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What is your opinion of religion as a concept?
- Thread starter CassCade
- Start date
I'm an Atheist but grew up in a catholic family and most of the people I know still believe in god.
I used to be a lot more 'militant' about talking about it but the older I get the less I care. Ultimately, believing in god makes people happy, as long as their beliefs aren't directly hurting anyone they can believe what ever they want.
I did go off on a few of my catholic friends for making fun of Scientology recently, they didn't understand how hypocritical they sounded.
I used to be a lot more 'militant' about talking about it but the older I get the less I care. Ultimately, believing in god makes people happy, as long as their beliefs aren't directly hurting anyone they can believe what ever they want.
I did go off on a few of my catholic friends for making fun of Scientology recently, they didn't understand how hypocritical they sounded.
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Basically I figure a long time ago, like in the bronze age, people didn't really know how things worked so the invented explanations. "Why do we sometimes find shells in rocks on mountains?" "There was a flood." It's not like they knew about plate tectonics. Lightning, the weather in general, seasons, sickness, etc. are just explained away with just-so stories.
Also, people are really scared of dying, so the lie that you get to be a magic ghost in happy land after you die is pretty comforting.
Also, people are really scared of dying, so the lie that you get to be a magic ghost in happy land after you die is pretty comforting.
Religion as a tool has certainly been used to channel great harm like a lot of other things. Non-religious societies have done great harm as well so the only real consistent pattern I've seen is that people in control will often spread evil given half a chance.
I've never been able to agree with the level of certainty that internet based atheists seem to have in their disbelief in intelligent design. Online communities are just as easily susceptible to "group think" as any religious community and there's still a strong element of "believe this or get out" just like in anything else (politics anyone?). Setting aside my personal beliefs, Agnosticism always seemed to me like the more logical conclusion of a purely existence based personal faith.
Organized religion though has some real major issues despite their charitable works. I believe there are decent individual churches, synagogues, mosques, etc. that do far more good than harm but these aren't the ones collaborating and funding politicians to support hatred and bigotry. Unfortunately, those good centers of belief are overwhelmingly outnumbered by the large congregations and their very deep pockets.
I've never been able to agree with the level of certainty that internet based atheists seem to have in their disbelief in intelligent design. Online communities are just as easily susceptible to "group think" as any religious community and there's still a strong element of "believe this or get out" just like in anything else (politics anyone?). Setting aside my personal beliefs, Agnosticism always seemed to me like the more logical conclusion of a purely existence based personal faith.
Organized religion though has some real major issues despite their charitable works. I believe there are decent individual churches, synagogues, mosques, etc. that do far more good than harm but these aren't the ones collaborating and funding politicians to support hatred and bigotry. Unfortunately, those good centers of belief are overwhelmingly outnumbered by the large congregations and their very deep pockets.
If religion remained more personal and played less into the "one true path" and need to then control and contort others to conform to that path, then it'd be fine. Sadly, that's not really the case and most major religions still push the all or nothing approach for the right of being a deity's chosen ones in the afterlife.
I appreciate religion as a template for people to live their lives by, but that's it.
I was raised Catholic, attending mass every Sunday. Our church would take second collections and announce that it would go to things like feeding the hungry. Then they started using it for renovations for the school, then the church, then they stopped announcing what they were for altogether. That's about the time I started disagreeing with the church as an organization.
I was raised Catholic, attending mass every Sunday. Our church would take second collections and announce that it would go to things like feeding the hungry. Then they started using it for renovations for the school, then the church, then they stopped announcing what they were for altogether. That's about the time I started disagreeing with the church as an organization.
They never do, they can spot the flaws of other religions a mile away, but have a mental block that prevents them from seeing the flaws in their own
We can. Pretty easily.
Religion as a concept and a practice is dangerous. It's primarily a method of control for those in power and that typically leads to bad things on Earth. People who reject ideas in favor of beliefs are scary as fuck.
People should be allowed to believe in whatever make-believe entities or stories they wish to, but it no one should not have to "respect" those beliefs and it should certainly have no influence in the public discourse or public policy. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying we shouldn't respect the people who hold these beliefs, but I don't need to respect anyones actual beliefs, since they are intangible ideas that lead other people to go "well then you have to respect my beliefs that it's okay to marry 12 year olds, or you have to respect my belief that all black people should be sent back to Africa". Beliefs do not need to be respected, only people do.
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I wasn't trying to take about it as a positive or negative, I want to talk about it as a whole withas little bias as possible from people's views on certain religions.
This is essentially how I feel.
Believing in God or a higher power is great. Living your life as a god loving spiritual person is great. Organized religion or pushing you beliefs into non believers is crap. Alls you have to do is look at the millions of examples of the horrible atrocities committed in the name of god throughout history.
Satan is cool. By simply standing for the opposite of Dogmatic Christianity, he becomes a good dude.
if it works for you fine, but I distrust any large organizations of people like this who build their life philosophy around misguided intentions and misunderstandings of texts from hundreds and hundreds of years ago.
go with god I suppose, but leave me the fuck alone.
go with god I suppose, but leave me the fuck alone.
This. I have no issues with religiousness. What I despise is proselytism and the institutionalization of organized religions.
Religion is the worst thing to ever happen to humanity. It's born out of superstition and ignorance and has been used to cause more harm then anything else in history and is a major contributor holding back humanity from making progress as a united civilization. Humankind might have a chance to survive and thrive long term if it could get past the divisions and hate all religion fosters.
I like the hope that religion gives to people. I like that, in the US at least, churches have become a community within a community. Some of these churches have done pretty amazing things for their neighborhoods and so on. There are legitimately good people out there doing good things in the name of God or their religion. That stuff is great. In that regard, I respect religion very much.
On the other hand, religion in the US has been the source of many problems. Things are often taken out of context and skewed to fit a horrible and hateful narrative. This isn't an uncommon thing, either. Even here in California, I've met people that said and did hateful things in the name of God. On top of that, religion is far too embedded in our lawmaking.
As a concept, I think religion can be a great thing. In practice, however, it's not always so great. Personally, I'm not religious. Most of my family is the same way, too. It wasn't really a thing for us.
On the other hand, religion in the US has been the source of many problems. Things are often taken out of context and skewed to fit a horrible and hateful narrative. This isn't an uncommon thing, either. Even here in California, I've met people that said and did hateful things in the name of God. On top of that, religion is far too embedded in our lawmaking.
As a concept, I think religion can be a great thing. In practice, however, it's not always so great. Personally, I'm not religious. Most of my family is the same way, too. It wasn't really a thing for us.
I personally know a lot of people who, with the help of their religion, have bettered their lives. I also know a lot of people who have garbage viewpoints that directly tie to their religion.
Growing up I was raised Catholic. I wouldn't consider myself Catholic anymore, I personally don't believe there is a higher power, or that Jesus was the direct descendant of God, but I still hold a lot of the values I learned in Catholic school. On a basic level the ideas most mainstream religions teach are great, and are basic ideas that I think are positive for humanity.
Religion is just like many other things where in the right hands it's great, in the wrong hands it's destructive. But I don't blame religion for it. Like I don't blame Islam and Muslims for groups like ISIS. I don't blame Christianity or Christians for people like the Westboro Baptist Church. Evil people will use anything to justify their garbage actions, religion is just a scapegoat.
I think religion has it's place. It shouldn't rule societies, but I think it's a good way for people to learn to care about themselves and others around them.
Growing up I was raised Catholic. I wouldn't consider myself Catholic anymore, I personally don't believe there is a higher power, or that Jesus was the direct descendant of God, but I still hold a lot of the values I learned in Catholic school. On a basic level the ideas most mainstream religions teach are great, and are basic ideas that I think are positive for humanity.
Religion is just like many other things where in the right hands it's great, in the wrong hands it's destructive. But I don't blame religion for it. Like I don't blame Islam and Muslims for groups like ISIS. I don't blame Christianity or Christians for people like the Westboro Baptist Church. Evil people will use anything to justify their garbage actions, religion is just a scapegoat.
I think religion has it's place. It shouldn't rule societies, but I think it's a good way for people to learn to care about themselves and others around them.
I feel like it's a relic of the past that a lot (certainly not most but a lot) of people use as an excuse to do awful things and hold horrible opinions while deflecting blame.
I think the world would be better off without religion and that it's holding us back scientifically and morally.
I think the world would be better off without religion and that it's holding us back scientifically and morally.
I think that religion can bring hope and comfort to people in very dark moments, it can encourage selfless behaviour and compassion. What it can also do is destroy people's ability to reason and think critically, foster great fear/animosity/cruelty and lead to great anguish when people's beliefs clash with the real world/their own decisions.
I think overall it's a negative influence on humanity but we are a very crude species and if there were no religion we would probably still have the same problems. We are animals and that will never change. Human nature is barbaric and virtuous in equal measure, religion is just one outlet for it.
I think overall it's a negative influence on humanity but we are a very crude species and if there were no religion we would probably still have the same problems. We are animals and that will never change. Human nature is barbaric and virtuous in equal measure, religion is just one outlet for it.
Organized religion is manipulative and total bullshit and we'd probably be a more progressed society if we had dumped it generations ago. But as long people keep their spiritual beliefs to themselves and their communities I'll not make too much of a fuss but when I starts to impact others outside of the religion I start having issues.
Hey, believe what you want but when you try to make or change laws based on what you think your imaginary friend wants we're gonna have a problem.
It is ignorance and the exploitation of the ignorant.
I will say that I can understand it as an aspect of someone's culture and thus plays a part in their lives(community, who doesn't love Holidays) but when you actually believe any of it is when I see it as a problem.
I will say that I can understand it as an aspect of someone's culture and thus plays a part in their lives(community, who doesn't love Holidays) but when you actually believe any of it is when I see it as a problem.
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You can, you're not everyone else, what applies to you doesn't apply to everyone else.
From my perspective the problem isn't "religion" in and of itself, but when people forget to maintain independent thought or when people coop religion for their own purposes. Religions do a great job of providing stability in people's lives, providing a sense of optimism, community, and a chance to experience something greater than the individual self. From a historical perspective religions are responsible for the development moral and ethical reasoning, for easing the suffering of the burdens of life, to this day are the world's most important sources of charity, and believe or not were major movers of human progress (for example, both Christianity and Islam were very progressive compared to what they replaced. The word pagan literally means "hick" in Latin).
That has nothing to do with religion in all fairness. From politics to dating, people are incredibly bad at understanding the holes in their own perspectives or behavior.
Like many others have mentioned, I have a problems with organized religion. I have personal experience with Jehovah's Witnesses for example. It isn't limited to Christians. Many organized religions, theistic and not, have major problems.
As far as non toxic beliefs such as one in a creator god, I have no problem with. It's completely fine as long as one's beliefs aren't harming others or oneself. I'm a Buddhist. It helps remind me that we are all brothers and sisters and to have empathy for every living being. Too often people lose sight of this. It's helped me a lot.
As far as non toxic beliefs such as one in a creator god, I have no problem with. It's completely fine as long as one's beliefs aren't harming others or oneself. I'm a Buddhist. It helps remind me that we are all brothers and sisters and to have empathy for every living being. Too often people lose sight of this. It's helped me a lot.
Polytheist here. Was raised Methodist, didn't work out. And like many of us here I'm not a big fan of organized religion.
However my personal practice has really helped me quite a bit. And I know many other Pagans who are happy as well.
However my personal practice has really helped me quite a bit. And I know many other Pagans who are happy as well.
The good things people point to about organised religion - having the comfort of being part of a community, getting together for a meeting/chat/sing-song/heart-to-heart - all these are great things. But can be achieved without the need to belittle and exploit people and make enemies of others. Any "comfort" people get from imagining there is something after this life is a brittle, cruel joke - no different to mediums and spirtualists who prey on vulnerable people. Again, that comfort comes with a cost - some people are the chosen ones, and others are automatically demonised - it's not a level playing field. Mostly religion comes down to geography and family - Where you were born and who to. Literally a postcode lottery for the vast majority. Wrapped up with religion are feelings of family and community duty, so even if people personally don't believe, they might often still go through the motions to keep up appearances, which would be fine except that they are still counted amongst the believers and thus strengthen the whole rotten infrastructure.
Even believers aren't truly fooled by it in their heart-of-hearts because no one really knows and beliefs are not facts. We're living in a time where feelings and beliefs are seen by many as more important than provable facts and that's fucked up - religion gives some kind of dellusional legitimacy to hang peoples fears on - as if some vague, cherry-picked, dusty book cribbed from prehistoric mythology proves anything other than the people who wrote it knew barely anything about the world around them. The wind is a demon, a drought is divine punishment. It's nonsense and a cancer on humanity. It's not just holding us back, it's dragging us down and that so many people are gleefully cheering that on is sick.
People can imagine and believe whatever they want - but it shouldn't be given credence. It shouldn't be given tax breaks. It should be "ok, that's nice, well on to the real matters of the day...."
Even believers aren't truly fooled by it in their heart-of-hearts because no one really knows and beliefs are not facts. We're living in a time where feelings and beliefs are seen by many as more important than provable facts and that's fucked up - religion gives some kind of dellusional legitimacy to hang peoples fears on - as if some vague, cherry-picked, dusty book cribbed from prehistoric mythology proves anything other than the people who wrote it knew barely anything about the world around them. The wind is a demon, a drought is divine punishment. It's nonsense and a cancer on humanity. It's not just holding us back, it's dragging us down and that so many people are gleefully cheering that on is sick.
People can imagine and believe whatever they want - but it shouldn't be given credence. It shouldn't be given tax breaks. It should be "ok, that's nice, well on to the real matters of the day...."
I think religion is a human invention to deal with the stress of living and death. Noble goals, but like anything else with power structures, easily subverted.
In general, I don't think the world actually needs religion, but strong social bonds. Personally, I feel like most religious people are fooling themselves for any number of reasons as the questions they seek answers for are impossible for humans to discern or understand.
As long as you're not pushing your shit on others or hurting people, I don't really care what you choose to believe.
In general, I don't think the world actually needs religion, but strong social bonds. Personally, I feel like most religious people are fooling themselves for any number of reasons as the questions they seek answers for are impossible for humans to discern or understand.
As long as you're not pushing your shit on others or hurting people, I don't really care what you choose to believe.
Far too exploitable for me to give any credence to.
It all boils down to "Give me your money cause God told me to. And maybe kill/hate some folks too."
Not really for me. And I mean, I believe in God but organized religion can go fuck itself.
It all boils down to "Give me your money cause God told me to. And maybe kill/hate some folks too."
Not really for me. And I mean, I believe in God but organized religion can go fuck itself.
Used to be a militant anti-theist.
Now I realize "religion" is a really broad concept with a lot of different meanings in different cultures. Also I realize what I'm actually opposed to is not something like fundamentalist Christianity per-se but the bigger concept of blind belief in dogma. That's a key component of a lot of religions, but can also often be found in other places, like the ends of the political spectrum.
Now I realize "religion" is a really broad concept with a lot of different meanings in different cultures. Also I realize what I'm actually opposed to is not something like fundamentalist Christianity per-se but the bigger concept of blind belief in dogma. That's a key component of a lot of religions, but can also often be found in other places, like the ends of the political spectrum.
Yeah. The only really problematic part of most religions is the idea that there's is the one truth and endgame for all people. That idea shows up in lots of places, not just religion.
Wow, what varied views on this site. It's good to see a non-uniformity of opinions. It gets bad when all people think the same.
There are a lot of posts here about 'organised religion'. Many people use that term but don't really define it. What do you mean by organised religion? What do you want the alternative to be? Disorganized religion, unorganized religion, private religions? I recon a better term would be institutionalized religion.
If some person invents a religion and then another person decides to follow it, does it go from being a personal/private to organised religion? I fail to see how organised religions are necessarily more harmful than private ones. A dude could have their own religion and it could be super harmful. A bung of hippies could have an organised religion and be super peaceful to humanity.
There are a lot of posts here about 'organised religion'. Many people use that term but don't really define it. What do you mean by organised religion? What do you want the alternative to be? Disorganized religion, unorganized religion, private religions? I recon a better term would be institutionalized religion.
If some person invents a religion and then another person decides to follow it, does it go from being a personal/private to organised religion? I fail to see how organised religions are necessarily more harmful than private ones. A dude could have their own religion and it could be super harmful. A bung of hippies could have an organised religion and be super peaceful to humanity.
You don't sound like an atheist to me.
Primitive compared to modern philosophies. Dangerous when taken to extremes. But it can bring people together, much like everything.
That is correct, although it is worth remembering that enforcing athesim can be just as dangerous
Same, good to know I'm not all alone here.
Organized religion means it's institutionalised with offical dogma, leadership etc. Non-organised religion are completely decentralised. The may organise in small groups, but that's about it.
Neo-Paganism are the most common example of Non-organised religions.
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I am and I don't think I would fall into the average/normal person category (I hope this doesn't come off as if I think am special or some shit). I seem to hold too many minority views.
Religion isn't going away, and no one is 100% rational, but quality education makes it more likely you can apply rational thinking to important problems. Education is the best way to combat domestic religious extremism. Religion should also be strictly kept out of governance, no federal funds for religious private schools, no opening prayer in our legislatures, etc.
There are good psychological benefits with some aspects of religion, some good stories that can relate important ethical lessons, and while not needed for community organization, there are many religious facilities and groups that have been good for such things. Preservation of aspects of various cultures has also been an important aspect of many religions.
There are good psychological benefits with some aspects of religion, some good stories that can relate important ethical lessons, and while not needed for community organization, there are many religious facilities and groups that have been good for such things. Preservation of aspects of various cultures has also been an important aspect of many religions.
