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Visual Novel Community Thread: No Auto Read Required
- Thread starter Vylash
- Start date
The only scenario I can think of that actually makes sense, would be that the developer have lost the source-code to the game. In addition, it is also possible that whoever did the original programming for the game no longer works at that company. But if so, that should have been disclosed when the KS launched.
If they lost the source code, Dramatic Create wouldn't be able to port and release a Vita version of the game earlier this year. I have no clue what's going on with the game.
Finished the first of the two "main" routes of A Sky Full of Stars. What a ride. It didn't do anything new or original, but the genuine passion the characters had for Astronomy and the painfully pure friendship between the three leads really elevated the entire thing to unexpected heights. There's just something about stories about incredibly passionate people that can actually sell how passionate they are.
The fact that it took place from 2008 through 2014, and not just via brief flashbacks, really gave the main three characters and those who'd been close to them from a young age a lot of room to develop, and lent an extremely nostalgic feeling to the work as a whole, which complemented the stargazing theme. I'm really looking forward to the second main route, which I expect to go into more detail about the rather large three year gap in the middle of the story that was only briefly touched on this go-around for assorted reasons.
I've never wanted a group of three not-quite-platonic life partners to all find their happiness more. The fact that it manages to maintain such a generally low level of toxicity and soap opera leanings while still remaining affecting and sometimes outright excruciating to read is a real point in its favor. I love me some melodrama, but there's a statement in here somewhere about childhood love triangles not being able to end completely cleanly no matter how you play them.
I'll probably skip the two "secondary" routes for now, with such a heavy release slate, and go back to them later. I gather they're perfectly meaty and competent, but the characters involved are barely secondary cast in the story's main thrust, and it feels more like they tacked them on because you can't have a VN with two routes than anything.
After that I suppose I'm going to have to decide whether I actually want to read the other astronomy-themed VN that released within three days of this one or sit down with Seabed for 15 hours first as a thematic palette cleanser to put off the decision.
Confirm/Deny on Hoshimemo mostly just being a fluffy magic-leaning moege that has superficial astronomy theme? That's the impression I got.
The fact that it took place from 2008 through 2014, and not just via brief flashbacks, really gave the main three characters and those who'd been close to them from a young age a lot of room to develop, and lent an extremely nostalgic feeling to the work as a whole, which complemented the stargazing theme. I'm really looking forward to the second main route, which I expect to go into more detail about the rather large three year gap in the middle of the story that was only briefly touched on this go-around for assorted reasons.
I've never wanted a group of three not-quite-platonic life partners to all find their happiness more. The fact that it manages to maintain such a generally low level of toxicity and soap opera leanings while still remaining affecting and sometimes outright excruciating to read is a real point in its favor. I love me some melodrama, but there's a statement in here somewhere about childhood love triangles not being able to end completely cleanly no matter how you play them.
I'll probably skip the two "secondary" routes for now, with such a heavy release slate, and go back to them later. I gather they're perfectly meaty and competent, but the characters involved are barely secondary cast in the story's main thrust, and it feels more like they tacked them on because you can't have a VN with two routes than anything.
After that I suppose I'm going to have to decide whether I actually want to read the other astronomy-themed VN that released within three days of this one or sit down with Seabed for 15 hours first as a thematic palette cleanser to put off the decision.
Confirm/Deny on Hoshimemo mostly just being a fluffy magic-leaning moege that has superficial astronomy theme? That's the impression I got.
http://store.steampowered.com/app/583090/SeaBed/
Seabed finally came out today. Gotta to start reading tonight. I hear the writing is exceptional, but it isn't a happy game.
Finished all but the true route in Chaos;Child. I can definitely see why people say this stands alongside Steins;Gate. It's actually amazing how much this blows Chaos;head out of the water. I'm expecting some truly mindblowing stuff in the true route with what's already been hinted at. If what I'm thinking will happen actually will, this is something that can alter the narrative of the entire science series.
Chaos;Child true ending get! Things didn't get quite as crazy as I expected, but they still got pretty crazy. It didn't really resolve everything I wanted resolved which makes it fall just short of Steins;Gate for me, but it was great all the same.
As is my complaint with pretty much all visual novels, my biggest one is it's just too damn long and has abysmal pacing at points. Going from Doki Doki Literature Club to this is some crazy length whiplash. A good 15-20 hours could probably be cut down or condensed.
Either way though, top 10 2017 game for sure.
As is my complaint with pretty much all visual novels, my biggest one is it's just too damn long and has abysmal pacing at points. Going from Doki Doki Literature Club to this is some crazy length whiplash. A good 15-20 hours could probably be cut down or condensed.
Either way though, top 10 2017 game for sure.
Wow, that's a great review! I heard good things about the game from other sources as well, so I'll definitely pick it up.
May I ask you a question by the way? I had long-time interest in picking up If My Heart Had Wings, but the complaints about the translation quality discouraged me from playing. Do you know if there have been patch to improve the translation quality?
People have been working on a patch for a long time, but nothing has been released.
Can still wait then, more money to save for the Christmas! Never heard about Seabed but looks like another VN I should keep a look out for the impressions.
Well, better to delay and release the game in a decent state than delay and release the game with major bugs intact (looking at you SP)
The SnK team has been much more upfront about any issues they have faced compared to Dies irae's team and they have not given vague messages regarding the Vita version and 18+ content, so I definitely think they have handled their Kickstarter better. Maybe them failing the first time helped them learn about the process.
Second main route of A Sky Full of Stars was about what I expected. Came out with a pretty high opinion of the work overall, as the two main routes are concerned. I'm not sure if It'll necessarily stick with me for a long time, but it definitely made me feel a lot of things in the moment. Very mono no aware, this one.
Much as with most route-based VNs that have some degree of an actual plot, I couldn't help but feel like each of the two central routes was hobbling itself a little to save some pieces of the puzzle for the other. Taken together they make for a very affecting story and taken individually you probably couldn't see the seams, but I couldn't help but get the impression that this probably would've made for a better experience if it had managed to synthesize the two routes' content into one linear narrative for a bit longer, if not for the full run. There's something to be said for the character study moments gained from having the scenario play out two ways, but I think a lot of the character work probably could've shone through without splitting into two somewhat incomplete feeling routes.
The common route splits itself up in a way, with the first choice, that you barely even see the other two route heroines unless you direct the protagonist not to pursue childhood friend love triangle hell, so I can't even really say much about them. It certainly made them feel all the more superfluous--in the "main" branch of the common route they have less screentime than several of the actual secondary characters.
***
Started reading SeaBed, I'll follow up with full impressions when I finish it tonight or this weekend. It's a very hypnotic experience. Extremely flat, highly descriptive prose completely bereft of emotion--really fits the protagonist's presumed clinical depression. Reading it is like being in a trance. A "this is the most boring thing I've ever read, 10/10," kind of experience. I think I know where it's going, but I'm not confident enough to say that with certainty. It certainly has its fair share of mundane mysteries to reflect on after you come up for air each time.
If the fan patch releases it might be worthy of reassessment, but honestly fan translations are usually rough enough to begin with that I wouldn't get my hopes up. The publisher's certainly never going back to it.
Much as with most route-based VNs that have some degree of an actual plot, I couldn't help but feel like each of the two central routes was hobbling itself a little to save some pieces of the puzzle for the other. Taken together they make for a very affecting story and taken individually you probably couldn't see the seams, but I couldn't help but get the impression that this probably would've made for a better experience if it had managed to synthesize the two routes' content into one linear narrative for a bit longer, if not for the full run. There's something to be said for the character study moments gained from having the scenario play out two ways, but I think a lot of the character work probably could've shone through without splitting into two somewhat incomplete feeling routes.
The common route splits itself up in a way, with the first choice, that you barely even see the other two route heroines unless you direct the protagonist not to pursue childhood friend love triangle hell, so I can't even really say much about them. It certainly made them feel all the more superfluous--in the "main" branch of the common route they have less screentime than several of the actual secondary characters.
***
Started reading SeaBed, I'll follow up with full impressions when I finish it tonight or this weekend. It's a very hypnotic experience. Extremely flat, highly descriptive prose completely bereft of emotion--really fits the protagonist's presumed clinical depression. Reading it is like being in a trance. A "this is the most boring thing I've ever read, 10/10," kind of experience. I think I know where it's going, but I'm not confident enough to say that with certainty. It certainly has its fair share of mundane mysteries to reflect on after you come up for air each time.
As someone who really enjoyed If My Heart Had Wings, I'd generally trend toward not recommending it myself, unless you have a pretty high tolerance for absolute garbage-tier localization and only intend to read Kotori's route. It's not even a matter of picking it up on deep discount, my bigger concern would be with time spent. I was more forgiving of localization of that quality back when it released because pickings were slimmer within the medium, but at this point even if you limit yourself to just VNs there's just too much better to read out there for it to be worth the time.
If the fan patch releases it might be worthy of reassessment, but honestly fan translations are usually rough enough to begin with that I wouldn't get my hopes up. The publisher's certainly never going back to it.
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How's the translation of A Sky Full of Stars then?
I'm really interested in this VN.
Does anyone know anything about The Way We All Go? I see it's on my wishlist and is only $1.49 during the Steam sale.
SeaBed impressions may not come for a while yet. I've decided to start taking breaks instead of powering through when it begins to get oppressively boring. It's not the kind of thing you want to sit down with for several hours on end, or at least I sure as hell don't. I'll split it up instead of overdosing on its deliberate detachment. I trust accounts that it's all symbolically intentional and worth pushing through for the payload--people have been pretty consistent in saying as much.
I'm liking it, mind. It's just immensely draining to persist in the hypnotic state it induces for too long at a time.
The writing is above average for English translated VNs, but not at the level of polish and inherent understanding of comedy that something that has koestl's name attached to it has, or the occasional bursts of incredibly inspired prose that you'd see in a Conjueror/Gare translation that was allowed to have enough time in the oven. The writer has some semblance of an idea of what native English prose is supposed to sound like and does their best to execute, though they stumble over themselves pretty heavily sometimes. The characters have relatively distinct voices that match their quirks, and they speak using proper slang that suits them, individually. It's above average for a translated VN, but a good bit below average for well-edited professional native English writing. The editing itself is lacking--there are a lot of minor typos and the like--but that comes with the territory.
Basically, they've turned themselves around. It's not the best localization seen in the medium, but it's at or above the average level of quality that their competitors put out in similar works. You won't marvel at the beauty of the prose, but it also doesn't detract from the narrative.
I'm liking it, mind. It's just immensely draining to persist in the hypnotic state it induces for too long at a time.
I can't speak to the actual accuracy of the translation outside of theoretical instances where things would go so far off the rails that just a passing understanding of extremely basic vocabulary and stock phrases is enough to tell you there were massive errors made--none of those happen here. There's one instance where the localization extensively rewrites a minor scene about honorifics to suit its removal of them, and nicknames are changed appropriately (e.g., A-kun becomes Aki). That's just doing your due diligence to rewrite stuff that has to be rewritten when you choose to do a heavier localization job, which this does.
The writing is above average for English translated VNs, but not at the level of polish and inherent understanding of comedy that something that has koestl's name attached to it has, or the occasional bursts of incredibly inspired prose that you'd see in a Conjueror/Gare translation that was allowed to have enough time in the oven. The writer has some semblance of an idea of what native English prose is supposed to sound like and does their best to execute, though they stumble over themselves pretty heavily sometimes. The characters have relatively distinct voices that match their quirks, and they speak using proper slang that suits them, individually. It's above average for a translated VN, but a good bit below average for well-edited professional native English writing. The editing itself is lacking--there are a lot of minor typos and the like--but that comes with the territory.
Basically, they've turned themselves around. It's not the best localization seen in the medium, but it's at or above the average level of quality that their competitors put out in similar works. You won't marvel at the beauty of the prose, but it also doesn't detract from the narrative.
Everyone who hasn't done so listen to this, dammit. Everyone.
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Technically, I consider them a separate medium, but practically I call them games.
I don't think "choices make visual novels games" is a sound argument technically- for example, that would mean one particular episode of one of Ryukishi07's works belonged to a different medium than all the others.
Practically -if I were introducing a casual gamer to a VN, say- I'd just explain that they were digital books with illustrations and music, but I'd still call them games. Games haven't really evolved to the point yet where we can conceive of different mediums under the label "computer software aiming to entertain and/or elicit emotion".
It's a non-problem for me, and I'm kinda triggered by those who use the weak definition to dismiss the medium: if a product is good, it's good whatever it wants to be, it's not like games are superior to books or music.
Anyway, I'm more of the idea that they are their own medium, a blurry intersection between books and videogames. It's sometimes difficult to even define what is a VN and what is not: why is Danganronpa a VN if there's so much interaction?
Sure, the term "novel" is defined, but games often tell stories in a novel form (many JRPGs for example), so that alone is not a definitive answer.
Some people make the distinction between graphic adventures and VNs, meaning that the second ones at most ask for some choices within the narration...that's kind pointless in my head, there are so many greys between the two extremes.
In the end, since there's no way to make everyone agree, I just treat them as games (backloggery and such), and whenever a game uses this type of narration without falling into a precise genre, for me it's simply a VN.
The only reason Danganronpa is called a VN is because it's Japanese. Otherwise everyone would acknowledge that it's just an adventure game.
I think it is perhaps somewhat of a misguided question.
If you boil it down to its essentials, then 'visual novel' is simply a medium of story-telling using text, (mostly static) images, and audio.
If you accept this, then asking if a 'visual novel' is a game is akin to asking if a 'graphical user interface' is a game. Much like a GUI, you can combine 'visual novel' with user-interactions typical of games, whether in the form of choose-your-own-adventure, puzzles, skill-based challenges, games of chance, etc., but it is itself a completely different category of thing.
Hence the question should rather be, "is this X that uses the visual novel medium a game?". And that will depend depend on the X. In the case an X without user interactions (i.e. kinetic visual novels), the answer must surely be 'no', as the story-telling medium is the totality of the entity. In the case of something like Danganronpa, then the answer must be 'yes', since it combines a lot of interactive 'game' elements with the 'visual novel' medium of story-telling. In the case of typical VN, which incorporate a limited set of choices, the answer probably depends on whether or not you consider something like a "chose-your-own-adventure" a game.
Personally I'm too lazy to be pedantic about it, so I normally just treat 'visual novel' as a category of games.
If you boil it down to its essentials, then 'visual novel' is simply a medium of story-telling using text, (mostly static) images, and audio.
If you accept this, then asking if a 'visual novel' is a game is akin to asking if a 'graphical user interface' is a game. Much like a GUI, you can combine 'visual novel' with user-interactions typical of games, whether in the form of choose-your-own-adventure, puzzles, skill-based challenges, games of chance, etc., but it is itself a completely different category of thing.
Hence the question should rather be, "is this X that uses the visual novel medium a game?". And that will depend depend on the X. In the case an X without user interactions (i.e. kinetic visual novels), the answer must surely be 'no', as the story-telling medium is the totality of the entity. In the case of something like Danganronpa, then the answer must be 'yes', since it combines a lot of interactive 'game' elements with the 'visual novel' medium of story-telling. In the case of typical VN, which incorporate a limited set of choices, the answer probably depends on whether or not you consider something like a "chose-your-own-adventure" a game.
Personally I'm too lazy to be pedantic about it, so I normally just treat 'visual novel' as a category of games.
Some sort of narration is an important element. If there's nothing but dialogue there's really nothing novel like about it.
That's true!
Incidentally, we've gone almost 8 months without a release date announcement for Tsumihoroboshi, Higurashi's sixth arc. It (like Arcs 7 and 8) has been out of TLC and editing for what, 3 months now?
This Leyline release looks really damn rough...
This is an addition to the whole updates wipe your saves deal.
This is an addition to the whole updates wipe your saves deal.
Wow, that's pretty awful. Glad I haven't started it yet - will wait for a patch. How did this make it through QA?
Are there any visual novels with only dialogue? Can't think of any that don't have at least some kind of narration, even among the hybrids.
The Steam version of 999 in ADV mode seems to be mostly that, though I believe that it switches to a narrated mode at points.
It is however something that should be possible to do in a VN, since anything that would otherwise be narrated can be described by characters themselves talking among each other or straight up shown through graphical and audio representations of the place, event, person, action, etc. It is actually an interesting possibility. You could for example use it to show a non-sentient 3rd "person" point of view.
Zero Time Dilemma, the Xblaze games off the top of my head. Danganronpa skirts the line.
Ah, never played the steam version of 999.
And yeah, it's definitely possible. It would just be screenplay format instead of novel format. Though it's not like there are no novels that aren't largely dialogue as well.
I don't know if I'd even consider ZTD a visual novel at this point. It's pretty much completely cinematic outside of the puzzle sections.
And Danganronpa definitely has narration in the form of the protagonists' inner thoughts when describing scenes even when we can outright see what's going on. It's the same format as a ton of VNs, even hybrids like Phoenix Wright.
Actually, that has me wondering about third person narratives in visual novels. There really aren't many, are there, at least not ones that actually have a clear protagonist and not just a general focus on a set of characters or scenes.
I just finished Nekopara vol.0 to grind out the trading cards, and it definitely consists only of dialogue. Using moege/eroge is kind of cheating I guess because they generally do not have a legitimate plot to narrate, but hey VN market seems fundamentally bound to these genres.
There are some tiny things the anime added that i do like but most characters where written a lot more one-dimensional, more under spoilers
In the game they also where very ambiguous about Munechika liking BL which is laid a lot thicker in the anime. There actually was a scene where Anju sneaks out to hand over a package for her to the party before heading to Tuskuru. Which ended up being a copy of a new BL book. Her reaction was kind of funny.
I think the biggest thing they cut in the anime, development wise is that Haku and the party does not investigate the ruins in Uzurusha and thus finds out/confirms that the Tatari are the old humans. During the war in the anime they do ut more emphasis on Vurai though, him even going so far as destroying a village with out caring the villagers which results in similar trauma for Haku. The anime also does not do the amnesia scenes but rather dedicated one full episode to Haku's past also showing the mikado spending time on creating the Akurukuta.
Oh and the ending is very different in the execution. Jachwalt stays behind in Yamato as a sacrifice to buy time. There only is one fight with Vurai and it is the one between Vurai and Oshtoru but in the capital. The epilogue scene from the VN also is a random flare of power in Yamato in the anime.
More randomly the anime spent way too much time on one-dimensionally written slice of life scenes.
I think the biggest thing they cut in the anime, development wise is that Haku and the party does not investigate the ruins in Uzurusha and thus finds out/confirms that the Tatari are the old humans. During the war in the anime they do ut more emphasis on Vurai though, him even going so far as destroying a village with out caring the villagers which results in similar trauma for Haku. The anime also does not do the amnesia scenes but rather dedicated one full episode to Haku's past also showing the mikado spending time on creating the Akurukuta.
Oh and the ending is very different in the execution. Jachwalt stays behind in Yamato as a sacrifice to buy time. There only is one fight with Vurai and it is the one between Vurai and Oshtoru but in the capital. The epilogue scene from the VN also is a random flare of power in Yamato in the anime.
More randomly the anime spent way too much time on one-dimensionally written slice of life scenes.
None of the rewards have been canceled. They even specifically mention photonflowers and photonmelodies as still being underway.
The VN part of Fate/Grand Order is exclusively dialogues without any narration at all, and it feels really, really, lacking. You get contrived lines like "oh my god! He lifts the ship with his bare hands and then swims away!" It just loses any sort of proper mood building and tension.
I think a visual novel without narration would need really detailed visual sequence for any action scenes to work, and at that point, why not just make a comic or animation.
Not sure where the pessimism comes from that I've seen... This just got announced, so it's not like anything has been changed... yet. Everything was still being worked on even before the announcement.
Finished my Onikakushi reread.
What an amazing arc- though it lost much of its impact the third time through.
What an amazing arc- though it lost much of its impact the third time through.
Sure it is... I just don't see this ending up with anything but disappointment for backers (including myself). It will be awfully easy now for the "new" company to say there are difficulties and just release digital or not even release Vita.
OG team is out and it's not like backers have any recourse. Meh... Oh well, at least we got the Steam version.
I'm still not throwing my hands up and walking out of the room. If Mighty No. 9 items can finally get sent out, so can this.
I bought Dies Irae on Mangagamer.
I really like the game, but I think that light's handling of the Kickstarter was about as bad as possible. Who woulda thought the people who backed the game would get the worst version of it (ie: the moronic patch that requires you to play through the all ages version before you can go through the 18+ version).
I really like the game, but I think that light's handling of the Kickstarter was about as bad as possible. Who woulda thought the people who backed the game would get the worst version of it (ie: the moronic patch that requires you to play through the all ages version before you can go through the 18+ version).