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US PoliEra 2019 |OT8| WHITE HOUSE ADMITS TO QUID PRO QUO WITH UKRAINE
- Thread starter TheHunter
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I mean, define some. 1 of the House of Reps republicans flipped to support the inquiry. Maybe we'll get 5-6 by the end of this. Not like she can say "oh, it's totally doomed to fail in the Senate and this is all technically for show".
It is factually accurate that those who support Bernie over Warren are more likely to hold hostile sexist attitudes, yes. They're also less likely to support abortion rights, and several other issues that area lways labeled as "identity politics" . As I said, BIden supporters are the worst offenders, but there is hard data from polling now and polling in 2016 that indicate a correlation. And, also, I didn't say it was the only reason.
I think a lot of folks don't understand bias as it relates to women seeking positions of power. (I don't mean you, I'm talking about a universal body of people.) I don't think all Bernie supporters are sexist anymore than all Biden supporters are racist rubes. Folks internalize a hell of a lot of stuff about gender, and I won't lie if I say I don't side eye the candidates that draw a disproportionate amount of support from folks I'd rather not associate with. (That goes for Biden as well btw). At a certain point though, we consistently see the same offenders attacking the same kinds of people over and over. After a while, a pattern of behavior makes one question why it's always certain kinds of folks they go after.
Also, I think it's important to remember this person does not work for the Warren campaign. Is not a Warren surrogate. Isn't, as far as I know, being booked on these shows on behalf of the campaign. I think it's beyond silly and pathetic that paid staffers are spending time on this. It's this kind of shit that makes people side eye the campaign. It's just dumb getting in the weeds shit that serves no purpose.
We didn't have Warren getting all pissed when Susan was doing her "BUT SHE WAS A REPUBLICAN" thing. Because, Streisand effect, irrelevant idiots, etc. The biggest news story in the world right now is the impeachment of Sander's political opponent...and the campaign is being sloppy on twitter complaining about an MSNBC guest contributor that 99.9999% of people have never heard of, never seen, or give zero shits about. It shows a horrible understanding of how to control/drive a news cycle.
Pelosi's messaging is fine. I do think that she's aware of how craven the GOP is, but she has to frame impeachment as an attempt to protect the republic, which, you know, it is.
Pesca's mistake is that, reading between the lines here, he assumes that a GOP "true believer" believes in protecting the sovereignty of the U.S. against foreign actors, no matter what.
But actually, GOP "true believers" believe in using racism and sexism to consolidate and abuse state power against black and brown folks and women. In this light, Cotton loves what Trump is doing and would never vote to remove him, and his Republican constituents would agree with him.
Pesca's mistake is that, reading between the lines here, he assumes that a GOP "true believer" believes in protecting the sovereignty of the U.S. against foreign actors, no matter what.
But actually, GOP "true believers" believe in using racism and sexism to consolidate and abuse state power against black and brown folks and women. In this light, Cotton loves what Trump is doing and would never vote to remove him, and his Republican constituents would agree with him.
I get that, and you're right, there is a higher than average amount of men and maybe even some women with sexist views on Betnie's side, but i do follow a lot of women for Bernie on Twitter who care passionately about his agenda and his campaign and very progressive issues. And it's never good politics to just accuse somebody of sexism because they don't support the female candidate.
I mean there's two types of sexism working against Warren (and Harris, who also contends with racism) that generally benefits male candidates.
"Electability" is basically the new "likability." Likable enough doesn't really work on Warren... because she has higher net favorables than anyone else in the field. But basically it's underpinned by views that women and people of colour are less electable than white men. "I would vote for a woman, but I don't think my neighbour would."
But with regard to hostile sexism...
Unsurprisingly, these people want a strong white daddy. Preferably straight.
"Electability" is basically the new "likability." Likable enough doesn't really work on Warren... because she has higher net favorables than anyone else in the field. But basically it's underpinned by views that women and people of colour are less electable than white men. "I would vote for a woman, but I don't think my neighbour would."
But with regard to hostile sexism...
About a quarter of the primary electorate is higher than average with regard to hostile sexism.
Unsurprisingly, these people want a strong white daddy. Preferably straight.
Sure, that's fair. Like, I think part of the problem is Bernie is pretty freaking divisive. The people that like him REALLY like him, and those of us who ... don't, really, really, really fucking don't. You hold a gun to my head and tell me I have to pick between Biden and Bernie, and I'm going to go weep in a corner. There is also a pretty large subset of female voters (my mom, several of my church grandmas who are WOC, etc) who loathe him far more than I do, if you can imagine. So, for me, it's hard to really grasp the reason someone could possibly prefer him to Warren. And I freely admit that. Other folks probably have the same issue, and sexism kinda fits the overall picture pretty well (deserved or undeserved.) But, ya, it's hardly surprising that folks (men and women) who have hostile sexist attitudes want a strong white daddy. Disgusting, but not surprising.
I also think the weekly airing of grievances against everyone who dares slight Bernie is part of the reason he's stagnant in the polls (if I'm being generous), seeing his favorables drop, and is basically getting 0 crossover support.
Who is answering polls going "yeah, I'm the most sexist person around, I'll never vote for Warren because of the cooties"?
I'm not trying to downplay the political risk they're taking, but it doesn't seat well with me how quickly the media disregards what they did because of their districts.
Maxine, Omar and Tlaib had to put up with credible death threats and a President who appeared to be encouraging the attacks.
Yeah, this woman is a nobody. The part of that clip that stood out to me is the complete lack of pushback from either of the others.
Warren is 100% my second choice, behind Sanders. If Warren was on the exact same page as Bernie on the issues I think are most important, she'd be my first choice, if only because a lot of people have a weird, intense hate for Bernie.
I don't think it's fair to 100% put him solely in the old white man category, either. If he won, he would be the first Jewish president, and that's not nothing.
Did they at least thank you as you handed off your soul today, Tim? It's the least they could do once the next bombshell lands square where the latest stand is being made.
They're asking a (probably reduced) set of questions like these: https://secure.understandingprejudice.org/asi/ which give an at least somewhat-standardized measure of benevolent and hostile sexism.
It's a fair objection that some of these are pretty obviously asking "are you a sexist", and so probably some sexists give non-sexist answers, but you're at least catching out some combination of dumb and sexist.
Let's look at what the pundit actually said:
"Basically, at this point, if you are still supporting Sanders as opposed to Warren, it's kind of showing your sexism".
The above statement is wrong and dangerous, full stop, and no one should be defending it. This is not what sexism is. Sanders and Warren are not the same candidate, and there's more that separates them than gender.
If you want to examine particular comments or groups of folks who are exhibiting sexist behaviors within the supporters for a particular candidate,, that's one thing. Throwing a blanket over all of Sanders supporters as "sexist" should not be condoned in any way.
"Basically, at this point, if you are still supporting Sanders as opposed to Warren, it's kind of showing your sexism".
The above statement is wrong and dangerous, full stop, and no one should be defending it. This is not what sexism is. Sanders and Warren are not the same candidate, and there's more that separates them than gender.
If you want to examine particular comments or groups of folks who are exhibiting sexist behaviors within the supporters for a particular candidate,, that's one thing. Throwing a blanket over all of Sanders supporters as "sexist" should not be condoned in any way.
A 3rd GOP Governor has voiced support for an impeachment inquiry... and it's probably not someone you predicted.
This is just a preview of what's to come. You already see it with "never-trumpers". Meanwhile, we still have concentration camps on the border but as long as white moderates get to pat each other on the back because this time we're for real - you know, during the greatest constitutional crisis - existential crisis- of this country. Stellar job standing tough to the basket of deplorables in your districts. Meanwhile in real america, things are utter shit and people are dying and we still have fucking concentration camps.
Sounds like Hutchinson is saying the inquiry has merit. I'll be shocked if he (or any red state GOP governor) goes beyond that to say the President should actually be impeached.
I don't see how "if you are still supporting Sanders as opposed to Warren, you are kind of showing your sexism" could be accurate to any kind of degree. She's not saying that some of Bernie's supporters are sexist, she is saying that if you supporter Bernie over Warren, you are sexist, which is entirely wrong and brainwormed and no one should be defending it.
Its funny how theres people justifying MSNBC lady saying the bernie sexism nonsense
It shouldnt surprise me but i guess that i never learn. For every reasonable Warren supporter there is someone with an irrational Bernie hatred
It shouldnt surprise me but i guess that i never learn. For every reasonable Warren supporter there is someone with an irrational Bernie hatred
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Bernie Staffer: MSNBC said something dumb and wrong
Warren staffer: agree, statement was dumb and wrong
What's the issue exactly
Warren staffer: agree, statement was dumb and wrong
What's the issue exactly
Imagine getting sucked in by the Bernie problem, the exact same way, *again*. Imagine being that person.
That MSNBC is giving voice to these dumb and wrong opinions.
OP
OP
I don't care who the candidate is, shit like this actually really fucking bothers me.
Stop using black spaces for headlines. That crowd is way too fucking white to be at Clinton College. You're rolling in millions at this point, Warren. Have your campaign do some goddamn work to get black people to show up.
???
Sorry, what kind of discussion are you trying to engage with me? Are we talking about the value of facts here? Of information sources?
I bet the GOP will use this excuse to try to get SHS to run for governor in 2022 against the Lt. Governor Tim Griffin
I'd like her to more actively denounce peope trying to shame Sanders voters into voting for her, just like I'd like Bernie to tell his supporters on Twitter that Warren isn't Reagan 2.0.
I don't think anyone should expect them to do anything about it. MSNBC has found a myriad of ways to snipe at Bernie, and this is just the latest example.
If it wasn't some guest speaker taking shots at him, it'd be some other method.
Hutchinson occasionally does do something surprising like this. He's done it in the past, too.
The fact you think it's irrational is reason 949 why Bernie won't win, tbh. It's totally possible to loathe Bernie for totally rational reasons. I've aired them multiple times.
She's supposed to engage in a weekly airing of grievances about everyone who says something bad about her, obviously.
.
This person has zero to do with Warren's campaign. She's not even a supporter of Warren, so far as I know. She's a random person who shared a a thing she thinks. In the middle of impeachment week, THIS is the hill Bernie staffers wanna die on? Really?
If this woman worked for the campaign, if this woman was booked on the show as a Warren spokeswoman, as a Warren supporter, as literally anything other than some person MSNBC hires...then I'd be the first one telling her she should probably check herself, and the Warren campaign should do something about it. This constant need for the Bernie campaign to make mountains out of molehills is just exhausting. Should the woman have said it? No. Does this person's comments warrant literal campaign staffers trying to make this some massive RIGGED MEDIA narrative for the 9 millionth time? Absolutely fucking not. If MSNBC ticks people off, like CNN and Fox News do for me, just like don't watch it. I'm sure TYT says only nice things about Bernie. (Are they still a thing? I honestly don't know....)
I have heard zero people, here or elsewhere, who have tried to shame Bernie supporters into supporting Warren. I sure as hell haven't heard anyone actually associated with the campaign attempt to do that. Unlike Nina Turner. Unlike the even more simply Susan. Meanwhile, there have been documented instances of horrific behavior from some subsets of Bernie supports (Small though they undoubtedly are!) who have engaged in behavior that has, out of necessity, warranted a response directly from the campaign. Idiots are gonna idiot, no matter who they support. But I've seen nothing from the Warren, Pete, or, hell, even Biden campaign that would warrant a talking to from the candidate. (The other ones I don't know enough to comment on, but I surely haven't seen it.)
Also, I'll praise Bernie here. The other day he had a good exchange when someone tried to get him to say why he was better than Warren. He didn't bite at that. It was a dumb question, and he handled it very, very well. Now, explain that to your surrogates and staff who, DO have an insanely online presence and who are directly and indirectly responsible for some of the more egregious behavior some (again, some, a small number, not a majority) of his supporters engage in online.
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You weren't kidding. Holy shit:
Tony Posnanski
@tonyposnanski
Do you take your guns out to dinner before you fuck yourself with them, sir?
@tonyposnanski
Do you take your guns out to dinner before you fuck yourself with them, sir?
2004, shit...
Kerry won 65+ voters in Arkansas.
That was a tough night, my first Presidential election that I could vote in and Dubya gets re-elected.
Still, it was so tame compared to 2016.
Lol Warren isn't going to acknowledge any of this nonsense because like most people she doesn't give a shit about a random pundit saying something stupid.
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