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Humidex

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,498
So anyone who purchased a more expensive 5G variant for the UK has been screwed over.
Not necessarily. For the layman, banning Huawei hardware shouldn't have an impact on coverage. At least in theory. The telcos would simply have to replace the current kit with new kit. Probably would still mean that the consumer would pay for it via higher bills.
 

ps3ud0

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,906
You guys should watch the last 15 minutes of Newsnight where Emily Matliss pushes Huawei's UK Director of Comms on questions about Chinese government conduct. Tiananmen Square even gets a mention. It's like Total Recall :p...

I don't trust Huawei enough for them to be positioned within the telecoms network but I also don't trust advice from the US neither. China's made it untenable for the last year or so where they have started to really flex their power for Chinese's companies not to held under a massive spotlight and interrogated. It's something we are too well aware coming from the US too...

ps3ud0 8)
 

WoodensBalls

Banned
Feb 26, 2018
22
User Banned (permanent): Whataboutism in regards to ethnic cleansing and cultural genocide
China is total garbage and I say that as a Taiwanese person who hates them deeply.

But I dunno if you really want to use treatment of Muslims by countries as the differentiator. The US I would say is by far the worst when it comes to that. I mean the US has murdered countless Muslim people, men, women and children and continue to do so whether it's a Republican or Democratic administration that's in power. Murdering brown Muslim people in the Middle East is one of the few bipartisan things left.
It's amusing seeing people from the west or pro-west ppl suddenly championing for Muslim rights given the track record of their democratically elected governments.The highly Islamophobic West which with each year is trying to make life for Muslims in the West even more shitty with the growing acceptance of far-right extremists sure is great. This affects Muslims in all ways in life: profiling, verbal and physical assault, media dehumanization, employment, real estate etc. Intensified post 9/11 but already there even before that. It's only marginally better than the situation in China in the sense that the ship isn't sinking as fast but it's still sinking. Now if you look at MENA though the same elected western governments are responsible for millions deaths of Muslims directly and indirectly going back decades, and it STILL continues today through:
  • Direct military involvement
  • Actions from proxy fascist states and non-state actors (Sunni Islamists, death cults like MEK etc.)
  • Propped up dictators from the past and current
  • Violations of national sovereignty and illegal presence causing instability.
  • Destruction of countries which sets them back decades in development (Iraq, Libya, Yemen, Syria, Lebanon, whatever's left of Palestine, etc.) and puts them in enormous amount of poverty and corruption, now and in the past.
  • One of the biggest contributors to supporting radicalization of Sunni Islam on a global level which has made the religious fabric of the societies in MENA to become cancerous and claim many lives (but the only lives that matter is when there's a terror attack in Europe)
  • Sanctioning countries not under Western hegemony. In plain words: starving people to death because they didn't submit to Western dominance. A tool which only a psychopath would support (and since so many shrug it off in the West you can tell how many that are brainwashed)
The list goes on; it's so fucking long I could be writing about it a whole week. The US/West isn't pressuring China about Uighurs because they care about Muslims. They couldn't give two shits about their favorite targets to kill abroad, and certainly not when they:
  • Are great buddies with the white colonial settler Israeli state who are busy with a Palestinians genocide
  • Keep giving a hand to their Al-Qaida proxies who kill any religious minority or secular Sunni Muslim on sight in Syria
  • Their proxy state starving Yemenis to death in what is considered as the worst famine in the past 100 years (with full logistical support from them)
  • The silence on the Rohingya genocide, look how long Aung San Suu Kyi was the darling figure of the West
People can shout all day they don't support any of it but they've been saying the same the past 70 years while doing the same thing again and again. They don't "support it" and it's "not their fault" and yet somehow the same kind of people are elected and they all conveniently "stumble" (to borrow terminology from the war-mongering "free" western media) into the next MENA country not under Western submission, but it's "not their fault" but still the Muslim in their own countries who pay the price. It's easy to say you don't support any of it and throw some "Free Uighurs, fuck China!" posts here and there but harder to admit that the war, exploitation, and chaos your elected government brings to the region helps you enjoy the privilege of having a good life by keeping the Western status quo which is only about keeping the global north wealthy and the global south fucked as in colonial times.
People want to fairly criticize China for bad things they do by all means go ahead, but bringing up the Uighur topic in the context of caring about Muslims is the most dishonest bullshit I've read here and one of the clearest example of the white man's "divide and conquer" strategy. The West makes China's treatment of Muslims look like top quality service in a five star hotel.
 

BlinkBlank

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,226
Yeah it shouldn't have got the go ahead in the first place. Just shows this government can't do anything in a straightforward manner. So much time wasted by doing it this way.
Even though it seems like Huawei is being frozen out of a lot of developed countries, I can see where they could easy roll their networks out in developing countries and seize those markets.

I know there have been some reports floating around, but have they been corroborated by multiple sourxes that Huawei is spying or combing data? I guess it's probably pretty hard to prove though.
 

Sir Hound

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,218
China is total garbage and I say that as a Taiwanese person who hates them deeply.

But I dunno if you really want to use treatment of Muslims by countries as the differentiator. The US I would say is by far the worst when it comes to that. I mean the US has murdered countless Muslim people, men, women and children and continue to do so whether it's a Republican or Democratic administration that's in power. Murdering brown Muslim people in the Middle East is one of the few bipartisan things left.
I disagree with all the wars in the Middle East but there is a difference between killing people in war and extralegal, systematic reprogramming and erasure of your own citizens.
 

Humidex

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,498
Why not 3G or 4G too? Did Trump not mention that!?
3G/4G simply does not has the capability or bandwidth for use in cases such as city infrastructure, traffic management, drone controlling, AR/VR, medical tech (e.g. wearables, real-time mobile diagnostics). 5G is potentially way way more than just a faster internet experience - it's that game-changing.
 

SilentPanda

Member
Nov 6, 2017
14,016
Earth
Even though it seems like Huawei is being frozen out of a lot of developed countries, I can see where they could easy roll their networks out in developing countries and seize those markets.

I know there have been some reports floating around, but have they been corroborated by multiple sourxes that Huawei is spying or combing data? I guess it's probably pretty hard to prove though.

No proof yet of anything by third party and the US hasn't provided any proof except claiming it does, which hasn't stopped Germany still using Huawei gear...and not counting out other countries, since their thing is supposedly the cheapest and most complete to deploy

Technically it is it's close tie to the CCP that is concerning, if they do put in backdoor or other, it would just completely kill their business in backbone which is not consumer level, but we also have a TV star leading the strongest nation and failing to combat a global pandamic...
 

Enkidu

Member
Oct 27, 2017
186
KutZCrE.jpeg

Britain: "Let's embrace our ideals & leave the market to decide who in the world produces our key technology infrastructure."

Also Britain: "We don't want Chinese 5G equipment."
I don't think anyone is denying that Huawei has the best technology right now. Part of the reason they managed to get to that position is by being essentially massively subsidized by the Chinese government, but either way they are in the lead. That is a slightly misleading chart though as cellular patents tend to fall in two categories: base station or handset. Obviously companies like Huawei or Samsung, which makes both types of equipment, will have a big advantage when it comes to pure patent count as they can patent things from both sides.
 

Nome

Designer / Self-requested ban
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,312
NYC

Gulfwarvet

Member
Oct 30, 2017
173
It amazes me that most politicians speaking about this have no clue whars so ever of how the 5g network is connected in the uk.

For huawei to have a back door they must also have a back door through the core network of another vendors equipment at the same time as dupping the security controls put in place by each operator.

The boffins at gchq didnt say and have never said huawei have back doors, the latest change came about by the supply of chips to huawei that they couldn't guarantee compliance with.

Its goona cost billions in dosh and years in implementing the swap. At least it will take me to retirement by the time its done.
 

riverfr0zen

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,168
Manhattan, New York
I mean a lot of things we have have potential ties to government of other countries. But we don't act like it's the worst thing in the world, that only a fool would agree to, because the country isn't named China.

The nature of the products concerned have implicit security implications.

Furthermore, because these are infrastructure products tending toward ubiquity, they inherently create long-standing implications and reliance. It's not like buying a bunch of wheat or plastic from somewhere, where you can just stop and find another supplier any time.

So given these inevitable bindings, why would you get into it with a government that has severe credibility and control issues?
 

Mindwipe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,272
London
Not necessarily. For the layman, banning Huawei hardware shouldn't have an impact on coverage. At least in theory. The telcos would simply have to replace the current kit with new kit. Probably would still mean that the consumer would pay for it via higher bills.

It will have an impact on coverage in that 5G coverage was hardly universal, and it's expansion will be signficantly slowed.

I'm looking for a new phone, and I would probably have bought the 5G version for futureproofing purposes, but I don't think I will now. Coverage to make it worthwhile will not be in the lifetime of the phone any more.
 

Mindwipe

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,272
London
Boris literally admitted to it.



The context of that was that the UK government says that the security situation has got worse with Huawei because it's no longer allowed to buy US software or chipsets (due to the US), and has to use it's own instead. So things are worse than previously.

It's not "Trump made us do this." Well, it is, in reality, but saying "Boris admitted it!" isn't true.
 

Protome

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,783
Yeah, I've been told already, apologies.

There was a huge thread on here about it at the time, I must have missed the debunking part later on lol
To be fair, it's incredibly fucked up that Bloomberg haven't pulled the story or put a disclaimer admitting that they made the whole thing up on the page to stop confusing people like that.

But hey, they're a terrible hack publication so what do you expect I guess.
 

Dave.

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,182
You guys should watch the last 15 minutes of Newsnight where Emily Matliss pushes Huawei's UK Director of Comms on questions about Chinese government conduct. Tiananmen Square even gets a mention. It's like Total Recall :p...

I don't trust Huawei enough for them to be positioned within the telecoms network but I also don't trust advice from the US neither. China's made it untenable for the last year or so where they have started to really flex their power for Chinese's companies not to held under a massive spotlight and interrogated. It's something we are too well aware coming from the US too...

ps3ud0 8)
There was a similarly hilarious / amazing segment this morning on GMB, the soft-going presenters there (i.e. not Piers & Suzanna) made the "CEO of Huawei UK" (I think it was) really squirm, putting him on the spot asking about Hong Kong and "If you're really independent surely you'll say how out of line their behaviour has been, no?" while he refused to say anything of the sort.
 

Humidex

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,498
There was a similarly hilarious / amazing segment this morning on GMB, the soft-going presenters there (i.e. not Piers & Suzanna) made the "CEO of Huawei UK" (I think it was) really squirm, putting him on the spot asking about Hong Kong and "If you're really independent surely you'll say how out of line their behaviour has been, no?" while he refused to say anything of the sort.
That's remarkably similar to the tack used by Greg Clark last week at a Select Committee where he basically gotcha'd Huawei's UK's VP on his thoughts re HK.
 

P-MAC

Member
Nov 15, 2017
4,533
To be fair, it's incredibly fucked up that Bloomberg haven't pulled the story or put a disclaimer admitting that they made the whole thing up on the page to stop confusing people like that.

But hey, they're a terrible hack publication so what do you expect I guess.

Not to mention, how the fuck do you make that up. The imagination you must need lol