college, like instead of flagships, they go to local state colleges. Yet, you rarely see that portrayed in media.
 

Deleted member 46958

User requested account closure
Banned
Aug 22, 2018
2,574
My biggest problem with the movie was the fact that Randall's character didn't talk to Wong's for SIXTEEN years after a small spat they had in a burger king.

Yeah, she went to college, but they could have reconnected in between and after. gtfo.
 

TickleMeElbow

Member
Oct 31, 2017
2,668
That's why I like Surf Ninjas so much.

The protagonists were Asian slacker surf bros who sucked at school, which was basically me except I was an Asian slacker hip hop head skater who sucked at school lol.
 

capitalCORN

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
10,436
I was kind of a criminal? But really guys, start calling out that othering shit. I've started recently and it's a lot better than to grin and bear it.
 

Fulminator

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,199
My biggest problem with the movie was the fact that Randall's character didn't talk to Wong's for SIXTEEN years after a small spat they had in a burger king.

Yeah, she went to college, but they could have reconnected in between and after. gtfo.
people lose contact for all sorts of small reasons all the time

don't see an issue with it tbh
 

Deleted member 46958

User requested account closure
Banned
Aug 22, 2018
2,574
people lose contact for all sorts of small reasons all the time

don't see an issue with it tbh

Given the fact that these two were childhood friends for *years* make it hard to believe that he did not look for her, and she didn't look for him.

Not only that, but the dude's mother died. A little hard to believe there for me from a writing perspective.
 
Dec 24, 2017
2,399
This was a very Northern California Asian-American movie.

That being said, you could say I love the Marcus Kim life right now.
 

mrmoose

Member
Nov 13, 2017
21,144
There are two recent sitcoms, The Good Place and Single Parents, where the Asian Americans are just doofuses. I'm not sure if that's a positive or not but it's definitely not stereotypical.
 

Fulminator

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,199
Given the fact that these two were childhood friends for *years* make it hard to believe that he did not look for her, and she didn't look for him.

Not only that, but the dude's mother died. A little hard to believe there for me from a writing perspective.
It didn't really seem like they wanted to talk to each other when they first reunited in the movie.

Am I supposed to talk to all my childhood friends for the rest of my life?

Gonna have to disagree with you on this one.
 

Deleted member 4452

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,377
Given the fact that these two were childhood friends for *years* make it hard to believe that he did not look for her, and she didn't look for him.

Not only that, but the dude's mother died. A little hard to believe there for me from a writing perspective.
I lost contact with my childhood best friend after elementary school. I only looked him up in my 20's only to find out he had died of cancer a few years earlier.
 

HStallion

Member
Oct 25, 2017
62,242
Given the fact that these two were childhood friends for *years* make it hard to believe that he did not look for her, and she didn't look for him.

Not only that, but the dude's mother died. A little hard to believe there for me from a writing perspective.

Wasn't the mother's death a big reason for the fallout being so extreme?
 

Deleted member 907

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,300
I would say this movie is on par with Harold and Kumar. Both are good movies within their genre's that pay enough lip service to the Asian American experience to let you know that it's done with intention and understanding. One of my favorite things is how loving and supportive both sets of parents are. There's so much subversion of stereotypes. This is one of my favorite movies.
 

S-Wind

Member
Nov 4, 2017
2,175
Given the fact that these two were childhood friends for *years* make it hard to believe that he did not look for her, and she didn't look for him.

Not only that, but the dude's mother died. A little hard to believe there for me from a writing perspective.
I can't say I agree with you on this one.

There's plenty of childhood close friends who I lost touch with for over a decade. And I know I am not alone in that experience.

I reckon your take is in the minority.
 

Jon Carter

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,746
Just bumping this because I saw the movie last night and I loved every second of it. The movie is smart and very well-written, Randall Park and Ali Wong are hilarious, and I thought its depiction of Asian Americans was just fantastic. I strongly recommend checking it out.
 
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