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mentok15

Member
Dec 20, 2017
7,279
Australia
Economies of scale and improvements in the manufacturing process will go a long way to lowering the prices imo.

And yea right now they're way to expensive to eat regularly, I only buy them when they're on special or heavily marked down. Normal prices are like a whole days food budget lol
 

MrT

Member
Oct 27, 2017
347
Do y'all think the price of things like vegan sour cream/shredded cheese will go down as more people go plant based? It's like 3-4x more expensive than the dairy variety.
I don't think they have their own cheese, but in the UK Co-op have reduced the price of their plant based range to bring it in line with other products and make it more affordable for everyone, so maybe things are starting to change?

We’ve cut the price of our plant-based Co-op GRO range to make it more affordable for everyone! | Co-op Blog

We don’t think plant-based foods should cost more than non-vegan food. That’s why, from May 2021, we’re reducing the price of our popular GRO range to match the price of our meat and dairy-based counterparts.
 

ArkhamFantasy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,541
I successfully veganized my moms old Tortilla Chip Casserole.

Normally it cream of mushroom/sour cream/milk/milk/cheese, i was able to make my own mock cream of mushroom and replaced the others with vegan alternatives, there's no noticable difference in taste, As i said earlier the only downside is the cost of the mock sour cream/cheese.

I'm very proud of myself lol
 

MatchaMouse

Member
Mar 12, 2018
311
I successfully veganized my moms old Tortilla Chip Casserole.

Normally it cream of mushroom/sour cream/milk/milk/cheese, i was able to make my own mock cream of mushroom and replaced the others with vegan alternatives, there's no noticable difference in taste, As i said earlier the only downside is the cost of the mock sour cream/cheese.

I'm very proud of myself lol
Aww, good job! I've been having some fun trying to veganize my mom's recipes too. They all taste very similar to the original in my experience as well.
 

FliX

Master of the Reality Stone
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
9,856
Metro Detroit
I successfully veganized my moms old Tortilla Chip Casserole.

Normally it cream of mushroom/sour cream/milk/milk/cheese, i was able to make my own mock cream of mushroom and replaced the others with vegan alternatives, there's no noticable difference in taste, As i said earlier the only downside is the cost of the mock sour cream/cheese.

I'm very proud of myself lol
Cool. Getting the comfort food right that one grew up with is important and not always easy. I've recently worked on my grandmas goulash. I'm happy with the result. That's all that counts.
 

ArkhamFantasy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,541
Does anyone know of an article or something explaining why animal products are the foundation of so many diets/meals despite there being over 20,000 edible plants in the world? If there's tens of thousands of choices, isn't it strange that humans continue to build all their meals around the same 4 or 5 foods?
 

eZipsis

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
2,435
Melbourne, Australia
Vegan Kit Kats ae launching is Australia soon.
They are only going to be in a few stores in the city but have them available on their website to pre-order a box of 9 bars.

Feels weird pre-ordering some chocolate bars, but I'm excited haha.
 

Mr X

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
1,205
Virginia / US
Does anyone know of an article or something explaining why animal products are the foundation of so many diets/meals despite there being over 20,000 edible plants in the world? If there's tens of thousands of choices, isn't it strange that humans continue to build all their meals around the same 4 or 5 foods?

It's an extensive answer, but I'll try to make a cliff notes version as much as I'm aware.

The genesis of the issue can be somewhat drawn to when protein was first discovered in the mid 1800s. Animal protein was then found to be the most complete protein in comparison to plant protein. You can even find traces of it in the medical literature today as "high quality" protein refers to animal protein, a relic of when it was first discovered to be a complete protein.

At the time, in western countries animal protein consumption was seen as a sign of "advanced" civilization and the thinking has persisted to this day. Eating mostly or all plants was viewed as something "sub" humans did (IE farming rural populations/tribes disconnected from advanced civilization), not something civilized and cultured people do.

In spite of the growing evidence that animal protein consumption is not good for humans, we continue to do so and that evidence is ignored and/or repressed. It isn't a back room cabal or secret handshake agreements, it's just powerful interests are invested in the perpetuation of animal product consumption.

Here in the US, we subsidize these industries in the billions via grain and antibiotic purchases (roughly 80% of antibiotics purchased in the US are purchased by animal/agri business), and they rake in billions a year, so clearly agriculture/dairy/cattleman's associations have no interest in seeing reductions in meat consumption. These institutions spend billions on representatives to ensure government doesn't get too involved in public wide dietary health concerns. You'll see generic recommendations for "lowering your saturated fat consumption (vast majority of saturated fat is only found in animal foods, hint hint)" but when you start naming specific food, industry will use all their political might and lobbyist to ensure the government doesn't name name's in it's recommendations.

There was even a strong push by the World Health Organization to put a "traffic light" system onto food labels to help guide consumers on European food labels. Studies were promising that such a labeling system would be very effective at educating the public on what foods they should and shouldn't avoid. US food interests kicked in to gear putting pressure on their government representatives for the US to pull all funding from WHO if the traffic light system were to be implemented. Ultimately US food interests won out and the WHO backed down from the labeling system. A WHO representative said it was the most aggressive campaign they had ever seen (even more than what tobacco had previously done).

Even some of the institutions you would assume might have our best health interests in mind don't here in the US. Some of the Academy of Nutrition and Dietetics Association's biggest sponsor's are the Cattleman's Association, Confectioners Association, the Egg Nutrition Center, Mead-Johnson (they specialize in infant formula), and even a few pharmaceutical companies. Clearly a who's who of looking out for individual's health and well being.

Even an organization such as the American Cancer Society is not immune. Ironically, they were founded by a statistician, Frederick Hoffman, who had found a correlation, even back in the early 1900s, between increased animal consumption and increased cancer rates. You'll find little mention of him because he wasn't a physician (and he didn't espouse the "higher minded" cancer treatments as vigorously as most founding members would have hoped). But many of the original board members were either surgeons, radiologists and oncologists. Not a single dietician...and what are the most common forms of cancer treatment that persist even to this day? Surgery, radiology and chemotherapy, it's not a coincidence. It became an "in-crowd" back then that has persisted to this day in most leading cancer institutions.

Side note: to this day, you'll never find any population studies that show an increase in animal products leads to a decrease (or even neutral) cancer or mortality rates.

So no political, commercial or institutional will to stop animal consumption. Makes it tough before you take into account the individual will is weak in most folks too. Even a relatively progressive place like this (ERA), has barely any will to fight against it, since most are indoctrinated by industry. Food is an addiction and diet has become religion. We are literally killing ourselves by burning up the planet (in large part due to our diets) and switching to a fully plant based diet on a global scale would lead to incredible gains in the fight against climate change but people (even on ERA) lose their minds when you tell them to eat less meat....that's not even accounting for the responses to suggesting to stop meat consumption completely. There is a line by Dr. Milton Mills where he says something to the effect of you've never seen addiction until you've taken a chicken leg out of someone's hand - sounds about right to me.

Look at any weight loss thread and I can't help but just shake my head at all the keto diet recommendations. It's a terrible diet that has no long term studies showing positive results and really requires it's own long post to get into the details, but safe to say, it's not good for us or the planet (since most keto diets are recommending the consumption of a heavy amount of animal fat and protein). And I feel bad for those folks as the studies that are out there based on what keto diets consist of imply those who eat keto diets are increasing their likely hood of cardiovascular diseases, like strokes and heart attacks, cancer, dementia along with lower quality of life associated with ED, lower back pain, pain in other joints, angina, among a myriad of other issues. My favorite are those weight loss threads where the OP says "help me lose weight ERA - but I'm not giving up meat and dairy." The CI-CO folks and keto proponents love to hear that though, too bad people are far too interested in anecdotes as opposed to analysis (a fact that many snake oil weight loss advertisers are well aware of).
 
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ArkhamFantasy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,541
Thanks for the summary Mr X. I started going vegan in march and i'm really shocked at how i missed so much of this information despite being in the fitness community and following nutrition and "healthy" bodybuilding recipes for years. I also had never even heard of things like Game Changers until after i got into the vegan community, I think this shows how much of a hill we have to climb with things like youtube and google algorithms.
 

eyeball_kid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,215
Does anyone have an allergy to quinoa? This is the second time in a month that I've developed a rash on my hands when eating a quinoa salad (from different restaurants). Quinoa and cucumber are the only two ingredients they share, and cucumber looks like an uncommon allergy. Really unfortunate if I have to give up quinoa.
 

Aztechnology

Community Resettler
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
14,131
I just tried some nuggets from Quorn which is a mycoprotein made from fungus and fermented into a meat substitute I guess. I was incredibly impressed. I think it's the best chicken substitute I've ever had.
 

FliX

Master of the Reality Stone
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
9,856
Metro Detroit
Does anyone have an allergy to quinoa? This is the second time in a month that I've developed a rash on my hands when eating a quinoa salad (from different restaurants). Quinoa and cucumber are the only two ingredients they share, and cucumber looks like an uncommon allergy. Really unfortunate if I have to give up quinoa.
Ugh, that sucks.
You could just lay off it for a while and be lucky.
In my late teens I developed a nut allergy, abstained from nuts a couple years and at some point realized the allergy was gone... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 

MatchaMouse

Member
Mar 12, 2018
311
I just tried some nuggets from Quorn which is a mycoprotein made from fungus and fermented into a meat substitute I guess. I was incredibly impressed. I think it's the best chicken substitute I've ever had.
Quorn stuff is sooooo good! They are one of those companies like Morning Star where you have to read the labels as it's kind of 50/50 whether a product contains eggs & milk or not. I'm hoping one day they'll go 100% vegan.
 

eyeball_kid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,215
Ugh, that sucks.
You could just lay off it for a while and be lucky.
In my late teens I developed a nut allergy, abstained from nuts a couple years and at some point realized the allergy was gone... ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Yeah, it's such a great protein for vegans, I hate to give it up completely. I read that the allergic trigger is actually a resin on the outside of the kernel, and if you wash it thoroughly it might be ok to eat. So at least perhaps I can cook it myself.
 

Nezumi

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,546
Hessen, Germany
This is the receipt from the video by the way.
rainbowplantlife.com

Crispy Baked Vegan Mac and Cheese

Vegan mac and cheese has never been this good! An unbelievably creamy cheese sauce meets a buttery, crispy topping - the ultimate comfort food!

Fwiw it's very similar to what I regularly cook already, and agree it's one of my favourites.

Made this yesterday and it's amazing. I can also see that sauce being rather versatile with some slight variations. Been a while since I stumbled upon a keeper
 

Deleted member 3896

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,815
Anyone else in SoCal? My partner and I are back in LA after being away for the better part of a year and my mind is being blown by the food options. There's a plant based Italian spot & pizzaria that is doing astounding things-- cacio e pepe, beautiful woodfired pizzas with housemade ricotta and pepperoni. I kind of can't believe it. And all of the vegan Mexican options are just bonkers at this point. I feel really grateful to have the access again. I hope this trend keeps on and keeps extending out everywhere else.
 

ArkhamFantasy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,541
I planned on having a big cheat meal today, but i made a vegan cookie out of oats/dates/dark chocolate and ended up only eating a normal amount of calories.

I know seem like i'm a broken record, but its absolutely bat shit crazy how filling vegan food is compared to what i was eating before.
 

Mr X

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
1,205
Virginia / US
It's very hard to gain weight (or not loss it if you're currently overweight) on a truly whole food plant exclusive diet. Vegan's tend to get into trouble with the processed vegan foods along with oils/nut butters/avocados. Even then, it's still leaps and bounds better than the standard American diet, among most other diets as well.
 

eyeball_kid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,215
Anyone else in SoCal? My partner and I are back in LA after being away for the better part of a year and my mind is being blown by the food options. There's a plant based Italian spot & pizzaria that is doing astounding things-- cacio e pepe, beautiful woodfired pizzas with housemade ricotta and pepperoni. I kind of can't believe it. And all of the vegan Mexican options are just bonkers at this point. I feel really grateful to have the access again. I hope this trend keeps on and keeps extending out everywhere else.

Are you talking about Pura Vita? There's a couple of vegan italian places in LA that I know about, but Pura Vita is amazing. I had resigned myself to never eating authentic, cheese-based Italian food again because no one got it right, but Pura Vita proved me wrong. The chef is Italian herself and I believe many of the dishes are her family recipes that she converted to vegan.

And yeah, the amount of vegan options and the quality in LA is probably a few years beyond anywhere else in the country, and probably a decade ahead of Europe. Not to mention the amount of diverse cultures that offer vegan options in their cuisines. There's pretty much no excuse not to be vegan if you live in LA.
 

Deleted member 3896

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,815
Are you talking about Pura Vita? There's a couple of vegan italian places in LA that I know about, but Pura Vita is amazing. I had resigned myself to never eating authentic, cheese-based Italian food again because no one got it right, but Pura Vita proved me wrong. The chef is Italian herself and I believe many of the dishes are her family recipes that she converted to vegan.

And yeah, the amount of vegan options and the quality in LA is probably a few years beyond anywhere else in the country, and probably a decade ahead of Europe. Not to mention the amount of diverse cultures that offer vegan options in their cuisines. There's pretty much no excuse not to be vegan if you live in LA.
Yes, yes I am. I stumbled across them by accident when looking for pizza delivery. They were so good that I thought about the pizzas every day for like five days in a row until we ordered again. Just went and ate outside at the restaurant and everything was great again. It's just... perfection.

Speaking of other LA vegan options and forgive me for being a little basic, but did you know Veggie Grill has a Mexican spin off that's delivery-only? Mas Veggies operates out of VG kitchens and it's really damn good-- the jackftuit carnitas in particular was great. Not authentic at all but if you want something cheap & cheerful on a more Tex Mex tip, it's delicious.
 

eZipsis

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
2,435
Melbourne, Australia
OkC1c1Z_d.webp


These arrived today. Should be available in Woolworth (Australia) by the 26th I think.

They are really good.
 

Aarglefarg

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,061
The Natural Confectionery Company has a vegan version of their lollies Though they are normally $4, they go on sale for $2 (200g) and that is when I get them.

The Ruffie Chicken-ie Schnitzel with Penne Pomodoro is also very good, it goes on sale for $5 and it's good for a full meal.
 

Small Red Boy

â–² Legend â–²
Member
May 9, 2019
2,671
Just tried making meringue from aquafaba by hand. Terrible mistake. Can't feel my arm and didn't even make it correctly. For a first try I'd call it a succes, but there is definetly room for improvement lol. Let's see how the sponge cake turns out.

Also before mixing the meringue with the rest of the ingredients I tried it and it trully doesn't taste like beans, but like meringue (i.e. sugar!!) lol. I had heard that was the case but due to the strong smell never trully believed it.
 

FliX

Master of the Reality Stone
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
9,856
Metro Detroit
Just tried making meringue from aquafaba by hand. Terrible mistake. Can't feel my arm and didn't even make it correctly. For a first try I'd call it a succes, but there is definetly room for improvement lol. Let's see how the sponge cake turns out.

Also before mixing the meringue with the rest of the ingredients I tried it and it trully doesn't taste like beans, but like meringue (i.e. sugar!!) lol. I had heard that was the case but due to the strong smell never trully believed it.
I've only used Aquafaba a hand full of times, but it's amazing how well it actually stiffens up. Just takes forever.
 

Small Red Boy

â–² Legend â–²
Member
May 9, 2019
2,671
I've only used Aquafaba a hand full of times, but it's amazing how well it actually stiffens up. Just takes forever.
Should probly consider investing in a hand mixer. But it is trully amazing, baking is back on the table! Can't belive it took me so long to actually try it out.
 

Sanatana

Banned
Mar 2, 2020
544
Pacific Northwest
Been on a vegan diet for a month and am infatuated with Angie's Kettle Corn. It's low calorie, salty with a hint of sweet, absolutely addicting. I recommend it but am also wary to do so because it's so addicting.
 

sgtnosboss

Member
Nov 9, 2017
4,786
Those of you with small children, what are your go to meals. I'm talk around 1 year old. Our daughter was pretty great at eating anything when smaller, but now it seems her pallet has decreased almost daily to what she is willing to eat.
 

panda-zebra

â–² Legend â–²
Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,734
Those of you with small children, what are your go to meals. I'm talk around 1 year old. Our daughter was pretty great at eating anything when smaller, but now it seems her pallet has decreased almost daily to what she is willing to eat.
Fun things to dip in hummus. When he began refusing hummus and them mashed potatoes stuff got tricky, but he was a good bit older. He still won't entertain the idea of hummus even now, and it's weird, it was the best thing in the world when he was small. Sad to say we relied on a lot of plastic pouch gloop early on, could have made our own cheaper and better without all the waste.
 

sgtnosboss

Member
Nov 9, 2017
4,786
Fun things to dip in hummus. When he began refusing hummus and them mashed potatoes stuff got tricky, but he was a good bit older. He still won't entertain the idea of hummus even now, and it's weird, it was the best thing in the world when he was small. Sad to say we relied on a lot of plastic pouch gloop early on, could have made our own cheaper and better without all the waste.
Hummus is one of the things she suddenly doesn't like anymore even though she loved it most of her life so far lol. It's killing me, she is refusing most things with texture lately. We had to pick up some of those pouches this weekend. It feels like going in reverse since those are for kids younger than her I feel, but like you said, it's all she's accepting the last few days. We HAVE to figure something out soon that she can eat that's solid lol. The poos, are so bad right now.
 

dean_rcg

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,270

eyeball_kid

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,215
www.theguardian.com

3D-printed steak, anyone? I taste test this ‘gamechanging’ meat mimic | Zoe Williams

Marco Pierre White is championing Redefine Meat’s products, but do they live up to the hype?
this sounds interesting, I will be trying it asap

Redefine Meat - New Meat, No Compromise

Creating a world where anyone can enjoy great New-Meat, without compromising on taste, sustainability, or experience.

I couldn't find any ingredient lists for their products, but surprised to see a vegan-centric product that is made in the same plant that uses eggs and milk:
"Containing: Soy, Coconut, Barley- Gluten, Pine nuts.
May contain: Nuts (Almonds, Brazil nut, Cashew, Chestnuts, Hazelnut, Macadamia nut, Pecan, Pistachio and Walnuts), Peanuts, Wheat-Gluten, Rye- Gluten, Oat-Gluten, Sesame, Celery, Mustard, Eggs, Milk."

Hopefully this comes to the U.S. soon (not sure why they're doing Europe first). Impossible meat makes me nauseous and I find Beyond meat a bit too highly processed and lacks tenderness, so it would be nice to have another alternative.
 

eZipsis

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
2,435
Melbourne, Australia
I tried the Impossible burger tonight at Grill'd.
Didn't really like it, I'm not particularly after something that tastes like meat though.
I suppose it would be good for some people but I don't think it's aimed at vegans, it's more for people who are plant based. I wouldn't have it again.
 
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FliX

Master of the Reality Stone
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
9,856
Metro Detroit
I tried the Impossible burger tonight at Grill'd.
Didn't really like it, I'm not particularly after something that tastes like meat.
I suppose it would be good for some people but I don't think it's for vegans, it's for people who are plant based. I wouldn't have it again.
That's a rather pretentious thing to say...
Unless people stopped eating meat because they legitimately didn't like the taste of it I see no issue with people still seeking out and enjoying said flavour and mouth feel.
fwiw I like them on occasion.
 

PinkSpider

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,904
There was a lot of controversy around Impossible and animal testing (The heame; the specifically killed I think 47 rats to get FDA approval). As such it's a dirty word in the online community (US groups banned it, it hasn't hit the UK thankfully so haven't had to deal with it).

Saying that re faux meats I've barely ever eaten meat (Went meat free at the age of 5, 30 years ago and Vegan 16 years ago. No idea what the real stuff tastes like but love a Beyond burger, had faux chicken in fajitas all last week, love faux bacon etc. It's just handy food to fit in established meals as far as I can see it and it helps with most who are used to it and have transitioned for the animals not becuase they don't like the taste.
 

eZipsis

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
2,435
Melbourne, Australia
That's a rather pretentious thing to say...
Unless people stopped eating meat because they legitimately didn't like the taste of it I see no issue with people still seeking out and enjoying said flavour and mouth feel.
fwiw I like them on occasion.
Yeah I can definitely see that, I didn't really phrase it right. What I mean is I don't think it was designed to be aimed just at vegans I think it was created more to take advantage of the plant based market with vegans being a bonus for them. Not to say vegans can't seek out and enjoy it too, people can eat what they want that's their choice. I did leave out a ton of context too, as what PinkSpider said above it's a bit of an issue in Australian groups and conversation about it has been banned. There is a lot of fighting about wether or not it is vegan because of the ingredient that needed to get FDA approval.
 

ArkhamFantasy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,541
As someone who just became vegan back in march, mock meats and dairy free alternatives have been a godsend for football season.
 

Mr X

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
1,205
Virginia / US
The fake meats and cheeses were a great gateway for me to now eating only whole fruits, vegetables, beans and whole grains. Even if someone weren't to make the transition to forgo the fake vegan meats fully, that's still infinitely more preferable than the alternative.

Whole plants have copious amounts of flavor, and many spices are some of the healthiest foods on the planet (minus fake/added sugars and salts). But it takes breaking away from the over salted/oiled/sugared foods. Weaning certainly worked for me.
 

mentok15

Member
Dec 20, 2017
7,279
Australia
I don't mind some of the mock stuff for convinces or when trying to copy a non-vegan recipe (e.g. veggie sausages for currywurst).
 

derFeef

Member
Oct 26, 2017
16,348
Austria
I love me a good burger from time to time. But I am personally not a fan of the "steaks" and what not, it's just not my thing.
For christmas we also always have some sweet tofu sausages grilled on raclette, yum.
 

MatchaMouse

Member
Mar 12, 2018
311
My entire life i ate burgers, wings, snacks with my family on football weekends. It's my favorite thing i look forward to all year.

Yeah I'm the same, its very difficult to look forward to a bhudda bowl in the same way :D its not even that it tastes especially great it's just the experience feels incomplete without it.
Aww well I'm proud of you both for making the switch! It's hard to adjust to new traditions. I hope you'll find veg options that make you just as happy.
 

PinkSpider

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,904
Aww well I'm proud of you both for making the switch! It's hard to adjust to new traditions. I hope you'll find veg options that make you just as happy.
I don't necessarily think Vegans should find the need to move away from these products, finding new meals is fun (I'm addicted to Mezze) but I love burgers and faux meats, no moving away from them though as I've been meat free pretty much all my life. It's just nice food which fits in with established meals. If cows taste like seitan then why the hell are meat eaters eating cows etc.
 

MatchaMouse

Member
Mar 12, 2018
311
I don't necessarily think Vegans should find the need to move away from these products, finding new meals is fun (I'm addicted to Mezze) but I love burgers and faux meats, no moving away from them though as I've been meat free pretty much all my life. It's just nice food which fits in with established meals. If cows taste like seitan then why the hell are meat eaters eating cows etc.
Oh I am on the same page as you :) sorry if it didn't come across that way. I just meant I hope they find suitable vegan versions of the foods they enjoy (burgers, wings, etc)