Two years ago, Sonic Forces released. How did this happen?

[Lant_War]

Today's November 7th, and in the same date in 2017 players had to endure a new Sonic game coming out. The series was just coming from the amazing Sonic Mania, the best Sonic game ever made btw, so Forces quality, or lack of it, stood out even more.

I'm the dumbass that paid $90 to get this game asap (international shipping things), so yes that does play a part in his sour I am in the game, but man Sonic Forces just doesn't have any redeeming qualities at all. The amazing gameplay from Generations was completely butchered, the music is horrid for the most part, the story is as cringe-worthy as it gets, the level "design" is so linear I refuse to call it design, Classic Sonic is somehow here and not nearly as good as the game that had released three months prior... Only positive thing I can say about the game is that while some zones are so bland they mix together, others actually look good like Metropolis and City (they even got lazy with the Zone names) and it gives me hope that the next Sonic game will look even better and be a better game overall.

Fuck this game, though. It's so bland it's not even enjoyable in an ironic way like 06.

 

[Ramsay]

How did this happen? It's simple. Sonic Team happened.

Never bet on Sonic Team.

 

[Squid Icarus]

I always preferred 3D Sonic over 2D Sonic, and Forces is the worst one I've played (not counting Sonic Boom, and I didn't play 06).

 

[Xtortion]

The game is aggressively mediocre

 

[Jegriva]

Sega happened.

 

[Zalman]

They played it as safe as possible by bringing back the boost formula and Classic Sonic. On paper, it was a good idea - Generations 2 with all-new stages.

Too bad they completely misunderstood what people liked about that game and missed the mark entirely.

 

[CloseTalker]

It's far from the worst 3D Sonic game, so I have a tough time mustering up any form of passion for it. It's definitely pretty weak though

 

[Deleted member 1839]

They gave the fans what they wanted.

 

[TheDinoman]

How did this happen? It's simple. Sonic Team happened.

Never bet on Sonic Team.

Click to shrink...

And we're done here.

 

[SunBroDave]

10/10 thread title lol. That said, it's pretty par for the course for Sonic Team 3D Sonic games. They're all basically terrible games, even the good ones

 

[Maedhros]

10/10 thread title lol. That said, it's pretty par for the course for Sonic Team 3D Sonic games. They're all basically terrible games, even the good ones

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Yeah, nice generalization. But you're wrong.

 

[Aurora]

For as much as people like to dogpile on the Sonic franchise I find Sonic Forces to be... pretty forgettable? There are points where I genuinely forget Forces was even a thing - and I think my biggest issue with the game is that it fails to leave a mark on the franchise. For as controversial as previous Sonic iterations are for some people, I feel like they have at least left a mark on the franchise for better or worse, whereas Forces may as well not even exist.

 

[Kunka Kid]

I had fun with it in a sick way, but yeah it's really shocking how bad this game was.

People crap on Sonic games but this took things to another level. It almost seemed like it was made by amateurs.

 

[SunBroDave]

Yeah, nice generalization. But you're wrong.

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Which 3D Sonic games are good, and what is particularly good about them?

 

[TheAggroCraig]

There was nothing about this game that stood out, usually I can fall back on the soundtrack being good but man, this game did not even deliver a single memorable track other than a White Jungle remix and even that wasn't that great. I went into this game with low expectations but still left wondering why I wasted my time.

A better game than Lost World though, I guess, considering I at least finished Forces.

 

[Symphony]

How did Sonic 06 release? How did it then release months later on the PS3 in the exact same state without any improvements? Because Sega seemingly has no interest in quality control when it comes to Sonic games. Sonic Team needs restructuring with another team being brought in as support for their next couple of releases to ensure things stay on track, but it won't happen.

 

[louisacommie]

Did they release this game on the October revolution anniversary on purpose lol

Biggest insult to it since pizza hut


Anyway I'm pretty sure this game had zero budget and only a year of real dev time

Also the lost world gameplay engine it used sucks

 

[Voke]

with the amount of butchering SEGA has done to Sonic, I'm very surprised that they most likely still turn big profits from the franchise. Like seriously its been like 15+ years of me reading about terrible sonic games.

 

[McNum]

There was nothing about this game that stood out, usually I can fall back on the soundtrack being good but man, this game did not even deliver a single memorable track other than a White Jungle remix and even that wasn't that great. I went into this game with low expectations but still left wondering why I wasted my time.

A better game than Lost World though, I guess, considering I at least finished Forces.

Click to shrink...

It did have one memorable track, but for no good reasons.

If you search "edgelord theme" on Youtube, you get this:




...second place is the theme of the Edgelords Youtube show.

And yes, it works. Try it. Seach "edgelord theme" on Youtube.

 

[Berordn]

For as much as people like to dogpile on the Sonic franchise I find Sonic Forces to be... pretty forgettable? There are points where I genuinely forget Forces was even a thing - and I think my biggest issue with the game is that it fails to leave a mark on the franchise. For as controversial as previous Sonic iterations are for some people, I feel like they have at least left a mark on the franchise for better or worse, whereas Forces may as well not even exist.

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I mean, that is part of what makes Forces particularly bad. Level design is just straight corridors, controls guide you toward the center and react poorly to you trying to do something they don't expect, there's only 2.5 boss fights in the game... Nothing it does leaves an impression, and it's mostly memorable for what they didn't do (Chaos boss fight, Super Sonic DLC, Infinite's retconned backstory in his own game...)

It's no '06 where it spectacularly blows up, but it also just doesn't do anything competently enough to be anything other than bad.

 

[Gold Arsene]

There were sooooo many ideas from Forces I genuinly liked. I wanted to go back to the more serious action cartoon style stories, I like the create a character, I love the soundtrack, heck I even like Infinite as silly and edgy as he is.

I don't hate this game like others seem to but it is one of the best examples of wasted potential I've seen in ages.

Also I'm sick of the boost games.

I hope the CaC idea is brought back for a better game.

(At least it gave the IDW comics a good foundation to build off of.)

 

[RecRoulette]

Fantastic soundtrack, and the avatar system was hilarious, but the rest of the game is a mess.

 

[Gold Arsene]

with the amount of butchering SEGA has done to Sonic, I'm very surprised that they most likely still turn big profits from the franchise. Like seriously its been like 15+ years of me reading about terrible sonic games.

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People exaggerate how "bad" some Sonic games are IMO. Like some people would have you think the series has been crap sense it left the Genesis but even putting aside contested games like the Adventure ones you still have the Advance series Rush, Colors, Generations, etc that were fairly well received.

 

[Radline]

I didn't buy this game since I had a bad feeling it wouldn't turn out well post-Sonic Mania, but I've seen others be bored by how unimpressive it is. The avatar is the only thing that stands out, but stages end right before you're getting a handle of the level design's theme. And it's pretty shady that they advertise Sonic's enemies coming back by Infinite, when 2 out of 4 of them are handled in cutscenes anyway.

Even though I didn't buy it, I would have enjoyed it less than Sonic Lost World which tries new stuff with hits and misses.

I like the cheesy music the avatar gets, however.

 

[Maedhros]

Which 3D Sonic games are good, and what is particularly good about them?

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Sonic Generations is pretty great overall in terms of gameplay and level design. It's great to boost through the stages multiple times discovering multiple paths and trying to reduce the time to finish the stages. And the soundtrack is a banger, one of the best in the series for me (only losing to Unleashed by a small margin).
Sonic Colors is another great game, the only problem for me it's the 2D sections making most of the gameplay overall. But it shares a lot of good things with Generations and some stages are among the best the series ever offered to me.
Sonic Unleashed, if it was about only the day stages, would be a better game for me. It's just alright though because of the terrible gimmick they used (Werehog). The MOD for Sonic Generations get the best from the game and makes it accessible on that engine.

The others are all ranging from terrible to forgetable. But these three, specially Generations, are among my favorite games in the whole series, including 2D ones. In fact, I like Generations a lot more than Sonic CD or the first game.

 

[RockmanBN]

4 YEARS

 

[Aaron]

There were sooooo many ideas from Forces I genuinly liked. I wanted to go back to the more serious action cartoon style stories, I like the create a character, I love the soundtrack, heck I even like Infinite as silly and edgy as he is.

I don't hate this game like others seem to but it is one of the best examples of wasted potential I've seen in ages.

Also I'm sick of the boost games.

I hope the CaC idea is brought back for a better game.

(At least it gave the IDW comics a good foundation to build off of.)

Click to shrink...

Null Space is probably the biggest waste of potential in the game.



They hype it up as this crazy development, you spend 10 seconds in the level and it's basically an interactive cutscene. Duuumb.

I have a feeling this game got hit hard by development troubles.

 

[Gold Arsene]

Which 3D Sonic games are good, and what is particularly good about them?

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Adventure 1+2(fight me I just replayed A2 and I still love it), Generations is pretty fun as well even if I'm not the biggest fan of the boost formula.

Not sure what you want me to say "whats good about them" besides the fact I just think there fun to play. I like going fast as Sonic and Shadow, I like exploring as Knuckles and Rouge, etc. I enjoy the cheesy drama that is the story and the soundtrack is freaking fantastic.

 

[Ixzion]

Because they have people who will faithfully give Sonic Team money, in spite of them having a proven track record of being decent to thoroughly trash for 20 fucking years.

 

[SunBroDave]

Sonic Generations is pretty great overall in terms of gameplay and level design. It's great to boost through the stages multiple times discovering multiple paths and trying to reduce the time to finish the stages. And the soundtrack is a banger, one of the best in the series for me (only losing to Unleashed by a small margin).
Sonic Colors is another great game, the only problem for me it's the 2D sections making most of the gameplay overall. But it shares a lot of good things with Generations and some stages are among the best the series ever offered to me.
Sonic Unleashed, if it was about only the day stages, would be a better game for me. It's just alright though because of the terrible gimmick they used (Werehog). The MOD for Sonic Generations get the best from the game and makes it accessible on that engine.

The others are all ranging from terrible to forgetable. But these three, specially Generations, are among my favorite games in the whole series, including 2D ones. In fact, I like Generations a lot more than Sonic CD or the first game.

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Thanks for taking the time to write that all out. Do you mind elaborating a bit on what you find so good about the level design in the 3D sections of Generations for example? From what I remember from that game, nothing about the 3D sections stuck out to me that differentiated it from the levels in Adventure 1/2, Heroes, etc.

 

[Anth0ny]

imagine the "real sonic team" following sonic mania with this travesty


how EMBARRASSING

 

[Mesoian]

How did this happen? It's simple. Sonic Team happened.

Never bet on Sonic Team.

Click to shrink...

This right here.

I FULLY expect the SA remake to be a Sonic 06 level trainwreck.

 

[Lant_War]

4 YEARS

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Iirc it was something like 2 years for the engine, one for the concept and one for actual development. Could be pulling this out of my ass though

 

[Syril]

It did have one memorable track, but for no good reasons.

If you search "edgelord theme" on Youtube, you get this:




...second place is the theme of the Edgelords Youtube show.

And yes, it works. Try it. Seach "edgelord theme" on Youtube.

Click to shrink...

Imagine having designed Shadow the Hedgehog and then being told NO WE HAVE TO GO EDGIER.

 

[Deleted member 33533]

None of this is good, OP. That's why it's called Sonic Forces.

 

[Sacul64]

They played it as safe as possible by bringing back the boost formula and Classic Sonic. On paper, it was a good idea - Generations 2 with all-new stages.

Too bad they completely misunderstood what people liked about that game and missed the mark entirely.

Click to shrink...

I would argue that on paper it was never a good idea as they changed how stages are loaded all at once (forces) vs in pieces (Generations) this made the stages dramatically smaller with less happening. Not to mention there is no doubt in my mind that lassic sonic was a last minute add in forced after the success of Mania. This is why his stages are half finished (one has zero enemies) and he is not an active participant in the story.

 

[nded]

They had to make it extra shitty to check people's expectations after Sonic Mania.

 

[Mugman]

I don't remember the music being horrible by any means, but it certainly was not up to the standards of the rest of the series. I agree about the rest though; think I got it for 15 dollars on the Switch and still felt like it was a huge waste of money. And the only thing I remember about the game was the character creator and the bizarre tone of the story

 

[Deleted member 17388]

I really liked the Fist Bump theme:

 

[Deleted member 3010]

It"s such a depressing car crash.

Short levels, in fact short game overall, missing bosses yet showed in the opening sequence such as Chaos, recycled mechanics for bosses, felt extremely cheap overall.

Music felt bad except a very few outliers. We're overdue for some good old Crush 40 butt rock.

 

[Gold Arsene]

I thought all the lyrical themes were good.

Also Infinite rave.

 

[Nali]

Forces is what happens when a team cranks out a game in about a year with the last well-regarded formula because the other two 3D games since then bombed.

 

[Gold Arsene]

The concept art was pretty cool too.

(Please stop trying to make Zavok a thing Sega, Mephalis has more fans then this guy.)

 

[Stuart Gipp]

I get dragged for it, but... I really, really enjoyed Forces. I thought it was fun.

 

[Maedhros]

Thanks for taking the time to write that all out. Do you mind elaborating a bit on what you find so good about the level design in the 3D sections of Generations for example? From what I remember from that game, nothing about the 3D sections stuck out to me that differentiated it from the levels in Adventure 1/2, Heroes, etc.

Click to shrink...

The boost games have the same design philosophy as the 2D series: you have a low, middle and high path, where the high path is the most rewarding, but the most difficult to follow, and the lower path the most straightforward one, but slowest. The middle path being something in between these two. There lots of hidden paths as well that makes you cut a lot of the stage if you can find them.

Totally different from Adventure or Heroes, which focused on a more slower approach to the stages.

Sky Sanctuary is among the best 3D stages for me in the entire series.

That being said, what I want from this series continuing forward is something different, the boost gameplay already shown what it could and I hope they can try something different in future games.

 

[Lant_War]

The concept art was pretty cool too.

(Please stop trying to make Zavok a thing Sega, Mephalis has more fans then this guy.)

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Mephalis?

 

[Gold Arsene]

Mephalis?

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You know, this guy.

I misspelled it. It's Mephiles.

 

[The Bear]

It was just really boring and didn't do anything memorable. At least 06 and Boom have lots of camp-value, Forces didn't have even that outside the Avatar and some dialogue.

 

[Deleted member 10629]

Sega happened.

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Sega is great. Sonic Team, not so much.

 

[Pancracio17]

Even though I never buy them I still get my hopes up for a good Sonic game every time a new one is announced. Yet im almost always dissapointed.