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Son of Sparda

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,616
This is a few days old but I couldn't find a thread for it. Thanks to Dualshockers for translating the interviews:
Toshihiro Nagoshi: Making Ryu Ga Gotoku 7 into an RPG was a big challenge. For the next game, we can keep going with RPG and make something that surpasses it. We can also go back to action. We could also make a hybrid system mixing action and the new RPG system. All of these are possible scenarios.
Toshihiro Nagoshi: Personally speaking, I want to keep going through the same road, and see what we could improve. For example, making the battle system even more enjoyable, by adding new functionalities related to the terrain and the battles' areas. We could also strengthen the company management mode. Things like that. But for now, I don't wanna think about all that yet (laughs).

So looks like Nagoshi himself wants to do more turn based games, but depending on the fan reception they might go back to action or even do a hybrid.
 

Phoenix944

Member
Oct 28, 2017
925
I'm not against turn based, but bashing some head with heat actions in Yakuza was always super fun. Hope they'll go back to it.
 
Oct 27, 2017
12,058
We've had a ton of brawler based Yakuza games, I'd love to see them iterate on the new turn based system before they revert.
 

Yuntu

Prophet of Regret
Member
Nov 7, 2019
10,691
Germany
I personally think expanding and improving for some entries is the right play. But its the dev teams decision, not mine - so who knows.
 

Kalor

Resettlement Advisor
Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,629
Reception seems positive so far to the new combat so I hope they stick with it and refine it like they did with the brawler combat. It'd be a shame if they scrapped it after one game.
 

Deleted member 34949

Account closed at user request
Banned
Nov 30, 2017
19,101
Considering how good they've been at iterating on ideas and mechanics over the course of the series thus far, I'd definitely be up to see what they could do with another turn based game.
 

Strings

Member
Oct 27, 2017
31,419
I would absolutely love to have them tackle another Kenzan/Ishin (not specifically a samurai game, but using the established Yakuza cast as actors in a different type of world) with the turn-based system. Like, their version of Journey to the West or something else fantasy themed would be fascinating.
 

Zephy

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,168
I wasn't convinced by the demo and actually noped out of the game pretty quick. I will still probably get 7 when the Yakuza craving comes back, maybe I'll be more into it when I play the full game and actually follow the story.

But I hope we get some form of action back, even if it's a hybrid with the turn based system.
 

NattyBo

Member
Dec 29, 2017
4,316
Washington, DC
Was hoping Y7 would be a one off with the turned based stuff, but If the series is going to continue as turned based I can just write it off completely for now. Such a huge disappointment for me personally.

At least I'll always have the Kiryu saga
 

shadowman16

Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,972
I could swear I read this months back... eh, either way whatever the series does I'm down for it. 7 has been a blast to play so far even with the different combat, so whatever they go with as long as they keep the party aspect for plot/exploration/side stories etc. I'll be happy, because its hands down my favourite change. Adds a lot to just walking and exploring, or doing mini games/eating out etc.
 

--R

Being sued right now, please help me find a lawyer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,785
How are the reactions to Yakuza 7? Is there an Import OT or something similar?
 
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Son of Sparda

Son of Sparda

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,616
I think they should (and they probably will) do an action style Judgment 2 and then either do a complete turn based (expanded version) or a hybrid style for Yakuza 8. That seems like the best solution and appeases both the action fans and turn based ones.

The demo made a believer out of me when it comes to turn based Yakuza, so it would be a shame for it to go away completely just after one game.
 

NattyBo

Member
Dec 29, 2017
4,316
Washington, DC

maybe it's just my bad opinion but people motivated enough to import a game probably aren't the best judges with regards to how a game is being received.

that said I recognize this is divisive and just based on the threads it seems a lot of folks are on board with the change, so it's probably going to be positive when it hits the west for real anyway.
 

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
115,738
As long as we're still getting brawler side stories I don't mind if they keep iterating on the turn-based formula. They NEED to speed the combat up a bit though, from what I've seen in footage, it feels glacially paced.
 

shadowman16

Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,972
As long as we're still getting brawler side stories I don't mind if they keep iterating on the turn-based formula. They NEED to speed the combat up a bit though, from what I've seen in footage, it feels glacially paced.
But its not. Its incredibly fast paced. If anything, I need stronger enemies because most fights last seconds in 7.
 

Strings

Member
Oct 27, 2017
31,419
maybe it's just my bad opinion but people motivated enough to import a game probably aren't the best judges with regards to how a game is being received.

that said I recognize this is divisive and just based on the threads it seems a lot of folks are on board with the change, so it's probably going to be positive when it hits the west for real anyway.
Nah, it's fair to always keep that in mind with import impressions, but outside of something like FF Type-0, I've usually found OTs here and in the old country to be pretty reasonable / inline with the final reception. I know that the one I participated in the most (for Valkyria Revolution) had basically all of us agreeing it was terrible.
 

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
115,738
But its not. Its incredibly fast paced. If anything, I need stronger enemies because most fights last seconds in 7.

Maybe it's just early-game footage that looks super slow, then? There's so much "character paces around awkwardly, then shunts into an attack animation, then goes back to awkward shuffling around" in the videos I've seen.

Like I LIKE JRPG combat, but this feels very janky to me at least from a "haven't actually had a chance to play it yet" perspective.
 

mute

â–˛ Legend â–˛
Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,095
More turn-based combat games across the board please and thanks. Taking Yakuza in this direction is wild and I hope it continues.
 

shadowman16

Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,972
Maybe it's just early-game footage that looks super slow, then? There's so much "character paces around awkwardly, then shunts into an attack animation, then goes back to awkward shuffling around" in the videos I've seen.

Like I LIKE JRPG combat, but this feels very janky to me at least from a "haven't actually had a chance to play it yet" perspective.
I'm on chapter 5. Its still opening stuff up. Game is fast paced. You can hot key attacks to unleash powerful attacks without menu hopping. If the combat is taking a long time in vids your watching, its because whoever is playing it sucks I'd wager.
 

RochHoch

One Winged Slayer
Member
May 22, 2018
18,914
Seems like good news to me.

Yakuza 7 looks phenomenal, so I'd love to see how they could build upon it in another turn-based game.
 

Noisepurge

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,489
Was hoping Y7 would be a one off with the turned based stuff, but If the series is going to continue as turned based I can just write it off completely for now. Such a huge disappointment for me personally.

At least I'll always have the Kiryu saga

Numbering it Part 7 definitely seems like it´s the new normal. If they would have kept it a spinoff or otherwise titled differently it could have been a one-off or a subseries.
 

Mendrox

Banned
Oct 26, 2017
9,439
I enjoy the turn based combat a lot lot more than the old beat m up style. Like, before that, even on Legends difficulty that whole gameplay system was just a means to the end for me and sometimes really fucking annoying where as here with 7 I enjoy it a ton and it just gets better every hour.

I'm not against turn based, but bashing some head with heat actions in Yakuza was always super fun. Hope they'll go back to it.

??? You can still do that.

maybe it's just my bad opinion but people motivated enough to import a game probably aren't the best judges with regards to how a game is being received.

that said I recognize this is divisive and just based on the threads it seems a lot of folks are on board with the change, so it's probably going to be positive when it hits the west for real anyway.

Why wouldn't we be? Sometimes those "hardcore" fans are the biggest critics in those cases (well and it's not like you have to be motivated a lot to buy a game with a click on PSN, understanding and knowing japanese okay, but I didn't learn it to just play this game) I played through 0-6 in 2018 and for me it's always about the crazy stories and great cutscenes and activities and now I enjoy it even more with the new battle system finally.

As long as we're still getting brawler side stories I don't mind if they keep iterating on the turn-based formula. They NEED to speed the combat up a bit though, from what I've seen in footage, it feels glacially paced.

If they make it even faster, excluding boss fights that are a lot longer, then they could just give you a skip button for every fight. Fights take a few seconds and a quicker than all the games before that.
 
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Son of Sparda

Son of Sparda

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,616
As long as we're still getting brawler side stories I don't mind if they keep iterating on the turn-based formula. They NEED to speed the combat up a bit though, from what I've seen in footage, it feels glacially paced.
I played the demo for a couple of hours and to my surprise (since I had also seen how slow the combat in the videos were) it is actually really fast paced.

Especially after the first few encounters, because then you know the controls and you can quickly pick the attack you want to do which helps with the pacing. Even in the demo which is pretty early stuff, in my second hour most fights would last seconds because I was starting to get a feel for each attack and I was using powerful AOE ones.
 

TimeFire

Avenger
Nov 26, 2017
9,625
Brazil
I hope we still get beat'em up spinoffs if the main series is going to be turn based for a while. Yakuza is pretty much the only one doing that gameplay style and it would hurt to lose it
 
Oct 27, 2017
39,148
I played the demo and liked the combat, that said, go back to brawling please. One game is enough.

It just doesn't compare and I hate how silly everything looks. They had the perfect balance before but now it is a Saints Row 2 to 3 situation.


Or, give us more Judgment each year along with more past japan games as brawlers. I would hate to see brawling die for yet another turn based game series.
 

shadowman16

Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,972
maybe it's just my bad opinion but people motivated enough to import a game probably aren't the best judges with regards to how a game is being received.

that said I recognize this is divisive and just based on the threads it seems a lot of folks are on board with the change, so it's probably going to be positive when it hits the west for real anyway.
Get lost with this silly stuff... Why should those who bothered buying the game have their opinions discounted just because your still mad at the combat changes. There's some legit complaints in there about combat, and I still am not sure just how well boss fights work compared to the old games but to ignore positive opinions is just hilarious...
I played the demo and liked the combat, that said, go back to brawling please. One game is enough.

It just doesn't compare and I hate how silly everything looks. They had the perfect balance before but now it is a Saints Row 2 to 3 situation.


Or, give us more Judgment each year along with more past japan games as brawlers. I would hate to see brawling die for yet another turn based game series.
I like the silliness myself, just because of the canon reason for it (Ichiban is delusional). Thankfully that doesn't bleed into the story though, aside from him being far more light hearted than Kiryu is (but that's what Namba is for, to smack him back into reality). Plus the series really does need more enemy variety, granted maybe not silly enemies, but Yakuza does have real issues in previous releases with the lack of different enemy types. So I do quite appreciate this in 7.

I'd rather we not get yearly brawler (or RPG) games, maybe alternate between them, but that's just because the more time each game gets, the better it'll end up being. But I certainly don't want either gameplay style to go away, both are quite unique. TGS this year will certainly be interesting as we should get an idea of where the series is going next (will it be another RPG?, brawler? Samurai?) I can't wait!
 

PlanetSmasher

The Abominable Showman
Member
Oct 25, 2017
115,738
I played the demo for a couple of hours and to my surprise (since I had also seen how slow the combat in the videos were) it is actually really fast paced.

Especially after the first few encounters, because then you know the controls and you can quickly pick the attack you want to do which helps with the pacing. Even in the demo which is pretty early stuff, in my second hour most fights would last seconds because I was starting to get a feel for each attack and I was using powerful AOE ones.

Cool. I'll defer to your experience since all I've got as reference right now are Youtube videos. Maybe they'll do us a favor and put the English demo out before release so I can get a feel for it.
 
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Son of Sparda

Son of Sparda

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,616
Cool. I'll defer to your experience since all I've got as reference right now are Youtube videos. Maybe they'll do us a favor and put the English demo out before release so I can get a feel for it.
I'm sure they will. They've been doing that for the past few years, so it's likely that they'll do it this time as well. Especially with this being a new combat style that people need to try for themselves.
 

NattyBo

Member
Dec 29, 2017
4,316
Washington, DC
Nah, it's fair to always keep that in mind with import impressions, but outside of something like FF Type-0, I've usually found OTs here and in the old country to be pretty reasonable / inline with the final reception. I know that the one I participated in the most (for Valkyria Revolution) had basically all of us agreeing it was terrible.
fair point

mendrox said:
Why wouldn't we be? Sometimes those "hardcore" fans are the biggest critics in those

Also fair point

Shadowman16 said:
Get lost with this silly stuff... Why should those who bothered buying the game have their opinions discounted just because your still mad at the combat changes. There's some legit complaints in there about combat, and I still am not sure just how well boss fights work compared to the old games but to ignore positive opinions is just hilarious...
You do realize you don't need to reply to me in every thread on the topic telling me about how I'm mad at the combat changes right?

You always seem to miss key words in my posts. I said "maybe it's just my dumb opinion" and threw it out there for more discussion, and even got a few reasonable replies that changed my point of view.

Your replies have been beyond dismissive of me (talking of the previous threads on this topic) so how about I also just generalize and say I know you're gonna stan whatever RGG puts out and that's fine.
 
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everyer

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
1,242
As who already put 40 hours in Yakuza 7.
I can tell you that the story is as good as 0, the system is better than 0. This is the best Yakuza game. You won't believe how good it is as an RPG.
 

everyer

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
1,242
Oh and the turn based combat is much much better than Persona or DQ (when you think about turn based RPG).
It's a combination of strategy and react QTEs. Very enjoyable.
 
Oct 27, 2017
39,148
Get lost with this silly stuff... Why should those who bothered buying the game have their opinions discounted just because your still mad at the combat changes. There's some legit complaints in there about combat, and I still am not sure just how well boss fights work compared to the old games but to ignore positive opinions is just hilarious...

I like the silliness myself, just because of the canon reason for it (Ichiban is delusional). Thankfully that doesn't bleed into the story though, aside from him being far more light hearted than Kiryu is (but that's what Namba is for, to smack him back into reality). Plus the series really does need more enemy variety, granted maybe not silly enemies, but Yakuza does have real issues in previous releases with the lack of different enemy types. So I do quite appreciate this in 7.

I'd rather we not get yearly brawler (or RPG) games, maybe alternate between them, but that's just because the more time each game gets, the better it'll end up being. But I certainly don't want either gameplay style to go away, both are quite unique. TGS this year will certainly be interesting as we should get an idea of where the series is going next (will it be another RPG?, brawler? Samurai?) I can't wait!
I gotta disagree with that it doesn't bleed into the story part. Each time the game turns into a turn based combat sequence in the middle of the story I get taken out of the experience. Sure, Yakuza had the heat aura when you were playing the game during the story but it never really had stuff like calling in an airstrike or Ichiban turning into a host and things like that (aside from the secret items). Maybe it is just me who feel like this though.

As for the enemies, I agree but to be fair the turn based stuff didn't really change anything. You are still doing the same exact thing against the same enemies (who do look different). It is really hard to fix that either way cause the way Yakuza plays (both old and new) are not really that flexible to make for something new. Perhaps introducing enemies that use different movesets could work (maybe if they keep the silly theme going and add some Streets of Rage stuff to the goons like jet packs or bikers) if they keep the whole silliness theme going that is.

You have a point on the yearly release date. We will see how they handle it and if they actually go hybrid I would hope they give us the choice to play it as we want instead of mixing the two. The TBC we have in Yakuza 7 would probably not work as well if they you able to move cause then you would lose the timing aspect along with objects being in the way, though thinking about it, perhaps if they change the combat a bit where they use movement as another strategy (similiar to Lost Dimension on the Vita).

If I had it my way, they would bring back the original combat at the very least and make the turn based stuff a huge mini game (could be cool if they add a Pokemon Go style game where you find Sonic and other classic Sega characters like Monkey Ball or Space Harrier while exploring the world). Or they can go hybrid but give us a choice to play fully as either gameplay instead of trying to combine the two. I had a vision where you play the game and Ichiban would learn moves until he "becomes" a dragon with a unique ultimate moveset (think Shenmue combined with the styles of Yakuza 0 before you unlock the secret style).
 

shadowman16

Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,972
As for the enemies, I agree but to be fair the turn based stuff didn't really change anything. You are still doing the same exact thing against the same enemies (who do look different). It is really hard to fix that either way cause the way Yakuza plays (both old and new) are not really that flexible to make for something new. Perhaps introducing enemies that use different movesets could work (maybe if they keep the silly theme going and add some Streets of Rage stuff to the goons like jet packs or bikers) if they keep the whole silliness theme going that is.
But your not doing the same thing. Different enemies require different strategies to handle, different attacks/character classes to be used, prioritizing attacks on certain enemies (and that's not even taking into account where you fight enemies as the environment can either worth with or against you in terms of approach - enemies or obstacles can shield these enemies so you gotta change up plans and tackle fights in different ways). Plus there's management of your MP bar much like management of your heat bar in old games. And then there's countering enemy attacks and that opens up a whole new set of requirements as enemies have different attacks, attack speeds, countering certain attacks are way more difficult especially if they hit several times etc. Then you have enemies that deal certain status effects, have moves which can make them invincible/invisible for a time etc. Your not just hitting "X" and selecting the same move over and over to hit enemies until they fall down, like the old combat you have to use your head and adapt to the enemies that the game throws at you.

Granted its not exactly like how the old combat works, but it certainly still manages to retain a certain feel that feels like Yakuza, while giving you more enemy types to fight. And its not like Yakuza can't flesh out enemy types more in the action gameplay - while 7 has silly characters like flashers or dudes with glow sticks, they have proper martial artists (several types) and give weapon based enemies far more unique move sets to utilise - like dudes with Vega style claws and combos etc. They could easily pinch the less exotic enemies from 7 and migrate them with little effort. Oh, and bikers in this game would make complete sense, just like it did in Yuya's (Kiwami) 2 side story, not to mention Yakuza/Judge Eyes already using some bloody weird enemy designs at points - like the dudes in leather outfits and gags that appear in Judge Eyes' sex dungeon stage or the monster dude that appears in Shangri La's remains in Yakuza 6.
 
Oct 27, 2017
39,148
But your not doing the same thing. Different enemies require different strategies to handle, different attacks/character classes to be used, prioritizing attacks on certain enemies (and that's not even taking into account where you fight enemies as the environment can either worth with or against you in terms of approach - enemies or obstacles can shield these enemies so you gotta change up plans and tackle fights in different ways). Plus there's management of your MP bar much like management of your heat bar in old games. And then there's countering enemy attacks and that opens up a whole new set of requirements as enemies have different attacks, attack speeds, countering certain attacks are way more difficult especially if they hit several times etc. Then you have enemies that deal certain status effects, have moves which can make them invincible/invisible for a time etc. Your not just hitting "X" and selecting the same move over and over to hit enemies until they fall down, like the old combat you have to use your head and adapt to the enemies that the game throws at you.

Granted its not exactly like how the old combat works, but it certainly still manages to retain a certain feel that feels like Yakuza, while giving you more enemy types to fight. And its not like Yakuza can't flesh out enemy types more in the action gameplay - while 7 has silly characters like flashers or dudes with glow sticks, they have proper martial artists (several types) and give weapon based enemies far more unique move sets to utilise - like dudes with Vega style claws and combos etc. They could easily pinch the less exotic enemies from 7 and migrate them with little effort. Oh, and bikers in this game would make complete sense, just like it did in Yuya's (Kiwami) 2 side story, not to mention Yakuza/Judge Eyes already using some bloody weird enemy designs at points - like the dudes in leather outfits and gags that appear in Judge Eyes' sex dungeon stage or the monster dude that appears in Shangri La's remains in Yakuza 6.
It is probably the way you say it. After all what I know is from playing the demo and watching some videos.

But I gotta clarify, when I meen silliness I am more so talking about the bosses themselves. Say we use Kuze as an example, if he was in 7 it wouldn't have been the same cause the combat is different and includes stuff like using idols or chefs in the fights and that to me breaks the immersion. In old Yakuza you see Kiryu or Saejima or Majima go in and it is relativly "real" looking. That's what I mean when I say it is silly looking and destroys the immersion. Just seeing bosses wait for their turn or use "magic" takes me out of the experience.
 
Jul 24, 2018
10,255
Playing Yakuza 7 myself right now and so far I'm just not feeling it. I miss bashing crooks heads with a bicycle. I hope they'll make s classic brawler based Yakuza in the future as I do like Ichiban as a protagonist.
 

shadowman16

Member
Oct 25, 2017
31,972
It is probably the way you say it. After all what I know is from playing the demo and watching some videos.

But I gotta clarify, when I meen silliness I am more so talking about the bosses themselves. Say we use Kuze as an example, if he was in 7 it wouldn't have been the same cause the combat is different and includes stuff like using idols or chefs in the fights and that to me breaks the immersion. In old Yakuza you see Kiryu or Saejima or Majima go in and it is relativly "real" looking. That's what I mean when I say it is silly looking and destroys the immersion. Just seeing bosses wait for their turn or use "magic" takes me out of the experience.
Yeah, but this is the same series that have you fist fight wildlife in big gold castles that appear from the ground after Osaka castle splits in two. Also several of the crazier heat moves aren't exactly the most believeable grounded stuff either. I get what you mean, but between some of the plot twists in games I can roll with the crazy very easily. Plus I feel the in game justification of job switching adequate enough, the rest is just in Ichiban's head. If Kiryu morphs into a dragon mid battle then yeah, that'd be weird.
 

Rotobit

Editor at Nintendo Wire
Verified
Oct 27, 2017
10,196
Alternate between turn-based and action between the main series and spin-offs, maybe even try out even more genres, and tailor them to the protagonist. Makes sense for the Dragon Quest fanboy to imagine the world as a JRPG, just as I imagine a Judgment 2 would continue to be action-y with a greater focus on less brutal attacks.

I'd still be all for a game based entirely around dance battles
 

Aswitch

Member
Nov 27, 2017
5,125
Los Angeles, CA
Just what I feared coming to fruition of course. Welp there's the past Yakuza games I can still play I guess. I played the demo and I can see myself having a good time getting attached to the characters/story, etc., but not as much as I would with it being in action format. Ugh. As long as Nagoshi is enjoying the change himself, i'll keep supporting(if the game is good as a Turn based RPG) as much as I really prefer the beat em' up style. Beat em' ups will come back one day...I Hope.....
 
Oct 27, 2017
39,148
Yeah, but this is the same series that have you fist fight wildlife in big gold castles that appear from the ground after Osaka castle splits in two. Also several of the crazier heat moves aren't exactly the most believeable grounded stuff either. I get what you mean, but between some of the plot twists in games I can roll with the crazy very easily. Plus I feel the in game justification of job switching adequate enough, the rest is just in Ichiban's head. If Kiryu morphs into a dragon mid battle then yeah, that'd be weird.
True, the osaka castle is a very weird chapter. I guess the series is very ridicilous at its heart so I see why you it doesn't bother you. I prefer the way Yakuza 0, Yakuza 1 and 6 did things if I am honest (even though 6 had some weird stuff). I like the story to be as serious as possible but with some over the top stuff happening from time to time (the bear you fight in Yakuza 5 or Kiryu killi... ahem, knocking out a helicopter which landed safely using a rubber bullet mini gun in Yakuza 6.
Alternate between turn-based and action between the main series and spin-offs, maybe even try out even more genres, and tailor them to the protagonist. Makes sense for the Dragon Quest fanboy to imagine the world as a JRPG, just as I imagine a Judgment 2 would continue to be action-y with a greater focus on less brutal attacks.

I'd still be all for a game based entirely around dance battles
If anything, I would prefer if Judgment just goes full blown Yakuza if the current Yakuza will stay turn based. I want them to bring in the guns and the brutal attacks (wouldn't fit Yagami, sure but I would prefer if they brought another character as the MC cause Yagami's story is finished).
 

Lashley

<<Tag Here>>
Member
Oct 25, 2017
59,991
Whatever they do, I'll be there. Excited to see where the series goes.
 

Virtua King

Member
Dec 29, 2017
3,975
The beat 'em up gameplay was the primary reason as to why I was into Yakuza, so yeah, this doesn't do anything to persuade me that better times are ahead. I also still don't get why so many people are assuming that Judgment was anything more than a one time spinoff.