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plagiarize

Eating crackers
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
27,511
Cape Cod, MA
NO, the Mueller Report content will be astonishing and shocking and damning. I'm worried about two related items:

1. What Barr releases to the public
2. How America and the GOP have been boiled like a frog to just not care anymore
Yeah. This.

They're probably going to view it like 'well even though it says the President did these criminal things, WE don't think they're criminal, so no one needs to know about those bits'. It's going to be a fight, but one I am confident the white house will lose.
 

thefit

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,243
Am I the only one getting the feeling that the Mueller Report may come up a dud somewhat?

I've been getting this feeling since the Michael Cohen hearing. During the hearing Cohen refuted some notable points of the Russian investigation and he seemed to be in the dark of concrete coordination with Russia.

The Mueller Report is suppose be done "any day" now and there's been no word of Don Jr. Kush, or Ivanka bring brought in for questioning or indicted. Clearly Manafort and Roger Stone are dirty but it seems their actions were periphery to the campaign rather than part of a key strategy.

We still don't know what Michael Flynn said and there still might be some quid pro quo involving sanctions. I personally think the Trump Moscow revelation was a big deal, but it seems Trump has already weathered that storm. I think the drip drip nature of all these revelations has allowed the public to get numb to everything and each revelation just fades away.

Hopefully in the Mueller Report there will be revelations of obstruction of justice and witness tampering that hasn't been made public yet. But if the Mueller Report contains 90% of things we've already know about, I think it'll land like a wet fart. Perhaps that's why House Dems are ramping up their investigations, so they don't have to rely on Mueller and his relatively strict guidelines.
Cohen wasn't kept in the loop in regards to the Trump tower meeting because that was being coordinated by others. Cohen only made sure the committee knew he wasn't part of that conspiracy. You only have to remember that Comey was fired to make "the Russia thing" go away to know it happened and Mueller knows about it.
 

Paches

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,598
A group of women from SC =/= young black men, but okay.

The rest of it makes sense. I probably should put my money where my mouth is because I think we're ending up with POTUS Biden if he runs.
If we are going to do a "Power Rankings" type thing, I think 1) Biden 2) Harris 3) Sanders.

I agree that if Biden runs he is going to be hard to beat in the primary, in theory. I guess we will see once the debates begin and we find out just how liberal he will run his campaign.
 

Stinkles

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,459
Couple thoughts.

1) Everyone in his camp is scared to death to release them. His lawyers have been arguing fiercely to make excuses since 2015. On the one hand that could have been a concern over misrepresenting his campaign rhetoric of being a smart and "wealthy" businessman, on the other...

2) the paper trail will lead to falsified valuations, potentially damaging interests and/or funds or havens that the family probably never wants under the public microscope. Also he may indeed have filed direct munnies funded from oligarchs in creative ways that possibly is covered by complicit consultants also trying to bury this shit.

3) or it totally clears the President.


Trump has lied enough PUBLICLY about his taxes and business for an IRS fraud case to be 100% in there, but his taxes are so bad, that the only reason he even entered the GOP primary was as a PR boost knowing that he was destined to lose and it would never come to light. Everything that happened since then has been crooked or lucky - and his deliberate leak of what appeared to be the only two normal pages of taxes he ever filed, ironically via Rachel Maddow, is all he's got. His charity alone will be cement boots.

HIs taxes likely contain two giant horrors for Trump:

1. Showing a huge and ancient pattern of illegal financial behavior.
2. Showing that he was not a billionaire, likely for the vast majority of the time he claimed to be one.


Trump is such a creature of ego and luck, that I actually assume number two is more worrying to him. Because he's never been sent to jail, he thinks that he cannot possibly be sent to jail. But he has been broke in public, and it's the worst thing that can happen to his self-created image.
 

Soul Skater

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,201
I think Biden also benefits from the fact that as problematic as he is I'm unsure if anyone in the field has the guts to really go after him.

I think most will hope he self implodes; but that would be a mistake
 

ArkhamFantasy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,545
I doubt a rich old white guy is going to win the democratic nomination post trump, but if a rich old white guy did win it probably wouldn't be Biden and his sales pitch of "working with our friends from across the aisle."
 

kcp12304

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,974
I think Biden also benefits from the fact that as problematic as he is I'm unsure if anyone in the field has the guts to really go after him.

I think most will hope he self implodes; but that would be a mistake

Yeah, the first Democrat to attack him will get "so I was talking to Barrack about this the other day and he told me..."
 

Linkura

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,943
The thing about Biden is what type of infrastructure would he have?
Ban cars, Amtrak is the only legal form of transportation.

Trump has lied enough PUBLICLY about his taxes and business for an IRS fraud case to be 100% in there, but his taxes are so bad, that the only reason he even entered the GOP primary was as a PR boost knowing that he was destined to lose and it would never come to light. Everything that happened since then has been crooked or lucky - and his deliberate leak of what appeared to be the only two normal pages of taxes he ever filed, ironically via Rachel Maddow, is all he's got. His charity alone will be cement boots.

HIs taxes likely contain two giant horrors for Trump:

1. Showing a huge and ancient pattern of illegal financial behavior.
2. Showing that he was not a billionaire, likely for the vast majority of the time he claimed to be one.


Trump is such a creature of ego and luck, that I actually assume number two is more worrying to him. Because he's never been sent to jail, he thinks that he cannot possibly be sent to jail. But he has been broke in public, and it's the worst thing that can happen to his self-created image.
Also his taxes are supposedly still under audit by the IRS. Betcha they found something.
 

Soul Skater

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,201
Gillibrand will. Christie it up.
Actually yeah good point; she might

However after the Franken situation sort of blew up on her (I know it's bullshit that it did but) she was sort of slow and more hesitant to call on northam to resign than others. Makes me wonder if she is re-evaluating the "destroy other dems for the greater good" strategy
 

Owzers

Member
Oct 26, 2017
13,443
Dems in disarray, too many scandals to look into so they look partisan!

The media is complicit with these trash narratives they love.
 

corasaur

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,988
I doubt a rich old white guy is going to win the democratic nomination post trump, but if a rich old white guy did win it probably wouldn't be Biden and his sales pitch of "working with our friends from across the aisle."

it's not gonna be "friends across the aisle," it's gonna be "remember when you had the luxury of thinking politics was boring?"
 

Autodidact

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,729
Actually yeah good point; she might

However after the Franken situation sort of blew up on her (I know it's bullshit that it did but) she was sort of slow and more hesitant to call on northam to resign than others. Makes me wonder if she is re-evaluating the "destroy other dems for the greater good" strategy
I hope she knows she has no chance of winning and will embrace that strategy.
 

Iloelemen

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,323
User banned (5 days): off-site drama
Are there any existing posters who are critical of Ilhan Omar and happens to post on sites like thebore?
 

DanGo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,739
The thing about the tax returns is that they probably don't show anything - or the IRS would (should have) caught it. We know Trump is super dumb, but I doubt he's dumb enough to put laundered Russian money in his tax forms.
This would only be true of a fully staffed and empowered IRS, which hasn't been the case for eons.
 

Blader

Member
Oct 27, 2017
26,607
Actually yeah good point; she might

However after the Franken situation sort of blew up on her (I know it's bullshit that it did but) she was sort of slow and more hesitant to call on northam to resign than others. Makes me wonder if she is re-evaluating the "destroy other dems for the greater good" strategy

I read a story months ago about how when all the stuff about Schneiderman was coming out and people were instantly looking to Gillibrand for a statement, she lamented at always needing to be the first one to come out swinging against problematic members of her own party. And probably does not want a reputation like to entirely define her.
 
Oct 27, 2017
993
Haubergeon Indiana Jones Tracygill

In relation to your suspended discussion from the 2020 thread (see: one / two / three), the thread aeolist posted yesterday (Former Clinton Treasury economist: The Democratic center should yield to the left) may be of interest.

DeLong's statements to Vox came as a bit of a surprise to many, given that DeLong is something of a 'champion' for those who proudly self-identify as 'neoliberal' (indeed, DeLong proudly describes himself as a neoliberal within the Vox interview itself, in order to emphasize his enduring affinity/enthusiasm for market-based solutions).

DeLong recommends that the center should 'yield' to the left "given the political-economic context" of the present time. There's also been interesting follow-up discussion of the piece:

https://twitter.com/haroldpollack/status/1102682679496138753
Brad DeLong captures the sentiment of many of us center-left policy wonks who spent much of our careers proposing reasonable policies that required or at-least presumed responsible center-right partner. We're kind of done with that, in light of experience: Link



https://twitter.com/Econ_Marshall/status/1103008218576576512
Fantastic follow-up to the @delong interview by @rortybomb. It isn't just the politics that discredits elite "Rubinite" centrism, but the economics also. The policy tradeoffs we were told we were making turned out to have no upside: Link

 
OP
OP
Ogodei

Ogodei

One Winged Slayer
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,256
Coruscant
Gillibrand could do her service by testing Sanders on sexual harassment. Either he has damning culpability there and should sink for it, or she gets him to condemn it more strongly than he did.

I just had the most bizarre phone screen for a liberal advocacy org. Lasted less than 7 minutes and was held by someone who had only been there a week, who would refer me on to the hiring manager so yay, I guess?

The in-person interview went better today. Fingers crossed to finally get my ass out of customer service. I burnt a sick day for this so I'm worried that it brings down suspicion. Three people in my department are in the process of quitting.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,877
Guys, you don't have to erase black men being a core part of the Democratic coalition in order to big up black women. This is not also to say that black women don't have slightly better numbers as vote share than black men or that they aren't better at voting for the correct candidate (i.e. not Donald fucking Trump), but that black men also are an outsized Democratic voting bloc over everyone else but black women. I think it's foolish to pretend that what black men think won't matter in a Democratic Primary. It's a wishful ignorance of some of the problems that Harris will have.

lbr, how many young black men vote in primaries?

This is actually a fair question, so I went back to the 2016 primaries, but it was hard to find an exact breakdown. I could find stuff like younger voters across racial demos being a higher proportion of the primary vote in 2016, but I honestly can't tell you what the answer is.

I just don't think that handwaving the attacks on Harris's record away as "Oh, it's just Bernie bros, etc." is very astute. And for what it's worth, though Harris is maybe my fourth or fifth choice on the list, I have zero issue with voting for her (without holding my nose at this point, even! She's developing good policy). I think that she's also the most competent candidate running (or at least very near the most competent).

But I think that she'll have serious problems, and not just with young black men, but I don't think she's going to do well with black men for a number of reasons. We'll see though. Trust me, I'd much rather have President Harris than President fucking Biden. Sweet fuck.
 

Linkura

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,943
Gillibrand could do her service by testing Sanders on sexual harassment. Either he has damning culpability there and should sink for it, or she gets him to condemn it more strongly than he did.

I just had the most bizarre phone screen for a liberal advocacy org. Lasted less than 7 minutes and was held by someone who had only been there a week, who would refer me on to the hiring manager so yay, I guess?

The in-person interview went better today. Fingers crossed to finally get my ass out of customer service. I burnt a sick day for this so I'm worried that it brings down suspicion. Three people in my department are in the process of quitting.
Non profits can really be a fucking mess. But it does sound better than where you're coming from at least.
 

Stinkles

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,459



in 2019, Google and IBM revealed that a technological singularity had occurred when they made the following query of the 12 trillion Yottaflop "Deepest Yellow" hypercomputer:

"Write the Trumpiest story you can, D-Yella"


lEFVu3J.jpg
 

Haubergeon

Member
Jan 22, 2019
2,269
Haubergeon Indiana Jones Tracygill

In relation to your suspended discussion from the 2020 thread (see: one / two / three), the thread aeolist posted yesterday (Former Clinton Treasury economist: The Democratic center should yield to the left) may be of interest.

Interesting reads, and yeah, this quote is absolutely right on:

Barack Obama rolls into office with Mitt Romney's health care policy, with John McCain's climate policy, with Bill Clinton's tax policy, and George H.W. Bush's foreign policy. He's all these things not because the technocrats in his administration think they're the best possible policies, but because [White House adviser] David Axelrod and company say they poll well.

And [Chief of Staff] Rahm Emanuel and company say we've got to build bridges to the Republicans. We've got to let Republicans amend cap and trade up the wazoo, we've got to let Republicans amend the [Affordable Care Act] up the wazoo before it comes up to a final vote, we've got to tread very lightly with finance on Dodd-Frank, we have to do a very premature pivot away from recession recovery to "entitlement reform."

All of these with the idea that you would then collect a broad political coalition behind what is, indeed, Mitt Romney's health care policy and John McCain's climate policy and George H.W. Bush's foreign policy.

And did George H.W. Bush, did Mitt Romney, did John McCain say a single good word about anything Barack Obama ever did over the course of eight solid years?

No, they fucking did not. No allegiance to truth on anything other than the belief that John Boehner, Paul Ryan, and Mitch McConnell are the leaders of the Republican Party, and since they've decided on scorched earth, we're to back them to the hilt. So the politics were completely wrong, and we saw this starting back in the Clinton administration.

In a vacuum I can appreciate the value of trying to work with the other party, to seek out "experts," to try and find "common ground" and so on, but in practice this always blows up in Democrats' faces and is honestly just bad, ineffective policymaking that muddies the waters for the public to gauge who is good and bad on what issue. Obama is the textbook example of this kind of working-together-incrementalist approach, given everything he could've wanted at the outset to make it all happen, and it didn't work, those polls telling them their approach would work perfectly were garbage (same as Robbie Mook and Hillary's great "data" on how they didn't need to campaign here or there turning out to be completely unreliable crap - you cannot just view things through focus groups) and we cannot, especially given the urgency of some issues like the environment, waste time doing literally the same thing all over again. If you've tried something over and over again and it doesn't work it's time to try something different - in this case its time to give the Left a chance.

Thinking about how much of Obama's policy was borrowed from the right and center is honestly amazing in retrospect, it floors me to read people saying "Okay, we need to beat Trump, but be careful how we do it, we don't want to go too far, we need to take it slow and [have exactly the same thing to us happen for the third time]."
 

sphagnum

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
16,058
Haubergeon Indiana Jones Tracygill

In relation to your suspended discussion from the 2020 thread (see: one / two / three), the thread aeolist posted yesterday (Former Clinton Treasury economist: The Democratic center should yield to the left) may be of interest.

DeLong's statements to Vox came as a bit of a surprise to many, given that DeLong is something of a 'champion' for those who proudly self-identify as 'neoliberal' (indeed, DeLong proudly describes himself as a neoliberal within the Vox interview itself, in order to emphasize his enduring affinity/enthusiasm for market-based solutions).

DeLong recommends that the center should 'yield' to the left "given the political-economic context" of the present time. There's also been interesting follow-up discussion of the piece:

https://twitter.com/haroldpollack/status/1102682679496138753
Brad DeLong captures the sentiment of many of us center-left policy wonks who spent much of our careers proposing reasonable policies that required or at-least presumed responsible center-right partner. We're kind of done with that, in light of experience: Link



https://twitter.com/Econ_Marshall/status/1103008218576576512
Fantastic follow-up to the @delong interview by @rortybomb. It isn't just the politics that discredits elite "Rubinite" centrism, but the economics also. The policy tradeoffs we were told we were making turned out to have no upside: Link



This is excellent, thanks.
 

Stinkles

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,459
This is Biden's...


Ignore the twitter user. It's one of those maga dummies/racists.



Yeah I will ignore the Twitter user and the sirens and the edit and the slow mo and the context because none of those things matter. Biden is a gaffe prone out of touch old man with serious personal space and appropriateness issues who's better off retiring -- but you're literally presenting an accusation of child molestation which apparently Joe does right in public.

If you really think he's a monster instead of an idiot then point to that but this is branded and edited content and repeating this edit is doing work for people who are not honestly concerned about any danger to children or biker molls. I'm not defending his creepy deal but I can't not say something about this mode of presentation.

I get that you're pointing out what they'll do.
 

KidAAlbum

Member
Nov 18, 2017
3,177
If you really think he's a monster instead of an idiot then point to that but this is branded and edited content.
Well the context that is my post speaks for itself. We're talking about his behavior and how that will come to bite him. The fact that it was edited doesn't change what he did.

No idea why you're even making a big deal outside of the footage. That is all irrelevant in this discussion.
 

Menelaus

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,682
Yeah I will ignore the Twitter user and the sirens and the edit and the slow mo and the context because none of those things matter. Biden is a gaffe prone out of touch old man with serious personal space and appropriateness issues who's better off retiring -- but you're literally presenting an accusation of child molestation which apparently Joe does right in public.

If you really think he's a monster instead of an idiot then point to that but this is branded and edited content.
Regardless of the editing or hilarious overdubbing of Radiohead, it's a pattern of somewhat disturbing, if not completely out of touch, behavior that is OPTICS SUICIDE KLAXON KLAXON in a 2019 world.

Fergie Olver was a fucking creep on his televised game shows and parents, visibily distressed but clearly subjugated by a person "in power" so to speak, were motionless to protect their own kids, so being "in public" has fuck all to do with it. As a parent, the looks on some of those mother's faces in the Biden vids tells me exactly how they are feeling in that moment.
 

JustinP

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,343
Yeah I will ignore the Twitter user and the sirens and the edit and the slow mo and the context because none of those things matter. Biden is a gaffe prone out of touch old man with serious personal space and appropriateness issues who's better off retiring -- but you're literally presenting an accusation of child molestation which apparently Joe does right in public.

If you really think he's a monster instead of an idiot then point to that but this is branded and edited content and repeating this edit is doing work for people who are not honestly concerned about any danger to children or biker molls. I'm not defending his creepy deal but I can't not say something about this mode of presentation.

I get that you're pointing out what they'll do.
Afaik nobody is accusing him of being a child molester -- KidAAlbum said it was video of him being a creep, and that looks pretty creepy to me.
 

-Le Monde-

Avenger
Dec 8, 2017
12,613
Pretty toothless when they support an actual sexual predator as President. Actually, they support multiple sexual predators.
 
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