Was Final Fantasy X received as badly upon release as XIII for its linearity?

[NateDog]

I was thinking of making this thread for a while but wanted to be sure I wasn't misjudging the game so I said I'd wait until I played the whole game through. I just finished X for the first time and I really liked it and can see why it's a lot of people's favourite Final Fantasy.

But something that was bugging me throughout was whether on its initial release it was attacked for being so linear. Don't get me wrong it's not really something I mind, in fact honestly I find most RPGs and JRPGs quite daunting lately as someone that is working 2 jobs and often 6 day weeks and has to spend about 3-4 hours on each of those days commuting, so having something more direct with less filler is actually almost like a breath of fresh air for me as someone that might only have a few hours of gaming free a week. But (personally, at least) I've never really seen people discussing whether they liked this or not about the game and XIII's similarity to it with regard to its linearity. X has more towns than XIII no question, but even then I felt a lot of those were really small and didn't have much to them apart from simply being places to shop and rest. But I just wondered if X was slated when it came out because it didn't have the freedom that the likes of VIII had, or because it doesn't have places like Treno in it to explore. I know it has the airship towards the end which makes things feel a bit more open but it's pretty much just there for going back to places you've been to already. XIII was my first FF game but since then I've gone on to play all of IV to IX (and now X rounds that off as I don't really have a huge interest in I-III unless I should be convinced otherwise) so I can see the faults that XIII has pretty clearly but I guess I'm just more surprised at why people reacted so angrily about that aspect of XIII. Did Square promise or show off the game as something different?

Anyway I did really enjoy the game. I already knew a couple of tracks (mainly Wandering Flame after seeing it posted in a thread years back about relaxing music) although I avoided ones like To Zanarkand because I wanted to hear it for the first time in game (and yes I used the original OST, I remember the furore over that with the PS3 remaster), but those better tracks in the game like Suteki Da Ne and To Zanarkand really are wonderful. I had parts of the story spoiled years ago as well but that didn't stop me from enjoying it and I actually liked the whole cast which is not something I'd be able to say often. The sphere grid system confused me a little at first but I realised it's not really complicated, although I still can't say I used it to its fullest. The battle system was solid, and although trying to even out the AP everyone got in each battle was a little tiring (I swapped everyone into most battles) it was great to not have to pick a select few to use and the rest to ignore unless I wanted to spend hours upon hours grinding. I was considering doing some of the side content but I've read a lot of it requires a lot of grinding and I wasn't exactly in a great place as I got towards the end so I think I'll leave it (only just got Ultima right before the final boss fight and used a friend sphere to give it to Yuna too, without that I wasn't finishing this game any time soon). Although I've seen most people shitting on it, I think I will at the very least give X-2 a try, I've seen some (not many, mind you) praise its dungeons and other aspects of its battle system.

 

[HK-47]

No, it wasn't. It also isn't linear in quite the same way as FF XIII

 

[Soulflarz]

No because 13 isn't fun. It doesn't play itself, while 13 is a straight line and braindead, which led many people to claim its just a really long movie.

 

[Sandfox]

It's been a long time, but theproblem people had with FFXIII IIRC is that it's just one big straight line with people even mapping it out. You also had the "HD towns are hard" thing.

 

[Anaron]

I certainly hated the loss of a world map and proper airship

But it's still not comparable to XIII's level

 

[Deleted member 36578]

I remember being very disappointed not having a world map and other people felt the same way. But the game itself was such a leap in graphics and technology that it still impressed as a new final fantasy.

 

[Cup O' Tea?]

FFX's linearity was appropriate due to the way the story was presented. It was a pilgrimage afterall. Mainstream reviewers pointed out the linearity as a problem for those that loved the old world map from the earlier games but it wasn't considered a big enough issue to hurt the game's reputation. Plenty of fans did complain about it at the time though (me included).

FFXIII was a similar situation where the critics pointed out the linearity but the game still reviewed well regardless. Fans on the other hand were way less inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt. People's expectations on how to present large 3D worlds had risen by that point.

 

[jiggle]

No
It was no where near the bad of xiii

 

[Kenzodielocke]

The game reviewed very well and is impressive to date for it's time.

 

[Mauricio_Magus]

FFXIII is way worse and has a lot of more problems.

 

[The n00b Avenger]

It didn't bother me but I was so psyched for the technology boost that the PS2 brought to the table that I wasn't picky.

 

[Keldroc]

It was commented on, but it certainly wasn't considered a dealbreaker the way FF13's was. Because for all its flaws, FF10 handles it better.

 

[signal]

Oblig




I don't even like FFX much but it's not as linear as XIII. I usually stop playing X around the Calm Lands because it arguably opens up "too much" for me and I can't decide what to do lol.

 

[balohna]

I recall reading reviews that talked about seamlessly walking from place to place with no world map as a good thing. FF was like a AAAA franchise at the time, so a lot of reviewers looked to it to be a cinematic and technological marvel. Losing the world map made it feel more like a movie, so quite a few people liked that about it.

 

[Marukoban]

No, but FF X was a huge leap in graphical fidelity that people were busy gawking at the pretty cutscenes. It was probably one of the best looking game for its time.

FFXIII was also pretty, but in that era a lot of game are as good looking or better, so people were less forgiving.

 

[Kain]

We were too busy being amazed by the graphics to bother ourselves by that. When XIII came out it was pretty but that's it, it was nothing groundbreaking, that made you think about other stuff.

 

[XaviConcept]

It was linear but still had breaks. It was very well received.

 

[ZeroX]

No.

People don't seem to realize that 'linear' was just one small issue in a much bigger disaster that was XIII. And past FF games weren't exactly open world games with a lot of freedom until near the end - same with FFX and the airship - something like IX is very on rails until you get the airship. The world map did give a nice illusion of freedom and really added a sense of scale to the world which was great. FFX nailed the feeling of being a journey and the previous title were world exploring epics. And then XIII just felt disconnected and XV literally takes place in a small patch of land that feels a few miles wide.

Although I've seen most people shitting on it, I think I will at the very least give X-2 a try, I've seen some (not many, mind you) praise its dungeons and other aspects of its battle system.

Click to shrink...

X-2 has great gameplay and it's interesting visiting that world in peace time. The story tone sure are something though. It's worth playing and I like it more than XIII and XV at least.

 

[Excuse me]

FFX was huge IIRC. I did love FF9 but seemed like it got bit lukewarm reception and then came FFX. It did lot of new things and top it all off it looked great. Biggest FF since seven. Given that it didn't leave legacy like FF7 did.

 

[Soul Skater]

No because the linearity was never the issue. It was just an easy critique to fall back on because XIII was such a disaster it was hard to articulate just how wrong everything about it was

 

[Deleted member 4346]

No, it was well-received despite being quite linear with its design. I think the bigger issue with XIII's reception wasn't the linearity but the 10 hour long tutorial. It's insulting.

 

[Doctor_Thomas]

X, when it came out, was an impressive technical feat. The world was fun to walk about in and there were still towns to visit along the journey with some alternative paths to take. You were locked into to a single path, but it always felt like you were going somewhere.

XIII, when it came out, was surrouned by pretty looking games, but it is basically nothing but single path until you get to Grand Pulse, which still manages to funnel you back into a single corridor. Like I can't remember any of the story beats up until that point, but can easily remember random details of the FFX journey.

 

[TDLink]

No matter how many times people try to compare the situation, it's never going to actually be comparable. FFX was a huge leap from the previous entries in the series as the first game on PS2. The world wasn't just artwork you ran around on. The characters were voiced. But lest that all seem like distractions: The story and characters were also incredibly engaging. It was a unique tale that isn't really like anything else, with a love story at its center.

And while people did decry the way the airship was handled... it still existed. You could backtrack without issue save for one area of the game. The journey, while linear, still took you through pretty explorable areas... and towns and cities.

I could go on, but do you see the problem yet? FFXIII has none of these things. In fact, "HD towns are hard" rightfully became a meme. Everything was literally a hallway, there was no going back. Instead of advancement, it felt like a step back, not just from FFX, but from the more recent FFXII as well.

The writing was also considerably worse and filled with all sort of nonsense technobabble you are expected to know. FFX provides context to immediately figure out what things like Zanarkand and Sin are, as they're just names -- and by time they introduce you to headier concepts (like the fayth) you've already been inducted in the world. FFXIII expects you to understand what Fal'cie and L'cie are right off the bat in a way that no one possibly can. It's an amateur storytelling mistake.

 

[Sasliquid]

No for several reasons including that it has better combat and world building

 

[KushalaDaora]

Final Fantasy X still offers side exploration while progressing through main content. In a way, it's not that different from FFVI-FFIX outside the lack of overworld.

Edit : Forgot that X also have real dungeons.

 

[jiggle]

I still can't believe they made a rpg you can't backtrack in lol

 

[snausages]

XIII was linear in ways that X was not. You couldn't even compose a party until chapter X. It's structure was much more terrible and limiting than X

 

[Pariah]

There are many reviews from that period available on the web. The short answer is no, it was considered an excellent FF game, with no special negativity about that particular point.

 

[Warukyure]

I think they are both equally as linear but I feel as if because FFX has a purpose and everything seems connected. Whereas FFXIII, it seems to just toss you into places haphazardly. Like one second you're are Lake Bresha, the next you're at the jungle looking facility. Not to mention, since you get most of your characters early on in FFX, it seems more of a grand journey, but in FFXIII, you don't get to choose, you're literally tossed in an area with whoever. Like there's a section where is just Sazh and Vanille, and with the early limitations on your crystarium, it's not really fun.

 

[Vault]

its the 2nd most popular game in the series so no

 

[Deleted member 5028]

I was thinking of making this thread for a while but wanted to be sure I wasn't misjudging the game so I said I'd wait until I played the whole game through. I just finished X for the first time and I really liked it and can see why it's a lot of people's favourite Final Fantasy.

But something that was bugging me throughout was whether on its initial release it was attacked for being so linear. Don't get me wrong it's not really something I mind, in fact honestly I find most RPGs and JRPGs quite daunting lately as someone that is working 2 jobs and often 6 day weeks and has to spend about 3-4 hours on each of those days commuting, so having something more direct with less filler is actually almost like a breath of fresh air for me as someone that might only have a few hours of gaming free a week. But (personally, at least) I've never really seen people discussing whether they liked this or not about the game and XIII's similarity to it with regard to its linearity. X has more towns than XIII no question, but even then I felt a lot of those were really small and didn't have much to them apart from simply being places to shop and rest. But I just wondered if X was slated when it came out because it didn't have the freedom that the likes of VIII had, or because it doesn't have places like Treno in it to explore. I know it has the airship towards the end which makes things feel a bit more open but it's pretty much just there for going back to places you've been to already. XIII was my first FF game but since then I've gone on to play all of IV to IX (and now X rounds that off as I don't really have a huge interest in I-III unless I should be convinced otherwise) so I can see the faults that XIII has pretty clearly but I guess I'm just more surprised at why people reacted so angrily about that aspect of XIII. Did Square promise or show off the game as something different?

Anyway I did really enjoy the game. I already knew a couple of tracks (mainly Wandering Flame after seeing it posted in a thread years back about relaxing music) although I avoided ones like To Zanarkand because I wanted to hear it for the first time in game (and yes I used the original OST, I remember the furore over that with the PS3 remaster), but those better tracks in the game like Suteki Da Ne and To Zanarkand really are wonderful. I had parts of the story spoiled years ago as well but that didn't stop me from enjoying it and I actually liked the whole cast which is not something I'd be able to say often. The sphere grid system confused me a little at first but I realised it's not really complicated, although I still can't say I used it to its fullest. The battle system was solid, and although trying to even out the AP everyone got in each battle was a little tiring (I swapped everyone into most battles) it was great to not have to pick a select few to use and the rest to ignore unless I wanted to spend hours upon hours grinding. I was considering doing some of the side content but I've read a lot of it requires a lot of grinding and I wasn't exactly in a great place as I got towards the end so I think I'll leave it (only just got Ultima right before the final boss fight and used a friend sphere to give it to Yuna too, without that I wasn't finishing this game any time soon). Although I've seen most people shitting on it, I think I will at the very least give X-2 a try, I've seen some (not many, mind you) praise its dungeons and other aspects of its battle system.

Click to shrink...

As a game it was linear, part of the story it was telling (a pilgrimage). What really made a difference is that at the time it was a pretty update of an existing formula. They knew what people wanted and gave it to them by allowing the larger environment to act as a world map.

For FF12 they opened that wider into a more expansive world map where you travelled the majority on foot. You could essentially go anywhere and fight anything in your path.

The next logical step should have been to evolve that template.

XIII stepped back from that, pit you against random encounters on a hallway you couldn't escape for many hours. So while those games were products of their time in taste and design, 13 should have been more in the same way Breath of the Wild evolved.

 

[Strings]

No. Mostly because it's a significantly better game in every aspect.

Plus, X does a pretty good job of presenting a false sense of exploration via maps that loop in on themselves etc instead of ending in dead ends.

 

[Kuroyume]

I remember people bashing it for the lack of a playable/explorable world map like the previous games. A lot of people here don't remember that though. Sort of how people bashed the hell out of MGS2 when it came out, but now people look back at it fondly as some brilliant game that everyone loved.

 

[sfortunato]

As many others have said, people felt a bit disappointed by the lack of a worldmap and of big towns as were used to before BUT the scenario, the battle system and the sphere grid were good enough to balance that.

The game did feel linear but it was also realy fun to play and you still felt a sense of exploration and wonders while playing.

 

[Pat_DC]

FF used to be one of my favorite series up until FF9.

FFX was the first FF game that I never finished and had no real interest in. It didn't feel like I was exploring a world and I wasn't as invested in the story or characters. Maybe it opened up more but I wasn't a fan.
FFXIII somehow took everything I didn't enjoy about 10 and pushed it further. I never finished it so it might have gotten better but I had no interest investing any more time into it.

I do think FFX was better received, even if I didn't enjoy it personally, I could appreciate the huge leap the game was. So I think that helped.
Even with X's problems I also think it was far better than XIII, which is my least favorite FF (I never bothered with XIII-2 and XIII-3).

 

[Massicot]

FFX didn't also gatekeep how far on the spheregrid you could travel on any given 'chapter', nor lock you into pre-determined party setups until 25 hours into the game.

Yes, the game was linear, but it did have other (admittedly small, but present) opportunities to allow people to dig into the game horizontally, so to speak. Especially on the Expert Sphere Grid.

 

[Inuhanyou]

FFX amd FFX13's similarities are only skin deep in regards to game design.

FF13 is linear in pretty much every way a game could be considered linear. The way you upgrade, how you traverse the world, how you are supposed to absorb the information of the game. FFX disguises the linear path with tons of objectives to do during the story and after it, a sense of a journey actually progressing through a real world, actual people you want to journey with.

FF13 has none of this..as just one example, in FF13 your upgrades and shop are liimited to a stat screen at a save point dumping useless lumps of nothing into weapons to get to more arbitrary higher numbers. With FFX, it allowed you to truly make your weapons, mix and match whatever kind of things you wanted into them, while actually having to go buy them at a town shop where people actually go to. It contributes greatly to a sense of world building and the game actually being full of something.

The combat having pretty much auto battle. with the player not even being in control of summons and how they work pretty much streamlines playerchoice in a bad way.

It all contributes to the game essentially playing itself. They throw essentially everything out for just the cutscenes contributing to the story, and even that was bad

 

[Deleted member 426]

No matter how many times people try to compare the situation, it's never going to actually be comparable. FFX was a huge leap from the previous entries in the series as the first game on PS2. The world wasn't just artwork you ran around on. The characters were voiced. But lest that all seem like distractions: The story and characters were also incredibly engaging. It was a unique tale that isn't really like anything else, with a love story at its center.

And while people did decry the way the airship was handled... it still existed. You could backtrack without issue save for one area of the game. The journey, while linear, still took you through pretty explorable areas... and towns and cities.

I could go on, but do you see the problem yet? FFXIII has none of these things. In fact, "HD towns are hard" rightfully became a meme. Everything was literally a hallway, there was no going back. Instead of advancement, it felt like a step back, not just from FFX, but from the more recent FFXII as well.

The writing was also considerably worse and filled with all sort of nonsense technobabble you are expected to know. FFX provides context to immediately figure out what things like Zanarkand and Sin are, as they're just names -- and by time they introduce you to headier concepts (like the fayth) you've already been inducted in the world. FFXIII expects you to understand what Fal'cie and L'cie are right off the bat in a way that no one possibly can. It's an amateur storytelling mistake.

Click to shrink...

Hello my brain, how did you get out of my head.

 

[NateDog]

Thanks for the replies all, seems pretty fair especially with regard to the pilgrimage aspect of it.

 

[TDLink]

I remember people bashing it for the lack of a playable/explorable world map like the previous games. A lot of people here don't remember that though. Sort of how people bashed the hell out of MGS2 when it came out, but now people look back at it fondly as some brilliant game that everyone loved.

Click to shrink...

People did complain about it, but it was far from a dealbreaker for the vast majority because of how great the game otherwise was. FFXIII is a million times worse in regards to those complaints, and also worse at everything FFX did right. That is why it rightfully is dumped on.

 

[EarthPainting]

FFX was a lot beter received, but it had a lot more working in its favour in general. It was so close to the launch of the PS2 that it was able to capitalise on that hype and momentum. The increased fidelity and inclusion of voice acting was able to compensate for many shortcomings compromises made along the way. It was also going back to the style of FF7 and 8, which which the contemporary Final Fantasy audience was a lot more into.

When FFXIII came around, didn't really have anything to compensate with. It seemed to have negative momentum instead. You'd hear more about Square Enix struggling with HD development and their proprietary engines than the game itself. That was also off the heels of FFXII, which also had a troubled development and mixed reception. Finally the devs were somehow also bragging about how much stuff they were cutting, which ultimately set the tone of the discourse at launch. When you prime your audience to expect a compromised game, then people will naturally look for cut corners. I suppose the whole multiplatform debacle that so many people got invested in didn't help either. I think better PR and community management could have done a lot to lessen that impact. That and these games needed to drop their minimap.

 

[Vault]

characters in 13 spend half the game splitting up to run down random hallways with no goal in mind

At least in 10 we know what the goal is and everything we do is on the road to Zanarkand

 

[kurahador]

FFX didn't keep jumping between characters for no reason and not allowing you to switch in combat like FFXIII. The casts stick together from the beginning, so everything they experience we experience it too.

 

[ryushe]

The problem with XIIIs linearity is that it's just a vehicle for the combat. There's nothing off the beating path to discover, no NPC's who further illuminate what's up with the world, nothing. While it narratively makes sense in both games (you are on the run for a majority of the time in one game and on a pilgrimage in another), it feels like much more of an issue in XIII than it did in X.

I personally don't have an issue with XIII's linearity but I get why people would

 

[TylersProphecy]

I dont really mind the linearity in either game, but what I do mind is shit characters and major plot details hidden behind menus. X beats out xiii in every way possible when it comes to story telling.

Also, ten isnt as linear as 13 at all.

 

[dunkzilla]

No matter how many times people try to compare the situation, it's never going to actually be comparable. FFX was a huge leap from the previous entries in the series as the first game on PS2. The world wasn't just artwork you ran around on. The characters were voiced. But lest that all seem like distractions: The story and characters were also incredibly engaging. It was a unique tale that isn't really like anything else, with a love story at its center.

And while people did decry the way the airship was handled... it still existed. You could backtrack without issue save for one area of the game. The journey, while linear, still took you through pretty explorable areas... and towns and cities.

I could go on, but do you see the problem yet? FFXIII has none of these things. In fact, "HD towns are hard" rightfully became a meme. Everything was literally a hallway, there was no going back. Instead of advancement, it felt like a step back, not just from FFX, but from the more recent FFXII as well.

The writing was also considerably worse and filled with all sort of nonsense technobabble you are expected to know. FFX provides context to immediately figure out what things like Zanarkand and Sin are, as they're just names -- and by time they introduce you to headier concepts (like the fayth) you've already been inducted in the world. FFXIII expects you to understand what Fal'cie and L'cie are right off the bat in a way that no one possibly can. It's an amateur storytelling mistake.

Click to shrink...

Agree with this. FFXIII was linear one ways X wasn't and a linear story was the least of the games problems.

 

[Deleted member 8196]

People should stop thinking that FFXIII was criticized ONLY because it was linear lol

 

[NateDog]

People should stop thinking that FFXIII was criticized ONLY because it was linear lol

Click to shrink...

I didn't say that in my OP though nor did I say that they're both the same in terms of their linearity. Just that they are both quite linear and if people disliked that about X.

 

[King Metal Zel]

No, it wasn't as bad for numerous reasons.

1) X's Story is a pilgrimage, which helps the idea of a somewhat linear track fine (esp. because once the pilgrimage is over, no more linear design)
2) X is well paced. XIII's pacing is atrocious..
3) X's gameplay systems give you full control. XIII waits about 15-20 hours before it decides you're ready for proper control.
4) X's world building is integrated naturally. XIII just gives you a glossary.

Personal opinion: Chapters 1-10 of XIII feel like they took a 4-5 hour tutorial and stretched it as thin as possible because it's clear that despite being in development for 3 years or so, it wasn't until the final stretch that they had any idea what they were making. I think the director even said as much? Like how they didn't know what the game was gonna be until they made the demo for the ACC BD? It shows.

 

[eXistor]

It's not nearly as bad a game as XIII, but I remember a lot of people not being happy with it (me included). It was the first game where people weren't unanimously enamored with it. I bet the same happened with VIII but I have no recollection of any backlash with that game.