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Alek

Games User Researcher
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
8,467
This is a fairly negative thread because I think the question has a relatively obvious answer. I don't want to be negative because a lot of folks worked tirelessly on this game, but at the same time, I can't say I've been anything but disappointed with it.

From the outset it seemed like the wrong move for the series. It didn't seem to be the leap forward that folks might have been enticed by. Instead it takes several steps to the side, reinventing things from Garden Warfare 2, but not necessarily in a way that's better, or worse. For the most part, it's a very similar game, but with a fair bit less content in some areas, and more in others. Critically, the subclasses were removed, which gives you less of a reason to continue to play.

Yes it's more competitive than Garden Warfare 2 was due to the lack of weird and unbalanced variants, but it's also far less interesting, I would say. Playing the same class every match, which has the same playstyle feels a lot less compelling. It does feature a load-out system which technically allows to customise your character a little bit, but it isn't as drastic as the different character variants in PvZ. At the same time, it didn't release with anywhere near as much content in terms of maps and whatnot, and without the drive to unlock more subclasses I felt very little incentive to bother with the PvE content.

All in all, I feel like they really messed up the core gameplay loop of playing matches to unlock sticker packs and unlock new variants of your characters. They also changed the sticker pack system which I found really rewarding (sticker packs are basically loot boxes except you can unlock them at extremely regular intervals without using any real world money), into a really stingy free to participate gatcha system. When I last played there was no microtransactions involved here, but that didn't make it feel any more rewarding. Playing for an hour only to end up unlocking a hat for a character I didn't care about... great.

In any case, I was contemplating either installing this or Garden Warfare 2 today (I know Garden Warfare 1 is a great game too, but I want to play the one with the more active community) and I checked their numbers on gamestat to get an estimate of popularity...

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I'm not really all too surprised but the data seems to point towards more players gravitating to Garden Warfare 2, than Battle for Neighbourville. I would contend that this is because it's cheaper, with more content and overall a more compelling package.

I guess the question though is where do they go from here? I don't know what the purpose of Battle for Neighbourville ever was, maybe to rebalance PvP? I can't really grasp what the idea of this game really was though. It just didn't move the series forward, and took so many features away, I can't understand where they anticipated this going.

In any case, 2 months ago they announced there would be no new content updates for Neighbourville, meaning it lasted less than a year...

VwI6Vo9.png


A rather depressing end for a series that was once really quite popular. The reality is that perhaps there will not be another Garden Warfare title, and Battle for Neighbourville could be the end for the series. Do you think we'll see a Garden Warfare 3? I think the fact that this title was subtitled suggests that they had some awareness of the risk that this project was undertaking. The fact that it entered early access instead of a full release with proper marketing suggested the same thing. I live in the hope that EA still have some faith in the Garden Warfare property and that we might see a Garden Warfare 3 in the future.
 

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
93,043
I only played the demo and instantly disliked it. It felt like one of those things that got extra fingers in the pot after it became popular.
 

Stoney Mason

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,919
The series should have made the transition to f2p since its filled to the gills with microtransactions in the first place. Plants versus Zombies was a cool multiplayer especially when there was less competition early on in the gen but later in the gen, its a hard sell especially when it felt like it came out as piece of early access material.
 

Kayotix

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,312
i want a new PvZ game thats more like 1 then 2 was.

I love the TD style of gameplay
 
OP
OP
Alek

Alek

Games User Researcher
Verified
Oct 28, 2017
8,467
I only played the demo and instantly disliked it. It felt like one of those things that got extra fingers in the pot after it became popular.

That's an interesting thing to say considering what happen to Geoge Fan, creator of the series. That's precisely what happened with PvZ and PvZ2 with George leaving as he refusing to help EA make a pay to win version of his first game.

It's such a shame what's happened to the series broadly, because I think there was a lot more to explore here, and EA have really killed it. Pushing it into this fairly high profile online shooter was a nice idea but it carries too much risk and a single slip up (e.g. battle for neighbourville) probably killed it.

The Garden Warfare series is good though, I think. Even Battle for Neighbourville, I think had good intentions. The fact that it wasn't heavily monetised too, was a nice change compared to other games of the same kind.

The series should have made the transition to f2p since its filled to the gills with microtransactions in the first place. Plants versus Zombies was a cool multiplayer especially when there was less competition early on in the gen but later in the gen, its a hard sell especially when it felt like it came out as piece of early access material.

I think that's a misconception though. Battle for Neighbourville didn't have any monetisation at first, and then only the battle pass I think?

And the original Garden Warfare games were so generous for players who didn't pay anything, that it was pretty irrelevant. You could earn enough currency to buy a sticker pack within about 30 minutes. Comparatively you'd be spending a couple of hours to unlock a loot box within Overwatch. Coins never felt like a good use of your money, especially as the game had no fomo elements in it either.

I think Battle for Neighbourville planned to introduce more of that, had it been successful, but it never got there. Either way, it seemed like they were really reliant on those upfront purchases for this series. Maybe an all out free to play would have been the right bet, but they'd really need to re-design the monetisation systems to achieve that. I don't think it helps that this series is targeting a much younger audience.

We're past the time that can release a game with loot boxes, that's also targeted children. EA would have received a lot of bad press with a free to play, heavy monetisation approach to this series, I think.
 
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Deleted member 16657

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
10,198
I really loved GW and the sequel but didn't even hear about this one. Did they reduce the variety of plants?

To me this was always a great series with not much mainstream appeal due to its art style. I think they could make a really solid F2P game out of it if they wanted to.
 

Jawmuncher

Crisis Dino
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
38,396
Ibis Island
Still amazed Garden Warfare sold as much as it did. Seemed like something a ton of people played but never talked about it.
 

Scottoest

Member
Feb 4, 2020
11,328
Loved the first Garden Warfare, in spite of the gross MTX. Never played the second one, and never knew this other game even existed, lol.
 

KillstealWolf

One Winged Slayer
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
16,069
I never really liked the skill load out compared to the variants system, generally with variants, you knew what you had to deal with based on visuals alone (Although the customisation could interfere at times) but with the new point system load out, you went sure what build they had running, Like is this All Star the one with the faster Gatling Rev time, or the one that kicks the Imp further. You can't really tell on look and it makes coming up with plans to beat the opponent more annoying.
 
Jun 15, 2020
7,125
I bought it and never even got around to playing it. No specific reason why, I always wanted to, just didn't happen.
 

CloseTalker

Member
Oct 25, 2017
30,569
From the way it was revealed, to how it was marketed, to how it was supported, it just never felt like a "substantial" game. It's hard to put into words, but something about the weird paid early access period just felt bizarre. It never felt like EA was that confident in it from the get go. It kind of turned me off of even trying, and I loved the first two games.

It's a shame they've never really been able to truly nail the formula, I absolutely love the idea and aesthetic of the series. Personally I'd be blown away if they gave it another shot after this.
 

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
93,043
I really like how the variants had different abilities and wish other games did that
 

Stoney Mason

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,919
I think that's a misconception though. Battle for Neighbourville didn't have any monetisation at first, and then only the battle pass I think?

And the original Garden Warfare games were so generous for players who didn't pay anything, that it was pretty irrelevant. You could earn enough currency to buy a sticker pack within about 30 minutes. Comparatively you'd be spending a couple of hours to unlock a loot box within Overwatch. Coins never felt like a good use of your money, especially as the game had no fomo elements in it either.

I think Battle for Neighbourville planned to introduce more of that, had it been successful, but it never got there. Either way, it seemed like they were really reliant on those upfront purchases for this series. Maybe an all out free to play would have been the right bet, but they'd really need to re-design the monetisation systems to achieve that. I don't think it helps that this series is targeting a much younger audience.

We're past the time that can release a game with loot boxes, that's also targeted children. EA would have received a lot of bad press with a free to play, heavy monetisation approach to this series, I think.

The original games were in the right place and right time. I liked them fine enough but they aren't something that will sell forever in the mp market. I also stand by the statement that they were loaded up with microtransactions whether a person wanted to partake in that system or not.

Didn't play the last one because like I said, I had already found the mp games I was into for that gen. The only real chance they had in a world of fornite, and other mp shooters that are free or heavily discounted was to go that way themselves. The game was sold at discount at launch. But that still wasn't enough. I doubt it will the next time either if they try to sell it at more than 40 bucks since this generation is continuous instead of a new clean slate.
 

Dyno

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
13,256
I mean it really didn't help that here in the UK at least, dunno about elsewhere, that the TV ad actually had no gameplay and due to the name change no way to associate it with the series immediately. It also didn't list any platforms at the end of the trailer so I assumed it was a mobile game and only found out it was a sequel to one of my fav shooters of the gen months after
 

Deleted member 41651

User-requested account closure
Banned
Apr 3, 2018
1,981
I played GW1 intensely for over 1k hours, GW2 a bit less and I'll say that BfN was an absolute heart breaker. It has a lot of cool ideas but it just wasn't fun. The Overwatch style of gameplay did it no favors on top of it being a rushed product as well. Popcap had something pretty special with the GW series there for awhile. :/
 

RecRoulette

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,044
It's straight up not a good game. They never really got the balancing right in the first few months I played it and playing online was miserable.

That's not even factoring in stuff like them removing the cool variants and replacing them with a lousy perk system.
 

CloseTalker

Member
Oct 25, 2017
30,569
Garden Warfare is one instance where I think going F2P and turning it into a service game would be 100% the right move.
 

JigglesBunny

Prophet of Truth
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
31,092
Chicago
Yup, as was Garden Warfare 2. The first game was incredible, they went too far by overindulging and it killed the franchise.
 

akilshohen

Member
Dec 8, 2017
1,307
It felt kind of redundant after GW2. If anything should be GAAS it's this series. After playing GW2 for years, I don't feel like trying to get all my unlocks again in something that feels derivative.
The early access also made me wait for a discount.
 

Camjo-Z

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,504
I liked it well enough. The maps were fun, I enjoyed the new character classes, and the free roam areas were a huge step up from the weak single-player offerings of the first two games. I think the fact that it had a subtitle rather than being called Garden Warfare 3 along with the early access release made people feel like it was some kind of weird experiment to be safely ignored rather than a direct sequel that they should get excited for.
 
Oct 27, 2017
3,988
Inland Empire
I played the hell out of Garden Warfare 1. I tried Garden Warfare 2 and it was ok. The fact that I got it too late to import my characters kinda soured on me. I didn't even try Battle for Neighborville. But man GW 1 was so good. Sunflower for life!
 

Rizific

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,948
Turns out less is actually more.

GW1 will not be topped.
This is how I feel about it. I loved GW and so did my son. We were pumped for gw2 and after it came out, we dropped it quickly. Turns out that bigger and badder wasn't what the game needed. I think the simplicity of GW and the characters with unique and static skill sets were what made it great.
 

frugaljoker8

Member
Mar 27, 2019
49
GW2 was a massive disappointment and BFN was absolutely awful took away everything i liked about GW1 and replaced it with a worse version of overwatch, at least GW2 tried to improve on the first (although it failed to). Popcap's obsession with adding "weird and over the top things also really messed up the simple feel of GW1
 

Hark

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,161
My crew loved PvZ 1 because it was so simple and straightforward.

From PvZ 2 things started to get a bit too involved. We didn't even pick up Neighborville because it just looked too busy.
 

bitcloudrzr

Member
May 31, 2018
13,912
Releasing as an early access game did more harm than chasing Overwatch similarities, although the direction of the previous two games is preferred. GW2 still tops the series for me and I will regularly play Neighborville until the next one.
 

Deleted member 11413

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
22,961
The first one is still the best one. I still play it from time to time. The second one was still good, and the expanded content/modes were nice, but doubling the classes and some of the class design I think hampered the game.
 

Berordn

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,740
NoVA
I really liked the campaign portion of BFN, but it ended up being so small that it wasn't that big a deal and once I finished that I had no real desire to come back for the MP. I don't think that cutting back on GW2's many subclasses was the wrong move, but there wasn't that much in BFN that really compelled me either.
 

DJ_Lae

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,858
Edmonton
I enjoyed it well enough, but them cutting off support the other month was disappointing. I also missed the variants from the second game, and it took WAY too goddamn long to let you make custom private matches as splitscreen was the primary way my oldest daughter and I played Garden Warfare 2 and Neighborville was a huge step back in not being able to play anything but the shitty curated 'battle box' matches for her.

I did really enjoy the larger levels for playing singleplayer/coop, though. That was a nice change. The new classes aren't bad either. I just wish they didn't axe the variants in the process.

And as much as I appreciate the first Garden Warfare game for proving that yes, you can make a third person shooter out of a tower defense game, it's not something I played much myself as it lacks the modes and splitscreen that made GW2 such a hit in our house.

Neighborville does have some pretty great costumes, of course, it's a shame they're so hard to get through the reward machine or spending the way-too-rare rainbow currency.
 

Powdered Egg

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
17,070
You could already tell from the song choice.

Highway to the Dangerzone > Come on Down 2 Neighborville
 

VeePs

Prophet of Truth
Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,358
i want a new PvZ game thats more like 1 then 2 was.

I love the TD style of gameplay

Same. First one was fantastic. I played the second one via demo or beta - and it kinda felt off. Just seemed like too much/trying to hard - and lost some of the simplicity of the original for me. I was thinking of trying out the new one soon but it seems like content wise its not getting anymore on-going support.
 

Elixist

Member
Oct 31, 2017
1,170
I only played the demo and instantly disliked it. It felt like one of those things that got extra fingers in the pot after it became popular.

thats how i felt playing part 2 after i thought the first one was brilliant af. immediately felt kiddy pandering with the new chars and aesthetic instead of a game for everyone. reminded me of tmnt movie sequels that were corny as hell
 

Aprikurt

â–˛ Legend â–˛
Member
Oct 29, 2017
18,775
The fuck did they do to Plants vs Zombies

How hard was it to make a full price, one-time purchase sequel to the first with new plants and new zombies? It wasn't even hard, and EA couldn't even get that right.
 

| TrusT |

Member
Apr 19, 2020
1,898
They never topped those fun stage designs of the first game they got steadily worse with each new release. Garden Warfare is an absolute gem.
 

StonerSage

Banned
Sep 22, 2019
176
My main gripe was the balance and team stacking. A lot of complaints on the forums about team stacking.
 

deathsaber

Member
Nov 2, 2017
3,097
Both PvZ GW2 and Neighborville were mis-steps. I still bought and played both, but both just put mud in the simple and addictive format of the first Garden Warfare, that just let you quickly get into matches, and enjoy the progression. The first Garden Warfare had the mix just right between free progression you didn't have to pay a dime for that was always constant and rewarding (or could pay if you wanted to accelerate), with all the different unit variants you could unlock (which were fun, but none were game breaking, as the original character kits could do just as fine in a match as the variants), and the balance was perfect. The sequels made existing fun character types not so much fun/useful anymore, and usually introduced one or more broken new character types that threw balance all out of whack. .

also, the games did not need the hub world as a buffer at all. Just let me quicklky hop into team deathmatches, Team P vs E, and the objective based competitive stuff, or get into my loadouts and shit via quick menues, not by wandering around the hub neighborhood.
 

vypek

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,539
I appreciate the quality of life changes in PvZ 2 and I think that game was slightly better than the first. Both of them are really incredibly. BFN was just not as good and the mechanics and gameplay felt way worse compared to the first two. So it definitely felt like the wrong move for the series.
 

watham

Member
Oct 30, 2017
244
Alabama, USA
GW was fantastic, but from GW2 on they started added way too many systems, modes, mechanics for it's own good. It's a kid's game about shooting peas at a football zombie, it shouldn't have gotten as complicated as it did.

I will echo the sentiment that GW should've remained a platform and gone F2P over time.
 

Real

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,416
Garden Warfare 1 is one of my favorite third person shooters ever made. I sunk so many hours into it because it was simple, fun, and fair. Great balance of characters, incredible game modes, fair monetization, and PvE/PvP mode that paid for itself.

Then 2 came and... it got more complex. Maps weren't as well designed, etc.

Battle for Neighborville didn't strike me at ALLLL. TTK was mad low, everything felt unbalanced, and the scope of the game was too large to balance, imo.

They need to return to their GW1 roots.
 

vermadas

Member
Oct 25, 2017
566
Agree with the balance complaints. I fell off BfN really quickly compared to the predecessors, even though I enjoyed a lot about it. It really is too bad because you can tell a lot of love went into this game, and I would be disappointed if this was the last entry.

On the other hand, I bought this game for my eight year-old daughters to play on the XB1, and they absolutely adore it. I introduced it to them thinking they'd stick with the PvE content, but more often than not they jump into the competitive multiplayer. They can split-screen co-op everything, and while the game is a bit violent it's all cartoony. They talk about how several of their classmates play Fortnite, and I'm much happier with them playing this instead.
 

cosmickosm

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,198
I enjoyed BFN for what it is. But yeah, the series peaked with 1 and gradually got worse with 2 and BFN. I only stopped playing BFN when they dropped the number of players for Turf Takeover. I still don't know why they did that.