We need to have a talk on how we treat sexual assault victims on this site

[Deleted member 2145]

Welp, my thread got locked. I tried. Sorry to the survivors in here, I thought it was important for you to see how the site really felt, for better or worse.

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I think the thing is we already have more than enough to go on to know how the site really feels, not necessarily every poster's opinion in aggregate but the literal culture of discourse on the site that's been fostered over the years. it's like any other topic, it doesn't matter how many people actually like or dislike whatever video game or blockbuster movie it's about the people who dominate the discussion and how the discussion is handled by the forum itself. except it's about actual victims in this instance, not some popcorn flick or video game. it's about acknowledgement and positive change at this point. we already know.

 

[RedMercury]

You should take some solace in the fact that the vast majority of people seemed to agree.

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I do, I hope that's a positive for everyone. You can find ten percent of jerks just about anywhere.

 

[timedesk]

It seems clear that the mods need to do more to protect victims on this site. Biden's nomination and subsequent endorsements has clearly emboldened some people to dismiss or demonize victims who feel uncomfortable voting for him. I don't know what I can personally do for people here who feel unsafe or anxious because of this. With everything horrible that's happening now the last thing you should have to suffer is obnoxious moralistic hostility. I know this issue extends far beyond just the election and related topics, but punishing abusive and dismissive posts against survivors would be the least moderation could do to improve the culture here.

 

[firehawk12]

What's happening here is literally what happened on the other forum. I guess being the Democratic nominee gets you mod immunity.

 

[TaySan]

I do, I hope that's a positive for everyone. You can find ten percent of jerks just about anywhere.

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Thank you again for your efforts.

 

[Surfinn]

You should take some solace in the fact that the vast majority of people seemed to agree.

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Almost all major recent threads about this/Biden have gone down the shitter (including the thread that was just closed), and even this thread ended up devolving into victims being pressured to vote for an alleged rapist, completely ignoring the purpose of the OP.

Those who bully, harass and minimize victims should feel pressure, not the other way around. A single poll doesn't represent the reality of the situation, and it doesn't mean that those who voted yes don't also engage in said behaviors.

 

[aerie]

What's happening here is literally what happened on the other forum. I guess being the Democratic nominee gets you mod immunity.

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There are and have been plenty of bans being given out, and we're still reviewing dozens and dozens of reports. We also have to make sure that marginalized and minority folk have a voice in all of this, while working to try to make sexual assault victims feel safe. I don't like to talk about this publicly, and I don't say this to erase any mistakes, simply to share my perspective, but I am a queer member of staff, and a sexual assault victim, and all of this is very close to home for me.

 

[Pixieking]

What's happening here is literally what happened on the other forum. I guess being the Democratic nominee gets you mod immunity.

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Errr... You mean, where Hillary (who raped no-one) was endorsed by the forum over Trump (who has multiple allegations of rape against him, as well as entering the dressing rooms of girls (not women) unannounced)?

You get that that (once again in this forum's hot-takes about the Biden allegation) shits on Trumps multiple victims, right?

Edit: Misuse of the word literally threw me here.

 

[Cyclonesweep]

Wanna come in and apologize for some comments I made earlier. I didn't realize how bad it had gotten here, or how bad some of my comments would come across. I'm not going to try and resay what I did, or defend myself for them. Sometimes politics really rile me up and I don't actually pay attention to what I am really saying.

To the person I made the suggestion to move, that entire post was made terrible and my train of thought didn't come across. And I want to apologize for that one as well, I hope that thing get better for you and America starts to become a place where you can be more comfortable in and doesn't make you feel the negative way you do.

I'll do more to be an ally here and call out those who are being awful towards you.

 

[Quzar]

Errr... You mean, where Hillary (who raped no-one) was endorsed by the forum over Trump (who has multiple allegations of rape against him, as well as entering the dressing rooms of girls (not women) unannounced)?

You get that that (once again in this forum's hot-takes about the Biden allegation) shits on Trumps multiple victims, right?

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Just leave, like turn off your monitor and go do something else. What are you doing?

 

[Mekanos]

Errr... You mean, where Hillary (who raped no-one) was endorsed by the forum over Trump (who has multiple allegations of rape against him, as well as entering the dressing rooms of girls (not women) unannounced)?

You get that that (once again in this forum's hot-takes about the Biden allegation) shits on Trumps multiple victims, right?

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They're talking about Evilore.

 

[Pixieking]

They're talking about Evilore.

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Oh, so this situation is not

literally what happened on the other forum.

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I do apologise.

After all, we didn't just start a whole new forum because of a mod revolt against EL.

 

[BADMAN]

There are and have been plenty of bans being given out, and we're still reviewing dozens and dozens of reports. We also have to make sure that marginalized and minority folk have a voice in all of this, while working to try to make sexual assault victims feel safe. I don't like to talk about this publicly, and I don't say this to erase any mistakes, simply to share my perspective, but I am a queer member of staff, and a sexual assault victim, and all of this is very close to home for me.

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I mean, it's true to an extend though. That Cenk thread made it clear that any support of him or his sexist and racist comments was met with a ban. Biden literally raped someone. I'm not saying what's right and what's wrong here because it's not my website to police, but if Biden wasn't the presumptive democratic nominee, there'd be a lot more bans.

 

[Mekanos]

Oh, so this situation is not



I do apologise.

After all, we didn't just start a whole new forum because of a mod revolt against EL.

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You aren't helping.

 

[IBLiSTRiGGER]

Wanna come in and apologize for some comments I made earlier. I didn't realize how bad it had gotten here, or how bad some of my comments would come across. I'm not going to try and resay what I did, or defend myself for them. Sometimes politics really rile me up and I don't actually pay attention to what I am really saying.

To the person I made the suggestion to move, that entire post was made terrible and my train of thought didn't come across. And I want to apologize for that one as well, I hope that thing get better for you and America starts to become a place where you can be more comfortable in and doesn't make you feel the negative way you do.

I'll do more to be an ally here and call out those who are being awful towards you.

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i forgive you.

for the record, i don't think you were being snide. i understood what you meant. your intention was pure, i could see that. but the sad truth is that, regardless of what i want, the industry i work in has a rockbed in america and basically only america -- and even still, it's my home, you know? i'd rather fight for it to be a better place than run away. i've done enough of that in my life.

thank you, though. it takes a lot to admit you were in the wrong lane. i appreciate it.

 

[aerie]

I mean, it's true to an extend though. That Cenk thread made it clear that any support of him or his sexist and racist comments was met with a ban. Biden literally raped someone. I'm not saying what's right and what's wrong here because it's not my website to police, but if Biden wasn't the presumptive democratic nominee, there'd be a lot more bans.

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No one was banned for supporting Cenk. People were banned for downplaying his sexist and racist comments and remarks.

edit: edited for clarity

 

[Pixieking]

You aren't helping.

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Again, I do apologise.

 

[Mekanos]

No one was banned for supporting Cenk.

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Bernie Sanders endorsed TYT founder and carpetbagger Cenk Uygur in CA 25 Congressional Race (UP: Sanders retracts endorsement) [SEE STAFF POST]

Good on Bernie. US Congress need more people that dont take bribes from corporations.

www.resetera.com

?

 

[RedMercury]

There are and have been plenty of bans being given out, and we're still reviewing dozens and dozens of reports. We also have to make sure that marginalized and minority folk have a voice in all of this, while working to try to make sexual assault victims feel safe. I don't like to talk about this publicly, and I don't say this to erase any mistakes, simply to share my perspective, but I am a queer member of staff, and a sexual assault victim, and all of this is very close to home for me.

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Thank you for keeping everyone up to date, it can be easy for people to feel kind of forgotten. I hope you feel like there's a good community here where if you ever need to unload, there's people who care and will listen.

 

[BDS]

Guys just...ban people who tell others to vote for Biden after they express reservations about his allegations. It's not hard.

 

[TaySan]

There are and have been plenty of bans being given out, and we're still reviewing dozens and dozens of reports. We also have to make sure that marginalized and minority folk have a voice in all of this, while working to try to make sexual assault victims feel safe. I don't like to talk about this publicly, and I don't say this to erase any mistakes, simply to share my perspective, but I am a queer member of staff, and a sexual assault victim, and all of this is very close to home for me.

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I just want to say thank you. I know this is a difficult situation to moderate and i really do appreciate everything you guys do.

 

[Cyclonesweep]

i forgive you.

for the record, i don't think you were being snide. i understood what you meant. your intention was pure, i could see that. but the sad truth is that, regardless of what i want, the industry i work in has a rockbed in america and basically only america -- and even still, it's my home, you know? i'd rather fight for it to be a better place than run away. i've done enough of that in my life.

thank you, though. it takes a lot to admit you were in the wrong lane. i appreciate it.

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Thank you.

I'm not the greatest with words and I can say the right thing, wrong without even noticing.

And I do get it. America is your home and you shouldn't have to run away, I just hate people suffering because of their surroundings. With other places being better for things like this, that should at least give you some hope that America can get there.

 

[aerie]

Bernie Sanders endorsed TYT founder and carpetbagger Cenk Uygur in CA 25 Congressional Race (UP: Sanders retracts endorsement) [SEE STAFF POST]

Good on Bernie. US Congress need more people that dont take bribes from corporations.

www.resetera.com

?

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That is the latter half of my statement with the surrounding context.

 

[Mekanos]

That is the latter half of my quote with the surrounding context.

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I really don't understand the difference to be honest but I leave that decision up to the mod team.

I hope the mod team are willing to make some difficult choices because this is going to be talked about a lot until November (hell, past that if Biden wins). I don't envy the position they're in but decisions have to be made on what is acceptable to host discussions on and what isn't. Certain politicians and media personalities are not allowed to be discussed here because of the harmful rhetoric they engage in. What is the line when both candidates for President are credibly accused rapists?

 

[Pixieking]

That is the latter half of my statement with the surrounding context.

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Sorry, it may be because I've just woken up (see cock-up I made above for proof of sleepiness), but what happens if someone says

Hopefully Biden wins.

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Instead of

Hopefully Cenk wins.

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Going by how I read your post, that would be ban-worthy because of "downplaying etc etc", and would indeed come across as being banned for supporting a candidate.

Sorry to put you on the spot like this, but moderation on this seems to have taken another turn?

 

[Deleted member 2145]

it does seem like there isn't very much consistency with which the parameters of discussion are set regarding certain people and personalities

this forum has wholesale banned discussion of certain people for tweets, which is fine, but then walk on eggshells regarding people of actual means and power, people with actual legacies of pain and destruction, people with horrendous wrongdoings, sometimes criminal

I don't know what the answer is because I feel like as long as you have a forum that has both video game and entertainment talk alongside current events and politics there's always going to be a certain kind of baked-in hypocrisy for the discipline that's doled but the problem seems clear, at least

 

[Wilsongt]

Guys just...ban people who tell others to vote for Biden after they express reservations about his allegations. It's not hard.

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Isn't vote shaming either way already a bannable offense?

And isn't backseat modding frowned upon?

 

[firehawk12]

There are and have been plenty of bans being given out, and we're still reviewing dozens and dozens of reports. We also have to make sure that marginalized and minority folk have a voice in all of this, while working to try to make sexual assault victims feel safe. I don't like to talk about this publicly, and I don't say this to erase any mistakes, simply to share my perspective, but I am a queer member of staff, and a sexual assault victim, and all of this is very close to home for me.

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I appreciate that the staff may be thinking about this behind the scenes and that we're not going to be privy to those discussions, but I hope everyone remembers how things unfolded previously and why this forum was created in the first place. I appreciate the stakes are different between the next President and internet drama, but privileging a position of addressing allegations only when it's politically convenient sends a terrible message that is exactly reminiscent of the very reason people came to this forum in the first place.

 

[Deleted member 8644]

that new thread is gonna go well.

Already calling victims of rape/sexual assault "privileged"

very cool.

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I dmed a mod about doing something about calling people you disagree with privileged when you have no idea what they're going through, "thank you for your input" but no answer. I posted it in a couple of threads, completely ignored. I talked about it when I appealed my recent ban (which was only 3 days so who cares about that) after losing my shit at another person posting bullshit like that. Ignored again.
Moderation seems to only care if you're a straight up monster about it.

 

[Lentic]

Guys just...ban people who tell others to vote for Biden after they express reservations about his allegations. It's not hard.

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Yeah. I thought we had reached a conclusion that shaming either way was not acceptable, but the messaging has been unclear. One day it's not ok and the next day people are allowed to do it as much as they want.

It really isn't that hard for posters to speak for themselves and their own perspective without stepping on others. Moderating this forum is going to get harder and harder long term if this continues.

 

[Kyuuji]

From the above and reading the posts over the past half day it seems to be understood that if we just call it privilege (😉) we can have as many people as we like dismiss and shame people for it.

 

[Truant]

Honestly, I feel kinda bad that just reading the OP had me shocked. Maybe it's just the threads I frequent, but I was genuinely under the impression that the toxic posts referred to in the OP were shut down really fast and not tolerated on Era.

 

[Kyuuji]

Honestly, I feel kinda bad that just reading the OP had me shocked. Maybe it's just the threads I frequent, but I was genuinely under the impression that the toxic posts referred to in the OP were shut down really fast and not tolerated on Era.

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As is commonly the issue the out and out abrasive posts are dealt with but the ones employing slightly more tact around how they word things often skirt under the radar. When it was written in the warning for not shaming people that the 'ban length would be dependent on the tone and content of the post' it really just amplified a message of "if you're going to shame people, do it graciously" to me.

 

[Pixieking]

As is commonly the issue the out and out abrasive posts are dealt with but the ones employing slightly more tact around how they word things often skirt under the radar. When it was written in the warning for not shaming people that the 'ban length would be dependent on the tone and content of the post' it really just amplified a message of "if you're going to shame people, do it graciously" to me.

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I mean, yeah, but this subject is not the only one where this occurs - a post inferring Biden was a paedophile in another thread wasn't actioned (never got a reply to my report answering why), and you can also infer Biden has dementia, as long as you don't use that actual word.

Honestly, "We need to have a talk on the moderation of this forum" is absolutely a thread that should exist.

 

[TaySan]

Great now victims are apparently privileged. I'm sorry, but I'm done. These people only care about victims when it's convenient for them.

 

[Seductivpancakes]

Great now victims are apparently privileged. I'm sorry, but I'm done. These people only care about victims when it's convenient for them.

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I'm about to keep a list of names of people who repeat this shitty behavior.

 

[Deleted member 4274]

Great now victims are apparently privileged. I'm sorry, but I'm done. These people only care about victims when it's convenient for them.

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I've been seeing this sentiment here for a few weeks now. Called it out a few weeks ago.

 

[MegaManTrigger]

I must say, as someone who was banned for bringing up Biden's dodgy history in the thread (I admit I was angry, because there were people in that thread who tried to minimize what Biden was accused of). I'm utterly disgusted that nothing was done to people who voter shamed under the guise of "b-b-but no Trump!" as if we're supposed to ignore the voices of those who underwent sexual assault.

I know my record isn't spotty, but I almost feel like the bans were politically motivated rather than allowing for voices to be heard.

 

[unknownspectator]

Great now victims are apparently privileged. I'm sorry, but I'm done. These people only care about victims when it's convenient for them.

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I'm a firm believer that actions speak louder than words and it's clear what they truely care about sadly. For what it's worth, you all got my support. I like to believe that the mostly silent mods are discussing this and will do something eventually but I don't know if they even will. I know a couple of them posted in this very thread but It's not enough. Far from it.

also, I legit chuckle everytime I see your username seductivepancakes, I don't know the story behind it but you've put a smile on my face today once more, thank you :D.

btw, how do you create tags to make a post hidden from lurkers?

 

[Deleted member 11413]

Great now victims are apparently privileged. I'm sorry, but I'm done. These people only care about victims when it's convenient for them.

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So people on this forum are actually, unironically invoking the same sentiment from that ghoulish 'privilege pyramid' article?

Fucking gross.

 

[CatDoggo]

It's been so fucking depressing watching this play out.

 

[Eighthours]

There is literally no proof that Biden raped or sexually assaulted Tara Reade, correct? So why is he being labelled guilty automatically by so many on this forum? The allegation is hardly cut and dried, stories have been changed, it's problematic as hell. There's a big difference between being disgusting towards victims and questioning an allegation.

 

[Seductivpancakes]

There is literally no proof that Biden raped or sexually assaulted Tara Reade, correct? So why is he being labelled guilty automatically by so many on this forum? The allegation is hardly cut and dried, stories have been changed, it's problematic as hell. There's a big difference between being disgusting towards victims and questioning an allegation.

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Did you come in here hoping to win against victims or something.

Looking at your post count and join date, I'd say yes.

 

[TaySan]

There is literally no proof that Biden raped or sexually assaulted Tara Reade, correct? So why is he being labelled guilty automatically by so many on this forum? The allegation is hardly cut and dried, stories have been changed, it's problematic as hell. There's a big difference between being disgusting towards victims and questioning an allegation.

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The onus is on Biden to come out and clear his name and so far there has been nothing, but silence from his campaign. So it's perfectly understandable that victims don't feel comfortable voting for someone with such a heavy allegation and they should not be shamed for it.

Did you come in here hoping to win against victims or something.

Looking at your post count and join date, I'd say yes.

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The other thread is getting bad too with this. :(

 

[Teggy]

The onus is on Biden to come out and clear his name and so far there has been nothing, but silence from his campaign.

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Serious question, what does an acceptable response from the Biden campaign look like?

 

[Kyuuji]

Is a little remarkable to witness how shaming victims because of their voting intention became a non-issue overnight because people just started calling everyone who doesn't want to vote Biden privileged and insulting or belittling them that way.

It's not like it's exactly subtle.

 

[Terra Torment]

Serious question, what does an acceptable response from the Biden campaign look like?

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Stepping down and directing his delegates to nominate another centrist.

 

[Deleted member 11413]

Is remarkable how shaming victims because of their voting intention became a non-issue overnight because people just started calling everyone who doesn't want to vote Biden privileged and insulting or belittling them that way.

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That argument has never made sense anyway because marginalized people are far more likely to be non-voters. It is especially gross in this context though.

 

[RedMercury]

There is literally no proof that Biden raped or sexually assaulted Tara Reade, correct? So why is he being labelled guilty automatically by so many on this forum? The allegation is hardly cut and dried, stories have been changed, it's problematic as hell. There's a big difference between being disgusting towards victims and questioning an allegation.

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Please leave this thread.

 

[TaySan]

Serious question, what does an acceptable response from the Biden campaign look like?

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If i were Biden i would step down from running and nominate another candidate, but obviously that is never going to happen. So now we have a potential rapist as a nominee.