I didn't equate soccer ultras to Antifa, you are sitting there denouncing my personal stories as lies (which is a shitty conversation starter to begin with) so I got into detail about existing leftist people and circles. Stop mushing stuff together I didn't say.
I don't know how often I have now said myself that Antifa is not a homogeneous group, yet you are still trying to lecture me about it, showing me yet again that you are reading into my posts whatever the fuck you want. It was my very first argument. But it is so much easier for ypur argument to act as if I said "All Antifa". I was talking about my personal experience. It's nice that you have had a different one. I am completely aware that my experiences with the people I met does not mean everyone coming to a demo thinks the way the others do. But they have done shit, yelled shit that people at gatherings were completely ok with that I am not. If you describe this as me not feeling cozy around them anymore, ok, laugh at me all you want. But nobody would speak up about this so yes, Infelt uncomfortable in their present. Maybe you haven't witnessed this yourself in 40 years, maybe you turned a blind eye, maybe you're the guy who actually engages in a discussion if you see shit. I have had much less contact with Antifa than you did, yet some of the stereotypes around Antifa were presented to me as true. But as I have learned, my personal experience equates to me reading Springer and believing every single word.
And since you brought it up, yes, everyone in that circle was outspokenly Antideutsch. And no, not everyone at Antifa is. But some are. Not everything around Antifa is unproblematic. That's all I said. I didn't denounce them as a one sided leftist terror group.
I'm sitting here, calling your "personal stories" anecdotes, accompanied by baseless bullshit you picked up from BILD.
You still keep treating Antifa as a monolithic entity, as long as you do that, it's completely pointless to at all try and discuss this with you. You're living in your own little bubble. Going to any sort of demo or rally and complaining about people protesting violently is extremly silly, though, it's ALWAYS been that way, not only in Germany, and it has nothing to do with Antifa. As long as you refuse to get that, I'll continue seeing your experience as BILD level bollocks.
I could write an essay about what I think of Antideutsche, honestly, they don't stand for a lot of what I stand for. But as long as we step up against Fascists, they're always "welcome" on my side. (Not like that's my decision or anything, since, again, not an organized group with memberships and shite)
Thing is, a lot of younger people (most Antideutsche, really) are still blind to their ideology and quick to go down more extreme paths that Otto-Normal won't or can't condone, but those people aren't "Antifa", all of "Antifa", or even a large part of "it", they're just individuals with their own ideals. See the following response to West if that's not clear enough.
And I'm sorry, if you felt personally insulted, but it's always the same damn stuff people who say "I'm left but not Antifa" bring up, it usually ends in "but they burn cars!" and eventually goes into the good old Hufeisen, I've little patience for that stuff, especially if I see someone isn't willing to budge from the stereotypes.
Yeah, I'm giving up for now, because you're just not getting what I'm saying. It's not "cliquey" here. And I never said that the "Antifa" as a whole is organized, anyone is calling the shots, there's a leader, there's membership. I've tried saying it many different ways, I'm not sure how else to put it.
Antifa and antifaschistisch are not truly synonymous in my eyes. If your bar for calling someone Antifa is "has demonstrated against oppressive bullshit" (or even lower), then sure, I'm Antifa.
You keep saying that Antifa is made up of small groups with cute little gang names in Austria, and I'm telling you that that's cliquey bullshit that has nothing to do with Antifa.
And that's not really my bar, that IS the bar. Anything else is stuff you add to it because somewhere, somehow you've seen things that are associated with Antifa, it just doesn't work that way though. "We" don't shoo people away, "we" don't have a bar to pass, membership requirements or anything. Anyone who stands up against the same sort of crap as us, is with us. And no, that doesn't mean condoning violent protests, burning Twingos or whatever. It doesn't even mean liking it, or turning a blind eye to it.
The way you, yourself, act as Antifa, is what you yourself are accountable for, what you condone, and what you think is right. You're not responsible for the actions of the Black Bloc or anything. Did that help to make my point more clear?
