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University laptops - what is it with MacBooks?
- Thread starter MrKlaw
- Start date
User Banned (3 days): platform warring and inflammatory commentary; accumulated infractions
Macs are for the computer illiterate, and college students by and large are fucking pathetic things. Can't fucking spell, can't fucking write competently, can't be on time, can't make good grades outside a 10 point scale. I had one kid tell me he didn't actually know how to print wirelessly from his Mac. Having been a TA for most of my college years I could go on about how fucking stupid college kids are, but I won't. You do NOT need a Mac for college. The cheap ass $300 chrome book/PC will do the job. You're going to drop it, spill shit on it and do other things to it. My university provided mac access to the kids that needed them because they are prohibitively expensive. I admit they are useful but the average college kid doesn't need one. Your department should let you know if you do.
Side note: OS aside the Surface Book 2 shits on every MacBook from a great height. And the Surface Studio....yeah I don't know a single art student that doesn't want Apple to make something comparable.
Side note: OS aside the Surface Book 2 shits on every MacBook from a great height. And the Surface Studio....yeah I don't know a single art student that doesn't want Apple to make something comparable.
I never understood why this garbage meme exists. As if you need command line mastery to use Windows or something.
This.
I greatly prefer the simplicity of macOS vs. Windows and it has near-equivalent compatibility with most third party apps.
Logic Pro X + Mainstage 3 + Final Cut Pro is also a godlike trio for anyone who enjoys AV.
I'm an IT Director and every one of my PCs are Macs except my gaming comp.
You seem angry at Macs, also, FYI.
What a terrible opinion.
I run a tech startup and use a MacBook Pro. I run windows with Bootcamp so I can run most things other users can plus OSX apps. What's the problem if there are laptops on the market with better specs? It doesn't make you computer illiterate if you need your device mostly for word processing, video editing, and such.
Don't be so harsh to him, Windows users only recently got an official (ok, somewhat gimped…) unix shell, maybe he just doesn't know?
Ascenion, I'm rooting for you! May your OS also one day have support for advanced technology such as "good trackpad" or "sane workspaces" 😝
The reality is the vast majority of PC hardware ages very poorly. The list of reasons for why this is the case is long and complex, and incredibly variable because of the incredible diversity of hardware that exists in the PC space. It doesn't change the fact that a lot of the hardware is inexpensive and poorly built, and higher-end, boutique Windows-based hardware that competes with Apple build quality and design is a very recent thing.
I get that people have an emotional attachment to the expensive things they buy. I understand why console wars exist, why people are defensive about their smartphones. Even literal investment aside, I get that people inexplicably build their identities around brands, and that's a very complex societal problem. I don't fault anyone, truly.
But in enthusiast communities like ERA, where the demographic skews towards those who, either through career necessity or just interest, very invested in tech, I don't get the dislike of Apple. I used to be a PC enthusiast. When I was a kid in high school, I was really proud of myself for being able to solve all of the inane issues I had constantly with my gaming desktop and my Lenovo gaming laptop. I thought the flexibility and affordability of hardware very blatantly made PC's better than Apple products, and I also very blindly preferred the Windows experience over OS X despite having never really used the latter.
Eventually, I went to college. Time became scarce, and coming home from a 14 hour day to try to work on production homework only to be forced to fix a bevy of little issues with my hardware or OS was increasingly grating. When I started only being able to get 3-4 hours of sleep a night, I was no longer in a position to enjoy the process of constantly having to keep my PC alive.
Then, I got my first design internship. Going into that office every day and sitting down to an iMac that booted instantly and just worked was absolutely life-changing. I had never had an experience where the computer was purely an invisible tool that I never lost time to or was held back by. A month later, I sold all of my PC hardware, bought a Macbook and never look back.
I'm sitting here typing this on an iMac from 2011. It boots in seconds. It runs flawlessly. I just finished creating a huge, very intricate poster in Illustrator that it handled like a champ despite the size and complexity of vector objects, and having dozens of Safari tabs, facetime, iMessage, Photoshop, like 10 finder windows and Apple Music running at the same time. It's nearly a decade old and I never have any issues with it, from software crashing to poor performance. And at the end of the day, that's the only thing a computer needs to do: work. I need to be able to sit down and immediately start banging out something, and Apple hardware has let me do that 100% of the time I've used it.
On top of that, my desktop, laptop, tablet, phone, streaming box, and speakers seamlessly and flawlessly coexist. All of my messages, files, contacts, calendars, photos, social media, passwords, books, movies, music, are synced and available with flawless continuity across every device I own. This experience simply does not exist outside of Apple's ecosystem. All of this again serves to reduce how much time I spend fighting my technology, and it just exists to support my work and my life. I haven't typed in a password or one-time-authentication code on any device I own in years, because keychain autofills that info instantly and verifies it with my face or touch ID immediately.
It's more that people on the whole are computer illiterate. That's the joke. The MAC helps nothing. They just get to not know how to do things in a cool way.
I'm not angry at macs, I'm angry at parents for thinking their kid needs a $1200 plus machine to turn in essays late. That goes for any computer. Macs are just more egregious due to now locked in teens are to the ecosystem. You buy your kid a Mac for 4 years of word processing and a lack of spellcheck use.
But then shouldn't you argue for fashion or whatever like others are doing. If the users you speak of are that dumb, what is macOS doing to help them? Opening a browser window for Facebook or whatever isn't any easier on either OS.
It's familiar? You're used to the way Apple does things having been groomed through iOS use. And iPhone is a fashion object. Android phones have been on par or better for a while now, but some people can't let iMessage and FaceTime go even with the google stand ins. Gotta have the newest iPhones like the celebs. A MacBook is actually a productive cool piece of tech in capable hands. Your 18 year old doesn't have capable hands.
I think part of it is that it's easier to buy a macbook when you need a good computer, they are generally all fine.
with windows ones there are so many options, and so many bad options that it requires more research to get it right, so if the cost is not a barrier people go with the macbook!?
also fashion/brand is a factor no doubt.
I think MS tried to achieve something similar with the Surface line.
with windows ones there are so many options, and so many bad options that it requires more research to get it right, so if the cost is not a barrier people go with the macbook!?
also fashion/brand is a factor no doubt.
I think MS tried to achieve something similar with the Surface line.
I went to uni in 2009 studying filmmaking, and went with a macbook pro because of the good quality build, great os and unrivalled customer support. But ultimately, yeah it was a status thing to some degree. It was "cool" to have a mac. Back then I was a little obessed with apple. I "needed" a mac and "needed" an iPhone.
To be honest I typed my work on my laptop, but mostly edited on the uni's mac desktops so it was a £900 word document and browsing machine.
Still today its a fashion statement, I feel like alot of people are completely clueless and go with apple because everyone else does.
If I was back at uni now I'd get a chromebook without hesitation. I got one in 2014 and use it almost every day and it's incredible.
To be honest I typed my work on my laptop, but mostly edited on the uni's mac desktops so it was a £900 word document and browsing machine.
Still today its a fashion statement, I feel like alot of people are completely clueless and go with apple because everyone else does.
If I was back at uni now I'd get a chromebook without hesitation. I got one in 2014 and use it almost every day and it's incredible.
OP
OP
This is a great post - thanks for the considered and detailed reply. I've been using macs at work for about 5 years now and you're right - I guess I take for granted that they just wake up from sleep quickly, don't need much manhandling to get through the day - they just work. (Aside from an annoying thing of not liking hot plugging external monitors via usb-c).
Whereas my desktop at home (and the windows laptops we have or have had) do require more looking after, do have odd little problems specific to them - eg drivers for trackpads, and do seem to need restarting often.
So for professionals I can understand - especially where a company is writing down the cost over 2-3 years the higher price is mostly irrelevant. Still feels a luxury for students - but perhaps less so for the parents likely buying it who want something they can be reassured will last 3-4 years.
I think this is part of the perception issue. People buy a cheap windows laptop, which has issues because its a cheap, poorly made computer. Apple stuff is pricy (a bit overpriced IMO), but they don't really make low end computers hardware wise. Even their out of date and underpowered machines have good trackpads and a nice case. I find it interesting a lot of people are willing to spend a lot on a mac so they can have a good computer, but wont do the same for a windows pc.
There's always been high end, quality windows laptops, but until recently they've only been 'business' laptops like the thinkpad. Which is why I think the average person just goes to Best Buy and gets a crappy windows laptop and has a bad experience, then they buy an expensive mac and have a better experience.
Also, the average person doesn't know shit about computers, and its easier to fuck up your windows pc than it is a mac.
Those have replaceable innards for the most part. Nowadays, Lord help us all.
I use a MacBook Air for work and it's the same now as the day it was bought in 2016. I spent £1400 two years ago on an amazingly good laptop for gaming/hobby web development as I travel a lot and it's still performing well but it always has issues waking from sleep and due to actually using it extensively like it's supposed to be used the adhesive around the screen is already not sticky and leaving gaps between screen and housing which I feel is totally unacceptable in such a machine. The other thing is battery life and trackpad, both are brutal on windows.
Depends on what you're studying. A chromebook won't cut it if you need to use some CAD or CFD software for your engineering assignments for example.
I disagree, I really like the flat clicky keyboard for typing, I just hope my 2018 one doesn't get broken keys.
Also this. I comfortably average about 100 wpm on my mechanical keyboard, but I can consistently be around 130 on my 2015 MacBook.
LoL
Some people are still stuck in the "I'm a PC/I'm a Mac" days.
Things have changed a little since then.
It's so bizarre when they try to mock Macs for being for people that "don't know how to use computers" because it has a cleaner user interface and the backend tech of the OS a is much more sensible. It's like they're trying to argue you can't do stuff on Macs.
I think any PC gamer knows PC's & Mac's use the exact same hardware these days, the difference is the OS & API's. unless you are talking about build quality, Apple is good with that, but the hardware in the same from intel/amd/nvidia.
Im still a bit shocked the industry is stuck on directx & keeping Mac (& linux) out of the PC gaming market, Blizzard was like the only PC dev to really support Mac all the time & i think that helped with their success, other devs didn't catch on.
It doesn't help Apple is doing whatever it can to make sure gaming will never be a thing on MacOS. It's a shame really...if only Halo would have stayed a Mac exclusive.
Some people are really salty about Apple huh
Buying a Mac is like buying a car that may not drive as fast as the other one, but is generally reliable and comfortable to handle. Do you need that car to get from A to B? No. Would you like to? Maybe. Should anyone berate you for that? Of course not.
Also well designed objects are good for the soul. Nothing wrong with being a little fashionable 😎
I know plenty of professionals in art and design that either have or would rather have an iPad Pro with the Apple Pencil. When I tell them the Mac and iPad are getting Cintiq like functionality built in, for free, they are ecstatic. I don't hear any of them ever talking about a Surface Pro. Not trying to dismiss the Surface products; they're good machines. But you seem ill informed on what Apple does for the art and design end user.
Buying a Mac is like buying a car that may not drive as fast as the other one, but is generally reliable and comfortable to handle. Do you need that car to get from A to B? No. Would you like to? Maybe. Should anyone berate you for that? Of course not.
Also well designed objects are good for the soul. Nothing wrong with being a little fashionable 😎
I know plenty of professionals in art and design that either have or would rather have an iPad Pro with the Apple Pencil. When I tell them the Mac and iPad are getting Cintiq like functionality built in, for free, they are ecstatic. I don't hear any of them ever talking about a Surface Pro. Not trying to dismiss the Surface products; they're good machines. But you seem ill informed on what Apple does for the art and design end user.
Nope! Hell nope!
Apple is pretty dumb to not support games really. I do like the fact that the community and devs try their damnedest, however.
What the what?! Yes! Everyone does!
It's not wise to go about comparing laptops with checklists. For a mobile machine, every single detail adds up. That's what pure PC gamers fail to understand (and honestly it's something Apple is bad at making the general consumers understand because it loves fluff words like "amazing" and "revolutionary" too much).
I seriously doubt that's what sways people at the $2K-computer-buying-bracket. At least that wasn't my deciding factor. For the longest time I've been building my computers, and I couldn't justify the cost. I did not understand how every day computing tasks are made easier until I pulled the trigger.
A company using terms like that for decades will do it, was mostly my point. I'm a big macOS fan (OSX, too of course.) iOS and iPadOS are, for lack of a better term, abysmal.
My biggest issue with Macs are their nearly non-existent user serviceability. Even specialists won't do it. Nowadays? Give me a Thinkpad and I'll throw macOS on it myself and I'm set with the option of dual-bootin'.
If the Wi-Fi/BT module is supported (most are if you go with a laptop or PC from the Hackintosh/Tony site), you're pretty much set. If not, a small USB dongle will do it. That goes for most Hackintosh issues, honestly. Most things just work now in my experience.
When macOS leaves Intel, fun times ahead!
You're funny. The tech support solution to almost anything Mac hardware related is "throw it away and get a new one".
Have a swollen battery? Sorry, can't swap it out yourself. Get a new machine.
Butterfly keyboard? Hope you like getting your machine repaired.
Battery under recall because it might catch fire? Plan to be without a machine for a few weeks because even Apple techs at an Apple store can't swap it out easily.
OS X handles app memory leaks poorly (Chrome can easily bring the entire system to a crawl), multiple monitor use has weird quirks (secondary will become primary for no discernable reason and I can't get the primary back without using an external mouse) and when something does crash, the system just reboots.
I will say I am amazed at the track pad love in here. I use a 2015 MB Pro for work and the touchpad is the biggest POS I've ever used. It is way too easy to get phantom clicks or random gestures that you don't want. I have to carry a Logitech mouse in my bag because of it. I'll try to use the touchpad for simplicity, but it has so many quirks, the mouse is always getting dragged out.
OS X can't even handle an Android phone as a drive. It needs a specific app to copy and paste files.
the only thing I agree with here is that most don't need a macbook for college work. the rest is blindingly, condescendingly, aggressively stupid.
as for "fashionable" – sure, going on 20 years now. big trend.
Normal people don't care and just wants something that works.
More reasons:
- 16:10 screen (surface books 4:3 is better though)
- gestures
- easy to google in case of problems
- easy to find parts in case of problems
- resell value
- trackpad
- unix baby
- no native ads, no dark patters, no u-wanna-play-candycrush?
More reasons:
- 16:10 screen (surface books 4:3 is better though)
- gestures
- easy to google in case of problems
- easy to find parts in case of problems
- resell value
- trackpad
- unix baby
- no native ads, no dark patters, no u-wanna-play-candycrush?
The build quality of Apple notebooks is second to none, especially as they've shifted away from plastic shells. I've had 3 now, going back to a white MacBook, moving to two 15" MacBook Pros. Most recent one I bought 3 years ago, and I've just had the battery replaced for free as part of a recall, so I can't see myself moving off it for a while yet. Support has always been good, and I've only ever had two major issues with them going back to that first one about 13 years ago.
OS X is more preferable to me (I work in IT and have a decent gaming/video editing PC as well, so please none of the 'computer illiterate' bullshit), and there's obviously a status thing that goes along with it in some people's eyes.
I'm in the Apple ecosystem now, so will undoubtedly end up getting another MacBook when this one bites the bullet, although I can't ever see myself going down the "pro" route again due to moving out of the industry I wanted to work in full-time and the insanity that the pricing is becoming in their pro lineup!
OS X is more preferable to me (I work in IT and have a decent gaming/video editing PC as well, so please none of the 'computer illiterate' bullshit), and there's obviously a status thing that goes along with it in some people's eyes.
I'm in the Apple ecosystem now, so will undoubtedly end up getting another MacBook when this one bites the bullet, although I can't ever see myself going down the "pro" route again due to moving out of the industry I wanted to work in full-time and the insanity that the pricing is becoming in their pro lineup!
This, so much this.
There's a vast difference between a Windows machine you buy at Wal-Mart and a top of the line computer. Of course the $1000+ Apple computer is going to be a vastly better machine then the $350 HP that is sold at Wal-Mart. Hell, there's a shit ton of fantastic refurbished computers that would be great computers for college students that can be picked up for $400-$500 that will be better then a piece of shit at Wal-Mart (that's what I did two years ago and I love the hell out my Elitebook).
The issue with buying Windows laptops is that unless you're looking for a gaming laptop, most people are buying those pieces of shit at Wal-Mart, Target or Best Buy. They're plopping their $300-$400 down, walking out with a computer that is built like a piece of shit, and then watching it not only get outdated super quick, but start to fall apart due to shoddy build quality in two years. They've never once looked at the higher end market (or the refurbished business laptop market) because that cheap POS they bought tainted their view on said market. They don't care that there are better quality Windows machines, all they know is that they bought a Windows machine and it was a piece of shit.
Apple doesn't have that issue since they don't make computers that target that market. They're a premium brand and it shows. I freaking love MacOS as an OS and I used to love Apple's hardware. I just flat refuse to buy their laptops anymore due to them removing upgrade options by soldering/gluing everything together.
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I live in on of the bigger major college towns in the country. I see countless college students on laptops constantly. I have not seen one single one ever use any kind of Surface product.
I'd say easily 80-90% of the students I see use Macs.
Damn, I wish I had the kind of free time that affords you to have such strong opinions about the most trivial of shit like what laptops other people use.
the first guy is Ascension and don draper is every college kid using a Mac
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I had a MacBook Air for university.
I'm not the most tech literate and I knew I was probably overpaying but I got it because it was lite and functional and I wouldn't have to worry too much about upkeep or viruses.
Nowadays, I'd probably go for a Surface Pro or any other W10 device.
I'm not the most tech literate and I knew I was probably overpaying but I got it because it was lite and functional and I wouldn't have to worry too much about upkeep or viruses.
Nowadays, I'd probably go for a Surface Pro or any other W10 device.
