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US PoliEra 2020 |OT 3| "I think he's learned his lesson" says The Concerned Immoderate Darling Collins.
- Thread starter TheHunter
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I thought it was fine for an overall mess of a debate.
you guys are wishcasting lol
I take offense to this statement.
...His last 2 answers were fine.
It seems the general sentiment here is pretty much the consensus if you look around.
Yeah, I think Bernie had a weaker debate than usual. And if people were paying attention, it's hard to imagine this not affecting the polls (he's probably not going to get a bump in SC, for eg). Bummer.
Bernie's gun answer was worse than Bloomberg's "I made some jokes that some women didn't like" answer? Really?
It's not as if he defended his previous votes against gun control. He explicitly said they were bad votes. There was literally nothing in his answer that defended his previous stance on guns, and to pretend otherwise is incredibly intellectually dishonest.
It's not as if he defended his previous votes against gun control. He explicitly said they were bad votes. There was literally nothing in his answer that defended his previous stance on guns, and to pretend otherwise is incredibly intellectually dishonest.
Yeah, like, I don't think there were any moments like the last debate that would fundamentally change anyone opinions. Everyone seemed to do okay considering what it was. I did not think I was saying anything particularly controversial given that seemed to be the sentiment here!
Some real Pete derangement syndrome in here.
She's saying Margaret
There's really nothing else to say other than that they were bad votes. Which he did! And I was glad to hear that. But the fact that he prefaced it with "Joe voted for these disastrous trade deals and the Iraq War" was so dumb, it came off as evasive and like I said earlier undermines his own argument about those very same issues. Because if Bernie can be forgiven for his bad votes, why should Biden then not also be forgiven for his bad votes?
She's saying Margaret
There's really nothing else to say other than that they were bad votes. Which he did! And I was glad to hear that. But the fact that he prefaced it with "Joe voted for these disastrous trade deals and the Iraq War" was so dumb, it came off as evasive and like I said earlier undermines his own argument about those very same issues. Because if Bernie can be forgiven for his bad votes, why should Biden then not also be forgiven for his bad votes?
That's the point though.
Bernie deflected that answer with a whatboutism over "but Biden voted on NAFTA!" That's weak and shows poor form.
But now you are also doing a whataboutism. I don't think anyone suggested that it's as bad as anything Bloomberg said but if that's your standard then that's already a low bar to clear (at least the answer isn't as bad as a really bad Bloomberg statement). It's not as bad as Bloomberg's answer, but it's still a bad answer in general.
I mean the whole reason that poster said that was because someone did say that.
If so then I apologize, I didn't see it on the top of the page. That answer was definitely not worse than the Bloomberg debacle from the previous debate.
Honestly it wasn't even as bad as Bloomberg almost saying "I bought Democratic congressmen."
I really don't see why Bernie needs to talk about the good things Fidel Castro has done. Who is that for? How does it benefit your campaign in the slightest to talk up literacy programs as a highlight of the Castro regime? It's just such an unnecessary thing to raise. There's no electoral benefit to it, it's way too complicated of a conversation to ever fit in a debate or interview or ad, and I don't know why this has to be a thing at all.
I wonder if that's because he was attacked from all sides.
Google says Amy's been using that term for a week or so I guess. There's also a blog somewhere that has a title starting with "Amy Klobuchar Uses Uncle Dick As Measuring Stick" which is lol.
No one's really denying that he's not really good at debating, just that he's a complete asshole who needs to go home and wait for his cabinet position.
He segued that into an admission that his previous stance on gun control was wrong.
What, specifically, did he say that was radically different from where the rest of the party stands on gun control? People here are acting as if he somehow doubled down on his previous stance, when in fact he did not.
Well someone literally said they thought it was the worst debate answer ever. No qualifiers. Just the worst answer ever given in the history of debate answers.
I think you can argue Bernie "won" if your bar is he didn't do anything to cause any of his support to waiver. And he probably didn't. The thing is, I have no clue what COULD make his support waiver. But I don't think if you went into the debate with doubts about Bernie being the nominee, he did absolutely nothing to assure any of those fears. In fact, Pete tore that scab wide open a few times. Did Bernie win over anyone with that performance? I don't think so. Was it a strong closing argument going into Super Tuesday? Nope. I don't think Warren did anything to help herself either. She really, really, really wanted a moment like last week. She didn't get it. Pete did great, but it's totally irrelevant for SC.
Biden I think probably did do a few things to help himself. At the very least, I think he did enough to get Clyburn's endorsement. He was already ahead in SC, so I think he might have done enough to go ahead and pull out the win there. if that can push him to maybe get a few wins on ST, that remains to be seen.
I would love to see how Bernie would deal with someone bringing up his vote against Amber Alerts now. I think that's one of those things a lot of voters aren't aware of, and particularly those suburban women we need to keep in the coalition. I kinda want all these attacks out of the way as early as possible to at least see how he's going to deal with it. Because I don't trust him to navigate it on the debate stage, should Trump manage to form a coherent sentence.
Biden I think probably did do a few things to help himself. At the very least, I think he did enough to get Clyburn's endorsement. He was already ahead in SC, so I think he might have done enough to go ahead and pull out the win there. if that can push him to maybe get a few wins on ST, that remains to be seen.
It's one of those things where he's technically right, so he won't let it go. There's more of that coming because it wasn't just Castro he praised.
I would love to see how Bernie would deal with someone bringing up his vote against Amber Alerts now. I think that's one of those things a lot of voters aren't aware of, and particularly those suburban women we need to keep in the coalition. I kinda want all these attacks out of the way as early as possible to at least see how he's going to deal with it. Because I don't trust him to navigate it on the debate stage, should Trump manage to form a coherent sentence.
yup. not surprised by this. the debate was too chaotic and general viewers don't like that. meanwhile, while sanders was attacked with some good barbs, just being the front runner and staying on-message is enough to reinforce that idea that he's leadership material.
That's probably why I didn't see it because it was such a hyperbolic statement that it didn't cross my stream of consciousness. But I still apologize for making that assumption.
I liked Bernie's response one time about what if progressive policies are popular.
Is it worse than Pete's black police officer derangement syndrome?
Lol, incredible.
Good politicking by Pete the uniter and reasonable choice.
My mom, for what that's worth as a suburban, white non-college educated (but she's still smart!) new voter since 2018, didn't like anyone today except Biden and Warren.
Pete: Too much shouting, she though it was gutsy first but by the end she was tired of hit shit and wanted him to shut up. She thought he was being too rude and, said, if any of the women had acted like him they'd be called crazy.
Bernie: She wasn't impressed nor unimpressed, if that makes sense, with his performance today. She said he had a feel of old man yelling at clouds at a few times with how he answered some questions.
Steyer and Amy: Neither left any impression on her at all, and she likes Amy. She said it felt like the end of Amy's candidacy in that she just didn't even feel present for the debate.
Bloomberg: Doesn't like him.
I was surprised she watched it but turns out she did.
Pete: Too much shouting, she though it was gutsy first but by the end she was tired of hit shit and wanted him to shut up. She thought he was being too rude and, said, if any of the women had acted like him they'd be called crazy.
Bernie: She wasn't impressed nor unimpressed, if that makes sense, with his performance today. She said he had a feel of old man yelling at clouds at a few times with how he answered some questions.
Steyer and Amy: Neither left any impression on her at all, and she likes Amy. She said it felt like the end of Amy's candidacy in that she just didn't even feel present for the debate.
Bloomberg: Doesn't like him.
I was surprised she watched it but turns out she did.
The biggest issue for Bernie was could he weather the expected storm. He had a bad first portion of the debate. But so did the entire debate stage. He recovered enough I think even though his performance overall was far from perfect.
It'll be an interesting next few days through Tuesday.
It'll be an interesting next few days through Tuesday.
I don't think Pete really sold himself all that well. Even if he managed to land a few hits, I don't know that any of it was to his benefit.
It was a shitshow, and honestly Biden was the only one that came out of it looking better than they did coming in.
It was a shitshow, and honestly Biden was the only one that came out of it looking better than they did coming in.
Biden is just a likable person.
Pete might be too in private, I've seen some stuff from him from 12 months ago where he's much more natural and relaxed, it's just now he's just doing this weird political cosplay that makes him seem phony and unlikable.
Bloomberg just has a rotten soul that's evident every time he opens his mouth.
Isn't this just the national polls redux? i.e., people thought their candidate did best in the debate
Edit: I referring to the order.
I mean, that's clearly not what Pete meant. Again, I'm not a fan of the guy, but to pretend he was saying the Civil Rights fight was bad or whatever is totally disingenuous.
Those are useless unless you know where they start which is why Nate's method is superior
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