-
Ever wanted an RSS feed of all your favorite gaming news sites? Go check out our new Gaming Headlines feed! Read more about it here.
WandaVision | Paul Bettany is in this | Fridays on Disney+
- Thread starter Deleted member 1248
- Start date
- OT
"I actually did bite a kid once"
Cicadas are a perfect symbol for Agatha. They're known for living their lives deep underground (spooky cellar), only emerging every 13 years or so (lines up fairly well with the time skips.)
The actual point of this scene was that parts of SWORD are not happy with Hayward and are in fact still loyal to Monica and her mother.
IE they are unhappy with the switch from SWORD being a Observe and Response Division and instead being an organization that tries to make Sentient Weapons.
This was all set up in episode 4
Leaked spoiler warning
the leak thread has alluded to this and so far leaks are pretty accurate
Last edited:
Don't do this, mark your spoiler as a leak before you spoiler it
They could have cemented that point without tying it to a foolish plan to enter the hex by brute force, which based on all the information they already knew, was destined to fail.
pretty sure you can hear the bunny purring when Agnes comes down to the basement and faces Wanda
Her plan was based on data of the hex before Wanda changed it and she had no way to get data on the changes since Hayward threw them out so she had no way of knowing if her plan would work or not but at that point might as well try.
They had a rover that was designed to keep cosmic radiation out, a real thing BTW.
Space wants to kill you.
Instead they had a rover designed to deflect to block that all that.
Then it doesn't work and are working through you own grief.
And because of Captain Marvel and you will break
I really wanted to see Wanda as the main villain of this series, but this episode was great and loved that musical part of it!
Didn't know anything about this Agatha Harkness, but it looks like she's an interesting character in comics:
Didn't know anything about this Agatha Harkness, but it looks like she's an interesting character in comics:
Wikipedia: Agatha has been depicted as one of the original witches from the Salem witch trials. She survived and later became a significant figure in Marvel continuity, protecting Franklin Richards as his nanny and later mentoring Wanda Maximoff (the Scarlet Witch) in real magic.
I'm just not all that convinced. I get empathy and heroism and all that, but there should be a limit, and taking a town full of hostages should be well beyond that. I'm not saying that Monica should be trying to kill Wanda or anything, but her focus on Wanda rather than Wanda's victims doesn't come off as very heroic.
I feel like it would work with a bit more setup. But we don't see much of Monica.
My original point was that going with the moon rover plan made them look incompetent, considering the information they learned about the hex even after the rover was presumably built (that the hex rewrites molecules), made them look even more incompetent that they would still try and expect a different result.
Doubly so, since as you said, they still tried even after Wanda's "enhancement", where they didn't know what the enhancement had done.
In this universe the hex was shown to have the ability to rewrites molecules, unless there was some throwaway line I missed on how this rover was designed to prevent that rewriting, it made them look foolish to try, which again was my original point.
Definitely. It's the answer to the question "Why Westview, New Jersey?"
"What I need is a 10000 pound fallout shelter comprised of lead for photons, cadmium for neutrons, tantalum for seismic blasts... on wheels, and then I would be able to safely reenter Westview, right?"
"Yes, theoretically"
i don't 100% buy it yet. wanda could be subconsciously creating a villain to shield her psyche from the guilt and shame
Who would've thought that the portal to Hell would actually exist...and that it would be in New Jersey?
The shame of what, though? Like she still created the hex herself.
hurting people and running away from society because she's not strong enough to process her grief
I don't know, I think if Scartlet Witch caused it all because she misses her boyfriend, it might play into a women are too emotional stereotype.
Vision has been the best in this show
Lol at him realizing talking to the cameras is dumb af
Sadly we are due for many deaths tbh :(
Lol at him realizing talking to the cameras is dumb af
Sadly we are due for many deaths tbh :(
Also the face CG makeup thing they do is still top notch. Looked really great this ep with his closeups.
Acting-wise you can tell Bethany is having an absolute ball.
I still think that's Fox's Quicksilver with Agatha puppeteering him. I'm hoping we get an X-Men style slow motion Quicksilver scene where he saves a bunch of the residents once vision breaks his spell.
The Modern Family skits were not so good, I guess with so few characters (and no Phil lol) it doesn't work as good. The Darcy + Vision mini road trip was also weird and unnecessary. So in general I think this was the weakest episode but it also had power Monica and of course Agatha who is just flawless. I love Hahn, she's such a great actress.
The song at the end just killed me.
It's nice to know that Wanda didn't turn or nothing, she's mostly under the influence of Agatha (of course she's getting some comfort from this lie but it's hard to believe she'd enslave people for no reason other than grief) and now let's see if Agatha is just experimenting, if she wants something in particular (maybe she's trying to bring somebody back to life?) or if she's following orders from some higher entity.
The song at the end just killed me.
It's nice to know that Wanda didn't turn or nothing, she's mostly under the influence of Agatha (of course she's getting some comfort from this lie but it's hard to believe she'd enslave people for no reason other than grief) and now let's see if Agatha is just experimenting, if she wants something in particular (maybe she's trying to bring somebody back to life?) or if she's following orders from some higher entity.
Might be a bit too deep for a Marvel show / movie, but I like what you're selling.
I wonder if Agatha is going to be our new Loki where she'll essentially be an anti-hero for the Galactus Phases of the MCU?
We see even less of Hayward but he seemed to be concerned about the hostages and even if he's trying to use the situation for his advantage, at lesst he acknowledges the hostages exist. I really don't like the writing for Monica, she's all about Wanda, ignores or excuses the fact she took an entire town hostage, says Hayward would burn Westview to the ground when there's no hint in the show he'd do that. She also acts like Hayward wanting to reactivate Vision is bad but when Wanda does it it's fine? Wanda's actively manipulating Vision, she doesn't use him as a weapon but she's still using him.
I can appreciate that Monica wants to try to find a peaceful solution but it's weird that she doesn't seem to accept a violent solution might be necessary and looking at the MCU's history no conflict involving super powered people was resolved peacefully so Monica's confidence feels weirdly out of place, she doesn't even have a personal connection to Wanda that might help her get through to her.
Monica also doesn't know about Agatha, she went in there under the assumption that it's all Wanda which means from Monica's perspective the only known facts are that Wanda stole Vision's corpse, revived it, created the hex, took over Westview and enslaved its population to play out her fantasy, so far all interactions Monica had with Wanda have been hostile, she was violently thrown out of Westview and then threatened twice in person. At what point does grief and trauma stop being an excuse? Monica saying Hayward is trying to make Wanda into a villain was nuts, Hayward didn't make up the hostage situation.
Y'all, Hayward tried to fire a missile into the neighbourhood, and when Wanda was next to her kids at that. He also rushed his soldier into the hex when Woo warned him that they had no idea what would become of him. This person still hasn't resurfaced!
I agree that the SWORD half of the show is the lesser half and that the writing there is sloppier, rushed, and mostly functional (e.g., used for exposition), but Hayward is a straight forward shoot-first-ask-questions-later authoritarian who is also obviously manipulating the situation to his advantage. He's the worst kind of cop!
With that said, this is the area in which the show should've taken the time to lay out the ideological difference between Hayward and Monica and friends. It's obviously a problem that so many people come to the conclusion that one side is just a rat pack of superhero fanboys. Too much of their dialogue is about Wanda, and I'd say it's because they were hoping to put the focus on the theme of grief, with Monica eventually doing as she did in the new episode, using the common ground to try and make a break through. (Aside: I felt this was an example of them telling and not showing, as Monica moves at a mile a minute with a laser focus up until that point on simply getting to Wanda; the audience doesn't get to see her grief.) More should have been said about the differing methods regarding the Wanda problem, but that material is there.
I agree that the SWORD half of the show is the lesser half and that the writing there is sloppier, rushed, and mostly functional (e.g., used for exposition), but Hayward is a straight forward shoot-first-ask-questions-later authoritarian who is also obviously manipulating the situation to his advantage. He's the worst kind of cop!
With that said, this is the area in which the show should've taken the time to lay out the ideological difference between Hayward and Monica and friends. It's obviously a problem that so many people come to the conclusion that one side is just a rat pack of superhero fanboys. Too much of their dialogue is about Wanda, and I'd say it's because they were hoping to put the focus on the theme of grief, with Monica eventually doing as she did in the new episode, using the common ground to try and make a break through. (Aside: I felt this was an example of them telling and not showing, as Monica moves at a mile a minute with a laser focus up until that point on simply getting to Wanda; the audience doesn't get to see her grief.) More should have been said about the differing methods regarding the Wanda problem, but that material is there.
Yeah that's clearly not the engineer. I predict post credit scene? Or the engineer to only be shown in the last episode when Monica goes back to SWORD HQ or something
I wonder why Agatha didn't do whatever she did to the Minimoffs as soon as they were in her house. Maybe it was Billy telling her she was quiet that prompted it?
Hayward is willing to send a drone strike on a woman and her kids in the middle of a suburban neighborhood and somehow he's the more rational one than the woman who was in the Hex and knows that despite how things appear that she feels Wanda didn't cause or intend her harm.
It's why it's a terrible idea to send in a cop to deal with someone having a mental breakdown or psychotic episode or is suicidal. They are a hammer and treat every problem like a nail. The person needs help, not a bullet in the head.
It's why it's a terrible idea to send in a cop to deal with someone having a mental breakdown or psychotic episode or is suicidal. They are a hammer and treat every problem like a nail. The person needs help, not a bullet in the head.
Last edited:
Yeah, Monica's motivation was immediately clear to me when she described the grief she felt while being inside the Hex, and combined with the fact that she's smart enough to understand that you can't solve a problem like "Mentally unstable magic user powerful enough to create a pocket reality" with bombs, and her actions make complete sense to me.
I do think most of the SWORD scenes were a bit rushed though. They should've given that place some more time to breathe. Seems a little silly to me that there was zero doubt that the space buggy would work. Just one line of "What do we do if it doesn't work?" or something would have mitigated that.
Okay, that's just poor framing. Hayward is insane, but this woman happens to be the most powerful Earth-based being, with the power to manipulate reality within a small space & using it to subjugate thousands against their will.
Monica didn't "know" anything; she's making guesses based on instinct and trust in Wanda. She has been fortunate so far. Also lucky that she had powers right when Wanda was going to slam her to the ground.
Hayward has been far more cruel, but the irrational part of what he did was... you know, firing a weak weapon at aforementioned powerful being while she was staring right at it.
EDIT: While I adore the show and characters, I feel like Hayward's evil & Monica's belief in Wanda aren't made clear enough for me so far.
Appropriately, Wanda, Vision, and Agatha are the strongest parts of the show for me. Agatha - even without knowing her motives, tons of buildup & hints. Wanda - maybe easy because she's been in multiple movies, but I buy both her trauma and her immense power. Vision - I buy the fear and emotion for his situation.
Monica... she's the good person. Hayward is a bad person. 🤷♀️
Last edited:
I feel they covered that the rover wouldn't necessarily work from the very beginning. Darcy only thought that it theoretically would protect her and that there were still things they didn't know and that it would be dangerous for her cells to be rewritten again. Monica was focused and felt it was more important that she tried and risk being rewritten than worry about what would happen to her.
Not only is she willing to take the risk because she recently (for her) lost the most important person in her life and didn't get to say goodbye, but she sees the opportunity to help someone else (and the others she is effecting) who she's felt the pain and grief they are experiencing.
But despite that being true he's the one who kept pointing out Wanda took thousands of people hostage while Monica doesn't do that at all. Monica comes off as callous by not even acknowledging the hostages.
I'm not stupid, obviously Monica will be right and safe the day by helping Wanda who then takes on Agatha and Hayward will either lose his job or be forced to grovel before the hero squad. But so far I think the writing does a not so great job with the Sword stuff.
Monica doesn't know that, she believes it based on her feeling Wanda's grief and a so far unexplained trust in Wanda being a good person. But Wanda in her grief is actually abusing and hurting thousands of people ... that's bad. And other hostages might disagree that Wanda didn't cause any harm.