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Chettlar

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,604
I guess I just don't think much of it at all. Probably in the minority with that opinion, though, based on some of the responses.

I used to think it wasn't anything special. I tried playing it a bit on my own and it seemed very basic. What was the point of doing anything? I think I'd seen so many imitators nothing it did seemed all that special. It kinda felt like the Seinfield effect. Where a younger person might go back and watch it and not think it's funny because all the jokes have been ripped off to death since.

It wasn't until some friends dragged me into it, and I started with a few small goals, that slowly it sunk its teeth into me, that I started to realize how smartly designed it was. There is a reason it is so popular. It is incredibly deep with a good learning curve. It's designed to encourage your creativity, even if it has to coax it out of you, you boring adult (like me), over time.

We once had an amazing experience where one of our friends got separated from us by thousands of blocks in the Nether via a rare bug no one seems to have heard of. I realize that bug obviously wasn't intended, but it lead to something that sort of was, a crazy wild expedition through the Nether to save him (The nether is the underworld of minecraft, and you go there via a portal. Every one block you go in the nether equals 8 blocks in the above world. So two portals 100 blocks apart equals 800 blocks in the main world). The adventure to save him that ensued was unlike any other I have ever experienced. Three of us suiting up and traversing this wild untamed wilderness, truly a wilderness that no human hand designed, having to make our way through was absolutely exhilarating and I will always remember it. This experience couldn't be created if it was a human crafted world. But the algorithm minecraft uses is so expertly designed, it never feels off or procedurally generated. And again, that's not all of the game. The game is built within that world and tailored to making sure your experience in that world is fun.

At the end, we not only rescued him, but we found he had gotten somehow stuck in the biggest Nether fortress we'd ever seen. We looted the place, and all of us headed back, finding some new pathways that would lead the way for a literal highway between where we'd started and this far far off nether fortress. Eventually my buddy built a massive ice highway, which you could apparently travel via boat and traverse in less than a minute. We went to the overworld at the fortress and the above ground had a fantastic area with a lot of resources we didn't have easy access at home. So then we started working out a little system of getting things back and forth. The building of that system was so much fun. Everyone contributed different things to make it happen.

It was just such a wonderful adventure. No other game really provides that. Minecraft is designed to ensure that your time in that world is fun and engaging. It gives you systems that are easy to get into and are well balanced to ensure you always have something to pursue. You can set up a basic goal, starting small, and the game will help make that goal happen, while gently nudging you towards grander ones. It is a huge rabbit hole to get into.

Most survival games I personally do not find fun at all. They are always very one note and always very limited. To me the "depth" doesn't feel intuitive at all. They're also pains in the ass. And a lot of procedural games are just empty slates. A lot of pointlessness. A lot of dead ends. Their systems usually end up feeling convoluted and arbitrary. They're always full of a lot of dumb bullshit. They always need constant updates to be fun and not get boring right away. But when you look at Minecraft, it's so naturally deep and all about overcoming pains in the ass with your own problem solving. It doesn't have any of the dumb bullshit. And it doesn't even need updates to be fun. 1.0 was a lot of fun. The updates just seem like bonuses. Kinda like Tetris.

If you look at the vast swathe of games that try to do things that Minecraft does, whether focusing on one area or trying to imitate it directly, and you see how they fail, then you start to have an appreciation for the fact that Minecraft makes it feel so effortless. That takes real skill, and there's a reason it resonates with so many people.

Sometimes something is super popular because it's like potato chips, like marvel movies. Low effort, low investment, easy to munch on for fun. Broad surface level appeal. But other times something is super popular because it speaks to something so many people have and so expertly handles it, with a natural depth that appeals to both casual players and to the more hard core players it pulls in, including from the casual side.
 

lvl 99 Pixel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,844
I think my biggest gripes were Witcher 3 and Arkham in the top 10, and God of War 2018 and Animal Crossing New Horizons in the top 20. And the Mario and Zelda choices felt too old. Symphony of the Night is a good pick, as is ME2. Bloodborne is the best From Software game. I personally am very down with Super Smash Bros Ultimate as high as it is; it's a wonderfully designed game.

I think people should stop ranking these and just put out equal lists if the best games of all time. There are too many good choices for these lists and the differences between them and how they're ranked feel minuscule at this point.

Mario and Zelda are too old but SOTN isn't when the metroidvania genre has been popping off? Recency Bias is worse than legacy bias imo.
 

Heruderu

Member
Oct 29, 2017
694
Minecraft in first place, Ocarina of Time and no BotW, Super Mario 64 instead of Galaxy or Super Mario World, Arkham City and Animal Crossing NH being there...

Yeah, I don't agree with these choices, but most of the games they picked deserve to be there. I just think that I would accept Tetris, Ocarina of Time, Half-life 2 or The Witcher 3 in first place way more than Minecraft. Fine by me if Minecraft is top 5, but first place is too much xD
 

Tavernade

Tavernade
Moderator
Sep 18, 2018
8,735
My only problem with this list is Arkham City, at least insofar as Asylum is better.

Good variety and seems to be concerning itself with importance/impact as much as anything else.
 

Dogo Mojo

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,179
It's not hard to see how many could view Minecraft as the best game of all time.Lego has been around forever and many still love them, Minecraft is basically digital Legos. That's not even mentioning the fact that you have a lot of people by now who will associate gaming more with Minecraft than they will character platformers like Mario or Sonic.

It's not the list I would put up, but I can see pretty much all of these games on the list having a decent impact on people's gaming history.
 

gfbandito

One Winged Slayer
Member
Apr 5, 2020
745
I'd be willing to entertain Minecraft anywhere in the top 10, had they not taken away the ability to quit without saving and disable autosaving.
 

Sonicfan1373

Member
Nov 24, 2017
783
Not a bad list.

Mine would be different (as would pretty much many other people) but I can see why someone would enjoy the games mentioned here enough to put them in their top 20. Not sure about some of the comments here though, this all subjective after all.
 

Ogopogo

Member
Sep 4, 2019
27
I really don't find it strange that one game released in the last year is what they consider to be one of the best 20 games of all time.
How do you not find that strange? If someone gives you a list of their 20 greatest movies of ALL TIME and Tenet is on there, how in the world do you take that list seriously? Or what if their respective list of greatest video games had The Avengers on it. I think one of the criteria for anything on a GREATEST OF ALL TIME list should be its ability to stand the test of time. That's why you see SO many lists with Mario 64 and Ocarina of Time and nobody bats an eyelash, because those games have stood the test of time. Maybe a list with New Horizons on it isn't "strange" per se but nobody's going to take a list like that seriously.
 

Psamtik

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,920
I've slowly come around on Arkham City versus Asylum. Nothing in Asylum is as good as the Mr. Freeze boss fight in City.
 

RiOrius

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,088
How do you not find that strange? If someone gives you a list of their 20 greatest movies of ALL TIME and Tenet is on there, how in the world do you take that list seriously? Or what if their respective list of greatest video games had The Avengers on it. I think one of the criteria for anything on a GREATEST OF ALL TIME list should be its ability to stand the test of time. That's why you see SO many lists with Mario 64 and Ocarina of Time and nobody bats an eyelash, because those games have stood the test of time. Maybe a list with New Horizons on it isn't "strange" per se but nobody's going to take a list like that seriously.
You yourself put it at sixty years total, right? So if we're picking twenty games, statistically we'd expect about a one in three chance of there being a game from any given year, including 2020. That's not super weird. Plus you'd expect that game developers would be improving: they're be learning, getting better and refining. Yeah, some games have aged better than others, and not every game in a series is an upgrade over its predecessor, but even the classics have aged, while games that just came out haven't aged at all, which gives them a legitimate comparative advantage over games that are old.

Yes, there's recency bias, but I also see a lot of recency backlash/sepia bias. The idea that older things are better, and the new stuff is all focus tested garbage. That's the nonsense that I can't stand. There have been fantastic games in the last couple of years. I haven't played Animal Crossing (not my style) so I can't speak to it, but I'm not going to disbelieve its quality just because it's new.
 

OzBoz

Member
May 29, 2019
447
A WatchMojo list that is n things out of the top 100 most popular things, what will they think of next?

Pretty funny that they chose the first entry in many long-running series, including the archaic Pokemon Red/Blue, but then they went for Mass Effect 2 over ME1.
 

Niosai

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,935
Honestly, this list is fine. I don't agree with all the choices, but I do agree with many/most of them. I wouldn't necessarily put them into this exact order, though. It's mainly missing BotW. Witcher III should be closer to 20 than 1.
 

ShinobiBk

One Winged Slayer
Member
Dec 28, 2017
10,129
20 amazing games?
I don't even like Minecraft at all but enough people play it for me to feel like I'm really in the minority on that
 

Ogopogo

Member
Sep 4, 2019
27
You yourself put it at sixty years total, right? So if we're picking twenty games, statistically we'd expect about a one in three chance of there being a game from any given year, including 2020. That's not super weird. Plus you'd expect that game developers would be improving: they're be learning, getting better and refining. Yeah, some games have aged better than others, and not every game in a series is an upgrade over its predecessor, but even the classics have aged, while games that just came out haven't aged at all, which gives them a legitimate comparative advantage over games that are old.

Yes, there's recency bias, but I also see a lot of recency backlash/sepia bias. The idea that older things are better, and the new stuff is all focus tested garbage. That's the nonsense that I can't stand. There have been fantastic games in the last couple of years. I haven't played Animal Crossing (not my style) so I can't speak to it, but I'm not going to disbelieve its quality just because it's new.
We're not talking about quality though. New Horizons is absolutely stellar. There's no arguing its "quality". What I'm saying is that I, personally, find a BEST OF ALL TIME list that has a brand new game on it hard to take seriously. Put New Horizon on a BEST OF 2020 list and I'd completely agree with it being there.
 

Cranster

Prophet of Truth
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
9,788
Refreshing to see a best of list with no call of duty games. Some odd omissions but otherwise a good list overall.
 

ShinobiBk

One Winged Slayer
Member
Dec 28, 2017
10,129
We're not talking about quality though. New Horizons is absolutely stellar. There's no arguing its "quality". What I'm saying is that I, personally, find a BEST OF ALL TIME list that has a brand new game on it hard to take seriously. Put New Horizon on a BEST OF 2020 list and I'd completely agree with it being there.
If I was making a personal best games of all times list after last year, Sekiro would be #1 because it is the best game I've ever played. Doesn't matter when it came out to me, if I feel it's the best game I've ever played, then that's what it is to me.
 

andresmoros

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,468
Houston
Look, AC:NH is probably one of my top 3 most hours in any game, ever, and I love it to death, but it's nowhere near top 50 ever at all. This list is shit. Minecraft is a huge franchise, but the best game ever? LOL. This is just a joke list anyway and not to be taken seriously because of its source.
 

Tpallidum

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,177
I rate the game selection 6/10
And the order of the items 4/10

Bad/average list overall

My personal list would include DotA/DotA 2
I'd include a Metroid
Mario World
Chrono Trigger!
I'd pick Arkham asylum over city
Smash ultimate is the best smash but it'd be closer to 20
I'd put RDR2 in there. Maybe instead of GTA5
SF2 is top 3. This is non negotiable
Probably halo 2 or 3 instead of 1
Resident Evil 4 higher
 
Jan 10, 2018
6,927
One of the better lists I've seen. Most of those games have had a huge impact on gaming. They might not be the best games today but that's not really relevant when you make a list like this.

I also don't like Minecraft personally but I can totally understand it being in the top 5 at least. Much, much more impactful than the usual story-focused singleplayer game that we see at the top of these lists.
 

Kieli

Self-requested ban
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
3,736
It's a decent list of games. There's one or two odd choices, but it ain't my list.
 

giapel

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,634
Tetris always kills me in these lists. Which Tetris? Not all of them are the same.
Also, Mario64 over... all the other 3D Marios? I mean it is a game of outmost importance in the history of videogames, but you'd think Nintendo made better games since... their very first attempt at a 3D platformer