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Balfour

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,541
True, DDD pretty much introduced the idea of anything is possible now. I think it felt like that because i watched the back cover movie like a month ago and didn't feel Luxu had that kind of personality when interacting. Also, the beginning of fragmentary passage showed Luxu watching the ending of BBS, even though Braig was there doing his thing during the final battle. I guess he had to go throw on his coat and grab the box real quick lol.

Actually looking back on it now, that could have been him watching the end of the original Keyblade War

also Luxu was a student of the MoM and MoM must of had a huge impact on him. Plus he has lived for many, many years and has changed over time. During back cover, he was a very young man and the youngest of the apprentices it sounded like. Plus taking on different bodies comes with many different masks he had to wear over the years
 

Nightengale

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,708
Malaysia
True, DDD pretty much introduced the idea of anything is possible now. I think it felt like that because i watched the back cover movie like a month ago and didn't feel Luxu had that kind of personality when interacting. Also, the beginning of fragmentary passage showed Luxu watching the ending of BBS, even though Braig was there doing his thing during the final battle. I guess he had to go throw on his coat and grab the box real quick lol.

Well, I don't expect Luxu in his teens/mid-20s to act like he still does at 600+ years old or something.

I guess the best way to put it is that off all the 'Luxu is ??? in Org13', Xigbar would be the least asspull-y out of em all. The only real candidates for a Luxu reveal were Xigbar, Demyx and Luxord, and Xigbar's hints were significantly more overt than the other 2.
 

MrConbon210

Member
Oct 31, 2017
7,647
So do we think at some point in history Luxu lost the MoM's Keyblade and that's why he was working for Xehanort?

He mentioned before he "died" that Xehanort promised to give him the keyblade which doesn't make sense if Luxu was the one who had it at the start. He must of lost it at some point.
 

Bakercat

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,154
'merica
Actually looking back on it now, that could have been him watching the end of the original Keyblade War

also Luxu was a student of the MoM and MoM must of had a huge impact on him. Plus he has lived for many, many years and has changed over time. During back cover, he was a very young man and the youngest of the apprentices it sounded like. Plus taking on different bodies comes with many different masks he had to wear over the years

Could be, but if it was why was it included in fragmentary passage? It would be a scene that had nothing to do with the game its apart of. Also, Kingdom Hearts was blue there, just like the end of BBS. I only played fragmentary passage for the first time like a month ago, so it was pretty fresh in my mind when this was revealed is all and just confused me more than getting the aha moment.
 

Balfour

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,541
So do we think at some point in history Luxu lost the MoM's Keyblade and that's why he was working for Xehanort?

He mentioned before he "died" that Xehanort promised to give him the keyblade which doesn't make sense if Luxu was the one who had it at the start. He must of lost it at some point.


Luxu's reports say, as he was ordered to, he passed the keyblade down to one of the new union leaders in the Dandelions and then watched for years to come to wait until a destined one of darkness takes it in hand to reenact a keyblade war so the Foretellers can return and so can the MoM. Basically he pawned the keyblade off and just waited for a long time until that one, Xehanort appeared

Could be, but if it was why was it included in fragmentary passage? It would be a scene that had nothing to do with the game its apart of. Also, Kingdom Hearts was blue there, just like the end of BBS. I only played fragmentary passage for the first time like a month ago, so it was pretty fresh in my mind when this was revealed is all and just confused me more than getting the aha moment.

Fragmentary Passage was basically a Prelude for KH3, You can think of 0.2 as a part of it

Also it couldn't be BBS because Luxu had the No Name, which was under Xehanort, now Terranort's control
 

MrConbon210

Member
Oct 31, 2017
7,647
Luxu's reports say, as he was ordered to, he passed the keyblade down to one of the new union leaders in the Dandelions and then watched for years to come to wait until a destined one of darkness takes it in hand to reenact a keyblade war so the Foretellers can return and so can the MoM. Basically he pawned the keyblade off and just waited for a long time until that one, Xehanort appeared

So why did Luxu have it in BBS though?
 

Nightengale

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,708
Malaysia
So do we think at some point in history Luxu lost the MoM's Keyblade and that's why he was working for Xehanort?

He mentioned before he "died" that Xehanort promised to give him the keyblade which doesn't make sense if Luxu was the one who had it at the start. He must of lost it at some point.

No.

Luxu's job was to pass the keyblade down to a successor, and then from then on - "just watch over it."

And wait and wait, and wait, until the keyblade falls to someone who wanted to create the χ-blade and unlock Kingdom Hearts. ( and MoM would know this, because he can see the future )

Luxu is to then reclaim the keyblade after Xehanort's dealt with, and resummon back the Foretellers.

That was the gist of his mission from MoM based off the secret reports and Back Cover movie.
 
Nov 19, 2017
492
So do we think at some point in history Luxu lost the MoM's Keyblade and that's why he was working for Xehanort?

He mentioned before he "died" that Xehanort promised to give him the keyblade which doesn't make sense if Luxu was the one who had it at the start. He must of lost it at some point.
To build on Balfour's point, the Secret Reports lay out that Xigbar/Luxu pretended that his main interest was getting a keyblade as a means to get into Org 13.

Here's a list of the reports: the last three are Xigbar/Luxu. https://www.khinsider.com/kingdom-hearts-3/secret-reports
 

Richietto

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,962
North Carolina
So, whats the general consensus on Xigbar being Luxu? Seems like a giant ass pull to me.
I like it a lot. Its simple to understand, and re-contextualizes his goals and who he is. I always knew Xigbar would play a larger role in the series. Dude was always around during the plot just like Xehanort.

So do we think at some point in history Luxu lost the MoM's Keyblade and that's why he was working for Xehanort?

He mentioned before he "died" that Xehanort promised to give him the keyblade which doesn't make sense if Luxu was the one who had it at the start. He must of lost it at some point.
Yeah he had to give it up and wanted it back by the time Xehanort came around and all that stuff happened.
 

MrConbon210

Member
Oct 31, 2017
7,647
No.

Luxu's job was to pass the keyblade down to a successor, and then from then on - "just watch over it."

And wait and wait, and wait, until the keyblade falls to someone who wanted to create the χ-blade and unlock Kingdom Hearts. ( and MoM would know this, because he can see the future )

Luxu is to then reclaim the keyblade after Xehanort's dealt with, and resummon back the Foretellers.

That was the gist of his mission from MoM based off the secret reports and Back Cover movie.

Hmm. So the box most likely contains the MoM's heart which would allow him to return as you can time travel anywhere your heart is. So by putting his heart in the box he would be able to return to the present day.

Doesn't explain how the Foretellers showed up...
 

Balfour

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,541
So why did Luxu have it in BBS though?

No one outright said that scene was post BBS. That's assumption because of the Blue KH. No Name was under Xehanort's control. Luxu can't just will it back. it has to be given back or he has to wait until Xehanort dies and reclaim it for himself

That scene is now most likely post original Keyblade War
 

Richietto

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,962
North Carolina
Doesn't explain how the Foretellers showed up...
giphy.gif
 

Lunar Wolf

Banned
Nov 6, 2017
16,237
Los Angeles
True, DDD pretty much introduced the idea of anything is possible now. I think it felt like that because i watched the back cover movie like a month ago and didn't feel Luxu had that kind of personality when interacting. Also, the beginning of fragmentary passage showed Luxu watching the ending of BBS, even though Braig was there doing his thing during the final battle. I guess he had to go throw on his coat and grab the box real quick lol.

To be fair, your personality is going to end vastly different if you could live through several lifetimes in different bodies.

That was Luxu watching the First Keyblade War not the events of BBS because MX using the No Name keyblade at that point and we can see Luxu holding No Name.
 

duckroll

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,161
Singapore
Yeah that scene in 0.2 is definitely not the end of Birth by Sleep. You can see Kingdom Hearts being summoned by the expiring lights ascending from the battlefield, and there are only fallen keyblades there. It's not Xehanort doing it.
 

Balfour

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,541
Doesn't explain how the Foretellers showed up...

During the end of the first Keyblade War, we saw all the hearts of the fallen being sucked into the sky, possibly KH. Its possible Luxu needed another Keyblade War for KH to appear to summon them back out from KH itself

That or they were "sleeping" in another wordline.

I assume we will learn more as KHUX gets updates as there is stuff in the reports foreshadowing that hell breaks loose like Brain predicted, forcing the Dandelions to jump back to their original world version and then into the future
 

Bakercat

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,154
'merica
To be fair, your personality is going to end vastly different if you could live through several lifetimes in different bodies.

That was Luxu watching the First Keyblade War not the events of BBS because MX using the No Name keyblade at that point and we can see Luxu holding No Name.

Yeah, i didn't realize he was using diffrent bodies for years until i read the wiki. Weird then that they included that scene in fragmentary passage then.
 

duckroll

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,161
Singapore
Can someone explain to me how Union Cross works exactly? I know it's a sequel/reboot of Unchained X, but how? If the Keyblade war actually happened, and Ava died, and Aced was defeated, why are they also in Union Cross? Wasn't Ava already training the Dandelions in Unchained X? If someone installed Union Cross now with a brand new account, how does the story start? Do they have to play through all of Unchained X before getting to the Union Cross content? Or was it reboot like the time travel at the Keyblade Graveyard in KH3?
 

Nightengale

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,708
Malaysia
Yeah, i didn't realize he was using diffrent bodies for years until i read the wiki. Weird then that they included that scene in fragmentary passage then.

The general idea of that scene imo - is to continue teasing what Nomura has been saying for a long time now, which is KH3 isn't the end of the franchise's story, and not by a long-shot.

And that the characters and events of UX are basically his seeding ground for the next main KH arc.
 

Typhonsentra

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,947
Is anyone else bothered that the first 75% of this game is just fucking around and aimless meandering until after the last Disney world? You have no real reason to even go to any of the places you visit.
 

Nightengale

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,708
Malaysia
Can someone explain to me how Union Cross works exactly? I know it's a sequel/reboot of Unchained X, but how? If the Keyblade war actually happened, and Ava died, and Aced was defeated, why are they also in Union Cross? Wasn't Ava already training the Dandelions in Unchained X? If someone installed Union Cross now with a brand new account, how does the story start? Do they have to play through all of Unchained X before getting to the Union Cross content? Or was it reboot like the time travel at the Keyblade Graveyard in KH3?

Union X is just Unchained X renamed. It's basically a 2.0 update with added story, but everything in Unchained is in Union.

The one that is different is the original browser-game only KH X.
 

Balfour

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,541
Can someone explain to me how Union Cross works exactly? I know it's a sequel/reboot of Unchained X, but how? If the Keyblade war actually happened, and Ava died, and Aced was defeated, why are they also in Union Cross? Wasn't Ava already training the Dandelions in Unchained X? If someone installed Union Cross now with a brand new account, how does the story start? Do they have to play through all of Unchained X before getting to the Union Cross content? Or was it reboot like the time travel at the Keyblade Graveyard in KH3?

KHX are the events of Back Cover, except you experience them through the eyes of your player character. Unchained X is a retelling of said browser game

KHUX is actually the extension of the story of what takes place after the Keyblade War where the Dandelions are sent to the other version of the world by Ava, which was her role given to her by the MoM to ensure Keyblade users survived the war

KHUX download covers all these events of X[chi]/back cover as well

Is anyone else bothered that the first 75% of this game is just fucking around and aimless meandering until after the last Disney world? You have no real reason to even go to any of the places you visit.

It was mean as a journey for Sora to figure things out on his own or he wouldn't have the power to face Org 13

but I agree. It was not well paced. they should have had

1st Set of Worlds
Save Aqua. You can even talk to her at the Tower or RG if they actually made it a hub
2nd set of worlds
Go Save Ven
Something Else
End Game

also a shame we didn't get to experience Kairi and Lea's training. I loved Kh3 but it had such untapped potential for more
 

Richietto

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,962
North Carolina
Can someone explain to me how Union Cross works exactly? I know it's a sequel/reboot of Unchained X, but how? If the Keyblade war actually happened, and Ava died, and Aced was defeated, why are they also in Union Cross? Wasn't Ava already training the Dandelions in Unchained X? If someone installed Union Cross now with a brand new account, how does the story start? Do they have to play through all of Unchained X before getting to the Union Cross content? Or was it reboot like the time travel at the Keyblade Graveyard in KH3?
All of that stuff still happens. But at the end of the war the dandelions get put into the dream world and go about their lives the same way it did before except the war never happens and they think everything is just the same.
 

duckroll

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,161
Singapore
Is anyone else bothered that the first 75% of this game is just fucking around and aimless meandering until after the last Disney world? You have no real reason to even go to any of the places you visit.
The narrative pacing is all over the place but it didn't really bother me because I got the best of both sides of KH that I like - the first 3/4 of the game was awesome Disney fanservice and really awesome world to world stuff that I originally got into KH for, while the last 1/4 was total Nomura fanservice giving closure to a bunch of stuff I've been waiting a decade to see conclude. During the Disney worlds I felt the one thing the game was missing in terms of being KH is having more humanoid character bosses with crazy moves you had to dodge or block and bosses you can actually juggle instead of just giant Heartless monsters. Then the game went all in and gave me the Org XIII boss rush. Perfection! :D
 

Deleted member 35011

User requested account closure
Banned
Dec 1, 2017
2,185
So that Hundred Acre Wood bit when Sora talks about starting to lose his connection to Pooh...is that meant to be an overarching story thing or just a Christopher Robin "he's growing up and fading away" sort of thing? Because the latter is somehow infinitely depressing to me haha.
 

Deleted member 5535

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,656
Can someone explain to me how Union Cross works exactly? I know it's a sequel/reboot of Unchained X, but how? If the Keyblade war actually happened, and Ava died, and Aced was defeated, why are they also in Union Cross? Wasn't Ava already training the Dandelions in Unchained X? If someone installed Union Cross now with a brand new account, how does the story start? Do they have to play through all of Unchained X before getting to the Union Cross content? Or was it reboot like the time travel at the Keyblade Graveyard in KH3?

From what I know, Union Cross is some kind of world like the sleeping ones in DDD where they revive their moments of X. I never played it so I'm not sure.
 

Lunar Wolf

Banned
Nov 6, 2017
16,237
Los Angeles
Can someone explain to me how Union Cross works exactly? I know it's a sequel/reboot of Unchained X, but how? If the Keyblade war actually happened, and Ava died, and Aced was defeated, why are they also in Union Cross? Wasn't Ava already training the Dandelions in Unchained X? If someone installed Union Cross now with a brand new account, how does the story start? Do they have to play through all of Unchained X before getting to the Union Cross content? Or was it reboot like the time travel at the Keyblade Graveyard in KH3?


We never see Ava die though.

Union Cross is the sequel.

I can boil down the main gist of the story pretty simply though.

As per her role, Ava assembled the Dandelions and trained them in a secret location to prepare them for the travel to the world outside when the Keyblade War broke out so that they could ensure the survival of light.

Five individuals were chosen by the Master of Masters to succeed the Foretellers after the Keyblade War; though only one of them would receive a copy of the Book of Prophecies, and they would be the only ones permitted to remember the world the Dandelions left behind. Ephemer was the first to be approached by Ava when his curiosity lead him to seek answers about the world. Ephemer then reached out to Skuld so that she would follow the same path as him and join the Dandelions, with Skuld destined to become one of the new Union leaders. Strelitzia was the final Dandelion to be approached by Ava, but in trying to convince Player to join the Dandelions, she was eliminated by an unknown individual, who then stole her rulebook and took her place as Union leader.
 

Kaelan

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
2,641
Maryland
Though I think it should be noted that even if he is going about it in a machiavellian way, his goal does stem from believing that the world is still headed towards destruction and trying to change that. Or at least that's what he says.

I hope they remake union cross or whatever for consoles. Seems like a crucial game to know going forward in the story, IMO
 

Tsunamo

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,156
Can someone explain to me how Union Cross works exactly? I know it's a sequel/reboot of Unchained X, but how? If the Keyblade war actually happened, and Ava died, and Aced was defeated, why are they also in Union Cross? Wasn't Ava already training the Dandelions in Unchained X? If someone installed Union Cross now with a brand new account, how does the story start? Do they have to play through all of Unchained X before getting to the Union Cross content? Or was it reboot like the time travel at the Keyblade Graveyard in KH3?
Basically the keyblade war happened, and everyone died, but the dandilions formed moved onto a new data world/new worldline with new union leaders (emp, skuld, ven, brain, laurium) and have been left to essentially erase those memories of the keyblade war and replace them with good ones, so that their memories of the war are erased and replaced with good ones to ease their pain (they have recollections of the prophecy and war supposed to be occuring, but the latter part of the games memorie's where the war starts occuring is replaced with stuff like you going to the beach with your friends and the war never happening) There's a traitor in the new Unions too though so that and trying to workout who killed Lauriums sister is the driving point of the plot at the moment.

Nomura could have just remade chi, had the story playout the same and no one would've battered a eye, but instead he decided to use Union X as a oppurtunity to continue the story while making the browser game having occured beforehand. He's a absolute madman.
 
Nov 19, 2017
492
Did anyone post this theory on here? It's amazing how much sense it makes. lol

https://www.reddit.com/r/KingdomHea...ler_an_interesting_theory_about_the_epilogue/
That's pretty good. I definitely think something significantly important to The Master of Masters is in it since it says "χSuper" on the box, and we know the Foretellers+Luxu's names are related to the seven deadly sins in Latin with the missing one being pride or "Superbia" in Latin.

That said, I'm thinking it's his heart not his body. Luxord mentions that the box contains hope, and at San Fransokyo Sora says that "In every heart, there's hope." That would also tie into the other two boxes we saw in KH3: Pandora's Box which contains all things evil but also hope, and the chest from Pirates which contains Davy Jones's heart.

Edit: I was reading through the replies and those points were brought up there lol. I also thought this was a great point.

w3QQpkm.png
 
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Illusion

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
8,407
I originally thought that the KHUX world was a book/data book like in coded. Maleficent put two and two together decided to look for a book. But then all of a sudden in KH3 she is looking for the box.

So my thought was that inside the box was a book/data world of the past. Or something along those lines.
 
Nov 19, 2017
492
Xenosaga Yeah that was my first thought as well, and that could just be the playfulness of MoM on display there.... but what if it means more?! :P I think the other evidence of the box containing his heart is pretty compelling, so that could be a subtle nod in that direction.
 

Xenosaga

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,976
Xenosaga Yeah that was my first thought as well, and that could just be the playfulness of MoM on display there.... but what if it means more?! :P I think the other evidence of the box containing his heart is pretty compelling, so that could be a subtle nod in that direction.
it certainly is very interesting theory and it could be the case. I personally think because how short that hand gesture was from (supposedly) MoM, I wouldn't put too much significance on it.
 

Deleted member 5535

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,656
That's pretty good. I definitely think something significantly important to The Master of Masters is in it since it says "χSuper" on the box, and we know the Foretellers+Luxu's names are related to the seven deadly sins in Latin with the missing one being pride or "Superbia" in Latin.

That said, I'm thinking it's his heart not his body. Luxord mentions that the box contains hope, and at San Fransokyo Sora says that "In every heart, there's hope." That would also tie into the other two boxes we saw in KH3: Pandora's Box which contains all things evil but also hope, and the chest from Pirates which contains Davy Jones's heart.

Edit: I was reading through the replies and those points were brought up there lol. I also thought this was a great point.

w3QQpkm.png

Yeah, it's crazy. And that reminds me the theory that Ventus was originally a bad guy that killed the girl until Xehanort separated him into Vanitas and good boy Ven lol

https://www.reddit.com/r/KingdomHea...i_think_we_have_to_revisit_the_theory_of_who/
 

duckroll

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,161
Singapore
Thanks for all the Union Cross explanations. Now I wonder if I should bother reinstalling it and continuing from my Unchained Cross save.
 

Illusion

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
8,407
Yeah, it's crazy. And that reminds me the theory that Ventus was originally a bad guy that killed the girl until Xehanort separated him into Vanitas and good boy Ven lol

https://www.reddit.com/r/KingdomHea...i_think_we_have_to_revisit_the_theory_of_who/
Actually.. What if Marluxia / Brian arent the traitors in the new group but a red herring. And that Ventus killed Streletzia since he's the one we least expect. There has to be a reason why Ventus had so much evil/darkness in him to create Vanitas.
 

Rellyrell28

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
28,888
Lol I was wondering why I never got the Salvager Trophy as I felt I got more than twenty treasure in the gummi ship. I just had to check the treasure list in the Info menu. Well that's platinum and guess I'm officially done with this game for now until critical and/or final mix content comes around although I may be tempted to do a level 1 run.
 

HiroTSK5

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 4, 2017
572
Lol I was wondering why I never got the Salvager Trophy as I felt I got more than twenty treasure in the gummi ship. I just had to check the treasure list in the Info menu. Well that's platinum and guess I'm officially done with this game for now until critical and/or final mix content comes around although I may be tempted to do a level 1 run.

That's where I'm at right now where I got the Platinum trophy Tuesday and took the disc out..only to put it back in the next day to start a Lvl 1 run.
 

alpha13a

Member
Jan 2, 2019
7
In my opinion, the world of the secret movie is a new world

A world created by combining the settings (and probably also the cast of TWEWY) with those of the remake of versus 13 (verum Rex)
 

Balfour

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,541
Yeah, it's crazy. And that reminds me the theory that Ventus was originally a bad guy that killed the girl until Xehanort separated him into Vanitas and good boy Ven lol

https://www.reddit.com/r/KingdomHea...i_think_we_have_to_revisit_the_theory_of_who/

Its pretty much looking like Brain did it since Luxu called the imposter a virus. So unless Luxu was wrong in the secret report, its Brain who he was referring to. The self claimed Virus

Also Xehanort split Ventus because he was too nice for Darkness. Then took him to Destiny Islands to pass because he felt bad about causing him to die. But Ventus lived thanks to bonding with Sora. We also do nor know specifics of when or how Xehanort came across Ven

God, Nomura putting his hands on TWEWY toan extended degree is gonna be painful.

I mean, he already has since he coproduced TWEWY
 
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Oct 25, 2017
23,202
Everyone is all bummed about the lack of Final Fantasy characters and I'm over here upset that no one even acknowledges that Eeyore is missing
 

Nightengale

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,708
Malaysia
It might not be the end of Ventus's story ( since he's a Dandellion ) but imo adding a twist where he was also Strelizia's killer might be a tad too much imo.
 

Winston1

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
2,104
.
Actually.. What if Marluxia / Brian arent the traitors in the new group but a red herring. And that Ventus killed Streletzia since he's the one we least expect. There has to be a reason why Ventus had so much evil/darkness in him to create Vanitas.
It certainly sounds like the kind of twist Nomura loves to do.

"You think Marluxia, the guy who's already been established in a previous game as a treasonous villain, is the traiter? FOOLED YOU! It was Ventus, the guy that we've only ever known as a nice-guy protagonist, all along!"