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Theecliff

Member
Oct 28, 2017
3,004
it's incredible how much Sony have fumbled this rollout. as it stands paying for the top tier subscription seems ridiculously not worth it for the paltry amount of extras it grants over the bottom and middle tier, and i can already foresee them abandoning their emulation attempts again after an inevitable slow 'premium' subscriber uptake if it carries on like this
 

YuSuzzune

Member
Nov 21, 2018
4,864
The PS1 library is so huge you have no problem adding two titles each month at least.
Instead in summer, usually a period in which people go on holiday and have much time to play, you provide absolutely no Classic title.
Now I understand why Sony didn't provide a Classic plan, because probably there would be months in which users would get no games at all.
 

Cerulean_skylark

Attempted to circumvent ban with alt account.
Banned
Oct 31, 2017
6,408
Didn't they just hire a manager responsible for game preservation? AFTER ps+ plans were made? It would get interesting to see if this whole roll out was too big for them and we've yet to see any solid effect from this hypothetical manager
 

androvsky

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,507
Didn't they just hire a manager responsible for game preservation? AFTER ps+ plans were made? It would get interesting to see if this whole roll out was too big for them and we've yet to see any solid effect from this hypothetical manager
The game preservation manager is for preserving the assets and build environments for current games iirc.
 

oni-link

tag reference no one gets
Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,027
UK
I thought the same thing. It's almost as if he wants to prove a point. People won't play classics if there aren't any to play.

I think it's far more likely he thinks that's "good enough" and considers any more effort to bring the emulators or games up to standard as not worthwhile considering old games are just that, old games

I'm sure there are a lot of people working on this that are passionate about it, but obviously the people in power don't care about it much

I get licensing issues can be hard to overcome, but when people can get PS1/PS2 games running on Series S or potato PCs better than how they run on PS5, it does smack of the people at Sony just not caring about it much

They should easily be able to add at least 1 new game a month, that's only 12 new games a year
 

Elgrannacho

Banned
Apr 23, 2022
78
Argentina
I think a lot of people missed it..

But Sony has a solution to sell Premium to those who aren't happy with the classics:

XZPv5Qf.png


They are also making some PS4 games exclusive to Premium lol
They are treating PS4 remasters as PS3 games...
 
OP
OP
DominicanGlory
Jul 26, 2018
4,685
You do realize that because of the way their emulation works, all the Classic (PS1, PS2, PSP) games they are bringing to the service need to be QA tested right? Which means there are people out there who need to play to completion each one of these games and for the games with trophies implementation, they need to ensure that said trophies work as intended and the users can get the platinum without issues.
You do realize they're charging millions of people for something they're not providing? Get it done. I don't want to hear this shit. If they weren't ready then don't launch the service
 

Plinko

Member
Oct 28, 2017
18,572
I think it's far more likely he thinks that's "good enough" and considers any more effort to bring the emulators or games up to standard as not worthwhile considering old games are just that, old games

I'm sure there are a lot of people working on this that are passionate about it, but obviously the people in power don't care about it much

I get licensing issues can be hard to overcome, but when people can get PS1/PS2 games running on Series S or potato PCs better than how they run on PS5, it does smack of the people at Sony just not caring about it much

They should easily be able to add at least 1 new game a month, that's only 12 new games a year
True. And with their extensive back library of their own 1st party games, I find it hard to believe they couldn't put even one on there.
 

fiendcode

Member
Oct 26, 2017
24,925
I'll also add that the (frequently maligned) NSO has had a pretty regular cadence this year of 1 N64 game per month and bimonthly updates for the Genesis and NES/SNES with 3-4 games on average. Not to mention that Nintendo launched each console with way more titles than the PS1 and PSP services.

Basically if Nintendo's drip feed is better than yours, you got a problem. :P
Pretty much yeah. And Nintendo gets unrelentingly raked over the coals for this level of support.

NSO currently sits at 93 FC/NES games, 72 SFC/SNES games, 19 N64 games and 30 MD/Genesis games.
 

TaKeRx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
581
My sub lapses in September. We'll see what happens next month, otherwise I'm out completely.

With such a huge library, I don't understand how Sony doesn't take advantage of this...
 

Karlinel

Prophet of Truth
Banned
Nov 10, 2017
7,826
Mallorca, Spain
Welp, for 11€ cost for the upgrade I got to enjoy Children of Morta, Kurushi and Stray, and see Yuffie in UHD. But back to essential!
 

digitalrelic

Weight Loss Champion 2018: Biggest Change
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,124
You do realize that because of the way their emulation works, all the Classic (PS1, PS2, PSP) games they are bringing to the service need to be QA tested right? Which means there are people out there who need to play to completion each one of these games and for the games with trophies implementation, they need to ensure that said trophies work as intended and the users can get the platinum without issues.

You do realize how absolutely ridiculous this sounds, right?

What you're saying would be like excusing a broken game because "you do realize new games have a lot of bugs and take thousands and thousands of hours to work out those bugs, right? Which means there are people out there who need to exploit each and every nook and cranny in the entire game, submit every bug they find, and then the devs need to fix the bugs ensure and that the game works as intended without issues."

If the game isn't ready, don't release it and charge customers for it.

If Sony's PS Premium service isn't ready, don't release it and charge customers for it.



It's not hard.
 

White Glint

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
3,617
Welp, for 11€ cost for the upgrade I got to enjoy Children of Morta, Kurushi and Stray, and see Yuffie in UHD. But back to essential!
Extra isn't bad. Even this month there's Secret of Mana and Metro Exodus which are neat, already have all the Yakuza games but I don't mind those additions.

Just Premium getting exactly 0€ of value this month is a sick joke. How did sony not realize that however good the Extra additions are, functionally killing Premium this early would overshadow it completely.
 

Karlinel

Prophet of Truth
Banned
Nov 10, 2017
7,826
Mallorca, Spain
Extra isn't bad. Even this month there's Secret of Mana and Metro Exodus which are neat, already have all the Yakuza games but I don't mind those additions.

Just Premium getting exactly 0€ of value this month is a sick joke. How did sony not realize that however good the Extra additions are, functionally killing Premium this early would overshadow it completely.
Agreed, extra is like a poor man's GPU, with some nice things every now and then. But Premium sounds like a mockery.
 
Oct 30, 2017
8,706
Much like other services, games, and hardware, it's best to just buy when the value is sufficient for yourself.

If Sony genuinely has few ambitions for this tier, they will likely dissolve it or they will beef it up to hit subscription targets. It'll work itself out.
 

Korosenai

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
763
Also to elaborate on the OP, having three tiers of ps+ is also shameful. No reason for it.
 

Expy

Member
Oct 26, 2017
9,862
It would be great if they added some monthly, but there was no indication that was ever going to be the case.
 

Hasney

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
18,625
It would be great if they added some monthly, but there was no indication that was ever going to be the case.

True, just expected from a competent service really, especially with Plus other tiers updating once a month. If this was only one tier of extra and that included the classics, then it would be more asking and hoping for more classics. But charging more, starting with such a meagre library, botching it by launching awful PAL versions in many territories, some of which even had NTSC back in the day and just being completely silent on the subject is an absolute joke. I just don't understand how just frankly awful Sony is at communicating with their customers.
 

liquidtmd

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
6,133
I mean this is just not true. Premium also includes PS3 games and Remasters, making it as a whole, a bigger list of games than Extra.

I appreciate that and the clarification, though my post was limited to the threads title in relation to PS Plus Premium's Classic Catalog (i.e PS1)
 

KORNdog

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
8,001
this is why i didn't jump straight into premium. besides the full blown REAL BC of the PS2/3 generation. sony have been pretty terrible with this stuff since. it's not a great start. but it's also still very early. i'll always be waiting to upgrade my sub if/when they start adding more content to the service. until then though. premium tier is a totally pointless offering.
 

ZeoVGM

Member
Oct 25, 2017
76,206
Providence, RI
Just as an aside, Resident Evil getting added to the service was pretty funny.

Don't recall them even talking much about it. Game just showed up as being available. You would think any Classic being added would have more fanfare to it.

Especially since it was the first ever console re-release of the original Resident Evil: Director's Cut in almost 25 years.

The downloadable PS1 Classic release of the game that was playable on PSP and PS3 was actually Resident Evil: Director's Cut (Dual Shock Ver.) -- the version of the game with a completely different and absolutely terrible soundtrack.
 
Nov 11, 2017
1,583
Software
Horrible "service".
You do realize that because of the way their emulation works, all the Classic (PS1, PS2, PSP) games they are bringing to the service need to be QA tested right? Which means there are people out there who need to play to completion each one of these games and for the games with trophies implementation, they need to ensure that said trophies work as intended and the users can get the platinum without issues.
Oh no this poor corporation. :( Do you know what a premium service is ?
 

plow

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,650
I appreciate that and the clarification, though my post was limited to the threads title in relation to PS Plus Premium's Classic Catalog (i.e PS1)

You are incorrect and completely right in raising concern about the monthly additions to the premium Service. It was more a clarification on my side, since i think ( also while reading this thread ) that some people assume that the premium Tier only adds "classics", i.e PS1-PS2-PSP games.
 

Hasney

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
18,625
You do realize that because of the way their emulation works, all the Classic (PS1, PS2, PSP) games they are bringing to the service need to be QA tested right? Which means there are people out there who need to play to completion each one of these games and for the games with trophies implementation, they need to ensure that said trophies work as intended and the users can get the platinum without issues.

Then do the work. People are paying for it, should be funded. Hell, the fact Sony didn't have several months worth of games in the chamber after a lacklustre start is an absolute joke.
 
Nov 4, 2017
7,377
I just went for Extra, which for now offers great value.

Premium seems like an absolute rort when I can chuck my PS1/2 games into my PC and get a superior experience. IMO Premium should have just included an emulator to run old discs.
 

TooBusyLookinGud

Graphics Engineer
Verified
Oct 27, 2017
7,960
California
I have Premium is it's awful. There is no need for the tier because what you get can easily fit into Extra. The Classic games offering are laughable at this point. There is so much potential but in its current state, Classics should have stayed in the oven a little longer.
 
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PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
115,670
The whole service just feels laughably rushed. Like they were so desperate to have something that kinda sounds like Game Pass on Playstation that they just crapped this out half-finished.

Some little part of me wonders if they're deliberately dragging their feet with classics so they can just be like "see? nobody wanted them anyway" and officially end support, but if that's the case, why even bother adding them in the first place? They didn't have to add them to the service if they weren't going to bother.
 

Joe White

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,040
Finland
This I disagree with. By having three tiers, you're giving consumers more choice. And because of that, consumers are able to choose Extra (which is fantastic value) over Premium (which is bad value).

It was better when we had PS Now separate from PS+. PS Now provided the content, cloud saves, MP and streaming, and in comparison PS+ didn't provide anything. Plus was only required to play MP on paid content. Current tiers killed a great service and moved its functions to be only available on more expensive tiers behind that useless essential one.
 

Kyrios

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,647
Yeah it's pretty nuts how much better Extra is than Premium. Like unless you care about PS3 game streaming, there ain't much there right now.

Really wonder if they initially planned on just dumping the PAL versions on there and backtracked after the backlash causing the delay.
 

cyrribrae

Chicken Chaser
Member
Jan 21, 2019
12,723
but if that's the case, why even bother adding them in the first place? They didn't have to add them to the service if they weren't going to bother.
That's where I land on all of this. Honestly, people wouldn't even be upset at all if they didn't provide this service. Granted, I expect (hope) they get everything sorted fairly quickly, but the whole strategy of the launch of PS+ has to be one of overwhelming positivity in order to take a big chunk of attention and goodwill from Game Pass while you still have the advantage of novelty. A botched rollout of a major tier does the opposite of that - even turning something that is a general goodwill generator like back compat into a liability by charging for it and thereby raising expectations.

Probably would have been better if they had marketed Extra, which already does the heavy lifting of being somewhat comparable to Game Pass. And then introduced Premium at the 1 year mark, to buoy interest and novelty once again, alongside a much smoother and substantial rollout of classic games.
 

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
115,670
Probably would have been better if they had marketed Extra, which already does the heavy lifting of being somewhat comparable to Game Pass. And then introduced Premium at the 1 year mark, to buoy interest and novelty once again, alongside a much smoother and substantial rollout of classic games.

Exactly. If they weren't going to put effort into Premium, they didn't need a third pricing tier right now. I don't know what possessed them to think that three tiers was anywhere remotely close to necessary.
 

TheBaldwin

Member
Feb 25, 2018
8,285
It's amazing how hard the have fumbled this

PS1 and PS2 are some of the greatest library's of games ever created for both first and third party, niche to big budget, and western to asian

Yet somehow they just have none of them.
 

erlim

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,511
London
Even if they just did a steady drip of first party ps1 or psp games they would be offering some good value. PS2 games like GOW games would be nuts. Instead there's only a steady slate of clone mobile runner shovelware games as new releases on PS store. Assuming programming each PS1 or PSP title isn't insanely complicated, Sony is making sole very strange decisions.
 

werezompire

Zeboyd Games
Verified
Oct 26, 2017
11,372
Feels like one of those psychological things where they offer multiple tiers, but they only really want you to pick one. So by making the top tier so anemic with new releases, all the complaints go towards it and everybody gets the 2nd tier without complaint.
 

riotous

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,333
Seattle
I think Premium Tier is really setup for the focus to be on streaming. While most people don't want it, the cost is certainly fairly high for Sony to maintain it, and Sony isn't in the business of not charging extra for costly things.

It's just that most of our eyes just skip past that part in the marketing, and the crowd that really wants classic games is annoyed they are lumped in with that.
 

thepenguin55

Member
Oct 28, 2017
11,815
I hate how they rolled PS Now into PS+. To be fair MS does the same thing as Sony by tying xCloud to their highest tier subscription service, GamePass Ultimate but it bugs me there too. I see the Deluxe tier that's available in countries where PS Now game streaming isn't available and wonder why we can't at least have that as an option? A lot of people have interest in game streaming but just as many (maybe even more) don't so because of that I think people should be able to opt out of paying for a thing most likely most have no use for without also having to forgo the rest of that tiers offerings and get some kind of at least minor savings.

Though the tiers beyond Extra really need to be reworked so something that would potentially be even better than just adding the Deluxe tier as an option everywhere would be more radically adjusting the tiers. I say this because it really feels like this thing was born out of them wanting a better answer to GamePass without just doing GamePass but the differences between what is on offer here combined with what's on each tier ultimately stack up to GamePass supper well. So I would say PS Now game streaming should not be a PS+ tier but rather an optional add-on for each tier. So you could subscribe to the Essential tier and for a small upcharge add PS Now streaming to that sub. No matter what tier you subscribe to adding PS Now to your sub would grant you access to their full game streaming library. Though maybe that just results in us who don't want to pay for game stream ultimately paying the same price for one less feature and people who want game streaming paying more than they currently are? So I guess scratch that idea as that's probably what would happen unless the game streaming upcharge is only $1.

Still, sticking timed trials of games behind a paywall is stupid to begin with but then tying it to the highest tier is extra dumb so I would at least move them to the Essential tier. After that adjustment maybe it then actually makes sense to just combine the Extra tier with the Deluxe/Premium tier into one tier so then there's just two PS+ tiers: the lightly revised Essential tier stays at $9.99 and the revised Extra tier stays at $14.99 with the $2.99 option to add PS Now to either tier. That actually is probably the best possible option as it brings their offering closest in line with GamePass in terms of offering+price and there isn't a scenario where people would be paying more than they are currently for less content than what is available in their current offering.

That also just feels like a really solid offering in a way the current offering isn't really. In a scenario where Sony was aggressively adding a lot of PS Classic games to the service even a tier that was just classic games would be worth it but Premium (which offers more than just classic games) as it currently stands feels grossly overpriced for what's offered and even Extra feels a little overpriced. This is really true when you consider that even if you set aside day one first party releases GamePass offers, GamePass Ultimate's $14.99 essentially offers the Xbox equivalent of everything offered in PS+'s Essential and Extra tiers as well as game streaming, PC games and Classic Xbox + Xbox 360 games. As it currently stands when my current PS+ sub runs out I can only see myself renewing said sub if I can find a year of Premium deeply discounted somewhere (assuming PS+ gift cards and codes are even still a thing). Otherwise, I'll just pick up a month of Essential whenever needed as what they're offering just isn't worth it to me.
 

Heidelbeere

Member
Jun 8, 2022
59
Feels like one of those psychological things where they offer multiple tiers, but they only really want you to pick one. So by making the top tier so anemic with new releases, all the complaints go towards it and everybody gets the 2nd tier without complaint.
Haha, it does feel like they're focused on tier two. Honestly, the base tier is pretty damn good. Yakuza and Tony hawk this month? Is there a strong impetus to move up from there? For some, sure. I'd like to see them just combine 2 & 3--seems like the obvious play. Foster some good will and figure out what's going on in the backend while taking less heat, but perhaps it's too early.
 

SimpleCRIPPLE

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,224
If i hadn't stacked a ton of Plus already so it ended up being a relatively cheap conversion/upgrade, i'd be regretting going with the top tier. As it is, i'm paid up through like 2027 now, so I guess i'm in for the long haul to watch how this develops.