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US PoliEra 2019 |OT8| WHITE HOUSE ADMITS TO QUID PRO QUO WITH UKRAINE
- Thread starter TheHunter
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More bias from the corporate media!
And acid washed.
I was hoping for that Warren/Clinton ticket.
But I don't think my prayers will be answered. Mostly because I'm not religious.
If Trump were to get in trouble for handling material on a server, I have no doubt you'll see people here trying to bring up Hillary and make their snide comments and trot out all the old bullshit.
And we already know that many of the people in this administration use private email to conduct official business. The GOP doesn't have to defend it, however, because nobody cares. Certainly not the media.
Trump is just savvy like that. Hillary is a crooked establishment politician who does nothing but spew lies and break laws.
Remember acid wash jeans? Tacky.
Oh, who cares about what people might theoretically do. Anyone theoretically making that point in the future is an idiot. I would find it deliciously ironic though. I have a warped sense of humor. One thing I learned from walking in the woods with my queen after the election, is that most people are total morons (myself included). Life's too short to worry about stupid people.
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It's not gonna be 100-0. I would prefer it to be secret if it fucking works and we actually get enough votes to impeach. Then by all means, fucking keep it secret.
I don't think your prayer will be answered for a myriad of reasons, least of which is your holy magic stat
I mean, I don't know.
It seems like the only logical reason we can't have nice things.
Well there's no harm in at least trying to raise it then. Start healing more, find someone who will let you respec, move some stats around.
We're all counting on you
Yeah. Hillary was definitely better than the alternative but 2 of the 3 front runners for 2020 are far better candidates.
I already busted this stupid mirror on The Lady Vengeance, I figure at this point I have to just start grinding.
LOL Congress leaks like an old bladder. Even with a "secret" vote, we'd know who voted how within hours.
Considering the lack of cooperation, obfuscation, and obstruction from the Administration, that doesn't really seem surprising. Indeed, wasn't Mueller's position effectively "there's some stuff here that suggests there is probably more there, and Congress should investigate given I've done about all I'm allowed to do"?
Combing over diplomatic transcripts wasn't like... at all in his scope of stuff though, unless I guess maybe you'd be referring to one with Russia directly (in which case yeah, one assumes there would have been stuff there?).
Edit: To clarify, I doubt Mueller would ever have thought there'd be proof of something THIS STUPID hiding IN PLAIN SIGHT in a diplomatic transcript. That said, does like no one ever read these if they're supposedly not super classified? If if they suddenly were super classified overnight one day, how did no one notice that?
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Well, Mueller's probe was very narrow in scope. Obviously, the transcript of the Russian phone calls probably should have been included, but it's entirely possible to understand why they might have been missed.
Also, I'ma say something that's gonna get some flames but yolo:
I'm voting for Warren. My husband is...probably voting for Warren but maybe Pete because that whole super serious military person/temperament thing works on him (and he wants to support a fellow gay, but Pete will be out by Ohio so I let him have his little fantasy for now). But Warren is the menu item I'm ordering cause they're out of what I really want. So instead of speaking with the manager and making a big scene, I just order the closest thing I can find. And that's totally fine. That's what being a grown up is all about.
Also, I'ma say something that's gonna get some flames but yolo:
I'm voting for Warren. My husband is...probably voting for Warren but maybe Pete because that whole super serious military person/temperament thing works on him (and he wants to support a fellow gay, but Pete will be out by Ohio so I let him have his little fantasy for now). But Warren is the menu item I'm ordering cause they're out of what I really want. So instead of speaking with the manager and making a big scene, I just order the closest thing I can find. And that's totally fine. That's what being a grown up is all about.
To be clear, "there's a server where the admin is hiding all the fuckin evidence every time Trump makes a dumb call and it's existed since day 1" is a thing Mueller should have identified and found.
And there are translators who literally sat alone in a room with Putin and Trump and he didnt even talk to him
Who did he even interview like what the fuck
Yeuuup
edit, in hindsight I'm sort of mad he didn't fire Mueller. I wonder if we would have gotten some traction with that?
Like, are we talking tree elves, or some sort of ground dwelling mammal?
Never looked like he wanted the job. Presented his facts thinking Bill Barr is a good character and the institutions are still working. Wouldn't even read his own fucking text during testimony. Afraid of saying "impeachment". Set a standard so, impossibly high for collusion crimes that no he was going to prove anything. Don Jr's email were enough to seal a criminal conspiracy but figured Don Jr was ignorant and didn't really commit crimes.
If Trump were maybe a grade smarter he would have come completely clean out of Mueller investigation.
Eh, I understood it even if I didn't go in deep myself. People needed a reason to hope and that was an "easy" reason.
How is it biased?
But also, that's why Sanders has a better chance of actually defeating Trump than does Warren. (Sad as it is to say.)
I think Mueller is catching too much heat here considering hindsight is 20/20, it's the hot take right now. However, I do think after the dust settles there does need to be an examination of his efforts- not in an effort to embarrass him or question his integrity, but to better understand why an official investigation landed only glancing blows when a 9 page whistleblower's memo has been devastating. I think any postmortem of the Mueller Investigation needs to look at things like the reviving the Independent Counsel, and related empowerment to compel testimony. His investigation was certainly hampered by uncooperative witnesses and corrupted institutions that didn't want to help him. There are certainly many mechanical improvements that can be made in the statute I imagine, but I'll leave that up to legal experts. It would be interesting if Mueller would comment on areas of difficulty and the powers that would have been helpful.
More specific to Mueller, I think things in and out of his control need to be identified as culprits. In hindsight the Mueller Report is very inaccessible. I've read a decent chunk of it and good god is it dry. It isn't particularly difficult, but like that Op-ed said today- the Whistleblower was a better writer. Mueller also wasn't any sort of salesman. On one hand that seems nice, a guy of integrity who is only interested in the facts, but he was out maneuvered by people who have proven to be pretty dumb. For all of his investigative skills, he clearly had a blind spot for politics. The narrative was snatched away from him by politically savvy people who warped his findings. Then, as if to further rub it in how unprepared he was to actually answer for his report, he dawdled to testify, and when he finally did testify he was stiff as a board. Yes, his report spoke for itself, but that doesn't suffice these days. Finally, his black and white view of his role was out of place in such a murky investigation- thus compounding his stiffness and blind spots. If you asked Mueller 'sir, this animal looks like a duck, sounds like a duck, swims like a duck, can we conclude it is a duck?' he would say 'I can't speculate on the nature of that animal, but I can confirm that it does look, sound, and swim like a duck.' Considering the criminals he was investigating, and their propaganda tools, he was a poor fit. I have to suspect that if Mueller was in position to determine the credibility of the Whistleblower's complaint, he would have dismissed it on the fact that it is 2nd hand information. In hindsight we needed someone that was more of an attack dog and would call a spade a spade. As it is, Mueller's criminal prosecutions are suddenly looking very weak.
It was also troubling how much he rolled over for the DOJ's memo about indicting a sitting President. Considering his position, he was in a prime position to challenge that very flimsy rule. In my mind, much has been made of that memo, but I'm sorry a memo is not law and it is begging to be challenged. Perhaps Mueller wasn't in position to do it, or maybe he wasn't the right guy, but as a layman from 30,000 feet he was the closest we've ever come to really discussing that memo's validity, and he rolled over for it. It is, again, an example of his deference to institutions and norms while the criminals he was investigating use those institutions and norms against us. His absolute lack of creativity was his undoing- and is ironically where a guy like Comey would have been useful.
More specific to Mueller, I think things in and out of his control need to be identified as culprits. In hindsight the Mueller Report is very inaccessible. I've read a decent chunk of it and good god is it dry. It isn't particularly difficult, but like that Op-ed said today- the Whistleblower was a better writer. Mueller also wasn't any sort of salesman. On one hand that seems nice, a guy of integrity who is only interested in the facts, but he was out maneuvered by people who have proven to be pretty dumb. For all of his investigative skills, he clearly had a blind spot for politics. The narrative was snatched away from him by politically savvy people who warped his findings. Then, as if to further rub it in how unprepared he was to actually answer for his report, he dawdled to testify, and when he finally did testify he was stiff as a board. Yes, his report spoke for itself, but that doesn't suffice these days. Finally, his black and white view of his role was out of place in such a murky investigation- thus compounding his stiffness and blind spots. If you asked Mueller 'sir, this animal looks like a duck, sounds like a duck, swims like a duck, can we conclude it is a duck?' he would say 'I can't speculate on the nature of that animal, but I can confirm that it does look, sound, and swim like a duck.' Considering the criminals he was investigating, and their propaganda tools, he was a poor fit. I have to suspect that if Mueller was in position to determine the credibility of the Whistleblower's complaint, he would have dismissed it on the fact that it is 2nd hand information. In hindsight we needed someone that was more of an attack dog and would call a spade a spade. As it is, Mueller's criminal prosecutions are suddenly looking very weak.
It was also troubling how much he rolled over for the DOJ's memo about indicting a sitting President. Considering his position, he was in a prime position to challenge that very flimsy rule. In my mind, much has been made of that memo, but I'm sorry a memo is not law and it is begging to be challenged. Perhaps Mueller wasn't in position to do it, or maybe he wasn't the right guy, but as a layman from 30,000 feet he was the closest we've ever come to really discussing that memo's validity, and he rolled over for it. It is, again, an example of his deference to institutions and norms while the criminals he was investigating use those institutions and norms against us. His absolute lack of creativity was his undoing- and is ironically where a guy like Comey would have been useful.
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The thing about the Mueller report that is different than the Whistleblower is this: Mueller went out of his way to avoid making judgments and literally spent years debating whether the president could be charged, and the report reflects that. Compare that to the whistleblower shouting THIS! RIGHT HERE! THIS IS A CRIME!
Yes, his vote for the garden gnome makes sense now.
Not just the probe, but all the investigations they handed off that were outside the scope of the inquiry.
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I'd stand by this statement if you can forgive the oldness of it - mueller was a joe Friday when we all needed a columbo.
I can live with it because I almost called him Joe Friday in my post.
Nah. If Comey hadn't been fired they would have easily obstructed him. Comey is weaksauce.
Mueller brought a LOT of attention to the doings in Trumpland. Yeah, he's too much of a boyscout and let Rosenstein constrain him too much, I can't argue against that but he was chosen because he was a boyscout.
The specific direct outcomes of the Mueller investigation are far less important than the threads he uncovered that have been successfully tugged on since.
Trump isn't even going to be the GOP candidate in November 2020. Possible outcomes:
1) Removal by the Senate (not due to conscience of GOP senators, but due to GOP panic)
2) Removal by the 25th Amendment (not due to conscience by Pence and cabinet members, but from panic)
3) Resigns in exchange for a pardon on federal charges (Pence would do this)
4) Gets sick and resigns (his neurological degeneration is observable, and it's going to accelerate even faster under stress). Falls down steps, has a neurological event, whatever
5) Gets "sick" and resigns (fake sick)
6) Dies of natural causes
7) Dies of "natural causes" (not getting into details)
8) Some combination of the above (gets sick and is removed because, or "sick" and removed...or gets "sick" and is pardoned, and so on...many permutations).
We're hitting pressure points. Release valves are going to pop. There's a point where self preservation kicks in among GOP elected officials and they cut their losses and try to survive without Trump. When they see no hope for Trump coattails in 2020, they *will* end his presidency. Trump's base can NOT win an election and never have won an election. It was his base *plus*, and the plus part is running for the hills. FOX News already is planning for "post Trump". Multiple Fox personalities are throwing him under the bus, much to the consternation of the other personalities. Multiple Republican officials have *already*, just after this week (lol we're just getting started) have said it's ok to have an inquiry. Most elected GOP officials are saying NOTHING. Yeah, the high profile ones are defending Trump, but most are completely silent.
Also, yes, his mind is really, really rotting. He wouldn't be able to do debates in 2020. There's a really good chance he's incapable of forming enough sentences that aren't read from a teleprompter by then.
Again he is not the candidate, and I say it repeatedly. Trump is not going to be on the ticket in 2020. And I post it so you can screenshot it and bookmark it for future ridicule.
But I don't see that happening.
The Trump POTUS era is winding down, and it's winding down fast. Once pure panic hits the GOP they will knife him in the fucking back because that's what the GOP is. Sure, the "Trump base" will be furious. They aren't big enough to be politically relevant. They didn't elect Trump. They weren't big enough to. You're giving them the benefit of clout they do not have.
If you thought this last week was a really long year, just wait.
Time is a flat circle. Most aren't looking at Watergate closely enough. Shit is worse now (polarization especially) but not different enough; Republicans *will* eat their own once the fight or flight instinct kicks in.
If I'm wrong, the far more likely outcome isn't Trump being the candidate. It's that the American Experiment ends and there isn't even an election.
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The short and sweet of the Mueller probe is that it was never about getting Trump. Rosenstien appointed Mueller because if he didn't, the leadership at the FBI was going to tear itself apart going after Trump. Keeping the focus narrow and never letting Mueller actually dig deep enough to bring anyone down was the only way to keep McCabe from prosecuting Trump. Once McCabe was gone and Barr was brought in, Mueller submitted a report that Barr knew could only say "not guilty" or "not not guilty." It was to protect the FBI from itself and protect Trump from the FBI.
I think Mueller wanted this to get out of DOJ's hands. Dude says sweet words about Barr, but I think he knew the game was up. It's the only thing that makes sense as to why they broadened their investigation, even into the middle east, and then *poof*.
Anyways, his entire report is an impeachment referral. From his excuses on why he didn't jail people he knew were boldfaced lying in an attempt to obstruct him to not dragging Trump in for further questioning. Can't indict president and escalating things close to president will make the investigation drag way too long. Couple this with his admission that he was being withheld information or things go missing and dude just knew when to cut loose and hope that Congress, someone with far more broader rules, does something.
Like Ukraine for example. In a similar pattern, Trump is withholding weapons from Ukraine and Ukraine then cuts off support to Mueller during his investigation and they let Kilimnik, one of the KEY guys to his already narrow investigation, escape to Russia. Mueller also looked at the corrupt Ukrainian politicians who were probably bribing Trump at his inauguration and later. But of course, passed off. I'm sure one of the several state and federal investigations into the inauguration have something on it.
Not to mention basically zero counter-intelligence included in Mueller's report and findings. And all financial crimes and the like were passed on to other jurisdictions. The whistleblower and other stuff - that's what we expect to find a lot more of in the counter-intelligence, which has been kept from Congress since Comey's firing.
Don't y'all find it curious how a lot of this shit seems to have a timeline spawning from that particular moment? Mueller did too as he himself was spawned from it, but he was constrained but also way too much of a servant to the system.
I'm coming to the conclusion that Barr came in and saw what Mueller had and that it could be easily worked around. I don't think he "killed" the investigation as much as he wrapped it up slightly early. From there he was able to massage it as necessary to avoid any real damage from it. The key is though that I don't think we were looking at months more of investigation from Mueller, I feel like he had what he had at that point. If left to his own devices he may have kept on for 4-12 more weeks, picking at some small fry and giving them short sentences, but once Trump refused any interview I think Mueller's grand scope closed quickly.
Barr's real corruption was in his release of the report and twisting its findings, but not in his closing of the investigation itself.
I find Pete very cute, not hot. I consider those two to be different types of attractiveness on a spectrum. He does have a mouse face though, but in a good way idk. I find Jason Kander, on the other hand, to be hot, though I'd rate them both at a similar level of attractiveness
Welcome to my mind btw
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When this is all said and done, we need a definitive telling of the inside story from the FBI/intelligence. I had forgotten that there were reports in those days after Comey's firing that the FBI was getting real anxious and wanted to investigate Trump directly. Like dabig2 said, there are probably more individual threads coming together right now, many uncovered by Mueller, than we'll ever truly know.
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