What would a JRPG need to do to be on Chrono Trigger's level?

[MaverickHunterAsh]

Do everything pretty much perfectly. No big deal!

Honestly, because Chrono Trigger sets such an astronomically high bar I'm not 100% confident there will ever be another JRPG that can match it, let alone surpass it.

Chrono Trigger is far and away my favorite game of all time, though, so I obviously have a certain bias here.

 

[Look! The Pie!]

Be called Terranigma.

But in all seriousness, as someone who doesn't consider CT to be half as magnificent as most of Era does, this is a tricky question to answer. I like it just fine, but it wouldn't get anywhere near my top 10 list. A lot of people (in this thread and many others over the years) have made very impassioned and informative posts about their love for it, and while I appreciate that it obviously resonated with a lot of people, I simply didn't have the same experience. I don't want to play the nostalgia card, but I never got to play it when it was first released, so maybe years of hearing it be extolled as this defining JRPG experience meant that when I did finally play it the game never could have lived up to the level of personal hype I'd (subconsciously?) given it.

I could go on for days about how I'm baffled that no one has tried to cash in on the "friendship skills" as I call them when characters pair up and do skills together, promoting team mixups and different party compositions, or how the combat being seamless helps sell the world it's in, and everything else I love about it, but I think the main 5 points really are the biggest contributors.

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You need to play the Suikoden series! XD

 

[Bit_Reactor]

You need to play the Suikoden series! XD

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I really do. I'm sad I missed the Suikoden hype train and keep hoping for a remaster/re-rerelease

 

[luther manhole]

Be the best game ever made I guess.

 

[super moustique]

Chrono Trigger audience will always prefer it over anything else, because it makes them nostalgic, it touched them as an experience when they were young and nothing will beat that.

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A reminder that CT was released for the first time in Europe... On NDS.

 

[ArbitraryWater]

I think a lot of Chrono Trigger's enduring appeal has to do with it being all killer, no filler in a genre frequently infamous for stringing the player along with endless combat or meandering story tangents. Certainly, it helps that CT is charming, beautiful, and sounds great, but I sincerely doubt it would be as beloved as it is if it didn't have such a rock-solid sense of pacing.

 

[TheJollyCorner]

Chrono Trigger had a ridiculously talented dev team:
-Yuji Horii
-Hironobu Sakaguchi
-Yoshinori Kitase
-Hiroyuki Ito
-Akira Toriyama
-Yasunori Mitsuda
-Nobuo Uematsu

It was just ridiculous... and it was right before Squaresoft started on FFVII. Everyone was firing on all cylinders.

 

[Eppcetera]

Chrono Trigger is probably still my favourite game, but I don't know if I'd say that no game since its release has matched it. I play lots of RPGs, and I've liked many of them nearly as much as Chrono Trigger. I don't think any have had the same high quality in every area (graphics, music, story, gameplay, replayability, pacing, accessibility) as Chrono Trigger, but there are plenty of RPGs that surpass it in at least one of those qualities. The main reason I don't think any classic-style RPG will be more highly regarded is because Chrono Trigger is really easy and doesn't waste time, which means that even people who aren't fans of turn-based RPGs often enjoy it

This accessibility is an underrated aspect, I'd say, since the game's low difficulty is also what hardcore RPG fans don't like about Chrono Trigger. It's also why Chrono Trigger doesn't exactly excel in some of the niche elements that some RPGs are well known for, like intricate plotting, complicated character customization, and endless content. The Trails series is much better at lore, Final Fantasy V outdid Chrono Trigger at customization options before the latter even came out, and it's basically mandatory for new RPGs to be longer than Chrono Trigger. So, it makes sense to me that plenty of hardcore RPG fans will enjoy a game like Shin Megami Tensei: Nocturne and Persona 4 more than Chrono Trigger, since Nocturne and Persona 4 definitely have strengths that Chrono Trigger does not. But I also think that it's clear that Persona 4 isn't as beloved as Chrono Trigger because it's nowhere near as accessible and suffers from drawbacks not present in the older game. I've heard of people who loved Persona 4 but never got around to finishing, but not so with Chrono Trigger.

Chrono Trigger has many of the qualities that people like in RPGs, but it also avoids much of what drives people away from the genre. In other words, it's a mainstream RPG, and there aren't very many of those being made now since most Japanese developers have given up on attracting the masses and focus on the niche appeal of the genre. Even the recent games made to be like Chrono Trigger try to appeal to the nostalgic crowd, which is definitely not the crowd Chrono Trigger aimed at in 1995. I think there have been a few other popular, well-made mainstream RPGs (like Final Fantasy VII, Final Fantasy X, etc), but these games don't quite do everything quite as well as Chrono Trigger did, or they have some flaw that Chrono Trigger lacks. It's really unfair, but a classic turn-based RPG would need to be well-made in virtually every aspect, while avoiding any glaring flaws, and achieve mainstream popularity in order to supplant Chrono Trigger in the near future. That's an incredibly uncommon set of requirements.

 

[Hours Left]

Be Suikoden

 

[CrunchyFrog]

The biggest thing is avoiding filler. Chrono Trigger is an extremely lean game, and the vast majority of JRPG developers haven't been able to do that.

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This is probably the biggest thing. Too much lore dumping in a lot of modern JRPG's in place of good, concise character building moments. CT's pacing is pretty much perfect.

 

[HorseFD]

Having the greatest VG OST of all time helps.

 

[Tace]

You need to assemble a team with more pure talent than the Dream Team. People say nostalgia is keeping Chrono Trigger at #1 but I didn't play it til 2015 and it instantly became my favorite RPG

 

[Bradford]

Panzer Dragoon Saga felt very similar to Chrono Trigger. I personally found it better than CT in almost every way. It takes a lot of the ideas w/r/t pacing and Combat and implements them in a really amazing and interesting way. It still has one of my favorite RPG/turn based combat systems ever.

 

[Laughing Banana]

I think DQXI is on its level.

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Beyond its level.

Also, Suikoden II soars above it.

 

[Mattersnotnow]

In FFT's case
It would need worse character design, a much less interesting progression and battle system and less relevant themes


(jk - I mean CT is good but it biggest strengths are probably pacing, branching and appealing character design - which are very good things to have, but it's systems and story are definitely the best in class)

 

[Elfforkusu]

I think the key part is one of the trickiest:

Have the courage to cut the filler and be 25-30 hours. There are a number of excellent RPGs that hit the highs of CT, but are too afraid of being "too short" and suffer as works of art immensely as a result.

 

[Mechaplum]

Not have any long ass 3D camera pans.

 

[Bigwombat]

There's a very strange impression that Chrono trigger was a lot better received than it actually was. Chrono trigger never sold anything near what FF or DQ did. It's basically about as successful as Persona 4-5 are right now. A solid game, but a niche one.

There's not really the data to support that it was a standout that appealed to the kind of broad audiences that make the game worth imitating or emulating.

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Huh. My friends and I loved it. I had several groups of buddies who bought it when it came out. I rented it a bunch from the local video store ; I know it's ancedotally but I found that it was talked about more than ff3.

 

[VileZero]

Chrono Trigger is widely considered one of the greatest JRPGs (and games) of all-time. There have been JRPGs since then that have been similar in style to Chrono Trigger in one way or another such as Radiant Historia & our own Cosmic Star Heroine, but even when people like these new attempts, the general consensus is that they're not on CT's level. What would a new game need to do to match Chrono Trigger for quality? What attributes do you must care about in a CT-style RPG?

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Chrono Trigger is one of my all-time favorites, but I think a lot of it is twinged with nostalgia. I adored Cosmic Star Heroine. It scratched my Chrono Trigger itch perfectly, and I consider it a worthy spiritual successor.

 

[cdyhybrid]

Be worse than Earthbound

 

[Jon God]

A character driven ensemble cast story, with enough cheese and charm to be in the same boat as the original Star Wars trilogy, decently fast paced battles, a short overall runtime, and a lot of creativity. Less tropes, and more interesting story telling. Characters that act more like characters, and less like walking cardboard.

 

[Ecks]

I didn't play it until I was in my 20's, and I share the sentiment about it being close to perfect. At least for my tastes. To do this again they'd have to:

1. Keep the story segments brief but interesting.
2. Focus on gameplay over story.
3. Have it be more than a levelling slog like many JRPG's are.
4. No handholding, let the player explore and find things
5. Worthwhile side content that doesn't feel tedious to play, but as though it fleshes out the world more.

 

[Weiss]

I think the problem with trying to make the next Chrono Trigger is that Chrono Trigger was lightning in a bottle forged by a dream team of artists. It's not something that can be hard replicated the way YIIK tried really, really hard to be the next Earthbound.

It's perfectly paced with no downtime to get tired or bored. It's a lightning fast battle system that, while easy, always provides just enough engagement to keep you going. It's one of the most beautiful works of pixel art on the SNES, with a charming fairy tale simple story of time travel and saving the world. It's an RPG you can hand to even the most ardent detractor of the genre and they'll have a blast. Individual elements can and have been taken from Chrono Trigger and infused into new products, but you'll never get a modern new Chrono Trigger because it'll take some years of hindsight to realize that we're looking at it in the first place.

At the risk of being a kissass I think Cosmic Star Heroine succeeded in some places at modernizing the Chrono Trigger formula with its huge diverse movepool across the cast and its lighting fast progression from one story beat to the next. Between this and Indivisible I can't tell you how completely over I am of the JRPG's love affair with making you sit through party wipe music and a Game Over screen.

 

[noquarter]

A lot of it has already been said.

For me it really is about being short with good replayability. The first time through the game is only like 25 hours, but even as you are going through it, you see things that you want to do differently when you play again, and the game allows you to play again.

The story was simple, but has some really good story arcs and it does a good job of making you think you could do something different to get a better outcome.

It has some really good standout moments that are kind of burned into my memory unlike any other game. The Trial, with the design, the way it shows what happened when you met Marle, the music, the background art. One of my favorite moments. Or when you are on the bridge with Frog and seeing the battle there.

Maps that are different but very much the same. Seeing the map in the future and in prehistoric times, but also having the current time and one that is very close to the same, just a few hundred years earlier.

It has just enough depth without being too complicated. It is a very easy game, but there is some depth to party design that rewards you for playing with a consistent party and also makes you want to play with everyone.

It has been probably 5 years since the last time I played it, but I still remember so much about it, since it was really interesting and let's you miss stuff. The simplicity can be seen in everything (a character named Frog or Robo) and all the stories are pretty basic, but it does it all really well, just focusing on nice short stories that have conclusions.

 

[Deleted member 43657]

What would a new game need to do to match Chrono Trigger for quality?

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Be Dragon Quest XI?

In all seriousness, the further time moves away from the release of Chrono Trigger, the more it becomes clear that Chrono Trigger is a once-in-a-lifetime kind of game.

 

[JaseMath]

Trigger is not that great. There've been dozens better than it since then. It doesn't really take all that much.

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Chrono Trigger is the only flawless video game outside of Tetris.

 

[LavitzSlambert]

Definitely! I've been meaning to replay it myself. Got it on Steam a while ago.

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I've been playing this for the very first time, and finally completed it today! Wow this game was definitely something special and really holds up well. I can see how it was something completely new at the time of its release, and the gameplay withstands the test of time with an awesome battle system. Story was great - nothing too complex but it fleshes out all the characters and addresses pretty much everything it introduced. I'm impressed by how the game ended up.

Now as nothing is so perfect, I'll recount some criticisms. To me it's still. 9/10 game with all of this I'm about to say, so keep that in mind.

First off I think the characters are all memorable and likable. But they didn't all get the development they deserved. Even completing all of the sidequests left me wanting more characterization and interaction between the cast.

Second, speaking of sidequests I liked them but hated how they were all left until basically the end of the game. Would have liked it more if they were sprinkled throughout the story. Instead it felt like everything was building up to the final battle and I basically just did other things and ignored it for a few hours.

Finally, I didn't love the way the game gives you hints for direction (or none at all) as where to go next. I'm not one for having my hand held constantly but there were a few times where I took a break playing and had no idea what I was doing. It was very annoying and with the lack of sidequests, it felt like I was being corralled into the next major plot point with the illusion of freedom. If the game opened up more I'd be more forgiving but there really isn't much you can do but wander until you hopefully figure things out. There are a couple leaps of logic that took me a while to understand but I finally came around.

Anyway it's definitely up there in my most enjoyable RPGs and I love the way it gets down to business without getting too bogged down and slow. Would recommend this to anyone who likes RPGs and anyone who should get into RPGs.

 

[AzureFlame]

Be Persona 4 Golden

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CT is way better.

 

[Geobros]

I think DQXI is on its level.

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I dont think so. Chrono trigger was not repetitive.

 

[Kr1spy]

Be released before I was an adult.

 

[Onix555]

Im wondering how much of this thread is rose tinted nostalgia. I've never played CT, but if I started today, it would be a very different experiance compared to an 8 year old in the 90's. It would also have to be literally the greatest thing ever in order to stand up to the praise and not be a disappointment.

 

[hussien-11]

People need to let go of their childhood memories. It is a great game but today games are of a completely different level, and they face design challenges that were never present at the time.

 

[Alanood]

People need to let go of their childhood memories.

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Stop. You're hurting us.

 

[PenultimateFantasy]

it would need to be released 25 years ago in order to have that love a game can only get from nostalgia

 

[Rodrix]

We need a real sequel, hire this guy

 

[Spaltazar]

For me it is the pacing. Currently playing Chrono Trigger for the first time on Steam and i am shocked at just how far and beyond this game from back then is in this regard. Makes the useless meandering about in modern games (like most recent rpg games) look like a bad joke.

in fact, I like Chrono Trigger so fucking much, that it has sent me on an odyssee of playing through older jRPG games from the snes era. will play through star ocean first departure r and collection of mana once i am done with it and take a look at playing stuff like terranigma etc.

 

[Tibarn]

IMO the only JRPG that comes close to what CT did in the SNES is the first Xenoblade, but it was released in a weak system and Nintendo didn't even try to sell the game. Even if the world setting and gameplay are amazing, it lacks the great party that CT has.

CT was really ambitious for the time, the way everything animates, the way the enemies are integrated in the environment, the fun combat system... It's a massive jump from FF VI in many ways, and sadly Square never reached this level of quality again.

I think that the only way a JRPG can be considered to be as good as CT is making something new, having a fun combat system and good characters and being on a popular gaming system.

 

[Terraforce]

"Concise" has been thrown out a lot, but it really can't be understated. I like plenty of JRPGs more than CT, but the fact that you can beat it in a reasonable amount of time really stands to its advantage. I've replayed Persona 5 before, but that takes a good 60+ hours out of me even skipping things on repeat playthroughs. CT being ~20 hours with multiple endings is just a great package.

Not to mention the characters and battle system are great. More turned based JRPGs need to implement shared party member techniques.

 

[Meriadock]

Im wondering how much of this thread is rose tinted nostalgia. I've never played CT, but if I started today, it would be a very different experiance compared to an 8 year old in the 90's. It would also have to be literally the greatest thing ever in order to stand up to the praise and not be a disappointment.

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It's not nostalgia.. It's really amazing. You should play it.

 

[.exe]

I've been playing this for the very first time, and finally completed it today! Wow this game was definitely something special and really holds up well. I can see how it was something completely new at the time of its release, and the gameplay withstands the test of time with an awesome battle system. Story was great - nothing too complex but it fleshes out all the characters and addresses pretty much everything it introduced. I'm impressed by how the game ended up.

Now as nothing is so perfect, I'll recount some criticisms. To me it's still. 9/10 game with all of this I'm about to say, so keep that in mind.

First off I think the characters are all memorable and likable. But they didn't all get the development they deserved. Even completing all of the sidequests left me wanting more characterization and interaction between the cast.

Second, speaking of sidequests I liked them but hated how they were all left until basically the end of the game. Would have liked it more if they were sprinkled throughout the story. Instead it felt like everything was building up to the final battle and I basically just did other things and ignored it for a few hours.

Finally, I didn't love the way the game gives you hints for direction (or none at all) as where to go next. I'm not one for having my hand held constantly but there were a few times where I took a break playing and had no idea what I was doing. It was very annoying and with the lack of sidequests, it felt like I was being corralled into the next major plot point with the illusion of freedom. If the game opened up more I'd be more forgiving but there really isn't much you can do but wander until you hopefully figure things out. There are a couple leaps of logic that took me a while to understand but I finally came around.

Anyway it's definitely up there in my most enjoyable RPGs and I love the way it gets down to business without getting too bogged down and slow. Would recommend this to anyone who likes RPGs and anyone who should get into RPGs.

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Oh hey, nice that you actually wrote this up! Great that you enjoyed it. I still haven't gotten around to playing it again, but I can imagine getting a little confused about what to do at times. I definitely recall getting a little stuck at certain points, and it's been long enough that I'll probably get stuck again. Good to hear it generally holds up though.

 

[Deleted member 49535]

Plenty of JRPGs are better. You don't even need to look further than what the PS1 offered.

 

[Wireframe]

Chrono Trigger is very rare in that it ticks pretty much every box. Great characters, great OST, time travel done well, the ATB, and a compelling story.

 

[Interested Observer]

Be really good.

Wait a few decades.

Be fawned over in misty eyed fashion.

Simple really.

 

[MegaSackman]

I would say that it's the people that don't want Chrono Trigger to be surpassed.

 

[Aleh]

I found CT to be pretty average and dropped it before finishing it because I didn't feel like playing it anymore. Don't know why it's so "popular", it doesn't really have many flaws except the fact it's just not very fun or exciting to actually play in my opinion, I'd rather have games with imperfections and quirks that still light a fire under my ass but maybe that's just me

 

[The Anonymous Wizard]

What would a JRPG need to do to be on Chrono Triggers level?

Skies of Arcadia would have to get marginally worse.

 

[Griffith]

I think Chrono Trigger is one of those Lightning in a Bottle type of projects that can't be replicated that easily. Square has a studio that is basically dedicated on trying to recreate it and so far they haven't come even mildly close.

• The right development team at the right point in their careers
• Memorable characters
• Excellent and timeless soundtrack
• A non-padded gaming experience with great pacing that doesn't require grinding and doesn't outstay its welcome
• A complex story that is told in simple-to-follow terms
• A great and memorable villain who has more than 2 dimensions to him

 

[eXistor]

It needs to be new, fresh and exciting. The first Xenoblade came close. It was clearly a Jrpg, but it wasn't like anything I've played before; a fresh take on the genre. That game ultimately dropped the ball in some areas, but it was a good try.

 

[Deleted member 2809]

just remake CT but with voice actors and crono talks

Spoiler

/s

 

[LavitzSlambert]

I forgot to add that the soundtrack is fantastic. This game would be a perfect candidate for a FF7 caliber remake (in scope, not multiple games).