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Video: Nancy Pelosi Knew Iraq War was Based on Bad Intel at the Time, Explains Why She Opposed Impeachment For Bush
- Thread starter BADMAN
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Always a good time to remember that GWB was 10x the criminal and evil piece of shit Trump is. Trump is shockingly, publicly racist and he is cruel seemingly for nothing but the fun of it. He's also got advanced brain rot and is easily the dumbest person to ever be President.
BUT, he didn't start a war that killed a million people. Trump lies every day, but none of his lies have been an iota as damaging as the BIG lie GWB and his White House told about Iraqi WMDs.
GWB should have been frog marched out of office at minimum, and I'm basically OK with treating a vote for the Iraq war as a disqualifying mark against current politicians. Sure, I get it. Easy to get swept up in the moment. But you fucked up, and it's OK if you go away and someone else takes your place.
BUT, he didn't start a war that killed a million people. Trump lies every day, but none of his lies have been an iota as damaging as the BIG lie GWB and his White House told about Iraqi WMDs.
GWB should have been frog marched out of office at minimum, and I'm basically OK with treating a vote for the Iraq war as a disqualifying mark against current politicians. Sure, I get it. Easy to get swept up in the moment. But you fucked up, and it's OK if you go away and someone else takes your place.
I think American exceptionalism is too ingrained at this point and nobody wants to seriously look in the mirror.
Civil war slave owners were allowed back into society as war heroes because the alternative was too difficult. Nixon gets pardoned and the media praises his comeback tour because the alternative is too difficult. GWB can't get impeached because it isn't politically practical and eventually becomes friends with Ellen.
It shocks me so many people get outraged about kids in cages after the GWB war crimes were swept under the rug so quickly. I bet 15 years from now the process of normalizing Trump and sweeping everything he did under the rug will be well under way and the pragmatists of the future will convince us its better that way.
Civil war slave owners were allowed back into society as war heroes because the alternative was too difficult. Nixon gets pardoned and the media praises his comeback tour because the alternative is too difficult. GWB can't get impeached because it isn't politically practical and eventually becomes friends with Ellen.
It shocks me so many people get outraged about kids in cages after the GWB war crimes were swept under the rug so quickly. I bet 15 years from now the process of normalizing Trump and sweeping everything he did under the rug will be well under way and the pragmatists of the future will convince us its better that way.
Weakness incarnate.
This is what white complicity looks like.
I truly fucking hate the Democratic party.
This is what white complicity looks like.
I truly fucking hate the Democratic party.
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The thing that bugs me about Pelosi's public silence on her knowledge about the Iraq war is the assumption that it would be useless and/or it would hurt her career.
Too often it seems that Republicans get away with telling Americans what to think while Democrats are afraid of what Americans think and adjust their actions accordingly. This is how the Overton Window shifts towards the right.
Too often it seems that Republicans get away with telling Americans what to think while Democrats are afraid of what Americans think and adjust their actions accordingly. This is how the Overton Window shifts towards the right.
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(beleagured sigh)
Yeah, I really think the 2020s would be much better without her leading the House Democrats.
After the last couple of weeks, I'm pretty sure Schiff would be solid, and could garner incredible support within the party.
Yeah, I really think the 2020s would be much better without her leading the House Democrats.
After the last couple of weeks, I'm pretty sure Schiff would be solid, and could garner incredible support within the party.
User banned (permanent): Long history of infractions for trolling, hostility to members and staff, mod whining, and fueling wars between communities
It's becoming quite clear that Era mods have an anti-leftist bias. This post isn't inflammatory in any way and it's a pretty common leftist thought. Liberals will absolutely excuse the actions Democrats make in regards to foreign policy. We have so many people here who consider Obama to be a good president despite him killing a lot of brown people overseas. That shit just gets ignored or excused. we had a thread that basically said that Obama's only scandal was the tan suit thing, but how his drone strikes killed an American teenager was largely ignored.
This ban should be reversed.
This ban is bullshit
god fucking damn this is why I dont do this shit around here
having to convince "allies" why human life is a thing to care about
this is bad for my health
Helio and other lefties, thanks for trying
I messaged mods earlier for the obama thread but I encourage others to message them regarding this ban. Perhaps they will allow us a thread for a public discussion on these bans because its becoming increasingly clear that if you say something too damming of the democratic party you catch a ban. And if thats the way it is thats the way it is, but it'd be nice to be open about it for others to know.
Well, the person who was banned got unbanned, so it must have worked lol.
User Banned (3 Weeks): Inflammatory comments, history of infractions
The extremist left posters on this site are disingenous hypocrites who care more about having a boogeyman to rail against than actually confronting the reality of politics. Complaing about her decade old actions offer zero benefit to people suffering at this very moment. And if they have their way folks will continue to die at the expense of a ridiculous moral crusade.
Same as with just about any other murder, zero - but they go to prison because that's what you do with a murderer, not because putting them in prison would have prevented the murder.
That is awesome news! Hadn't heard back and hadn't checked. Hopefully this one does too.
Holy fuck. She had the knowledge and decided to not rally people around the fact the intel was bad? The US has spent trillions on that war.
Why are strawmen of leftists fair game if generalizations of liberals aren't?
How do you know the people upset at her past actions don't also want change in the present?
Fuck's sake, again?
How is this:
Fundamentally different in substance from this:
I'm going to assume it's not the Ellen bit. Because people have heaped contempt rightly on Ellen without issues. I assume it's not the two pages bit, because that's happened before and it'll happen again and posters begged for admins to sticky a thread about Chile (and someone pointed out a thread about a kid dying in ICE custody went to ground in ignonymy in this very thread, so that isn't it). Is the inflammatory generalization that liberals don't care about brown lives across the globe? Because I went one further and said Americans don't care about brown lives across the globe. Didn't have to specify exceptions, didn't have to say a damn thing, and my point was well-understood and taken in good faith.
How is this:
Fundamentally different in substance from this:
I'm going to assume it's not the Ellen bit. Because people have heaped contempt rightly on Ellen without issues. I assume it's not the two pages bit, because that's happened before and it'll happen again and posters begged for admins to sticky a thread about Chile (and someone pointed out a thread about a kid dying in ICE custody went to ground in ignonymy in this very thread, so that isn't it). Is the inflammatory generalization that liberals don't care about brown lives across the globe? Because I went one further and said Americans don't care about brown lives across the globe. Didn't have to specify exceptions, didn't have to say a damn thing, and my point was well-understood and taken in good faith.
And I assume by the same whatever the fuck rules, this garbage shit will be banned too?
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This is patently true. The loss of human life plays a very small factor in analyzing and critiquing the cost of US wars for the public. We sold ourselves as liberators in Iraq and destroyed their country, killing hundreds of thousands of innocent people in the process and completely destabilized the region. When Democratic politicians criticize the war, they criticize the monetary cost, the loss of US soldier's lives, and how little of our objective we've accomplished. Little respect is payed to the deaths of the people who's country we're raiding.
It seems the only time we're told by our politicians and the media give a shit about the people is in the lead up to the conflict, to give us righteous cause . Once in conflict, the people are quickly forgotten about or demonized. If we kill a terrorist leader and 50 civilians die, then it's simply collateral damage.
Look at how quickly the media and the Democrats were willing to let Trump fuck with Venezuela and how close we were to having the blood of innocent Venezuelans on our hands.
Maybe he was being inflammatory, but nothing he said was incorrect.
EXTREME LEFT POSTS = people who aren't cool with up to 1 million dead based on a lie. She had the chance to give some justice to the victims of the Iraq War, but didn't. How long ago doesn't matter.
You dont want change if you are unwilling to do what's necessary for it. A foundation for progress doesnt happen over night so you need to be more open to other options instead of just telling people to "fuck off" time after time.
now watch this unmitigated bullshit go unpunished
Edit: Thank you, mods
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The insinuation that leftists don't actually care about ppl esp foreign ones more than libs given the fucking topic we're in is beyond laughable and frankly disingenuous af.
This is exactly what I'm talking about. Talking as if what you say is 100% fact. Justice? A failed impeachment attempt that would have eliminated other opportunities is justice? No, its you wanting to fight for the sake of fighting with no regard for what comes tomorrow. The belief that none of your choices could ever make things worse for people is what makes you extremists.
reminds me of something
it's almost as laughable as the clip in question
History informs the present. It shows how holding republicans responsible can't happen when democrats are responsible too. It's why they can't bring up children in cages at the border too much, or get into the emolument clause, or tie Epstein to trump. It's why impeachment is forced to be narrowed down to just Russia and Ukraine stuff that doesn't effect or interest anyone who needs to be, because that's the one thing that is totally unique to Trump and not just normal corruption done to a higher extent.
We already know what came tomorrow. Absolutely nothing. Pelosi didn't do shit about the information she had.
Oh I love being called extremist.
"accused of virtue signaling"
"being ungrateful for incremental change"
This is why I generally don't even bother posting in political threads.
Me neither. We already know that Pelosi didn't do anything, but somehow failed impeachment would have made things worse for people? I'm not following the logic
Everyone who has seen the UN speech with Powell on tv at the time knew the entire thing was bs, I remember that to this day and couldn't believe some of the members actually agreed, it was also clear they didn't agree because they were convinced but because of politics.
One of the first big public moments (at least for me) where it became painfully obvious that there are a bunch of amateures in high positions, trying to be clever and bullying the rest to get what they want.
One of the first big public moments (at least for me) where it became painfully obvious that there are a bunch of amateures in high positions, trying to be clever and bullying the rest to get what they want.
We dont even have to look back at history to see how certain actions do not lead to the outcome people insist they will. Trump is almost 100% going to be impeached but not convicted. A reasonable look at the circumstances can lead you to that understanding and that failed impeachments aren't justice.
In what reality could she have done anything that leads to a Trump conviction? You're are looking for a scapegoat.
I knew it was based on bad intel and I was a 9th grader.
I'm not sure what I'm supposed to be surprised about here.
I'm not sure what I'm supposed to be surprised about here.
Anything that is not pragmatic is extreme I guess... Talk about low expectations.
People would have just been so pissed off that an already unpopular and hated man was getting rightfully impeached over a litany of war crimes, lying, theft, and conspiracy that they would've revolted and ruined '06 and '08.
And after things have once again gone to shit under their power and influence and schemes, they want to keep doing the same thing because of course we're not crazy. Of course the planet isn't on fire and of course fascism isn't on the rise and our imperialist romps throughout the Middle East haven't wrecked the region for the few generations humans have left in that area.
So it's all good. Play ball, lie your fucking ass off by direct lying or omission, control the flow of information as to not get the plebs too riled up, protect the money, and let's
You're not following it because you dont think its possible to overreach. 2 years of the public telling you the same thing month after month, report after report, and yet you'd insist that if she just impeached him then the public would finally get behind the idea and not hold Dems accountable.
this has all been about Bush. Literally talking about the Iraq War and how she knew Bush lied about it and did nothing about it when Democrats gained the House in 2006.
This is why centrists aren't allies, they are so adherent to the status quo that no matter how far it shifts to the right, they regard any attempt at accountability and resistance as extremism.
A political system with no accountability is a failed system and it doesn't matter if its one tyrannical ruler or hundreds of representatives, the collective functionality is the same. It gives the right the opportunity, or freedom even, to hurt the poor, vulnerable and minorities without real repercussions.
Just because a fight for justice may fail doesn't mean you don't fight it. You make it fucking hard for them so that they're dissuaded, so you encourage others to join your fight and also to show the people you're fighting for that you're with them.
It isn't being the adult in the room to go "oh this probably won't work so we shouldn't do it", it's a position swimming in privilege and based on a platform that the status quo isn't inherently the issue.
By telling people, in this case Iraqis, that yeah sure the United States is fabricating an excuse to invade and occupy after over a decade of inhumane sanctions but our system doesn't seem to let us stop it so propping that up is more important than your lives and any notion of morality, you're holding your hands up and admitting that the concept of democracy is a sham.
People around the world know the US doesn't stand for shit cos politicians are more concerned with playing the political game than accountability.
If your personal politics align with that, you really need to think hard about what it is you think you're defending here - is a failed system really more important than sticking your neck out and defending principles?
Even if you don't have any objections with the lack of impeachment of Bush... Doesn't that make what Trump did extremely small?
tHe ExTrEmIsT lEfT oN rEsEtErA.cOm aRe GeTtInG pEoPlE kIlLeD!11
What are you even on about.
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Yes, she's essentially saying that the Russia stuff + the Ukraine phone call is worse than lying to get into an endless war with a massive civilian death toll that did irreparable damage to the region.
War is normal for Democrats, so they don't really bat an eye when a bunch of brown people are slaughtered. It's such a lopsided standard
Washington Post ran that the intel was bad for months when Bush was drumming up war. This isn't some shocking revelation. Weird to be mad at her a dozen plus years later for something we already knew and which anybody working in Washington would've been clearly aware of. The country at large was convinced. Washington knew better and didn't care.
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