Watchmen |OT| This is the Moment

[Deleted member 4274]

Will saw the WWI German propaganda his father brought back, and after the massacre in Tulsa he probably bought into the message. I don't think he's an actual Nazi, but in the late 1930's he's seeing the rise of the Nazi party in Germany and he's interested in their vision. Before WWII a lot of Americans were impressed/enamored with the "turnaround" Germany was experiencing

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no. There was no indication will fed into any Nazi ideology. He watched the bombing of Tulsa. He fought KKK member. Nah that's not it. I can't accept that. Maybe he said those things publicly... To get people off the trail, but it still doesn't make sense. Peteypedia mentions that Owls book was mostly bullshit.

 

[Deleted member 16657]

Going right into the trophy case alongside this first post

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Damn I remember that one too. Fine alright I'll follow you

 

[a Master Ninja]

The shot of Will seeing a vision of his parents bodies being dragged by the squad car of his fellow officers is the best in the show so far. I was floored by how brilliantly it was executed.

no. There was no indication will fed into any Nazi ideology. He watched the bombing of Tulsa. He fought KKK member. Nah that's not it. I can't accept that. Maybe he said those things publicly... To get people off the trail, but it still doesn't make sense. Peteypedia mentions that Owls book was mostly bullshit.

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I'm just saying that the Nazis' real deal wasn't widely known internationally at this time, so if Will bought into some flattering articles about them, and plenty really did exist, I wouldn't hold it against him.

 

[rusty chrome]

Yeah that was one of the best episodes of anything I've ever seen. My god this show is actually good, I'm so happy.

 

[Deleted member 2802]

What a doozy of an episode

Can't wait for them to unpack it all

 

[Hella]

I could've done without the entire flashback, it wasted an entire ep to establish like four relevant plot points. Well shot and all that, but it's so unnecessary.

Really wish they'd just cut to the chase. So much information is presented out of sequence for the sake of ~mystery~ and future reveals.

 

[ReginaldXIV]

What's the significance of all the romaine lettuce imagery and the 7K/KKK? HJ knocks one in to a bunch. Then there's the truck from episode 1 that LG discovers last episode. Red Scare (and maybe Pirate Jenny I forget) was eating some a couple of episodes ago. There may have been more but I haven't checked.

Makes me think Red and Jenny are agents of the 7K.

 

[ryutaro's mama]

Can we get a Will Reeves spin off show that just follows his exploits, plz?

 

[Deleted member 4090]

So just as an analogy to Watchmen, the "good guys" ultimately failed to stop the grand plan. So they're ultimately going to fail against mass brainwashing? Or is that only Plan A.0, and there's a second layer to it that is more wtf?

 

[Burt]

Will saw the WWI German propaganda his father brought back, and after the massacre in Tulsa he probably bought into the message. I don't think he's an actual Nazi, but in the late 1930's he's seeing the rise of the Nazi party in Germany and he's interested in their vision. Before WWII a lot of Americans were impressed/enamored with the "turnaround" Germany was experiencing.

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no. There was no indication will fed into any Nazi ideology. He watched the bombing of Tulsa. He fought KKK member. Nah that's not it. I can't accept that. Maybe he said those things publicly... To get people off the trail, but it still doesn't make sense. Peteypedia mentions that Owls book was mostly bullshit.

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I thought it was Nazism at first too, but someone pointed out to me after the first episode that it was WW1, prior to Nazism in Germany.

If you look at how him jumping out the window to escape the KKK got turned into him breaking in through the window to stop a robbery, you can see how facts can get distorted through time and perspective, all the way to their inverse. Will's sole heirloom from his KKK-murdered father was a piece of German propaganda-literature about the relative equality in Germany for people of color. During the rise of Nazism, he might've made an offhand remark that echoed his understandably cherished piece of propaganda. I'm not an expert on the history -- either in the specifics of the Watchmen-verse or our own -- but even something like Jesse Owens in the '36 Olympics in Berlin could've shaped his worldview or prompted a comment about the hypocrisy of America that eventually got warped into "So you love Nazis, huh, HUH?!?!".

He definitely wasn't a Nazi. He was a victim of heinous, systemic, omnipresent racial violence with an emotional attachment to a piece of not-inaccurate not-Nazi German propaganda and an extremely justifiable anger towards white America. One reflexive response calling out the bullshit in America's distaste for the treatment of German Jews in the early days under Hitler could've easily been twisted to frame his entire legacy.

Damn I remember that one too. Fine alright I'll follow you

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set your expectations low that's all I got in there

 

[Soap NickTavish]

While not my favorite episode from the standpoint of moving the present day plot along, it was still really well done. Some of the composite shots featuring Will's mixed up memories were just fantastic. Everything coming together with HJ's origin was awesome, especially the use of the white makeup forming the inverse of his granddaughter's face paint. I felt the reveal still respected and fit flush with the source material. Great hour of television.

Really wanna get things rolling with Angela and her grandpa, as well as Veidt and my boy LG, the latter of whom I unfortunately fear the worst for 😭

 

[Seesaw15]

I could've done without the entire flashback, it wasted an entire ep to establish like four relevant plot points. Well shot and all that, but it's so unnecessary.

Really wish they'd just cut to the chase. So much information is presented out of sequence for the sake of ~mystery~ and future reveals.

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Lol. No offense but why do you watch TV? Seems like you would enjoy a wiki summary more tbh.

 

[Tiger Priest]

Hm, it was a alright episode and very well shot but the retconning doesn't sit right with me since I always thought of HJ as a German Nazi sympathizer. I guess this whole show is an alternative universe anyway.

Question: if Fred was running this whole secretive KKK hypnosis factory why would he personally go and personally throw a molotov cocktail into a Jewish deli? I get that he's a racist and all but isn't that exposing their whole operation to needless risk? Couldn't he get an underling to do that?

 

[Hella]

Lol. No offense but why do you watch TV? Seems like you would enjoy a wiki summary more tbh.

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I mean, you're right. I don't know why I do.

Hm, it was a alright episode and very well shot but the retconning doesn't sit right with me since I always thought of HJ as a German Nazi sympathizer. I guess this whole show is an alternative universe anyway.

Question: if Fred was running this whole secretive KKK hypnosis factory why would he personally go and personally throw a molotov cocktail into a Jewish deli? I get that he's a racist and all but isn't that exposing their whole operation to needless risk? Couldn't he get an underling to do that?

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Wasn't he just a front man working for the org? He's the "legitimate businessman" that anyone would investigate, if they tried to look into cyclops.

That was my read of it, at least.

 

[krazen]

Hm, it was a alright episode and very well shot but the retconning doesn't sit right with me since I always thought of HJ as a German Nazi sympathizer. I guess this whole show is an alternative universe anyway.

Question: if Fred was running this whole secretive KKK hypnosis factory why would he personally go and personally throw a molotov cocktail into a Jewish deli? I get that he's a racist and all but isn't that exposing their whole operation to needless risk? Couldn't he get an underling to do that?

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The last part works because dilligently going after hate crimes wasn't a thing back then in comics...or reality, lol. Going back to how there was a Nazi rally in MSG around that area, its not crazy to assume a dude that has connections to cops could commit race based crimes with immunity since minorities have no way to push justice and the majority at the time didnt give a damn.

 

[Mariolee]

God what a fucking show.

That whole episode was just incredible.

 

[I KILL PXLS]

Hm, it was a alright episode and very well shot but the retconning doesn't sit right with me since I always thought of HJ as a German Nazi sympathizer. I guess this whole show is an alternative universe anyway.

Question: if Fred was running this whole secretive KKK hypnosis factory why would he personally go and personally throw a molotov cocktail into a Jewish deli? I get that he's a racist and all but isn't that exposing their whole operation to needless risk? Couldn't he get an underling to do that?

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Because he can. Who's going to stop or expose him? The police?

 

[Seesaw15]

Hm, it was a alright episode and very well shot but the retconning doesn't sit right with me since I always thought of HJ as a German Nazi sympathizer. I guess this whole show is an alternative universe anyway.

Question: if Fred was running this whole secretive KKK hypnosis factory why would he personally go and personally throw a molotov cocktail into a Jewish deli? I get that he's a racist and all but isn't that exposing their whole operation to needless risk? Couldn't he get an underling to do that?

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What risk? There's like two black officers on the force and everyone else is either racist or knows their place. He was untouchable so why not?

 

[Wracu]

While not my favorite episode from a story standpoint, it was still really well done. Some of the composite shots featuring Will's mixed up memories were just fantastic.

Really wanna get things rolling with Angels and her grandpa, as well as Veidt and my boy LG, the latter of whom I unfortunately fear the worst for 😭

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I'm sure Lube Man will save him. Or at least I hope...

 

[Tiger Priest]

What risk? There's like two black officers on the force and everyone else is either racist or knows their place. He was untouchable so why not?

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But they never even come back to it. It seemed like it had to be part of something bigger but it's like nope, he just randomly woke up one day and threw a molotov into a Jewish deli? I thought there was going to be some kind of Nazi connection with the WW2 news in the paper but then it didn't go anywhere and their plot had nothing to do with Jewish intimidation. Just seemed like a random convenient plot device.

 

[Shaun Solo]

But they never even come back to it. It seemed like it had to be part of something bigger but it's like nope, he just randomly woke up one day and threw a molotov into a Jewish deli? I thought there was going to be some kind of Nazi connection with the WW2 news in the paper but then it didn't go anywhere and their plot had nothing to do with Jewish intimidation. Just seemed like a random convenient plot device.

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He was also running a shop (with KKK ties) and getting rid of the competition. White supremacy and capitalism go hand in hand. Just like Metropolis not going after the KKK / corrupt cops and helping HJ because the Minutemen was a business venture and not interested in actual justice.

 

[FreezePeach]

That was really really good...

 

[Nightwing123]

Incredible episode the cinematography and directing reminded me of Birdman. Fantastic origin story for Hooded Justice and I can't believe we only have 3 episodes left😢. Also Fuck Captain Metropolis.

 

[Fletcher]

It's amazing that this show is this good.

 

[Deleted member 4346]

Holy fuck, this hits on many levels. Pulls no punches.

 

[Wracu]

It's amazing that this show is this good.

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Lindelof serving up platefuls of crow so far.

 

[ShutterMunster]

Fantastic work by Lindelof and his writing team. They're making a bunch of great decisions and you can tell that they're ALL in.

 

[Rosé Fighter]

anyone catch that when Hooded Justice joins the Minutemen, and Metropolis basically shuts him up to reveal a sponsor, which is an ad that has a white cop manhandling a black person?

Metropolis was racist af

also, that's probably where the idea that HJ was a nazi came from, that he worked with who was essentially a white supremacist in different clothing.

 

[Shaun Solo]

It's fun looking back at the letter Lindelof put out when he was shooting the pilot for this last year: https://www.instagram.com/p/BjFsj6JHEdq/

He strongly hints at what was finally revealed in tonight's episode towards the end of the letter:

We also intend to revisit the past century of Costumed Adventuring through a surprising, yet familiar set of eyes...and it is here where we'll be taking our greatest risk. Risk is imperative.

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[Deleted member 36578]

This show is QUALITY as every single facet of it is well thought out and extremely well done. I even thought the fight choreography was really well orchestrated in tonight's episode. What a great series so far! How the hell are there only three episodes left already!?

 

[OutofMana]

Amazing episode. The music selection has also been awesome. Don't remember if it was this show or a different one, but is this season 10 episodes or 8?

 

[Deleted member 36578]

Amazing episode. The music selection has also been awesome. Don't remember if it was this show or a different one, but is this season 10 episodes or 8?

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The preview after the episode said there were only three episodes left!

 

[WoahW]

Great episode but do they have enough time to actually finish the story?

 

[Tiger Priest]

Also I don't get why HJ would then stay with the Minutemen for another ten years after Captain Metropolis pulled this crap (in the book, he stuck with the group all the way through its end even after he stopped the first Silk Spectre's rape). If the whole reason he joined the group was for help uncovering this plot, why would he stick around when he got betrayed by them?

Honestly this whole story only really works for me if I consider this a totally alternate universe that just borrows the original Watchmen story, but that's been my feeling with this entire show since the start (Veidt's behavior for instance in no way matches his coldly calculating persona from the books). Even the hypnosis film struck me as totally ridiculous - I get that in the book Veidt engineered a giant psychic squid, but he was the Smartest Man on Earth and these were just some random KKK bozos with pre-Dr. Manhattan tech.

 

[Rosé Fighter]

Also I don't get why HJ would then stay with the Minutemen for another ten years after Captain Metropolis pulled this crap (in the book, he stuck with the group all the way through its end even after he stopped the first Silk Spectre's rape). If the whole reason he joined the group was for help uncovering this plot, why would he stick around when he got betrayed by them?

Honestly this whole story only really works for me if I consider this a totally alternate universe that just borrows the original Watchmen story, but that's been my feeling with this entire show since the start (Veidt's behavior for instance in no way matches his coldly calculating persona from the books). Even the hypnosis film struck me as totally ridiculous - I get that in the book Veidt engineered a giant psychic squid, but he was the Smartest Man on Earth and these were just some random KKK bozos with pre-Dr. Manhattan tech.

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He didn't get betrayed, he got ignored. He accomplished his goal, he managed to stop what he thought was cyclops.

 

[Tiger Priest]

He didn't get betrayed, he got ignored. He accomplished his goal, he managed to stop what he thought was cyclops.

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But what's the point of sticking with the Minutemen?

 

[BrightLightLava]

See now this is the kind of reaction that International Assassin would have gotten if more then 14 people watched The Leftovers.

 

[Rosé Fighter]

But what's the point of sticking with the Minutemen?

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Because at that point he was too far into the Hooded Justice persona. He was HJ before the minutemen, then his wife and kid left him while he was in it, and he refused to accept the fact that hew as putting his HJ persona first. Its why his wife left him when he couldn't come to terms with that fact, and he's just sitting there on the sink while his wife announces she's going back to tulsa.

So at that point, he's gonna stick with the minutemen because it allows him to be himself.

 

[ToddBonzalez]

Great episode, but they really are going to keep us hanging on the ep. 5 cliffhanger for another week? Feels kind of odd that they didn't address that at all considering Looking Glass was left in a life-or-death scenario at the end of last week.

 

[Wracu]

Great episode, but they really are going to keep us hanging on the ep. 5 cliffhanger for another week? Feels kind of odd that they didn't address that at all considering Looking Glass was left in a life-or-death scenario at the end of last week.

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Well, there is a small bit relating to that in one of the peteypedia entries that went up after the show. Nothing conclusive of course.

 

[Deleted member 16657]

Great episode but do they have enough time to actually finish the story?

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Not even close. This shit is ending on a mean cliffhanger.

 

[spootime]

I wrote a few paragraphs that I had to delete because I can't properly capture how much I love the writing in this show. This last episode was one of the best episodes of television I've ever seen.

 

[overcast]

Kind of wish this show had another season in the chamber. A lot of stuff to gather in just three episodes. But also, look how far we've come in 5

See now this is the kind of reaction that International Assassin would have gotten if more then 14 people watched The Leftovers.

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That was a fucking brilliant episode, but you're .

 

[Yasuke]

Best episode of TV I've seen in years.

 

[Miracle Ache]

Well that was fucking fantastic.

 

[Namtab]

I wish they would adapt the graphic novel for the next season, so we have a proper adaptation of it.

 

[Saifu]

Not even close. This shit is ending on a mean cliffhanger.

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Didn't they say that this show is written as a single season?
I can't see this ending on a cliffhanger if that is the case.

 

[oatmeal]

Man, Lindelof has been swinging for the fences on this (and Leftovers) and been hitting Barry Bonds dingers.

My only question is: WHERE THE FUCK IS ERIGU

 

[NTGYK]

Wonder if after killing the KKK fucks in the warehouse that HJ become even more violent.

I really wish he kicked Captain Metropolis's ass for the shit he pulled

 

[overcast]

Didn't they say that this show is written as a single season?
I can't see this ending on a cliffhanger if that is the case.

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Nothing ever ends etc etc

Expecting something challenging, but something that doesn't necessarily complete every narrative arc.