It's even worse that 95% of said mobile game's story missions are nothing but filler, but then those last 5% are given so much signifigance.
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[UNMARKED SPOILERS] Kingdom Hearts III & ReMind DLC- Spoiler Thread
- Thread starter vestan
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It's even worse that 95% of said mobile game's story missions are nothing but filler, but then those last 5% are given so much signifigance.
OK, that makes sense. Thanks for the heads up.
I guess I'm just waiting for the inevitable DLC now. If they could add some cutscenes here and there to smooth things out, then that'd go a long way.
The cutoff with Xigbar reminded me a lot of some kind of Kojima/Metal Gear Solid 2 esque twist. There were other parts too that were weird as hell and reminded me of that game but I can't recall them right now.
Also the pacing and amount of cutscenes was very Metal Gear
Also the pacing and amount of cutscenes was very Metal Gear
I always said KH3 was gonna be MGS4 of Kinngdom Hearts and it was to certain extent.
Long post, I'll break it up.
My thoughts on non-KH3 stuff...
Very surprised people are expressing disappointment that the next saga's story pieces were not tied up in KH3. I never played the mobile games, but got caught up through YouTube, and I knew the moment I saw the MoM that anything tying directly to him or the Keyblade Legacy storyline was going to be further set up but never addressed. MoM is most likely end game for the series itself. Since KH1-3 is the Dark Seeker Saga where Xehanort is the villain, MoM is the overarching big bad of the entire KH series probably. In my opinion, the below all tie into the next saga and thus I wasn't mad at their lack of resolution
I think that the most important bits we got from the secret reports is the emphasis on "World Lines"...I don't know what this means but I'm going to assume that somehow Riku and Sora have crossed word lines (In "Yozora") even though it's something very difficult or uncommon to do. The MoM seems to be in other word lines and I'm going to guess he traverses them. Kingdom Hearts may be the one commonality between word lines. Random speculation there.
Last thing, we should all know by now that the secret endings are very deliberate. Even though Deep Dive was kind of a template (because it was the first one so I'm sure Nomura wasn't sure of how to handle), the secret endings since have all been vital to the important plots of future KH stuff. We will see almost the exact scenes as foretold in the secret ending somewhere in a future game.
Anyway, I totally get the gripes on KH3-related plot lines, because I don't think it makes sense to really revisit them now that the Xehanort Saga is done:
While I loved the game overall, I think some of the pacing could have been fixed up. While I think the 50/50 split of Disney/KH-Original in beginning and end is an interesting direction, I have to say that I enjoyed the structure of KH2 more. I am looking forward to the next arc. The Keyblade Legacy is interesting as hell.
My thoughts on non-KH3 stuff...
Very surprised people are expressing disappointment that the next saga's story pieces were not tied up in KH3. I never played the mobile games, but got caught up through YouTube, and I knew the moment I saw the MoM that anything tying directly to him or the Keyblade Legacy storyline was going to be further set up but never addressed. MoM is most likely end game for the series itself. Since KH1-3 is the Dark Seeker Saga where Xehanort is the villain, MoM is the overarching big bad of the entire KH series probably. In my opinion, the below all tie into the next saga and thus I wasn't mad at their lack of resolution
- Demyx's existence. He was decidedly missing from the final battle, but we know he ties to the Keyblade legacy. Who is his "somebody"...to be revealed. His personality, like Xigbar's, is definitely an interesting connection to the MoM
- Luxord: Luxord faded, but he gave the card to Sora. I'm almost certain that it holds a connection to the Keyblade Legacy within him.
- Lea/Isa's "friend" - this girl is referenced in the secret reports and to me it sounds like she is Ava or Skuld. Either way, it probably directly ties in to the Keyblade legacy as she mentions three things - four other friends, a key, and says the infamous line that the fore tellers and the MoM uses.
- The Black Box - it has successfully been brought into the present time, but clearly this is meant to be a reveal for either end of series or end of next arc. It is never explicitly tied into the Xehanort plot line. It will probably be one of the most important plot points so its existence now was important to at least be referenced, so in the end game we aren't looking at the black box as some random thing that was never established.
- Laurium - We know that he is in the Keyblade legacy, so enough said.
- I think Luxu being Xigbar makes a lot of sense. If you think about Luxu's purpose, it ties in perfectly with all of this. And Luxu is really the single solidified connection between the Xehanort saga and the Keyblade Legacy.
I think that the most important bits we got from the secret reports is the emphasis on "World Lines"...I don't know what this means but I'm going to assume that somehow Riku and Sora have crossed word lines (In "Yozora") even though it's something very difficult or uncommon to do. The MoM seems to be in other word lines and I'm going to guess he traverses them. Kingdom Hearts may be the one commonality between word lines. Random speculation there.
Last thing, we should all know by now that the secret endings are very deliberate. Even though Deep Dive was kind of a template (because it was the first one so I'm sure Nomura wasn't sure of how to handle), the secret endings since have all been vital to the important plots of future KH stuff. We will see almost the exact scenes as foretold in the secret ending somewhere in a future game.
Anyway, I totally get the gripes on KH3-related plot lines, because I don't think it makes sense to really revisit them now that the Xehanort Saga is done:
- Lingering Will - just, what happened here? Was he just there to save them? And why the fuck did he appear after Sora visited the final world? You would have thought Sora would save everyone now that he has awoken them. And then LW disappeared?
- Xion - Where the hell did she come from? Maybe they can explain this since she's with the gang but it makes no sense for anyone besides Lea and Riku to remember her, but even then it makes no sense that she's back. I still loved her scene.
- Lack of character interactions - It felt like there was a huge opportunity to have more character interactions with everyone there. But nope - Ventus and Roxas simply glance at each other. Terra doesn't recognize Riku at all (Riku saying "I kept our secret" would have been more than enough here), and more. The only people who seemed like they really connected was Aqua<->other people
- Kairi - while I think people are underestimating just how important she was to the game's plot here, I do empathize with the fact that she didn't show much battle prowess despite her training, but she is ultimately the reason Sora came back to life and the reason he subsequently dies at the end. Overall, unnecessary buildup considering her off screen actions throughout KH3
While I loved the game overall, I think some of the pacing could have been fixed up. While I think the 50/50 split of Disney/KH-Original in beginning and end is an interesting direction, I have to say that I enjoyed the structure of KH2 more. I am looking forward to the next arc. The Keyblade Legacy is interesting as hell.
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Does anyone else love/hate the dumb retcon with Yen Sid saying "may your heart be your guiding key" under his breath and only Goofy being able to hear it because of his big ears
Is it bad that this is how I've felt about every Kingdom Hearts game since CoM; That nomura and co. just keep throwing out more characters with slight hints and red-herrings that go no where.
Given how integral it is to the story going forward I have to assume we'll get some sort of releases that covers the events of the mobile game at some point.
At least, I really hope they do.
We get (or at least I do) that she was important, but she was only important as a mcguffin. She could just have easily been replaced by a random object and not much would have changed and that's what's frustrating. Despite all of her supposed growth and training, she was literally no better than KH1 Kairi in execution (Just like in 1, all she did in this game was call for Sora, get kidnapped, and rescue Sora from the darkness. Bonus points in that Sora had to sacrifice himself to save her again). Nomura absolutely screwed up with her.
As for the direction, I see it as very similar to KH2 actually. Just like KH2, each world is split up into 2 sections, it's just that in 2, it went, for example, Mulan/HollowBastion/Mulan, now it's just Mulan/Mulan on one visit instead of 2.
Just finished and I was not impressed with everyone coming back so easily with no real pay off for the come backs, namine was the worst, oh shes back guys....lets not explain that one, I guess kairi just went there before dying, I dunno. Sora just went bye bye and I didn't care. My heart just wasnt there for the ending, it all felt rushed and it annoyed me. I cared more for woody and buzz ending then I did for the main guys.
I biggest issue with the story is the amount of teasing for 4, it was so annoying.
I biggest issue with the story is the amount of teasing for 4, it was so annoying.
I took Namine saying she would handle Terranort as confirmation she temporarily recalled the Lingering Will to tip the scales. It probably poofed after a while. I guess I don't know why people want to see what happened to it so badly. It doesn't seem like it would matter. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Like what's even crazier is that there is KH3 related stuff...
That was added to the game just a week ago.
Stuff that was actually referenced in KH3.
It's maddening!
Either this shit needs to be made into it's own game or they need to dedicate an entire KH3 DLC or section of KH4 to get people up to date.
Oh, and one thing I forgot to mention is that I definitely think there will be re-releases of the KHUX or KH Chi stuff on consoles proper before the KL arc begins for Sora.
Generally, I agree. But Kairi has always been the McGuffin for Sora. I get that people don't like that, but I'm not surprised or disappointed by it really. Sora and Kairi are very much like how they were in KH1 still. A lot of people view that as a bad thing but I don't.
As for structure, what I really liked about KH2 was that you have Roxas Story - Hollow Bastion - End Game anchoring the Disney worlds in addition to the Organization members appearing in the Disney worlds. In KH3 it's just like some Org members in Disney Worlds, then once they're done, a rush of all KH-stuff. I would have liked to have seen, for example, Aqua and Ventus returned as a mid-way arc throughout the story, to help with the pacing.
Sorry, I hadn't finished my post on Kairi before I posted.
Generally, I agree. But Kairi has always been the McGuffin for Sora. I get that people don't like that, but I'm not surprised or disappointed by it really. Sora and Kairi are very much like how they were in KH1 still. A lot of people view that as a bad thing but I don't.
As for structure, what I really liked about KH2 was that you have Roxas Story - Hollow Bastion - End Game anchoring the Disney worlds in addition to the Organization members appearing in the Disney worlds. In KH3 it's just like some Org members in Disney Worlds, then once they're done, a rush of all KH-stuff. I would have liked to have seen, for example, Aqua and Ventus returned as a mid-way arc throughout the story, to help with the pacing.
I got a chuckle out of it.
Not even the worst Yen Sid retcon in the series, in any case.
I don't think it's bad for you to think that because all of the writing in the games only enforces your theory. I could forgive a little clunky elements at the beginning of the series because they didn't know how many sequels they would get to make.
The way that no game in the entire series has ever wrapped up all its own plot points is extremely frustrating. I'd imagine they find these games harder and harder to write - Nomura has said as much. If that's the case, why don't they try reducing its scope.
It is absolutely criminal that this track plays for at most 2 minutes in game and with cutscene dialogue over it for half the time.
I haven't gotten all the secret reports yet, but I'm pretty sure the girl Saix and Axel talk about is either Skuld or Ava from the X/Back Cover/Union X. Xigbar/Braig being Luxu was something I kinda figured giving the mannerisms of Luxu but it was still a cool reveal, and I always kind of figured Xigbar knew way more about everything than he let on. What I'm interested in knowing is that his motivations revolve around wanting a keyblade of his own. Does that mean the keyblade that I assume Luxu gives to Xehanort at some point was never his to begin with?
Anyway, the only lingering plot threads are basically all mobile game related and that's a little weird I suppose for the future of the franchise since like nobody really played that game and they seem to be closing out the stories of all the other characters pretty neatly.
My only disappointment is the severe lack of Final Fantasy. Not even the story relevant characters like Aeris, Cloud, Squall, Yuffie, Cid, and Sephiroth. They all have a story arc in KH2 that was left unresolved.
Anyway, the only lingering plot threads are basically all mobile game related and that's a little weird I suppose for the future of the franchise since like nobody really played that game and they seem to be closing out the stories of all the other characters pretty neatly.
My only disappointment is the severe lack of Final Fantasy. Not even the story relevant characters like Aeris, Cloud, Squall, Yuffie, Cid, and Sephiroth. They all have a story arc in KH2 that was left unresolved.
Someone explain who the 13 darknesses and 7 lights were by the end of the game? And which battles forged the 13 keys Master Xehanort needed? He said he had 9 by the time Sora gets to him.
So on the bad guy side at the start you got
Master Xehanort
Ansem
Xemnas
Young Xehanort
Terra-Xehanort
Vanitas
Dark Riku
Xigbar
Marluxia
Larxene
Luxord
Saix
Xion
Then the good guys got
Sora
Riku
Kairi
Mickey
Axel
Aqua
Ventus
Okay, so
Sora and Riku beat Dark Riku and Xigbar which forges 2 keys
Sora and Mickey beat Marluxia, Luxord, and Larxene which forges 3 more keys
Sora, Ventus, and Aqua beat Vanitas and Terra-Xehanort which forges 2 keys
So we're at 7 keys right now
Xemnas beats Axel, did that forge a key?
Then Sora, Roxas, and Xion beat Saix which forged another? Does Xion still count as a vessel if she switches sides? Was her version of Xehanort at Scala ad Caelum?
Then you have the last battle, Sora, Riku, and Mickey beat Ansem, Xemnas, and Young Xehanort which forges 3 more keys
And then Master Xehanort takes out Kairi which forges the last key
Did I get all of that right?
It's so good. I was wondering if Shimomura did it. I know there were more composers this go around, but this feels so much like her.
So on the bad guy side at the start you got
Master Xehanort
Ansem
Xemnas
Young Xehanort
Terra-Xehanort
Vanitas
Dark Riku
Xigbar
Marluxia
Larxene
Luxord
Saix
Xion
Then the good guys got
Sora
Riku
Kairi
Mickey
Axel
Aqua
Ventus
Okay, so
Sora and Riku beat Dark Riku and Xigbar which forges 2 keys
Sora and Mickey beat Marluxia, Luxord, and Larxene which forges 3 more keys
Sora, Ventus, and Aqua beat Vanitas and Terra-Xehanort which forges 2 keys
So we're at 7 keys right now
Xemnas beats Axel, did that forge a key?
Then Sora, Roxas, and Xion beat Saix which forged another? Does Xion still count as a vessel if she switches sides? Was her version of Xehanort at Scala ad Caelum?
Then you have the last battle, Sora, Riku, and Mickey beat Ansem, Xemnas, and Young Xehanort which forges 3 more keys
And then Master Xehanort takes out Kairi which forges the last key
Did I get all of that right?
It's so good. I was wondering if Shimomura did it. I know there were more composers this go around, but this feels so much like her.
Have to agree, focus more on the characters we already have. If anything the first game actually has a pretty decent story all on it's own, it's a little rough and there's hints at bigger things but it's also fairly self contained. Then they start wiping memories in the next game lol and proceed to add like 15 new characters and it immediately becomes way more complex than it has to be.
Okay so yeah I'm also confused by these two:
So for the first...
Did time reset after The Final World? Cause I honestly couldn't tell but then I got back to the graveyard proper and the cutscene began to play out the exact same. What did going to TFW have anything to do with Lingering Will appearing? How are these two related? Where did LW even go? Shouldn't he been fighting alongside Aqua and Ventus?
Also for Xion? How...? Didn't everyone forget she even existed after she vanished? How is she there? Why is she there?
I am so confused...
I have one question. At one point in the game, Vexen whispers to Demyx about someone in the organization also wanting to atone like him and Demyx seems surprised. Near the end of the game, after beating Ansem SoD, it seems like based on what he had to say that it was him? Just want to make sure I got the right person. It actually makes a lot of sense to me when you consider he's the oldest of the villains in terms of the series' length, I'd be tired of this shit too.
I also think Demyx is supposed to be more important than he is. The way he says he's a "chicken" when talking to Vexen after being benched gives me Xigbar levels of bullshittery that makes him look pretty suspect.
I also think Demyx is supposed to be more important than he is. The way he says he's a "chicken" when talking to Vexen after being benched gives me Xigbar levels of bullshittery that makes him look pretty suspect.
So anyone remember that one famous reaction video from E3 of the guy screaming at how Aqua got Norted? Well, I found out today that he did a Twitch stream in which finished the game and oh my god, I've never seen someone's hype deflate so much and so fast watching that epilogue/secret ending.
I didn't even get that was she actually Norted or just consumed by Darkness?
The latter. Being exposed to too much darkness will give you yellow eyes and pointy ears over time. That's why Xehanort changed the way he did.
Makes sense. I guess.
I feel like they should have did something other than "yellow eyes and pointy ears" to signify if someone has been norted if that's also the same things you get if you're exposed to too much darkness.
Maybe like a marking or somethin.
The person who wanted to atone sounds like Saix.
Unsure. They sound "Alive" as Aced mentions that Luxu "summoned" them. I suspect that they are in different worldliness and have been summoned to the KH1-3 worldline.
I thought it was supposed to be Vexen, but who the hell knows. The way all of the villains after being defeated were like "oh man oops I didn't mean to be evil" INCLUDING Master Xehanort was extremely stupid
Oh yea, duh. How the hell did I miss that. Well I like my interpretation better so I'm just gonna go off canon on this one.
It's not so much surprising as it is disappointing. Not even for the 'girl power' aspect of it, but I really wanted Kairi to do Something this time. All throughout the series, we see she has this feistiness and eagerness to help but doesn't have the ability and now, this time, she finally would! I don't even dislike the angle they went with with Axel by having him immediately get curbstomped by Xemnas after giving his epic "Damn, I'm awesome!" speech. But instead of anything cool or competent, she just gets armgrabbed, replaced by Xion (a character I already didn't like, but that's a separate thing) and killed. She doesn't even get to protect anyone since in every scene she's in, some other person jumps in front of her to block the attack.
I don't disagree, I liked the structure for 2, even if every world wasn't the best. That story arc through-line was more enjoyable than the 50/50 split we have now. Even if the 1000 Heartless battle is kinda tame now, having that midgame climax pushing into the final arc was amazing in a way that KH3 doesn't reach, imo.
Looking at his tweets it just seems like "Well, I beat it, now what?" Which I can get. You wait so long for this game and you beat it so quick in comparison.
Xehanort states that over time, people became corrupted by darkness. He wants to reset the universe so that it can be of pure light again.
He is a contrarian douche.
I feel like that's such a weak reason. Not to mention HE'S THE ONE HELPING SO MANY TURN TO DARKNESS.
:/
But what are worldlines? Is it another version of the same world, different world or what? Is this explained in the mobile game because I can't recall hearing about it.
Let me tell you something about something called Steins Gate, which is now plot critical to the Kingdom Hearts series.
I dont really feel like Xehanort was redeemed at all. He was still doing evil things and his intentions dont really matter. Sora called him out on that shit, and he just gave up when he knew he was beaten. Then Eraqus takes him to Kingdom Hearts where all hearts go at the end.
Wait so are worldlines multiple timelines?
I don't know how much more I can take of this.
Can someone explain Riku Replica?
The ansem that went back to young xehanort and taught him time travel stayed behind until KH1 and possessed riku, that version time travelled along with young xehanort(who came along by that point in the future) to DDD and then kh3?
Where does COM play in this?
The ansem that went back to young xehanort and taught him time travel stayed behind until KH1 and possessed riku, that version time travelled along with young xehanort(who came along by that point in the future) to DDD and then kh3?
Where does COM play in this?
Yeah, I don't agree he was redeemed either. None of the cast bar Eraqus really forgave him. His motivations were good though, and that's as unnecessary a retcon as they come.
I was just being tongue in cheek. I don't know about multiple world lines but apparently the secret reports in game say that Xigbar/Luxu were supposed to cause the Keyblade war so he could bring back the Master of Masters / the others from his time.
WHY he would need to start the war to do that ... who the hell knows
He's lying about being from KH1. He's just a norted Riku Replica, that's it.
That's why he was specifically used in the Big Hero 6 world. To further push the theme between copies and originals.
I feel like the backstory really didn't need to be this complicated. Like the foretellers, Master of Masters, all of that should have been scrapped.
The Riku on the Darkside was from when Ansem possessed Riku in KH1 ("I'll never let you take Kairi's Heart!" boss fight).
Riku Replica, from CoM, faded away into darkness after being defeated by Riku in CoM. When Riku was about to die in the Realm of Darkness, Riku Replica's heart/soul found him as he was about to give up his existence and saved Riku instead.
Then, at the final battle, he expunged Ansem!Riku from the Vessel and left it there for Namine to use, partly out of not wanting to be just a clone of Riku and partly because, in a fucked up kinda way because of how CoM works, he was in love with Namine.