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Deleted member 23850

Oct 28, 2017
8,689

In April 2018, Mark Zuckerberg made a rare public appearance wearing a suit. Congress had compelled him to testify on Capitol Hill, the lawmakers curious why Facebook had been so adept at harvesting personal data and so inept at policing Russian spies.

Zuckerberg's suit was navy and his tie was bright blue, a shade or two lighter than Facebook's color scheme. The New York Times called it his "I'm Sorry Suit" and, like many outlets, praised his appearance and poise. He was lauded for a "strategic" decision to make a visual statement of contrition.

Had he? Or was he in a suit because Congress had dictated the terms for him? For one of the few times in his adult life, sweating through a barrage of government questions, Zuckerberg was not in control. And these days, when you are not in control you wear a suit.

"They put Mark Zuckerberg in that suit," says Deirdre Clemente, a fashion and culture historian and author of Dress Casual: How College Students Redefined American Style, referring to Congress. "I would've had a lot more respect if he showed up in a hoodie: 'This is who I am and what I do.'"

Although the suit is historically associated with projecting elegance, authority, and mastery of a profession, those qualities hearken back to the days when suits were prevalent, worn by the Atticus Finches and Don Drapers of the world. How long until we realize the suit — while still used for special occasions and by a shrinking number of traditionalists — has become associated with the opposite? The suit has become a uniform for the powerless.


There are exceptions. Women celebrities have recently donned suits in glitter and velvet and purple, modernizing a Marlene Dietrich staple, and the suit is an important component of non-binary clothing trends. Those choices are made to subvert expectations of the suit. But most people who wear suits are men. And they wear them because they have to please someone else, whether it's an employer or Congress. Unless you live on Park Avenue, the suit brings to mind job interviews, junior salespeople, young employees behind the counter at Enterprise Rent-A-Car, hotel clerks, and court appearances.


When you're in control, at least in relative control, from the C-suite down to the long rectangular table in the open-air office, you wear whatever you want, which is almost never a suit. It is the vest or bomber jacket for men, a blouse or a shell top for women. For people wealthy enough to attend wine country casual weddings, the male guests (and potentially the groom) can get by with light slacks and a button-down. At this year's Oscars, the male celebrities who garnered the most headlines, like Chadwick Boseman, spurned suits for outfits that resembled dresses. JPMorgan lightened its dress code to business casual for most of its 237,000 employees in 2016. Goldman Sachs, the financial firm reputed to "rule the world," nixed its suit requirement in March.


When you're in control, you wear whatever you want, which is almost never a suit

The numbers alone suggest suits lack the value and influence they once had. The Consumer Price Index for suits in June 2019, according to the Bureau of Labor Statistics, was about 25 percent lower than in June 2000. This descent began well before the Great Recession and during a period in which the CPI for the general apparel market has declined 4 percent and risen since the financial crisis. The CPI, which measures the price paid by consumers over time, is considered a proxy for inflation, so a CPI decline is the opposite of what would be expected in an economy with high consumer confidence.



Americans are also buying fewer suits. US revenue for men's suits declined to $1.9 billion in 2018 from $2.2 billion in 2013, according to the research firm Euromonitor (revenue for women's suits tumbled in the same timeframe to $402 million from $795 million). The total number of men's suits sold in 2018 was 8.6 million — or about .07 suits per man.


Compare this to the late 1940s. A board member of the National Clothing Manufacturers Association estimated back then that half a suit was bought per man per year, which would equal roughly 25 million suits. At the average price for a suit at the time, about $50, revenue would have been $1.25 billion. And that's in 1940s money. Accounting for inflation, the market would have been $12.5 billion. And that's for a United States that had half the adult male population the country has now. And — a final and — this board member suggested the industry needed to increase sales to one suit per man per year. The rate of half a suit per man, he said, "should cause us to hang our heads in shame."
 

Matador

Alt Account
Banned
Sep 12, 2019
132
That's cause we're no longer Sophisticated Adults.
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Dec 31, 2017
7,084
Yeah suits as everyday attire as they were in the 20th century is not really a thing anymore.

Of course you still have some industries where it is a "requirement" but many workplaces are trending away from that. Suits still remain a necessity for interviews for most positions however; I think they still hold the aura of professionalism better than any other dress.

I actually like wearing suits, but usually only for weddings or fancy events.
 

Mekanos

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 17, 2018
44,106
I don't think I've ever worn a suit and tie as a grown adult. Not even for job interviews.
 
Aug 16, 2019
844
UK
I still remember that for my first job I bought 5 suits before starting.

Then I got there to discover that everybody was casual.

I still dress professional and smart enough, but definitely not suits.
 

Ary F.

Member
Oct 30, 2017
736
Have to agree with women wearing suits being the exception. I am seeing more women in suits and its a welcome change because now I can finally get myself a tailored suit for Christmas. Always looked good in one, especially with my hair in box braids. Guys on the other hand....yikes. Only exception I can think of is my ex and I gotta give to him, he looked damn good in suit. The standards for men keep getting lower and lower and at this point I'm wondering if there's a bottom.
 

Feep

Lead Designer, Iridium Studios
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
4,595
Look I'm no fan of suits in general, but like. Are you people going to weddings? You kinda suck if you show up to a nice wedding in like slacks and a button-down.
 

Mekanos

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 17, 2018
44,106
Look I'm no fan of suits in general, but like. Are you people going to weddings? You kinda suck if you show up to a nice wedding in like slacks and a button-down.

I've gone to three weddings in the last 2 years and I promise you nobody cares.

I did wear a suit for my brother's wedding as best man, but no tie.
 

Feep

Lead Designer, Iridium Studios
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
4,595
I've gone to three weddings in the last 2 years and I promise you nobody cares.

I did wear a suit for my brother's wedding as best man, but no tie.
I dunno, man. I hate to play the "conservative" on the forum, but a wedding is an event for another person, not a time to "wear whatever you want". To me, dressing nicely shows them that you give a shit. And almost all weddings I've been to as an adult are pretty strongly 80%+ suit wearing men, if not higher. I've been to over a dozen.
 

Mekanos

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 17, 2018
44,106
I dunno, man. I hate to play the "conservative" on the forum, but a wedding is an event for another person, not a time to "wear whatever you want". To me, dressing nicely shows them that you give a shit. And almost all weddings I've been to as an adult are pretty strongly 80%+ suit wearing men, if not higher. I've been to over a dozen.

Wearing a long sleeve button up with slacks and dress shoes is perfectly acceptable at a wedding, it isn't like you're walking in with a hoodie and sweat pants. Nobody cares. Seriously. Decorum is nice but the idea that suit and tie is a minimum is bullshit.
 

Feep

Lead Designer, Iridium Studios
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
4,595
Wearing a long sleeve button up with slacks and dress shoes is perfectly acceptable at a wedding, it isn't like you're walking in with a hoodie and sweat pants. Nobody cares. Seriously. Decorum is nice but the idea that suit and tie is a minimum is bullshit.
Well, agree to disagree. People care. I do, my friends do. You can speak for yourself and your friends, maybe, but not others. You clearly have some line of "this is minimum acceptable attire", ours is just a bit more formal.
 

Kapryov

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,122
Australia
Yeah, when it's just something that's expected of you (like for a job interview) a suit just becomes some kind of costume.
I feel really bad for people working in jobs where a suit is required. Not sure I could put up with that.

Some people do look really good in suits, though.
 

Andi

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,316
I only own two suits and seldomly wear them, but I like them and I think they do make look you a bit more professional if you turn up for a job interview, at an bank or in an government office. People tend to take you more serious in my experience.
I do like to wear jeans and a shirt to work though without a suit jacketbecasue it fits more in with what everybody else is wearing but that could be because the average age in my compnay is 40+. I also think a shirt (and suit) helps my posture a lot, I tend to slouch a bit.
 

Jindrax

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
1,454
I wear suits and ties literally every day.

Can't really justify coming to work without one
 
Doing my last state exam in med school, the professors expect you to wear a suit or formal dress plus a white coat.
I heard stories of students arriving in jogging pants just for fun, who immediately got thrown out of the exam.

Also attending congresses, dissertation defence and of course weddings are dates I'd need to wear a suit.
 

dark_prinny

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
5,374
Most people don't have the slightest idea on how to wear it anyways. Used to wear one on a daily basis but not anymore. I do look good as fuck when I do

lol
 

Pankratous

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,237
So glad I work somewhere with no dress code.

I'll probably never ever take a job somewhere that requires a suit, unless the pay was obscene.
 

mozbar

Member
Feb 20, 2018
856
I don't mind the decline of power suit or suits in general.

The lack of options for men's formal wear in a business environment has always bothered me.
 

TheMadTitan

Member
Oct 27, 2017
27,190
I don't hate suits since I look good in them -- I look good in anything -- I just hate dress shoes and ties. Dress shoes suck for feet and never look good, and ties are decorative nooses.

I should buy a suit though. Paired with some dressy sneakers, I'd look good.

I don't mind the decline of power suit or suits in general.

The lack of options for men's formal wear in a business environment has always bothered me.
The bigger issue is how "business casual" is seen as an immediate turn off when someone wearing a crisp polo and some slacks can look as good or better as far too many people who wear suits.
 

MilkBeard

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,778
Suits can be nice but I never really liked them much, and rarely wear them (only when necessary). So I'm okay with this.
 
OP
OP

Deleted member 23850

Oct 28, 2017
8,689
I always wish I could pull it off, but I can't. So I don't wear suits.

Slim jeans, basketball shoes, and a baggy t shirt work best for me, that's probably my style.
 

MistaTwo

SNK Gaming Division Studio 1
Verified
Oct 24, 2017
2,456
I actually like wearing suits occasionally, but only do it for interviews really.
It's just too damn humid here in Japan to even think about wearing them for like 3/4 of the year.

Not bout that salaryman life AT ALL.
 
Oct 27, 2017
21,508
Suits are outdated idiot nonsense. And I have no idea what people here are talking about in regards to weddings. Weddings have become far more casual over the years in my experience at least and what I've read on news sites.
Anyway they suck, haven't worn one in decades, and never will again.
 

Lord Fagan

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,367
Sure seems like a lot of words to just say they're too fucking expensive for millennials to give a shit, just like a lot of material staples of generations that dominated the 20th century.
 

mangopositive

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
2,420
I've got 2 decent suits. I last wore them about 4 years ago. We have khakis and polos now! Suits are unnecessary! It's one of those odd arbitrary things that everybody thought looked good for so long that no one has stopped to examine the practicality of them. They just arbitrarily "look good". Take the tie, for example... it's primary function was to hide the shirt buttons, with flair. But we've got T-shirts now! There are no buttons to hide. Also, it looks like it's never going to get below 90 degrees here in Georgia ever again, so good riddance to bad rubbish.
 

SABO.

Member
Nov 6, 2017
5,870
I love my 2 suits. Got them tailored and made up in Hoi An, Vietnam.

They're for me. They fit the way I want them to and look the way I want it to. I feel powerful, sleek and elegant in it.

I only whip them out for events I deem important enough tho.
 

Kwigo

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
8,024
I thought this was a Power Rangers thread.

Also fuck suits when it's work related. I'll be just as productive in jeans and t-shirt.
 
OP
OP

Deleted member 23850

Oct 28, 2017
8,689
Also, I have to say that, while I like suits, I just can't stand wearing ties. I look horrible in them pretty much 100 percent of the time.
 

Tangyn

Member
Oct 29, 2017
2,280
Wore suit / tie to work in London for 11 years and hated it, especially in the summer.

So glad I no longer am forced to wear one.
 

Wackamole

Member
Oct 27, 2017
16,931
Yeah but people love to seem more important than they really are.
So suits and people telling other people what to wear won't go anywhere soon.
People need that. Needy and insecure we are. We're sad fucks, when you think of it. But it is what it is.

Good it's wearing off a bit.