Find me a game with action combat as deep and challenging as Devil My Cry, while also having a large focus on open-world exploration, puzzles, and stealth.
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Tried Arkham City out for the first time.. overrated button mash fest
- Thread starter hwarang
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For real lol, let's see how OP is playing during combat sections.
The combat system in the Arkham games is fine for those games and allows you to sufficiently feel like you are the goddamn Batman. I'm not a huge fan of it, but it does its job well enough not to get in the way, especially once you start to really get the hang of it.
What I really, really don't like about it is that so many other games started blatantly copying it once the Arkham games took off. I don't feel like this is a combat system that is strong enough for reuse in other games and that it feels out of place in, say, the Mordor games.
What I really, really don't like about it is that so many other games started blatantly copying it once the Arkham games took off. I don't feel like this is a combat system that is strong enough for reuse in other games and that it feels out of place in, say, the Mordor games.
yeah I'm super confused
The combat like straight up doesn't work if you "button mash"
The game is not as challenging as character-action games (god I dislike that term) like DMC, but it is a satisfying Batman beat-up-thugs (or stealth them) simulator.
I know that's not what you technically complained about, but one alternative to button-mashing would be waggling, and I bet you would not like that alternative.
I know that's not what you technically complained about, but one alternative to button-mashing would be waggling, and I bet you would not like that alternative.
Most of that stuff is fluff though.
I had a similar issue with The Force Unleashed. There was one combo you could unlock fairly early on that clearly put out the most damage by far, so then you were a fool to use any of the other ones. But that also meant every fight was just that combo over and over, which got old fast.
I wouldn't go as far as saying "button mashing," but 90% of the combat in the Arkham games (up to City, I haven't played the rest) is extremely simple to the point of essentially being a solved experience (EG "this enemy is type A, so I counter and then punchpunchpunch. The other guy is type B, so I dodge, then punchpunchpunch"). You get their guard down via X,Y, or Z and then wail on them.
I don't hold it against the gas because it's blatantly a power fantasy, but I also don't hold it against someone if that's very dull to them.
Batman games (And thse lotr shadow games) have relatively simple combat systems but that's the point to make them accessible. They are not aiming to be the end all and be all of complex fighting system like its a devil may cry game. They are made so the "average" gamer can enjoy them at the base level.
It's fine to want something else or something deeper in other games but they purposely make those games that way so a mass of audience can find them approachable and understandable.
It sounds like you came in with the wrong expectations.
It's fine to want something else or something deeper in other games but they purposely make those games that way so a mass of audience can find them approachable and understandable.
It sounds like you came in with the wrong expectations.
Mashing is literally NOT what batman combat is about, but y'know, it's fine to pretend you've got a handle on it after 20 minutes.
That's like saying souls combat is mashing R1 a bunch and hitting roll sometimes.
Sekiro you just parry and then hit attack. bad combat game 1/10
That's like saying souls combat is mashing R1 a bunch and hitting roll sometimes.
The combat in these games is about throwing multiple enemies of different types at you at once. It's reductive to say 'you beat this enemy by countering then hitting attack and repeating' just as it's disingenuous to say 'mario is just about hitting jump' or 'dodge attack and then hit attack a lot' for any 'complex' soulsborne game.
Sekiro you just parry and then hit attack. bad combat game 1/10
It's simple to understand but the joy to it is the real time planning and management of enemies of different types and using your resources to make it flow and avoiding breaking flow.
The campaign enemies are not much of a challenge but where it shines is the challenge rooms and aiming for perfect flows. I particularly like the survival challenges where there is no end with ramping up of challenge.
I don't agree that its just mashing a single button. It's different from what DMC or action games of the time would be. It certainly spawned a new subset of action games and is still one of the best out of the ones that adapted it.
It is more reliant on different handling of enemy types with specific ways to defeat whereas DMC has more emphasis on what combo you can do and knowing the moveset of the enemy to know how to dodge it.
The campaign enemies are not much of a challenge but where it shines is the challenge rooms and aiming for perfect flows. I particularly like the survival challenges where there is no end with ramping up of challenge.
I don't agree that its just mashing a single button. It's different from what DMC or action games of the time would be. It certainly spawned a new subset of action games and is still one of the best out of the ones that adapted it.
It is more reliant on different handling of enemy types with specific ways to defeat whereas DMC has more emphasis on what combo you can do and knowing the moveset of the enemy to know how to dodge it.
It's not button mashy at all, combat gets more complex fairly quickly. Are you sure you played the game enough OP?
No, it's not, all the gadgets are used by holding the shoulder buttons.
Combat is not complex but it is generally well regarded as fun. OP does not think it is fun but seemed driven to tell the world. End of thread.
You can continue lying all you want, but you've said nothing of substance in this thread and demonstrated you actually don't know anything about it's controls or mechanics, so this is just some real bad faith posting. The simple fact you think you can reduce it to button mashing, or even just a small subset of the buttons actually involved in the technical demonstration linked earlier that uses literally every possible button on a controller shows your actual ignorance.
I wouldn't look at this as a straight character action game, it's far more of a stealth-action hybrid, with excellent characterization, a really cool open-city, and some excellent levels and bosses.
Love the Arkham games. The combat is simple, I'm a huge Ninja Gaiden fan, but I wouldn't compare it to that game. It does a ton of things amazing that Ninja Gaiden doesn't or doesn't even attempt to do.
Love the Arkham games. The combat is simple, I'm a huge Ninja Gaiden fan, but I wouldn't compare it to that game. It does a ton of things amazing that Ninja Gaiden doesn't or doesn't even attempt to do.
This thread reminds me of this bit from the Bo Burnham special.
"Here's a question for you guys. Um…
Is it… is it necessary?
Is it necessary that every single person on this planet um, expresses every single opinion that they have on every single thing that occurs all at the same time?
Is that… is that necessary?
Um…
Or to ask in a slightly different way, um, can… can anyone shut the fuck up?
Can… can anyone, any… any… any one, any single one, can any one… shut the fuck up about anything–
About any… any single thing?
Can any single person shut the fuck up about any single thing for an hour?
You know, is that… is that possible?
And I know you're thinking, "You're not shutting the fuck up right now," and that's true, but…"
I personally loved the combat. It may not be deep but it felt amazing when you mastered it and could get insane combo counts. One of the best games of that gen!
The OPs big issue seems to be that they find the combat not deep enough.
I doubt they will like asylum since the combat is about the same.
The OPs big issue seems to be that they find the combat not deep enough.
I doubt they will like asylum since the combat is about the same.
I agree. The combat isn't bad, but it's dull. The game also does not benefit from being open world.
The only memorable thing, for me, was the voice work.
Other than that, I found it to be really boring.
I feel like it gets too much slack for being a superhero licensed game that isn't terrible.
The only memorable thing, for me, was the voice work.
Other than that, I found it to be really boring.
I feel like it gets too much slack for being a superhero licensed game that isn't terrible.
This reminds me of the discussion about playing games on easy from yesterday lol. this is what can sometimes happens when people play game on easy. This is why i think playing games on easy can be a mixed bag.
Yes but it doesn't matter, pressing a series of buttons in a coordinated and deliberate fashion to perform complex actions is still 'button mashing' to this person lol
The game overall is more about feeling overpowered and awesome as Batman than actually having depth or complexity or anything like that, and that's perfectly fine. It may not be the type of game you want, but it's good at what it's doing.
It aged just right. People had these same issues back at release too.
The combat is entirely focused on canned animations, and it is really basic and mindless once you get even the barest grips with it. You have four core options Parry, Attack, Jump, and Stun. All four will function in the exact same way regardless of the situation. Your dodge will always take the same amount of time. The attack will always take the same amount of time. the dodge will always take the same amount of time. the parry will always take the same amount of time. You don't need to consider positioning because batman will snap from a specific enemy to another with little input from the player. The entire combat system is so limited because of how locked in batman and the enemies are.
There is no good way to hit multiple enemies at once. All enemies have easily identifiable tells on what they are about to do and countering them is pretty simple. So with all this, the entire combat system after a while starts feeling like a glorified quick time event and it doesn't take much skill to master.
I really wish it wasn't kept for all of the Arkham games because it was pretty flawed. Not that I ever expected good combat from a genre like this, but it was disappointing that it was kept for all the Arkham games with little changes and that other games copied it.
There is no good way to hit multiple enemies at once. All enemies have easily identifiable tells on what they are about to do and countering them is pretty simple. So with all this, the entire combat system after a while starts feeling like a glorified quick time event and it doesn't take much skill to master.
I really wish it wasn't kept for all of the Arkham games because it was pretty flawed. Not that I ever expected good combat from a genre like this, but it was disappointing that it was kept for all the Arkham games with little changes and that other games copied it.
I would recommend trying those "Extreme Brawl" challenges, thats where the combat shines.
The campaign is pretty easy and never expects you to utilise the combat at full.
The campaign is pretty easy and never expects you to utilise the combat at full.
I think your criticism is pretty disingenuous, and I didn't even like the game that much.
Thank you.
If your goal is just to survive and progress by mashing 2 buttons then you're doing it wrong. Play the game with a goal to be as cool and stylish as possible. I suggest you to try getting high scores in challenge maps to fully appreciate the game's combat.
I only played Arkham Asylum, and the combat was mind numbingly boring, and it soured the whole thing for me. I wish all the encounters would've been the stealth type.
It's not button mashy, but it is very simple, and there's little depth outside hitting the buttons in the correct rhythm. Like, if you can reliably time a parry in a game, you've got the Arkham combat down.
It's not button mashy, but it is very simple, and there's little depth outside hitting the buttons in the correct rhythm. Like, if you can reliably time a parry in a game, you've got the Arkham combat down.
Honestly how it feels most people are when they talk about 'combat' in games these days. Like, shit the controller has so many buttons, and everything is a combination of button, context, and timing. it ain't that complicated.
Lmao. Love this picture (unless whoever made this meme was serious).
I kinda sorta liked it. I'm not much for the setting, which prevented me from feeling genuinely interested, but I was motivated enough to complete it.
I implore people to try challenge modes and different difficulty settings before calling a game mind numbing or brainless. It's okay if Arkham City isn't for you, but the combat system is much deeper than it's getting credit for.
