Twitter is a fucking cesspool, regardless of topic. I don't think that is a games industry or games community problem.
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WaPo: Phil Spencer on the ‘console war’ mentality, and Xbox’s shift away from the box
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Twitter is a fucking cesspool, regardless of topic. I don't think that is a games industry or games community problem.
Well yeah it is, but like it or not it's a significant part of gamer culture and obviously the sorts of people he's referring to.
To me, this is all talk until I see some direct attempts by Phil to bring Game Pass and Xbox Exclusives over to PlayStation. We know that Sony would likely never do the same for Xbox, so as a gamer, I would buy a PS5, get Game Pass, and have the best of both worlds on one piece of plastic, supporting both companies. Phil would be an even greater guy by getting Gamepass over on PlayStation.
I wish console warring on this place wasn't this rampant. Going into next-gen threads is a minefield, sometimes I'd like a good technical discussion or something but no, it's always "my console has the secretest sauce", "my SSD", "best first party", "annihilate the competition". You're not shareholders and presumably not on MS' or Sony's payroll. I wish mods did a better job to moderate such threads because there's a reason most of the frequent posters show up in them less and less, instead moving such discussions to other avenues outside of Era.
I'm pretty sure Phil Spencer would love for xCloud to be available on PlayStation down the line. Somehow I don't see Sony agreeing to this for now.
He can release his first party games on PS5 then , I am desperate to play Flight Simulator but cannot buy two next gen consoles, and my pc will never be able to run it.
Yeah.. haven't heard the Playstation twitter taking jabs/making comparisons like this at all.
So..The WaPo can write an article like this, but its not like some Xbox Brand guys(Tim Dog etc that speak to Phil, their not just fans) and their twitter account is innocent in console warring.
Yes, this. If the shoe, market share wise, was on the other foot... well.
Doesn't make sense when the end goal of Xbox is Xbox Game Pass subscribers. You can't play Game Pass on PlayStation.
Why they can not release gamepass on PS ? Afaik, there is EA Access already on PS.
ive really fallen for it before, and have been banned multiple times to the point I'm on my last warning. It's so frustrating because I know that if I sat down in real life with almost anyone on this forum, I would respect them and feel confident we would get on and have a great chat. sometimes you just read something that triggers negativity and you respond with comments you don't really mea n or you haven't stepped away to think about, your responding out of anger, at least imo....
....there's too much upset and anger...:(
im trying to just step back and think, I always buy every console, I have a kick ass pc, I'm so lucky to be able to play and be blown away by a game like last of us 2 and also genuinely love gears 5 shooting/scenarios...then play some paper mario.
too much investment in the plastic box, over the great experiences and I'm trying to get away from the negative mentality. I will get there :)
you are so right, great comment.
i just have to not allow myself to be triggered and start reporting posts and let mods deal with it.
This is a nice intent, but some of the phrasing used by him less than 24 hours ago around 'choice' came across as direct criticism of Playstation - not being forced to buy new hardware etc. In the spirit of not fanning flames of console warring, they could have talked about choice and cross gen without including those specific words.
This is almost me too (although I've not been banned as often as you..) I buy both consoles, I talk about maybe buying lockhart but inside I know I'll just buy xsx instead. I want access to everything - that delivers my 'choice'. But I still get perhaps unnecessarily involved in the minutiae of arguments. Some of it is fun though - I try and keep it constructive even where there is criticism.
I'm getting both XSX and PS5 but imo Phil and his crew are doing a way better job with promoting XSX than Sony is doing with PS5 and they are having a different approach to the gaming community. Feels like Sony is not having the confidence they should have? I don't know.
Keep up the good work Spencer and the rest of your staff.
Keep up the good work Spencer and the rest of your staff.
That's not console war to say "XSX is more powerful than PS5". Just like it's not console war to say "XSX is more black than the white PS5". It's simply stating facts (as far as we know at this point in time).
What would be console war is to say "that's why you have to buy XSX over PS5!", or "that makes it an objectively better console!". Those are console war statements.
Saying XSX is the most powerful console (for now) is an argument in favor of buying the console in the same way saying "we have a Spiderman game" is an argument in favor of buying the other console. And in the end it's up to the customer to decide what's best for them when comparing all arguments (power, services, form factor, games, etc).
What would be console war is to say "that's why you have to buy XSX over PS5!", or "that makes it an objectively better console!". Those are console war statements.
Saying XSX is the most powerful console (for now) is an argument in favor of buying the console in the same way saying "we have a Spiderman game" is an argument in favor of buying the other console. And in the end it's up to the customer to decide what's best for them when comparing all arguments (power, services, form factor, games, etc).
It's easy to say that stuff in an interview. But when people in your own marketing department constantly takes shots at the competition and signal boosts the problematic fanboys, it makes it seem like your leadership isn't being taken seriously.
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Sounds great, Phil!
Now let me play Ori through Geforce Now.
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This all sounds good and all but I don't see how this is anything else than PR to make people like them more. They're still putting up restrictions that hinder the growth of the hobby just like everyone else. They just want the industry to grow if it helps them selling more Xboxes, Xbox Live accounts, Windows 10 PCs, Xbox Game Pass and xCloud subs. They just move the war from plastic boxes to ecosystems.
Now let me play Ori through Geforce Now.
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This all sounds good and all but I don't see how this is anything else than PR to make people like them more. They're still putting up restrictions that hinder the growth of the hobby just like everyone else. They just want the industry to grow if it helps them selling more Xboxes, Xbox Live accounts, Windows 10 PCs, Xbox Game Pass and xCloud subs. They just move the war from plastic boxes to ecosystems.
This has always been true, it's a good thing for consumers if everyone is doing well. There will always be a console war element for a lot of people though since many can only afford to make a choice to own a single console so they have to justify their purchase and convince themselves they're not missing out on games that are on other platforms - that is largely an issue created by the manufacturers themselves in their effort to sell their hardware.
User Banned (5 Days): Inflammatory commentary. Junior account.
Is he a dissociative identity disorder?
Next gen...
In the previous thread people were saying that the last time this was said it was 2 years from then. Now?
And then now people are saying it doesn't matter where you buy their games, as long as you do. So, should Microsoft go full third party and release more of their games and gamepass on Playstation platforms? That'd be even more consumer friendly. Many more millions of potential users there. No of course not, their hardware is still a vital part of their plans currently.
It's really just all muddy PR speak that fits their intended strategy. A strategy no one can really judge it's effectiveness for a while until the market shows its reaction.
I'm still for clean breaks in generational consoles. Not only for the new features, but for the streamlining and continued ease for development. Having to support more, and variable targets will always have an associated cost in people power, design restrictions and pipeline development.
Edit: Wrong Phil Spencer thread...
In the previous thread people were saying that the last time this was said it was 2 years from then. Now?
And then now people are saying it doesn't matter where you buy their games, as long as you do. So, should Microsoft go full third party and release more of their games and gamepass on Playstation platforms? That'd be even more consumer friendly. Many more millions of potential users there. No of course not, their hardware is still a vital part of their plans currently.
It's really just all muddy PR speak that fits their intended strategy. A strategy no one can really judge it's effectiveness for a while until the market shows its reaction.
I'm still for clean breaks in generational consoles. Not only for the new features, but for the streamlining and continued ease for development. Having to support more, and variable targets will always have an associated cost in people power, design restrictions and pipeline development.
Edit: Wrong Phil Spencer thread...
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Look guys, Phil is just PR. He says that console warring is bad, but allows Xbox Twitter to promote their features and state facts like the Series X is the most powerful console whilst also praising Sony and their incredible SSD tech. How dare he. That is the clearly engaging in console wars. Also, Xbox should monitor and restrict whom their employees engage with on Twitter and any social media. Liking positive Xbox tweets by Xbox fanboys and responding to questions and helping spread their messaging, clearly shows that the whole Xbox division secretly supports the console war and that Phil is full of BS.
Thank you for saying this. I didn't want to say anything for fear of being banned, but at this point I don't really care. I came to this forum from reddit, because on reddit, I kept hearing about how bad this place is and if reddit thinks a place is bad it usually means that place doesn't tolerate the isms or phobias(racism, sexism, transphobia, homophobia, etc), which for the most part is true, but there's still work to be done on that front, also.
I thought console warring and fanboying was also less prevalent here, but unfortunately I was wrong. I know the mods don't live on Resetera and have lives outside of the internet, but it gets so tiring seeing thread after thread get derailed with warring and fanboy shit, usually by the same posters. It makes this site useless for some.
Thinking the fanboy console warz are dumb and counterproductive isn't the same thing as sacrificing your entire console hardware business on the altar of togetherness by putting all of your exclusive software on your primary competitor's platform. Particularly when Sony aren't reciprocating.
Exclusives primarily exist as a means to add unique value to your platform, so more people buy into it. They don't primarily exist to be online ammunition between fans who are over-invested in those platforms.
As for xCloud, I actually suspect Spencer would love to put it on PlayStation consoles. And Sony would never in a million years let them, for obvious business reasons.
...are you implying that was him being a "console warrior"? Saying Sony did a good job, but also that you feel good about your own plan, and you think your own advantages will show up when you show your own games? lol
That's about as polite and respectful as competition gets.
Same here. I was also expecting the typical "he talks too much", "too political" etc.
I always love reading interviews about gaming to get a better insight into things regarding gaming and the thoughts behind certain decisions or stances. I often question why people read (if they even do) these interviews if they just don't seem to be interested in it or just use it to feed their own rhetoric.
Phil always comes across as a very friendly and open person that wants the best for the gaming community. Of course he has an agenda to promote his own product and is enthusiastic about it. He wouldn't be here if he wasn't. Same goes for Major Nelson and Aaron Greenberg (I also dislike the tone in some of his twitter posts, but otherwise a very enthusiastic and likeable guy. Nothing "fanboyish" about saying games are coming to your console and calling it the most powerful if that is really what it is. You might think the "most powerful" line is unnecessary and so do I in a way. But it is also what his job entails. He is in no way disregarding other peoples choices or making fun of people who choose a different console in that post, and that is often the biggest problem on fora, twitter etc. Something I believe we can all agree on.
Marketing your product isn't the same as encouraging a toxic atmosphere buddy
I was around when people argued about ZX Spectrum vs Commodore 64. If such arguments are still around almost 40 years later, it ain't going to change!
I never mentioned marketing. Maybe you quoted the wrong person.
They aim to grow industry by increasing content availability and providing better services for customers.
Geforce Now is not a device, and Service Wars might become a thing, but at the moment those don't feel as hostile and toxic as console wars (unless we are talking about Stadia).
ERA is unbearable in this regard. I thought it was founded to be a better place, and I also thought the global pandemic would probably have people put things into perspective. Anyone doing showcases or console launches this year are to be applauded. But no, people seem to spend even more time on console warring. I really wish ERA had a zero tolerance approach, threads like the one on "joy" shouldn't be allowed to exist.
I'm glad I'm not the only one in thinking that..
I don't know the man obviously but there is something about him, It's hard to know if he's really genuine in the things he says or if he's as just saying things people want to hear..
But yeah besides that I do agree that we need to move away from the fanboy mindset , although I doubt it'll ever happen!
I've seen some of the mods participate in it themselves, lol.
I think the main problem is that because openly "console warring" makes for a pretty quick vacation from here, a lot of people have mastered the the rhetorical art of things like concern trolling and passive-aggression.
I both agree, yet also am sort-of happy it does, because there was a lot of funny stuff in there.
that didnt take long....first post to justify console war then a good old whatabout post! Congrats!
For me it's only this quote, that even told honestly factually contradicts their position, and their policy (and he already said the same thing when he was chief of software, the statement isn't the problem here).
The same Phil that signed off on the xbox adaptive controller to help physically challenged people to game?
Same Phil that severed ties with a toxic fanbase in Brazil?
I'll take his word for it.
I think the sentiment is laudable, but if you're going to get up on a high horse, you have to expect examination of your own company's approach.
In terms of marketing approaches, and the rhetoric it promotes, others are much further down the road on letting creative achievement do the talking, of having that be a core part of their brand identity and what sells their platform. In the last few years Microsoft has leaned far more heavily on comparing boxes, and the suggested inferiority of their competitor's plastic, than either of their competitors. Which is a bit funny when they're trying to move the focus away from the hardware.
In the reality of marketing, it of course depends on what you have available to sell - and I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I think Phil is genuine in terms of what he wants to see, but pontification will always court scrutiny, and clearly he has to see the reality of selling what you've got. Maybe when Microsoft's own creative output ramps up its own marketing department will get the memo.
In terms of marketing approaches, and the rhetoric it promotes, others are much further down the road on letting creative achievement do the talking, of having that be a core part of their brand identity and what sells their platform. In the last few years Microsoft has leaned far more heavily on comparing boxes, and the suggested inferiority of their competitor's plastic, than either of their competitors. Which is a bit funny when they're trying to move the focus away from the hardware.
In the reality of marketing, it of course depends on what you have available to sell - and I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I think Phil is genuine in terms of what he wants to see, but pontification will always court scrutiny, and clearly he has to see the reality of selling what you've got. Maybe when Microsoft's own creative output ramps up its own marketing department will get the memo.
Saying someone has a mental health challenge because he's talking up his own product in a benign fashion?
Sorely tempted to report this.
I don't think there is any way to stop these type of posts unless mods continuously monitor several threads 24/7. Otherwise you'll see the same old tired "muh teraflops" back and forths about which studios are the best and services talk.
Great point. He's great at PR because he says what people wanna hear by stating the obvious. Console wars are stupid, thanks Phil! Same with Sony when they got applauded for not screwing their customers over by allowing second hand games to be played on the PS4.
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