TPC: Pokémon Sword & Shield has sold through 6M copies (2M in Japan alone). It's the fastest selling Nintendo Switch software ever. [SEE STAFF POST]

[Fj0823]

he comes off as a defeatist because he thinks if he makes the games too challenging people won't play them, instead opting to play one of many mobile games

he also believes that there's no reason to add a plethora of endgame content for the same reason

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Yes, his entire philosophy is "Kids will drop my game and go play on their phones so why should I bother?" How is that healthy for a franchise?

His stance has only gotten worse with GO's success. That's why I fully believe that the Wild Area is a goner sooner rather than later, he will take a quick look at the data, see that small kids don't spend hours in the wild area, and decide to remove it. Mark my words.

I HOPE this success even at like 25% of the franchise's potential opens his eyes at what his team can achieve. But I'm not holding my breath

 

[Meatwad]

Sounds like a series you didn't care much for to begin with it.

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Sounds like somebody who is an emotionally mature adult actually

 

[808s & Villainy]

but then again so are most Pokémon fans that hate on Gen 1 because it's the hip and cool thing to do

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Yes, it's only disliked because it's "the hip and cool thing to do". No wonder you can't tell why people dislike genwunners

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LOL

 

[Scarlet Spider]

Yes, his entire philosophy is "Kids will drop my game and go play on their phones so why should I bother?" How is that healthy for a franchise?

His stance has only gotten worse with GO's success. That's why I fully believe that the Wild Area is a goner sooner rather than later, he will take a quick look at the data, see that small kids don't spend hours in the wild area, and decide to remove it. Mark my words.

I HOPE this success even at like 25% of the franchise's potential opens his eyes at what his team can achieve. But I'm not holding my breath

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Then the demographic should change a little to slightly appeal to more older fans since they're aware of their aging fanbase....but nah.

 

[TyraZaurus]

He will never live down that ORAS statement regarding children getting frustrated at challenges and them just playing on their phone.

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Except that statement was backed by actual data they collected.

 

[Meatwad]

Then the demographic should change a little to slightly appeal to more older fans since they're aware of their aging fanbase....but nah.

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No, the games are for kids, they're not supposed to grow up with you

 

[Cronogear]

On one hand yeah, I've had a lot of fun with the game. On the other, this gives GameFreak even less incentive to improve the games.

Playing Sword/Shield you realize it could've just been more. And better. A gargantuan mound of wasted potential.

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I can agree with this.

Through the first few hours of the game I was like "Yeah, this is pretty fun." But when you get further and further into the game and also start thinking back to previous games, you realize what's missing. You realize there's really not much to do in the Wild Area. You realize the routes and towns are much smaller and linear than previous games (the town with the 7th gym is a literal hallway). You realize the story is about as barebones as it gets. And then I realized, the reason I was having fun is because the core Pokemon formula holds up so well.

There are things that Sword and Shield do well. I think the encounter system is basically perfect. I really like the UI, and all of the QoL improvements are welcome. The foundations are there. But the game itself is far too linear, easy, and lacking in content for my tastes.

 

[Flame Lord]

Not at all- I love Pokémon, but if I felt strongly enough about it that I didn't want to play the games any more, I'd try and quietly step away (not least because I'd probably be hurting over it).

Some of the posters who're saying that they're done with the franchise have posted about it dozens, if not hundreds, of times recently, and I simply don't get it.

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Given that sales and reviews have shown that they won't get the message through, there's nothing left for people disappointed in the series to do besides voice their concerns. Do you really not understand, or do you just want every Pokemon thread to be a circlejerk?

No, the games are for kids, they're not supposed to grow up with you

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Yet consistently they fall back to nostalgia batting with gen 1 remakes, and having the ONLY started to return be Charizard.

 

[Keyouta]

Can we get a Morimoto/Unno tag team for the third version games, or Diamond Pearl remakes? Please.

That these games are selling incredibly well doesn't surprise me, the series is too strong. I wonder if they'll cut these game's legs short with a release next year or wait until 2021.

 

[TyraZaurus]

I think all of you hoping Morimoto will show up and be a Maverick and satisfy all your hopes and dreams are gonna be disappointed if he's ever put in charge of a game again.

 

[Fj0823]

I think all of you hoping Morimoto will show up and be a Maverick and satisfy all your hopes and dreams are gonna be disappointed if he's ever put in charge of a game again.

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For once, I agree with you 100%. The problems are the philosophies at GF

 

[Dwebble]

Given that sales and reviews have shown that they won't get the message through, there's nothing left for people disappointed in the series to do besides voice their concerns. Do you really not understand, or do you just want every Pokemon thread to be a circlejerk?

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I'm not talking about people who are disappointed, I'm talking about people who are saying that they're stepping away from the series entirely.

Of course there's a place for criticism- I've made plenty of it myself! I just wouldn't bother if the bad outweighed the good like it apparently does for some here.

 

[KillstealWolf]

Let's Go will be back, mark my words. Let's Go was the best Pokémon game in years anyways. Just because you didn't like it doesn't mean it's not a valid and fun game. You're being just as dismissive as the "genwunners" you fight against, but then again so are most Pokémon fans that hate on Gen 1 because it's the hip and cool thing to do

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I have a whole 10 point checklist of things that if the next Let's Go didn't do, I'd be interested in it.

1. Keeping to the Grid Layout.
2. Only having pokemon from that region and no others (Even in Postgame)
3. No option to play with traditional capture mechanics with wild battles.
4. Simplification of Difficulty with no challenge at all, along with a partner pokemon that can sweep the entire game for you.
5. Gym Requirement Gating
6. AVs
7. Master Trainers as the post-game content.
8. Hideous Chibi Artstyle.
9. Horrible Online Features
10. Forced Motion Controls and no Pro Controller Support

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If they can avoid all those points of problems. I would probably be interested in picking it up. I could probably add respecting that Fire Red and Leaf Green existed as well to that list to be honest.

I would have picked it up had they mixed up the world design and pokemon in it. ORAS actually updated teams with newer pokemon like giving Wally a Gallade now instead of a Gardevoir, that was a cool choice. Let's Go didn't have any of that.

If I have to deal with a Let's Go Johto that won't allow me to use Togekiss, Sylveon, Gliscor, Yanmega or Weavile (among others) just because they didn't exist when Gold/Silver/Crystal did, then it's not a game I want to support. HG/SS allowed them fine. I'll just replay HG/SS instead since they are in that one. Likewise I'll just replay FR/LG if I want a Kanto based game.

And as a pro for SwSh, they avoided... most of the problems Let's Go had. Did fail the only pokemon from the region (Sorta, there's a few more to come looking at the datamine I guess) failed the Difficulty Check (Unless the game really ramps up the difficulty for the final battles of the story, I'll make final call on this when beating the game), and debateably weak post-game (Haven't reached it yet but mixed responses on this) and bad online features with the loss of GTS being a big negative.

 

[Scarlet Spider]

No, the games are for kids, they're not supposed to grow up with you

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When did you realize that you Pokemon was a game that would keep people playing into adulthood?

JM: When we developed Red and Blue we weren't explicitly targeting children. If you look at the animation, for instance, that was meant to appeal to kids with cute designs and so on. But if you look at the game and that design, even from Red and Blue it was intended to be a game that adults could also enjoy. In that regard, there's not been any change in how we design the games.

Just like how children and adults both like playing soccer -- children might like it at first because the ball is round and colourful but adults put far more thought into it.

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How do you balance the adult and child audiences?

JM: It's very difficult. In Omega Ruby and Alpha Sapphire they're remakes of an original game and we want the older players to be able to enjoy it, not just the new players.

So how do we make new content to keep them interested? For instance, in X and Y we introduced Mega Evolutions so in

ORAS we've taken that a little further, dug a little deeper.

We wanted to carry that story further, but it's very difficult in terms of creating content that will be interesting and captures a child. But we put a lot of effort into creating something each target could enjoy.

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[Anth0ny]

Congratulations! They can get away with literally anything at this point and the game will sell like gangbusters regardless.

So here's how I feel going forward: Even with all the cuts, Sword and Shield felt rushed. For the sanity of the dev team, they should cut the dex even further next time. Maybe hold a poll and only include 50 fan favorites on top of the 100 new pokemon introduced. Cut down on moves, ain't nobody got time for all that shit. It's confusing anyways. Implement less gym leaders and include more friendly rival encounters between each city to pad out the length of the game. New gimmick turns Pokemon red. Like just a simple palette swap, but when they turn red they become stronger-er and get a special move or something. Every gym leader has one powerful Pokemon that can turn red. Remove roaming Pokemon from the overworld, creating all those animations for 100 all new Pokemon is tough and doesn't matter.

I don't think they'd lose a single sale if this was implemented. Not in my wildest dreams could I dream up the stuff that ended up making in into (Or, the stuff that DIDN'T end up making it into) Sword and Shield. And it broke sales records regardless.

 

[Fulminator]

the "Pokemon is for kids" excuse is getting tiring. Everyone knows damn well at this point that people of all ages enjoy Pokemon.

Yes, his entire philosophy is "Kids will drop my game and go play on their phones so why should I bother?" How is that healthy for a franchise?

His stance has only gotten worse with GO's success. That's why I fully believe that the Wild Area is a goner sooner rather than later, he will take a quick look at the data, see that small kids don't spend hours in the wild area, and decide to remove it. Mark my words.

I HOPE this success even at like 25% of the franchise's potential opens his eyes at what his team can achieve. But I'm not holding my breath

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i don't think he is thinking "why should I bother"...i think he is trying to set the games up for success, but he's doing it with a VERY narrow minded point of view, which in the end i think is harming the franchise more than helping. I don't think he is intentionally trying to do that though.

 

[banter]

I can agree with this.

Through the first few hours of the game I was like "Yeah, this is pretty fun." But when you get further and further into the game and also start thinking back to previous games, you realize what's missing. You realize there's really not much to do in the Wild Area. You realize the routes and towns are much smaller and linear than previous games (the town with the 7th gym is a literal hallway). You realize the story is about as barebones as it gets. And then I realized, the reason I was having fun is because the core Pokemon formula holds up so well.

There are things that Sword and Shield do well. I think the encounter system is basically perfect. I really like the UI, and all of the QoL improvements are welcome. The foundations are there. But the game itself is far too linear, easy, and lacking in content for my tastes.

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Interesting, I had the same feelings but opposite timing. When I first started I noticed all of the things that could have been better, but as I continued I realized I was still enjoying my time with the game despite those things and they suddenly weren't nearly as big a deal. This ended up being the first pokemon game i played through in its entirety since black and white 2.

 

[Fj0823]

the "Pokemon is for kids" excuse is getting tiring. Everyone knows damn well at this point that people of all ages enjoy Pokemon.


i don't think he is thinking "why should I bother"...i think he is trying to set the games up for success, but he's doing it with a VERY narrow minded point of view, which in the end i think is harming the franchise more than helping. I don't think he is intentionally trying to do that though.

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His idea of that success is "Managing to keep the kids away from their phones for a little while before they inevitably drop the game and go back" which is already conceding defeat, as some other posters have pointed out

 

[tenderbrew]

You're getting them, but not next year.

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How do you know that?

 

[Meatwad]

So then I fail to see the issue. What demographic shifts need to be made?

 

[Fulminator]

Congratulations! They can get away with literally anything at this point and the game will sell like gangbusters regardless.

So here's how I feel going forward: Even with all the cuts, Sword and Shield felt rushed. For the sanity of the dev team, they should cut the dex even further next time. Maybe hold a poll and only include 50 fan favorites on top of the 100 new pokemon introduced. Cut down on moves, ain't nobody got time for all that shit. It's confusing anyways. Implement less gym leaders and include more friendly rival encounters between each city to pad out the length of the game. New gimmick turns Pokemon red. Like just a simple palette swap, but when they turn red they become stronger-er and get a special move or something. Every gym leader has one powerful Pokemon that can turn red. Remove roaming Pokemon from the overworld, creating all those animations for 100 all new Pokemon is tough and doesn't matter.

I don't think they'd lose a single sale if this was implemented. Not in my wildest dreams could I dream up the stuff that ended up making in into (Or, the stuff that DIDN'T end up making it into) Sword and Shield. And it broke sales records regardless.

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yeah, it felt VERY rushed past the 6th gym

 

[Anth0ny]

the "for kids" argument is the absolute shits and has been a pathetic defense of bad things since the beginning of time.

The Star Wars prequels are for kids
The Transformers movies are for kids
WWE 2K20 is for kids

so don't criticize OKAY

 

[greenwell]

Congratulations! They can get away with literally anything at this point and the game will sell like gangbusters regardless.

So here's how I feel going forward: Even with all the cuts, Sword and Shield felt rushed. For the sanity of the dev team, they should cut the dex even further next time. Maybe hold a poll and only include 50 fan favorites on top of the 100 new pokemon introduced. Cut down on moves, ain't nobody got time for all that shit. It's confusing anyways. Implement less gym leaders and include more friendly rival encounters between each city to pad out the length of the game. New gimmick turns Pokemon red. Like just a simple palette swap, but when they turn red they become stronger-er and get a special move or something. Every gym leader has one powerful Pokemon that can turn red. Remove roaming Pokemon from the overworld, creating all those animations for 100 all new Pokemon is tough and doesn't matter.

I don't think they'd lose a single sale if this was implemented. Not in my wildest dreams could I dream up the stuff that ended up making in into (Or, the stuff that DIDN'T end up making it into) Sword and Shield. And it broke sales records regardless.

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Someone's mad lol

 

[Blackleg-sanji1]

I'm like 100% sure the "meta" for Pokémon is made for kids guys.. 😏

 

[Deleted member 4413]

It's disappointing, but I guess I've just grown out of the series at this point. Been playing for nearly 25 years, since red and blue. GF just isn't interested in progressing the series anymore, in fact they seem more interested in stripping it down to it's bones.

It's nice that some people are enjoying it, but it's clear the series is a shell of it's former self.

Edit: And can people who have valid criticisms about the game and GF stop being compared to the asshole low life's on Twitter who have been harassing employees?

 

[poptire]

If the games are in the 80s on Metacritic and sold record numbers of copies why are we arguing about how bad the franchise is?

 

[ArcaneStar_]

It's actually very rare for someone who directed a third version to direct another game (I think Morimoto is the only exception). They shuffle them all the time

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Masuda first game as Director was Pokemon Crystal, a third version, and then he directed Ruby/Sapphire and Fire Red/Leaf Green (and many others). It's actually not thaaaat rare. Platinum's and BW2 directors only worked on those, yeah, but Emerald and Crystal's director went on to direct more games after that. It is normal for them to use third versions and remakes to test new directors that will direct other games later, Ohmori started directing a remake, OR/AS, for example.

I get what you are saying, though, I wouldn't be surprised if it is a completely new person as director of the remakes since it happens a lot. In any case it is safe to assume that Ohmori and Masuda won't be directing these games at all, Ohmori is probably already working on early gen 9 stuff.

 

[MrWindUpBird]

I like Pokemon, don't care about dexit or whatever but it does kind erk me how much Gamefreak gets away lol.. been playing Sword this weekend and it's the meh visuals, no voice acting, the same old plot, with a awful rival, .... how less ambitious it is compared to Nintendo's other titles kinda pisses me off seeing the amount of success this series keeps getting ...hell I'm part of the problem too lol bought it thinking maybe this Pokemon game will get.me back into the series ...but nah sigh..

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Why do you people keep acting like Game Freak is "getting away with it"? I know Era is in it's own little bubble, but these are kids games. Games aimed at kids, and while that doesn't negate the criticisms, acting like the world at large actually gives a shit about any of this is delusional. Era has 40,000 members, of everyone here bought the games that wouldn't put a dent in the sales. The 6 million people who bought these games are either parents who got it for their kids because hey, kids love Pokémon and don't care about the National Dex and what have you, or adults who also don't care about these issues. Era is, and always will be, the minority when it comes to these things.

People buy Pokémon games because they like them, it's as simple as that.

 

[Glio]

Yes, his entire philosophy is "Kids will drop my game and go play on their phones so why should I bother?" How is that healthy for a franchise?

His stance has only gotten worse with GO's success. That's why I fully believe that the Wild Area is a goner sooner rather than later, he will take a quick look at the data, see that small kids don't spend hours in the wild area, and decide to remove it. Mark my words.

I HOPE this success even at like 25% of the franchise's potential opens his eyes at what his team can achieve. But I'm not holding my breath

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So next time 24 million are sold in a week?

 

[Blackleg-sanji1]

If the games are in the 80s on Metacritic and sold record numbers of copies why are we arguing about how bad the franchise is?

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Ppl do it for every other franchise out there. Don't see what's different about Pokémon

 

[Flame Lord]

I'm not talking about people who are disappointed, I'm talking about people who are saying that they're stepping away from the series entirely.

Of course there's a place for criticism- I've made plenty of it myself! I just wouldn't bother if the bad outweighed the good like it apparently does for some here.

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This is similar to a line I've seen often that confuses me. I some times see people talking about how people criticizing the game need to move on, it's for children it's not for you etc. etc., but at the end of the day, these games have barely changed. They have't made a complete change that makes me think the series is no longer for me, they just keep making bad/worse games than they have previously put out. It's like saying someone should step away from NBA2K if they don't like it anymore; that's silly because it's still basketball, and you like basketball, you just want a good basketball game, and not a bad one.

 

[SinCityAssassin]

Vinesauce, right?

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Very prevalent from both sides of the argument as well.

Don't recall seeing it here whatsoever

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There's a bit more informed people in here I'd say, even with the giant threads happening when the game leaked and the vitriol in those threads, a specific thread propped up about if this would affect game sales in the long term and it was like a 60% no and 40% yes split.

 

[Scarlet Spider]

I'm like 100% sure the "meta" for Pokémon is made for kids guys.. 😏

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Little 6 year old Timmy is researching EVs and IVs right as we speak for competitive!

 

[KillstealWolf]

How do you know that?

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I think there's an assumption next year a break year? It's possible Sword and Shield has the infrastructure to run on Events for the year with increased chances for certain Gigantimax pokemon.

Spoiler

And the 35 or so extra pokemon found in the datamine getting unique timed events like Mewtwo, the remaining Kanto Starters, the Alola Starters and Legendaries and the Unova Legendaries.

But until we here official word from the company that the next year will be a gap one. I shall assume there will be another game ready to come out this time next year yet again.

 

[Blackleg-sanji1]

Little 6 year old Timmy is researching EVs and IVs right as we speak for competitive!

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Signed my son up for the 2020 championships

 

[Anth0ny]

Someone's mad lol

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pokemon is probably in the worst state quality-wise of any game franchise I care about. maybe throw in banjo kazooie and metal gear, but both are probably considered dead at this point so there's no point getting worked up about it.

obviously these bad games selling this well is like salt in the wound.

I try to just move on and ignore the franchise entirely but it's tough. those first two games were special and gens 3-5 were at the very least good.

 

[808s & Villainy]

Except that statement was backed by actual data they collected.

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Uh huh

If the games are in the 80s on Metacritic and sold record numbers of copies why are we arguing about how bad the franchise is?

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The same reason people do for FIFA or Call of Duty, or is Pokemon exempt?

 

[DecoReturns]

Awesome.

NOA, can we get vouchers in NA again so I can be the game too lol

 

[PirateKingERA]

as good as this game is, it's definitely time for Masuda to step down from the producer role. take Ohmori down from directorial duties since he's just Masuda part 2. many of the problems this game suffers from are the same ones the series has since been suffering from; and Masuda has no interest in improving on the formula.

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Doesn't Masuda compose most of the tracks? I think he gets unnecessary hate, he has been working on Pokemon since red and blue after all and was the director of fan favorite Black and White.

 

[BloodshotX]

That the vocal disgusting group that send death threats and harass developers are the minority?

Yeah me too.

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Yea so true that was disgusting. Even the developer pinpointing other developer's flaws was baffling. I do hope now that TPC knows that pokemon has a good base on switch that they are allowing Gamefreak to put more money into future pokemon projects.

While i think Sword and Shield are awesome, it has its flaws (wild area being quite empty ect). Lets see what pokemon has in store for 2020, i mean its basically time for the sinnoh remakes isnt it? (now that lets go is pretty much dead)

 

[Dwebble]

This is similar to a line I've seen often that confuses me. I some times see people talking about how people criticizing the game need to move on, it's for children it's not for you etc. etc., but at the end of the day, these games have barely changed. They have't made a complete change that makes me think the series is no longer for me, they just keep making bad/worse games than they have previously put out. It's like saying someone should step away from NBA2K if they don't like it anymore; that's silly because it's still basketball, and you like basketball, you just want a good basketball game, and not a bad one.

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OK, you're still misunderstanding me.

I'm not saying that people should walk away from the series, I'm saying that if you are walking away from the series, sticking around to rub salt into the wounds doesn't make much sense to me.

 

[PirateKingERA]

I think all of you hoping Morimoto will show up and be a Maverick and satisfy all your hopes and dreams are gonna be disappointed if he's ever put in charge of a game again.

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I'm pretty sure he'd do the same things the others are doing, abd tbf to Ohmori a lot of his ideas are really good.

 

[Zeroth]

Except that statement was backed by actual data they collected.

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Could you elaborate on the point you're making?

 

[Scarlet Spider]

Except that statement was backed by actual data they collected.

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Would love to get a link to that.

 

[Fj0823]

If the games are in the 80s on Metacritic and sold record numbers of copies why are we arguing about how bad the franchise is?

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[TyraZaurus]

Could you elaborate on the point you're making?

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Would love to get a link to that.

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It's from the same interview the cellphones comment comes from I think? Either way he mentioned that they collected player feedback re: older games and they found that players didn't engage with stuff like battle facilities and other intensive side content like it.

 

[Command & Conker]

Era killed my hype for this game, but I had already purchased it on the eshop. When i played it I was pleasantly surprised with it. I'm loving it despite the Dex cut. Animations are awesome. This is a good game and deserves the success.

 

[Deleted member 58846]

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FFXIII was one of the lowest selling games in the series despite the multiplatform status. Literally not comparable at all.

 

[Flame Lord]

OK, you're still misunderstanding me.

I'm not saying that people should walk away from the series, I'm saying that if you are walking away from the series, sticking around to rub salt into the wounds doesn't make much sense to me.

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I want a good Pokemon game, I won't settle for less thus I will not buy Sw/Sh. However I will continue to voice my concerns in hopes that one day they will be heard, and I get my wish. I don't know what is hard to understand about that.

 

[Deleted member 58846]

I want a good Pokemon game, I won't settle for less

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Good news, it's out now, and is the topic of this thread :)