If Twitch fosters a community of users that think they can donate money and ask what ever they want of the content creators. They are going to spread to other parts of the website when their main channels are suspended. They want to have under 18 users streaming right next to the do what ever for donations channels. It's such a weird disconnect in tone.
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Hell no, twitch is way better now than it ever was, love watching the weird random shit that pops up there now.
All the cooking streams i have watched have legitimately made me a better cook.
Yeahhh, hot tub streams were one thing - I mean, who gives a shit there. But this....ehhhh lol.
I will never not find it funny (in a sad kind of way) that women in bathing suits and yoga pants is bad for Twitch 'because of all the kids' but any M rated games where you blow peoples heads off, that's fine and dandy.
Laughable response.
Anyways Twitch isn't going to do anything until they force to when the eventual advertisers catch on. There's also a layer of hypocrisy in that Twitch will make money off sexually suggestive ads like Dr. Sasquatch(granted I don't watch Twitch virtually at all but I'm assuming those are there).
I don't get people are acting upset on behalf of her because she isn't upset or acting if the performative ban for a paper trail isn't justified
Twitch can very well stop this but they decide not to time and again. No one should have any beef with these streamers.
Twitch can put a definite stop to this.
Twitch can put a definite stop to this.
Since you don't consider that harassment, I guess It would be alright to tell the female bartender at the stripclub to take her top off because clearly she can make more money copying the strippers.
It's definitely not a twitch thing but a society thing. Violence as entertainment is vastly more accepted than "sexual" content. Anyways, I agree with you...it is stupid. I still find myself understanding the argument of "think about the kids" but I never go with it because I now know that it comes from a sexist place.
More or less just ruins it for other women on the platform since they get constantly harassed to do the same thing. That said there are a lot of things that shouldn't be easily accessible on twitch the GAMBLING section for one fuck that shit right off please.
I mean its not them but they are bringing that type of user to the site. You have to set up for the lowest common denominator when it comes to these things. Its like gun control I guess in smart countries(yes thats an extreme example but its the same point small amount of fuckwits ruin for everyone) .
Thats like, American society since forever. Thats the least shocking thing about Twitch to me.
I am watching a fabulous bearded man in a rainbow tutu dance badly in a inflatable pool, all is good with the world.
Twitch follows the ESRB ratings for allowing games and on top of that has a list of prohibited content/games that cannot be shown on stream. They don't allow modded games, and ask streamers not to make sexualized parts of allowed games be the center of attention. For example, the big nopixel rp gta community had to remove the strip club from the server because several streamers got banned for making the strip club the center of attention for too long.
Oh, I'm not surprised in any way. Like you said, that's the US in a nutshell.
I still find it sad though.
Why are we comparing video game violence with things people do in real life? Twitch streamers also aren't allowed to engage in violence. Streamers technically aren't even allowed to make violent threats on twitch.
There's been an effort to overcorrect for backlash to things like the hot tub streams, so now we have those saying Amouranth isn't responsible for her actions when she knowingly breaks rules. It's just infantilising tbh.
Yep! That's the best thing about this honestly. I found a cat shelter stream, this Marine Mammal Rescue stream and a stream of dogs playing in a pool. Super happy about that :D
Exactly. We've gone from exploiting a loophole (a hot tub or a kiddy pool aren't technically a swimming pool and definitely not a beach) or using sexy lace lingerie designed to cover with opaque bits exactly what the TOS tell you to cover to blatantly playing a escalating game of chicken about basically how much time will it take Twitch to ban them for breaking extremely clear rules that says not to do exactly what they've been doing (camera focus on breasts, buttocks, or pelvic region, including poses that deliberately highlight these elements) because they know the banhammer won't be immediate for them due to the amount of money they bring.
We as a society have decided one is worse than the other.
Porn is 18+ in the western world, and while extreme acts of violence are sometimes 18+ as well, they mostly are 13+ or in similar age brackets.
This is not something new, this is not unusual and this is what most people think is correct (including me).
Iirc some people say that our bodies should not be 18+ (ie nudity) but at the same time there's a huge difference between people making "softcore porn" on twitch while advertising their hardcore onlyfans and that.
Hammer, nail, head. Anyone acting like "lol this is fine" and wasn't a blatant disregard to the rules that should've been cracked down on sooner before it got altogether extremely out of hand is kidding nobody, not even themselves.
Your personal feelings (or mine) on sexually explicit content and whether it's appropriate for Twitch's audience don't really come into play here. Twitch's platform rules are clear, and it's beyond obvious this content was never in good faith. We've really gone from people simply expressing themselves freely to blatant abuse of the platform. It's about time Twitch took themselves seriously.
Because I've seen people say that this stuff should be banned from Twitch because it's full of kids. And I really don't see how watching a lady in yoga pants or a bikini is bad for a kid, but watching a play though of Last of Us 2. (Which as of right now is being streamed by plenty of people.)
What is the original focus of twitch streaming? I rarely used
From what I recall It was made for people stream their Gameplays
From what I recall It was made for people stream their Gameplays
I guess my thing is, why should I care about Twitch's TOS? Hell, they don't seem to most of the time. Honestly, Twitch has a history of letting big streamers do whatever they want while banning small streamers for following the rules.
So why am I supposed to be pissed off this time? Hell, last I checked the ladies in question aren't alt-right fascists or nazi's so they've already got a leg up on a lot of people who got big on twitch.
Basically, Twitch is so inconsistent with it's rules that I don't really if someone broke them. And trying to say that women acting sexy of their own accord is somehow worse than graphic violence I'm gonna disagree.
I didn't care about hot tub meta because there's nothing inherently/overtly sexual about it, it's just attractive people in swimsuits. This is just putting the camera on your butt while you thrust/bounce/spread your legs/etc, the point is to make it as sexual as possible while actually breaking the rules. Like, a PG-13 movie with a beach scene I dunno why anyone would be mad, a PG-13 movie with overtly sexual stuff has had people call them out (transformers comes to mind).
As far as the games, it is known to be for 17 and above. Twitch should absolutely age gate those games (and maybe they do?), but for Just chatting/ASMR/whatever else they use, what is the age requirement for those? You just have to assume it's whatever the minimum of the site is (13) unless stated to be mature by the streamer themselves and the things they do are absolutely not "13" appropriate just like a violent video game isn't "13" appropriate.
I don't know if you can solely blame two women who dominate a niche category for the rise of sexual harassers towards non-sexual girl streamers on Twitch. It's been a major unaddressed issue way before either of these "metas".
I don't think you can ignore the fact that it hasn't been a problem for them the way it is now until this past week.
Well I think one of the things playing to this is that people don't want to sound sexist lol, right? I mean look at the arguments over the hot tub stuff...it was essentially you either support/tolerate this or your sexist because you don't want women taking ownership of their bodies an exploiting men who oversexualize them. That was my feeling and I was fine with the hot tub stuff to an extent.
I feel like I'm walking a tightrope with this comment cause people on the internet see things so black and white and are quick to get outraged.
Even though the focus was gameplays, it evolved into people cooking, doing all kinds of art or just talking and chilling with their community. As such kind of platform, Twitch stablished a series of rules for no NSFW content. The problem we have at hand is that, during these last months, there has been a group of streamers that have been constantly poking at the rules looking for loopholes to exploit in bad faith but with a plausible deniability so they could claim dumb in order to have the most borderline NSFW possible content and make bank of it, with twitch patching, clarifying and trying to put as much sensible and easy to understand red lines as possible without resorting to basically telling women to cover themselves (which would have been horrible). We're at the point where these streamers have resorted to directly stomping over extremely clear rules for the sake of their content and all the fuss is basically because Twitch rule enforcement is the most inconsistent the more money you bring to the table so they're not banned on sight the way a smaller streamer would.
This is one of the reasons why sexual harassment against women is so pervasive. So many men normalize these harassing comments against women like you're doing, and that we should just put up with it.
Im not saying it's worse than graphic violence or equating them. I don't even think they should be banned. I was just trying to find some logic in Twitch's actions. However like you said they are wildly inconsistent in their application of it so it's a bit of a fools errand Im taking here.
Omg they are on Twitch? I found their YT around 9-10 months ago. Baby otters are so fluffy <3
I can find plenty of logic in what Twitch does. They like having sexy ladies doing sexy stuff on their platform because it brings in viewers. But they have to say they don't like it to make advertisers and platform holders satisfied, but they constantly let it happen because you know, money. It's a grey that Twitch loves because then they can just collect money and not have to take a stand for anything.
And I just want to say, if your reaction to women getting harassed on twitch is to blame other women instead of the filth doing the harassing, then you are in fact a garbage person.
But again, why are the women being blamed in this situation and not the creepy men? This tweet sums up my point.
I agree with this. This is (to me, at least) completely about Twitch's rules and streamers absolutely purposefully breaking them to promote their Onlyfans and not getting punished (or laughing about a 2 day ban), while other, smaller streamers, can simply not even come close because they'd be banned within minutes. At this point, I also think "they are within their right to skirt the rules" is kind of a cheap excuse, since this is not a one time thing anymore, and it's clearly on purpose.
If Twitch updates their rules and allows this openly and officially without any blurred lines, to anyone, I'd be completely fine with this content.
This one, however, I can't really agree with. Many people in here argued against this stuff without being called "sexist". If you have an argument that's not literally misogynistic or sexist, there's only a very, very low chance on people saying you are, I'd say. It's perfectly reasonable to be fine with women taking ownership of their bodies and still dislike how Twitch doesn't give a shit about their own rules when it comes to a tiny portion of Top streamers. The point is that it becomes unreasonable to accuse these women to.. idk, do what twitch allows them to do without repercussion? That should indeed not be a problem, and in most cases actually does sound like at least under-the-surface sexism of jealous male streamers.
I honestly think the "tight rope" in your post is less the opinion about tiktok-pants streamers and more the implied "Era SJWs only see black and white" lol.
Yes. That is absolutely harrassment. Just because a few streamers do pseudo-erotic stuff on Twitch (and at this point, caught a ban for that) gives you absolutely no right to expect, ask or harrass other women about doing the same for your enjoyment. It's absolutely harrassment, even more so if it happens multiple times per hour.
I think if they like the viewers it brings in then they should make a firm stance that they allow it and quit banning streamers (big and small).
I think you have me confused with someone else for the second part of your post.
The women who are speaking out are blaming the harassers, but they're also intelligent enough to understand these idiots don't exist in a vacuum. So they're also blaming their fellow Twitch streamers who are knowingly breaking the rules in order to funnel users to their actual money making sites, as well as assigning blame to Twitch for not better policing streamers and viewers alike.
I agree, they should actually make a choice and stick with it either way. But they won't.
And that second part wasn't directed at you, just at a sentiment I've seen in this thread that I find very distasteful.
Trust me, even years ago when I was streaming all us women knew there were two standards on sexualized content. Slap on the wrist for popular sexual content, permabans for even tame borderline unintentional content with smaller streamers.
When I was streaming, I saw women get permabans for having a low cut top, while in particular a big streamer got a like 1 month ban for intentionally showing her bare crotch on stream by "accident"
The problem IMO is that there's no "choice" they have to make this time around like they had to with the hot tubs loophole. There's a very clear rule about what NOT to do and a group of streamers are intentionally doing exactly what the rules tell you not to do, verbatim. Their only choice is "are we going to enforce the very clear rules that already exist equally or will we keep on looking the other way when big streamers break them?" and so far their stance is IMO not the correct one for the long term viability of the platform.
If this was just ladies walking around or doing yoga, I would get your point. I feel like when we reach the point where a lady is sticking a microphone up her asshole to meet a "fart" subscriber goal to the chorus of a chat filled with orgasm emoticons, then I'm fine with people pointing out that the platform isn't really child friendly anymore. I don't know if watching someone else play a violent video game is quite on that level.
B/C like porn games which are banned in twitch, streamers selling what amounts to soft core porn, or serve as advertisements to funnel viewers to their actual porn are different than media not made explicitly for sexual gratification. There is a mature viewer setting you can use for streaming something like tlou2.
First, the women should keep doing it until Twitch stops them. I see no reason they shouldn't keep making their money in this way while it's allowed. Second:
Spot on, though the quoted tweet gets at something else. Let's talk about ERA. Would we be okay making threads for the enjoyment of these streams? Answer is probably not, because that would flout the "boys club rhetoric" rule. In that for this particular community, we know that would make the environment unwelcoming, no matter how much we all favor sex work here.
Bringing it back to Twitch, I can see the problem if some (not all) of the most popular women streamers have become popular and made more money by making sexual content. That's a reflection on the audience of gaming more than anything, but still very much reinforces it.
Not that Twitch cares about being a boys club in other regards, though...
Third: Someone else brought to my attention that more than the content itself, it's also the parasocial nature of it that are more likely to affect children. Streamers actually won't know the age of the people making requests, as far as I know. See: stans of any influencer ever. I'm actually very curious to see the study in 10 years or so.
This is my personal, updated stance on the matter and I'm looking forward to someone poking holes in it so I can update it further.
That said, to repeat my first statement... the streamers themselves can keep doing it as long as the platform allows. It's not their job to manage the details.
Spot on, though the quoted tweet gets at something else. Let's talk about ERA. Would we be okay making threads for the enjoyment of these streams? Answer is probably not, because that would flout the "boys club rhetoric" rule. In that for this particular community, we know that would make the environment unwelcoming, no matter how much we all favor sex work here.
Bringing it back to Twitch, I can see the problem if some (not all) of the most popular women streamers have become popular and made more money by making sexual content. That's a reflection on the audience of gaming more than anything, but still very much reinforces it.
Not that Twitch cares about being a boys club in other regards, though...
Third: Someone else brought to my attention that more than the content itself, it's also the parasocial nature of it that are more likely to affect children. Streamers actually won't know the age of the people making requests, as far as I know. See: stans of any influencer ever. I'm actually very curious to see the study in 10 years or so.
This is my personal, updated stance on the matter and I'm looking forward to someone poking holes in it so I can update it further.
That said, to repeat my first statement... the streamers themselves can keep doing it as long as the platform allows. It's not their job to manage the details.
This is also a very good point. If these streamers are not bringing quality content but just advertising their actual NSFW work in other platforms, they're not fostering and bringing a quality community along going by the rampant cases of harrasment that seem to be spilling over other female streamers in the same categories they decide to squat and they're constantly pushing the rules (when not blatantly breaking them like it's this latest case) in bad faith to the point of actually having a ban history, Twitch has to make a decission whether it's worth catering to them and applying double standards on content moderation and rule enforcement depending on how much money you make until the matter explodes on other social media or if it wouldn't be better to rip the bandaid off immediately and make a clear statement on their moderation policies (and of course honour it).
This should have had stopped the very first day a hot tub stream devolved into dry humping an inflatable banana intentionally sticking the ass out as much as possible (clearly banned by the TOS), but since it didn't happen, here we are now.
It's the fault of the men. But the men are invited to continue that by the platform itself (Twitch) on a bigger percentage, and lastly by the biggest streamers that benefit directly from this. Obviously the men are mainly to blame. But behaviours don't exist in a vacuum, and Twitch could be much, much improved if they took their own platform seriously. I mean, they have rules and don't enforce them half the time lol
I fear for my children and the cesspool of internet culture they may encounter as they get older.